Phillies

[ice grillin you]

Why Trea Turner, Phillies found a great fit on an age-defying contract

PHILADELPHIA, PA - DECEMBER 08
Dec 9, 2022

PHILADELPHIA — When the contingent of three Phillies officials — Dave Dombrowski, Sam Fuld and Rob Thomson — met Trea Turner and his wife, Kristen, at their home in Florida, it was Dombrowski who did most of the talking. The visit before Thanksgiving lasted three hours. And, when Turner reported back to his agents, there was something that stuck with him.

Dombrowski, the club's president of baseball operations, did not hide his intentions. He was transparent, and it set the tone for the negotiations. In baseball, obfuscation has become an art. Teams are more secretive than ever.

"I'm going to be honest with you," Turner said to the three men. "All I ask is that you be honest with me."

The Phillies showed Turner their hand.

"I didn't really care to play the games and all that," Turner said Thursday as he wore red pinstripes for the first time. "He told me right there that I was their No. 1 target."

By the time Turner was introduced, his 11-year, $300 million contract had more context as a wild MLB offseason churned ahead. San Diego had agreed to an 11-year, $280 million deal with Xander Bogaerts, who is almost a year older than Turner, 29, and less likely to remain at shortstop as long. Carlos Correa, who will not cost draft picks to sign, may fetch more than $300 million. The sport is awash with money.

The Nationals offered Turner $100 million before the 2020 season. He turned it down. He's accumulated the second-most WAR, according to FanGraphs, in all of baseball since. (Only Aaron Judge was more productive.) His $300 million deal was the highest guarantee to a position player who attended college, before Judge's $360 million contract eclipsed it. (Anthony Rendon's $245 million was the previous record.)

So, how will Turner stay productive into his 30s? "I could talk for a long time on this," Turner said.

He laughed.

"I bet on myself all the time," Turner said. "That's kind of why me and my family are in this situation. I bet on myself every step of the way. I'm a competitor. Whether it's a board game or whatever, I don't like losing. I'm going to compete for as long as I possibly can at the highest level I possibly can and I'll just bet on myself every step of the way.

"I put the effort in, whether it's in the weight room or the training room. I take it seriously. I don't know what it's going to look like; I don't plan too far ahead. I try to focus on what's right in front of (me)."

As the Phillies evaluated Turner against the other free-agent shortstops, they viewed him as the best bet to stick at shortstop the longest. He is imperfect there, although the Phillies see someone with unmatched athleticism. Turner will regress at some point, but he is starting at such a high level. There are objective ways to measure it.

But other perspectives were required in this exercise.

"I don't think there are enough Trea Turners on the planet to say definitively, 'Well, this is what this player did and Trea's a lot like him.'" said Fuld, the Phillies general manager. "There just aren't enough baseball players in the history of the game that are like him to be able to be confident in our ability to predict how he's going to age. So there has to be some sort of subjective approach to it. His desire to be really good. He's a high-level competitor. He wants to be great. He's got a World Series ring already, but you can tell he's hungry for more.

"So I think it starts with having a high level of confidence in Trea as a person. Then, he does a lot of other things beyond run fast, right? You're not putting all your eggs in that basket. So if there is, at any point in this contract, some decline in speed, he'll have plenty of other ways to beat the opponent."

The deal wasn't signed for the later years. The length helped lower the hit against the luxury-tax cap. The Phillies are aiming for massive production in the first five years of the contract.

They have reasons to believe in Turner's ability to be productive beyond that.

"He's got this blend of style and smoothness with a sort of gritty, blue-collar approach," Fuld said. "I don't know how many people can pull that off. And I think he does it really well."

"I'm going to compete for as long as I possibly can at the highest level I possibly can and I'll just bet on myself every step of the way." Trea Turner said.

A lineup with certainty

It was serendipitous how the one spot on the field where the Phillies had a vacancy happened to be the one with four above-average free agents to canvass. Consider this: The Phillies now have eight positions under club control through at least 2025.

The lineup, at least for the foreseeable future, is in place.

Catcher: J.T. Realmuto, signed through 2025.

Second base: Bryson Stott, club control through 2028.

Shortstop: Trea Turner, signed through 2033.

Third base: Alec Bohm, club control through 2026.

Left field: Kyle Schwarber, signed through 2025.

Center field: Brandon Marsh, club control through 2027.

Right field: Bryce Harper, signed through 2031.

Designated hitter: Nick Castellanos, signed through 2026.

