Rest of Baseball 2011

[ice grillin you]

bush stalin and hitler would not be in the world leaders HOF

terrible analogy

you wanna have a steroid era wing at the HOF be my guest....but these guys do not under any circumstances get their own bust up in that peezy

[SD]

bush stalin and hitler would not be in the world leaders HOF

terrible analogy

you wanna have a steroid era wing at the HOF be my guest....but these guys do not under any circumstances get their own bust up in that peezy

I'm starting to think Todd's a retard

[ice grillin you]

HOF comparisons:

george bush = randy ready

stalin = john cangelosi

hitler = bartman

[MDS]

its not a world leaders hall of fame analogy, its a history analogy.

the baseball hall of fame isnt just a shrine for the great players, its a shrine for all things baseball and its history. and whether you want to admit or not, steroids are a part of that, just like commies, nazis and retarded texans are in a world historical sense.

you put shoeless joe in and say he was an illiterate hick moron who took some money to throw some games but still did this in the 1919 world series.
you put rose in and you say he bet on baseball and hes banned for life.
you put mcgwire in and say he hit 3000 home runs but he was a roided up freakshow.
you put bonds in and say he did this before the roids, this during and this after.

people then make their own judgments, we dont make them for them.

[ice grillin you]

shoeless joe and rose can be in since their deeds didnt artificially inflate their numbers

steroids absolutely do that and since its numbers that make the sport and the HOF so sacred roid heads should not be in


and the hall of fame is not about history its about special achievments...put mcgwire in the smithsonian american history museum if you want...i have no problem with that

[MDS]

shoeless joe and rose can be in since their deeds didnt artificially inflate their numbers

steroids absolutely do that and since its numbers that make the sport and the HOF so sacred roid heads should not be in

valid point but where do you then begin to judge what mcgwire, sosa, bonds, raffy, etc. did on steroids and when they were clean? do we know for sure? do we just assume they were "cheating" their entire careers? and do we loop someone who might look the part but never really came up in the discussion like jeff bagwell into the group?

you start walking a fine line between good and bad when you do that. with that, as you said, they should define what exactly the voting procedures should be for steroids. some definite rules need to be set. but since they are not, since there is noting, then what, we randomly assign guilt and just say you juiced in 1998 so youre out?

and the hall of fame is not about history its about special achievments...put mcgwire in the smithsonian american history museum if you want...i have no problem with that

it absolutely is about history

im not saying you put in willie wilson because he did the most coke or lefty williams in because he was one of the 1919 black sox, but you cant simply ignore someone who hit 600 home runs because they were on steroids for a portion of their careers. now you can say that they would be 300 home run hitters if they didnt take roids...that might or might not be true. we cant really say. we do know that their power hitting capabilities were aided by this, which is something you directly mention on their plaques.

[ice grillin you]

i already said a determination has to be made as to when the steroid era started and began....once you do that you find out how many games of a particular players career were played in that time frame and if that number equals 75% or more of his total games played he doesnt make it

and no i dont care about the players who fall into that definition but maybe didnt do steroids...tough luck for them and chances are they did them anyway...im on the toher side of the fence from rjs in that id rather have a couple deserving players miss out than put one single non deserving player in...the sporta nd the hall are bigger than any one player

[MDS]

so as a good liberal you believe in guilt by association?

[ice grillin you]

were arent talking about going to jail we are talking about a sports hall of fame...analogy king killin it again

anyway how many players were:

1. steroid era guys
2. HOF locks
3. not in anyway associated with roids

[Sgt PSN]

i would put a committee together to determine when the steriod era was...put players who used on the committe coaches gm's strength coaches ect....anyone and everyone who could come up with a time period of when steriods became out of control in the game

1993 - 2003 is pretty much it. 

[MDS]

lenny dykstra was doing steroids long before 1993

[Rome]

And how do you know he wasn't on roids when he hit 49 HRs? Canseco was already on the team at that point.

You tell me:

[QB Eagles]

Just imagine how empty the Pro Football HOF would be if they kicked out the roid users. Between 1970 and 1990 you'd just have a lot of WRs and DBs.

[Sgt PSN]

lenny dykstra was doing steroids long before 1993

There were players on roids for at least 20 years  before 93, but in terms of it kind of getting out of control, 93-03 is pretty much it (give or take a year or 2 on the front end).  Prior to that, the % of players juicing up wasn't nearly as bad. 

[SD]

Gil Meche is calling it a career:

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Retiring-Gil-Meche-puts-a-price-tag-on-his-pride?urn=mlb-309149