McNabb's passer rating

rjs246 · October 18, 2006, 10:31:28 PM

Playing for a team that had home field advantage three years in a row AND made four straight NFCCGs you just can't make that argument. Those teams were good enough to go to, and win, at least one superbowl. But they didn't so you are going to try to argue that Wildcard and Divisional round games are 'big games'? Please. You're embarrassing yourself.

The BIGSTUD · October 18, 2006, 11:22:00 PM

McNabb roolz.

PhillyPhreak54 · October 19, 2006, 03:21:05 AM

Quote from: rjs246 on October 18, 2006, 10:31:28 PM
Playing for a team that had home field advantage three years in a row AND made four straight NFCCGs you just can't make that argument. Those teams were good enough to go to, and win, at least one superbowl. But they didn't so you are going to try to argue that Wildcard and Divisional round games are 'big games'? Please. You're embarrassing yourself.

So wildcard and divisional games are nothing? They are the playoffs! That is a big game. I don't care if it is at home, in his goddamn front yard or whatever. It's a big game because it's lose and go home. And to try to pawn off the wins as the other 52 guys and/or because they got there so much they were just bound to win once is bullshtein.

Basically you say that because they never won a SB its McNabb's fault and not the fault of the entire team/staff. But then when it comes to getting there its not McNabb who gets credit, its the team or circumstances. Please. You're embarassing yourself by saying that any playoff game is not a big game.

I guess in your mind no game is a big game unless its a CCG or SB. In that case there are a lot of QBs in the NFL who suck.

bobbyinlondon · October 19, 2006, 05:40:57 AM

Quote from: rjs246 on October 18, 2006, 10:06:51 PM
You are completely missing the point. Every big game opportunity that he has been in has resulted in failure. Have they all ben his fault? No. Has he elevated himself above the other mitigating circumstances? No.

I'm not attacking him. Or saying that he hasn't overcome a lot. Arguing that would be idiotic. McNabb and Westbrook are two of my favorite players and they certainly have my respect (assuming otherwise is assinine). But they are flawed and everyone with a brain can see it.

I'm simply saying that until he wins on the biggest level I will not trust him to put this team on his back, against good competition, on the biggest stage and carry this team to a championship. I will always have doubts.

But seriously. He's fat. And this team needs to learn to run the ball rather than just put every farging game on the shoulders of one player.

McNabb already put this team on his back--when he had Darnell Autry, Amp Lee, and god knows who else for RBs and Charles Johnson and Torrance Small for WRs.

shorebird · October 19, 2006, 06:14:14 AM

Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on October 19, 2006, 03:21:05 AM
Quote from: rjs246 on October 18, 2006, 10:31:28 PM
Playing for a team that had home field advantage three years in a row AND made four straight NFCCGs you just can't make that argument. Those teams were good enough to go to, and win, at least one superbowl. But they didn't so you are going to try to argue that Wildcard and Divisional round games are 'big games'? Please. You're embarrassing yourself.

So wildcard and divisional games are nothing? They are the playoffs! That is a big game. I don't care if it is at home, in his goddamn front yard or whatever. It's a big game because it's lose and go home. And to try to pawn off the wins as the other 52 guys and/or because they got there so much they were just bound to win once is bullshtein.

Basically you say that because they never won a SB its McNabb's fault and not the fault of the entire team/staff. But then when it comes to getting there its not McNabb who gets credit, its the team or circumstances. Please. You're embarassing yourself by saying that any playoff game is not a big game.

I guess in your mind no game is a big game unless its a CCG or SB. In that case there are a lot of QBs in the NFL who suck.

To say McNabb has never won a big game is nuts. Every playoff game, the day before it's played, is the biggest game of every player on that teams career.

rjs246 · October 19, 2006, 07:21:44 AM

Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on October 19, 2006, 03:21:05 AM
I guess in your mind no game is a big game unless its a CCG or SB. In that case there are a lot of QBs in the NFL who suck.

You're absolutely right. In my mind there are a lot of QBs who suck. Among the few top tiered QBs there are two that have constantly been surrounded by quality teams and haven't been able to get over the hump. One is Peyton Manning. And what is everyone's favorite adjective for him? The other is Donovan McNabb, but none of you will use that same adjective for DMac. Why? Oh right, because you're homers who will defend all things Eagles tooth and nail.

bobbyinlondon · October 19, 2006, 07:47:45 AM

Quote from: rjs246 on October 19, 2006, 07:21:44 AM
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on October 19, 2006, 03:21:05 AM
I guess in your mind no game is a big game unless its a CCG or SB. In that case there are a lot of QBs in the NFL who suck.