The exception: Rhys Hoskins has one more year of club control until he's a free agent following this upcoming season. The new lineup, obviously, won't stay intact forever. Things change. But the Phillies have a base that will allow Thomson to keep a consistent batting order. That is something he prefers.

It's also important to Turner.

"I'm pretty comfortable anywhere," Turner said. "I told them (during the) process that I like hitting in the same spot every day, trying to learn my job. Who's behind me? Who's in front of me? Ultimately, we're going to have to get together in spring training and make those decisions."

A hitting coach's influence

There might not be a coach with more job security in the entire sport than Kevin Long. The veteran hitting coach agreed to a new contract during the World Series, like the rest of Thomson's coaches. But Long has an outsized influence. He has shaped the club's acquisition strategies; he advocated for Schwarber and was consulted about Marsh before the Phillies traded for him. He has a strong connection with Harper. There was an instant trust factor between Long and all of the Phillies hitters during his first season working with them.

Then, on the first day teams could have contact with free agents this offseason, Turner called Long. He was his former hitting coach in Washington.

"What do we got?" Turner asked him.

The sense within the organization, later proven accurate, was that Long's relationship with Turner was integral. "My sense is that it's really close and they really respect each other a great deal," Thomson said. "I'm sure it was a big part of it."

Turner joked about that initial conversation Thursday.

"I talked to him, and I still have questions about the hitting coach," Turner said. That drew laughter from the room.

"I had a pretty good phone call with him and just what his perspective is," Turner said. "I think a lot of things he said matched up with what I believed. But it's nice hearing it from the inside."

Thomson and Long are close friends; they spent years working together with the Yankees. The manager is not afraid to extend an uncommon amount of latitude to his hitting coach.

"In a lot of ways, I think you care more about who your hitting coach is than your manager," Fuld said. "And so that's a huge leg up that we had. You can tell it's a really healthy, fun relationship (between Turner and Long). One that I think is hopefully going to last for a long time."

[SD]

The Phillies' top trade-deadline acquisition this season in a deal with the Angels, Syndergaard will sign a free-agent deal with the Dodgers, according to ESPN's Jeff Passan. He'll make $13 million for one year, Jon Heyman of the New York Post reported.

Wouldn't have hated having him back but not for that much

[ice grillin you]

baseball contracts are ludicrous

[MDS]

once they signed walker that ended their need for a SP...syndergaard sucks anyway.

and he evidently got better offers for even more money. barely passable starters, $15 mil. what a world.

[PhillyPhreak54]

To pitch 4-1/3 innings. Or better yet they could have a QUALITY START of 6 whole innings!

[Don Ho]

^^^ ^^^

[MDS]

To pitch 4-1/3 innings. Or better yet they could have a QUALITY START of 6 whole innings!

the phillies shouldve started noah syndergaard in the playoffs and let him pitch all 9 innings

[Geowhizzer]

My first thought was, "Who?"

https://twitter.com/Phillies/status/1606353340929015825

[MDS]

this isnt worth anything beyond off the top of my head but i think he was an early offseason waiver claim who was removed from the 40 when they signed walker. instead of taking the minor league assignment, he elected to try his hand elsewhere. goodbye, king.

a thought:
the remaining relief pitchers are mostly meh, seems like theres not much difference between say michael fulmer and the various in house arms they have like sam qoonrod. but what about CRAIG KIMBREL. hes been all over the place the last 2 years. dominant, terrible and mediocre. worth a crack for 1yr, $10ish mil? he wouldnt be the stopper. you could seemingly manage his innings.

its only cancer stick money

[SD]

I'd be thrilled with Kimbrel on a one year $10 million deal

[MDS]

it would probably be more like $15, kenley signed for $16 and hes below that

but whatever, its just money. if hes awful, so what, you set $15 mil on fire. they set more than that on fire last year with knebel and familia

[SD]

it would probably be more like $15, kenley signed for $16 and hes below that

but whatever, its just money. if hes awful, so what, you set $15 mil on fire. they set more than that on fire last year with knebel and familia

Be thrilled with him at $15 million and agreed I'd rather spend on quality then a bunch of crap like Hand/Familia/Knebel

I'd kick the tires on Knebel again if he's willing to come in cheap

[MDS]

knebel got $10 last year so hed def be under that. i really dont know whats left in his arm. he couldnt make it through 2022 and even when he was healthy, he was pretty much awful.

a hearty pass

[PhillyPhreak54]

Youse spoke it into existence

Craig Kimbrel signed

[SD]

Youse spoke it into existence

Craig Kimbrel signed

1 year $10 million. Holy shtein merry Christmas.