Political Hippo Circle Jerk - America, farg YEAH!

[rjs246]

McCain has always been better than most Washington politicians on reducing spending.  His record is better than anything he's talking about in his campaign.  Additionally, as I've mentioned, the tax plans are hugely different when it comes to capital gains, estate, and corporate taxes.

This may be accurate and from what I've read I think that it is. But it hasn't even been brought up seriously in the conversation from the McCain camp and I refuse to believe that the majority of McCain supporters (or people in general) have done enough research to know about it...

[ice grillin you]

mccain is pro war

and has voted with bush across the board on his spending increases

i fail to see how he will cut spending

he talks about maverick this and maverick that and reform this and reform that but i have yet to hear him say one single time that he will reduce the size of govt or cut spending...and if he has he hasnt been serious about it

[rjs246]

The War expenses are the real sticking point. The amount of money that is being dumped into Iraq is staggering and McCain wants to continue the effort. He may have a plan to cut domestic spending but in my opinion that plan is the worst of all possible scenarios. Cut spending at home while dumping untold billions into a war abroad? I don't see how that benefits anyone.

[ice grillin you]

worse than that is he is proposing a continuance of the bush tax cuts...this will raise the national debt not lower it..most esitmates last i read had it adding 5 tillion to the debt...

now obama certainly doesnt look like hes gonna balance the budget anytime soon either and is talking tax cuts as well but ones that will cost a lot less and go to the people who need them rather than the bush/mccain cuts that go more towards the rich

[Cerevant]

RJS, I agree with you on most points, but what you describe as McCain flailing around in desparation is actually the plan.

The core of the Republican strategy is one of distraction: keep Obama on the defensive, and keep changing the subject.  Don't let Obama gain any momentum in any direction - offensive or defensive.  Instead of "fire and move" it is "distract and move" - do whatever you have to do to keep the subject off of George Bush.  Once you accept this as their strategy, the Palin nomination makes perfect sense - how could you possibly create a bigger distraction than she has been?  Everyone is talking about Palin...which means no one is talking about Bush.

Obama has his own strategy, but it is a bit more subtle - just like in the primaries.

1) Obama will not make personal attacks directly - he has surrounded himself with people who will make his attacks for him.  My only problem with this is that Kerry has been his #1 attack dog to date, and that isn't going to impress a whole lot of people.  Now he's got Biden pounding the podium, along with a pissed off Hillary.  Yesterday, Rendell tried to set a record for saying "liar" in a sound bite.  Hopefully this train is turning around.

2) Obama clearly has the upper hand on the electoral map.  Just like in the primaries, he is playing the numbers, focusing his efforts where they will pay off.  It isn't about how much you win by, but that you win.  Don't be surprised if he loses the popular vote and wins the election.

3) The strategy of scatter-shot attacks will fall apart in the forum of a moderated debate.  I think this is where the Democrats will shine, because the Republicans will have to answer direct questions, and the holes in their plans will become apparent.

Don't panic - the polls are just showing the Republican convention bounce, amplified by the fact that the conventions were right on top of each other.  Give things a week or two to settle out before you go jumping off the bridge.

[ice grillin you]

im not on the bridge yet but i can tell you when and if i get there a friggin canuck isnt going to talk me off it

[rjs246]

Who's jumping off a bridge you friggin drama queen? I'm just pointing out the obvious stuff that no one has been talking about.

Obama is black (sort of)!
Palin is hot (sort of)!
Biden is a hot-head (definitely)!
McCain's body has been reanimated!

[shorebird]

Obama's unwillingness to badmouth his opponent or get too politically dirty, while very admirable, is hurting him a lot and may ultimately turn voters off who want a change but also want a 'strong' figure in the White House.

i couldnt agree more about your first point..barry is almost morphing into kerry mode with his lack of aggression...the problem is america does not want to see a angry strong black guy going after an older white guy or god forbid a white women.....hes stuck btwn a rock and a hard place right now and theres no way to get out

Huh, well, this is one Republican who has noticed the classy way Obama has handled himself. He's earned my respect in that way. As for people wanting a "strong figure" in the White House, what shows more strength, being able to focus on the issues and not give into the personal attacks on you and your family? Or standing up like that stupid two faced bitch Hilldog and making ignorant innuendos about the Titanic?

[rjs246]

As for people wanting a "strong figure" in the White House, what shows more strength, being able to focus on the issues and not give into the personal attacks on you and your family?

I agree with you, he is showing strength in a way, but a refusal to play dirty can easily be interpretted as weakness.

[ice grillin you]

Obama's unwillingness to badmouth his opponent or get too politically dirty, while very admirable, is hurting him a lot and may ultimately turn voters off who want a change but also want a 'strong' figure in the White House.

i couldnt agree more about your first point..barry is almost morphing into kerry mode with his lack of aggression...the problem is america does not want to see a angry strong black guy going after an older white guy or god forbid a white women.....hes stuck btwn a rock and a hard place right now and theres no way to get out

Huh, well, this is one Republican who has noticed the classy way Obama has handled himself. He's earned my respect in that way. As for people wanting a "strong figure" in the White House, what shows more strength, being able to focus on the issues and not give into the personal attacks on you and your family? Or standing up like that stupid two faced bitch Hilldog and making ignorant innuendos about the Titanic?

good for you...the country needs more people like that

and what you say is correct but its probably not the best path to the white house...like i said rock and a hard place...do you sell your soul everything your campaign has been built on and anger a lot of people or do you go for it all

[shorebird]

I agree with you, he is showing strength in a way, but a refusal to play dirty can easily be interpretted as weakness.

I see your point. Goes back to my assumption that most Americans are like Sheeple, on both sides. There are people who won't vote for Obama because he's black, and people who will because he's black, no other reason. Same as with whatever party you belong too.

I want to see a debate. It's going to go along way toward me deciding who I'm going to vote for.

Obama has declined invitation for the 'town hall' format, and choose to remain committed to the three debates on the table for September and October. If he's so great a speaker, then why not debate McCain in any format? Why wait for one that will be moderated and controlled? I hear from most people who post in this thread that Obama will more or less destroy McCain in a debate. Then why won't he debate in a town hall were he has to answer directly to the people?? Does it go back to the radical rights claim that he's lost without his teleprompter? I guess we'll find out on the 26th.

[ATV]

The best reason is that Obama's agenda is too drastic to attract moderates.

100% pure bullcrap.

Lower taxes for moderately income folks.
Getting us out of Iraq.
Maintaining pro-choice.
Obeying the Constitution.
Affordable healthcare.
and on, and on.....

What we've seen from the Bush administration the past eight years is that when people feed you some bullshtein over and over again eventually it becomes part of the discourse - Or at least something that people feel comfortable throwing out there no matter how ludicrous it is. For example, this statement by FF. Another recent example would be that Sarah has foreign policy experience because Alaska is close to Russia.

[PhillyGirl]

IGY...just an FYI regarding your poll numbers you were showing the other day.

To get an idea of how worthless convention bounces are in the polls? Michael Dukakis had a 17 point convention bounce.

[Phanatic]

There's no reason for these guys to go to the personal attack well. They've got plenty of philosophical differences to draw on for attacks.

It's funny you hear both sides say their guy or gal will win the debate because the 'other' guy doesn't have any substance. If your that Ra Ra your a sheople like everyone else. Baaaaahhhh

[Phanatic]

Obama: Bush's Afghanistan, Iraq plan isn't enough
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080909/ap_on_el_pr/candidates_war_7

I kind of agree with him at this point however this means we'll still be spending the same amount of money on deploying the troops. We'll just be doing it differently.