You're absolutely right. In my mind there are a lot of QBs who suck. Among the few top tiered QBs there are two that have constantly been surrounded by quality teams and haven't been able to get over the hump. One is Peyton Manning. And what is everyone's favorite adjective for him? The other is Donovan McNabb, but none of you will use that same adjective for DMac. Why? Oh right, because you're homers who will defend all things Eagles tooth and nail.

I think if you look at Manning and why everyone considers him a prime choker in the playoffs, and maybe not McNabb, it's because of his supporting cast--it's been far superior than ANYTHING the Eagles have put up--with the exception of when Owens was one fo the wideouts. To me, a QB with the talents of Edgerrin James, Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Brandon Stokely, Dallas Clark, plus their offensive line, that puts up huge numbers in the regular season but can't do it in the playoffs definitely deserves that label. I mean, one year they got shut out by the Jets in the WC game. Not to mention HFA in at least their first round games.

rjs246 · October 19, 2006, 08:15:10 AM

A fine point, but the Eagles' defense has always been superior to the Colts' (in the years in question anyway) and the Eagles dominated their conference in a way that the Colts never really did. The Eagles were talented enough to make and win the big game. You can blame the receivers or Andy Reid (and rightfully) but McNabb seemed to do just fine with Reid and those receivers every year until he got to the biggest stage and then he just fell apart. Look at his stats in NFCCGs and the Superbowl. They look NOTHING like his stats in other games. This is a dude who never turns the ball over and he's turned it over constantly in those games. That is the definition of choking.

Sgt PSN · October 19, 2006, 09:10:45 AM

I'm leaning more towards bobby but rjs makes a pretty stong argument. I don't think there's any denying that McNabb has performed at a level beneath his norm in most of the big games he's played in. But I also don't think there's any doubt that he is definately a better "big game QB" than Golden Boy, Peyton Manning.

This discussion isn't about whether McNabb's any good or not. We all know he is. It's about whether or not he plays at the same level during the post season as he does during the regular. And while he's had some pretty good games in the playoffs, he's also had more than his fair share of bombs as well.

RezRob · October 19, 2006, 09:54:09 AM

Don't forget to give Mr.Gameplan and Adjustments his share of the losses.(big game) We were easily outcoached in "most" of those big games. By "most" I mean all.

bobbyinlondon · October 19, 2006, 12:07:38 PM

Quote from: rjs246 on October 19, 2006, 08:15:10 AM
A fine point, but the Eagles' defense has always been superior to the Colts' (in the years in question anyway) and the Eagles dominated their conference in a way that the Colts never really did. The Eagles were talented enough to make and win the big game. You can blame the receivers or Andy Reid (and rightfully) but McNabb seemed to do just fine with Reid and those receivers every year until he got to the biggest stage and then he just fell apart. Look at his stats in NFCCGs and the Superbowl. They look NOTHING like his stats in other games. This is a dude who never turns the ball over and he's turned it over constantly in those games. That is the definition of choking.

You do have a point--where he is better than 2:1 in the regular season TDs/INTs (147/68 including this year thus far--about 21/9 per regular season) he's only a little better than even (18-12) in the playoffs.

Phanatic · October 19, 2006, 12:16:55 PM

I think all of those big games, super bowl included the offense put up descent enough numbers. It is still a team loss. Clock management accounts for a good portion of late game losses with this team anymore. If we are saying that winning the SB is the only thing to rate a QB by then Brad Johnson is better then McNabb..

Phanatic · October 19, 2006, 12:24:10 PM

I would like to follow this up by saying that the coaching staff has choked in big games. Not one specific player.

rjs246 · October 19, 2006, 12:57:15 PM

4 NFCCGs and 1 Superbowl: (I'll include the one big game that he won.)
101/177, 1051 yds, 6 TDs, 8 Ints

Take out the win:
84/151, 871 yds, 4 TDs, 8 Ints

G.R.O.S.S.

ice grillin you · October 19, 2006, 01:01:41 PM

dont forget the stellar competition mcnabb was rushing thru in his playoff career

jim miller
michael vick
shaun king
duante culpepper
jake delhomme
ect....

kurt warner and tom brady were the only great qb's he faced and he lost to both