Political Hippo Circle Jerk - America, farg YEAH!

[PoopyfaceMcGee]

And so goes the story of his life

[PhillyGirl]

Remember when he used to Bold all of his quotes? Those were the days...

seriously it could be worse

a man trys to better himself and still gets grief

You're right, you could actually know how to spell tries.

[ice grillin you]

Remember when he used to Bold all of his quotes? Those were the days...

seriously it could be worse

a man trys to better himself and still gets grief

You're right, you could actually know how to spell tries.

babie steps

[rjs246]

A pretty interesting, though heavily liberal, article in TIME about the frustration that McCain must being feeling with regards to foreign policy during this campaign.

In the end, both Obama and McCain seemed to have a piece of the truth about Iraq, but Obama's truth was larger and more strategic. Obama had been right about the war in the first place. It was a disastrous idea, a phenomenal waste of lives and American credibility that diverted focus from our real enemy, al-Qaeda in Afghanistan and Pakistan. And Obama was right about the war now: the progress in Iraq was enabling a quicker withdrawal — a plan already hinted at by Bush. And Obama was right about the future: the Iraqis don't want long-term U.S. bases on their territory, a McCain keystone and the source of his infamous comment about staying in Iraq for 100 years. McCain's piece of the truth was tactical: he was right about the surge and right about the brilliance of David Petraeus' battle plan, which had helped quiet down Iraq. McCain was justifiably infuriated that Obama wouldn't acknowledge that success — indeed, Obama seemed to understand that he was pushing McCain's buttons, hoping perhaps to elicit McCain's Vesuvian temper...

[Rome]

I can't wait until Barry wipes the floor with that old fossil in the debates.

[PoopyfaceMcGee]

Obama wasn't in the U.S. Senate when the war was first waged.  It's easy for him to say he was against it all along.  Even many of the most liberal Senators caved to the war in fear of being thought of negatively post-9/11.

Last I checked, the Illinois State Senate didn't hold any meaningful votes on going to war with Iraq.

Anyway, it's horseshtein.  Getting rid of Hussein was a positive step, but as evidenced by the "Mission Accomplished" fiasco, no one seemed to understand or expect what kind of unrest would be faced after his capture/death.

So, going to Iraq was not a bad thing overall, but making Iraq the "primary" battleground in the "war on terror" was ludicrous, and we have not only paid the price with American lives galore, but now we are stretched too thin to adequately address the real front lines in Afghanistan.

Ugh.  I just get annoyed when people think it's as simple as "pulling out troops" or "ending the war".  If only.

[Diomedes]

I can't wait until Barry wipes the floor with that old fossil in the debates.

That's what we said about Gore and Bush and wipe the floor Gore did, and the dividends from that performance were paid out by everyone feeling sorry for poor dubbya looking stoopid.

Obama is obviously far more intelligent and capable in every way, but if he struts it too much, if he confuses McCain with logic, or angers him with clever rhetorical jabs, people will likely pity the old man and heap scorn upon Obama for picking on a geezer.

[Diomedes]

So, going to Iraq was not a bad thing overall

Fail

[Rome]

I don't think Gore went nearly far enough in exhibiting his intelligence in 2000.  He tried to dumb down his message, and as a result, he allowed Bush to stay in the game with him.

Screw it.  If you're going to lose you might as well play your best hand.

[Diomedes]

For entertainment value alone, I'd love to watch Obama abuse McCain, even if it means he loses the election.  I just don't think he's gonna go for the throat because he'll be wary of the pity vote.

[Rome]

And by the way - they didn't go into Iraq to take out Hussein.  They went into Iraq because he wouldn't play ball with his oil reserves.  No one gave a damn about the "poor" Iraqi citizens that were being tortured, maimed, and slaughtered back then any more than they do now (and yes, it's still going on).

Oil is the reason we went in; oil is the reason we're there now; and oil is the reason we'll continue to stay regardless of who gets elected in November.

[ice grillin you]

Obama wasn't in the U.S. Senate when the war was first waged.  It's easy for him to say he was against it all along.  Even many of the most liberal Senators caved to the war in fear of being thought of negatively post-9/11.

Last I checked, the Illinois State Senate didn't hold any meaningful votes on going to war with Iraq.

so your way of attacking obama or defending mccain or whatever youre attempting to do here is to make up a hypothetical scenario where you say IF obama was a us senator he would have been for the invasion...solid

obama announced his senatorial campaign four months before the iraq invasion...he was against it from the start...if youre suggesting that he would have been on the bandwagon had he actually been in the senate because of the support across the country for the invasion then why wouldnt he have supported it to help his senatorial bid

Getting rid of Hussein was a positive step

he was about 50th on the list of leaders around the world whose country we should have taken over

So, going to Iraq was not a bad thing overall

lol...one of the worst things youve ever said and youve had some doosies

but making Iraq the "primary" battleground in the "war on terror" was ludicrous, and we have not only paid the price with American lives galore, but now we are stretched too thin to adequately address the real front lines in Afghanistan.

the minute we decided to invade and occupy a country the size of iraq it was the primary focus of our everything....are you suggesting that invading iraq was a fine idea but we also should have sent multiple brigades to afghanistan at the same time

you cant have it both ways...either invading iraq was not a bad thing or we should have gone to afghanistan/pakistan...but not both

[Diomedes]

We went into iraq, in this order of successive purposes, if memory serves:

They have WMDs, pose an imminent "mushroom cloud" threat
then it was To overthrow Saddam
and then To install a democracy
and then To fight the war on terrorism there instead of here
and then To stabilize the security situation so the government can operate

It is an unqualified disaster on a world wide, all time human history scale.  after slavery, and the genocide of native americans, it's the worst of America ever

[PhillyGirl]

We went into iraq, in this order of successive purposes, if memory serves:

They have WMDs, pose an imminent "mushroom cloud" threat
then it was To overthrow Saddam
and then To install a democracy
and then To fight the war on terrorism there instead of here
and then To stabilize the security situation so the government can operate

It is an unqualified disaster on a world wide, all time human history scale.  after slavery, and the genocide of native americans, it's the worst of America ever

I couldn't agree with you any more than I do. Perfectly stated.

[PoopyfaceMcGee]

My whole point was that "going in" to Iraq with correct and precise objectives would not have been a mistake.  A full-scale "invasion" with no clear mission to actually accomplish was an incredible and awful error.

Obama was still a spectator to national politics when it all started regardless.