Health Care Reform thread

mpmcgraw · October 15, 2009, 01:39:07 PM

Can someone explain to me what exactly is being reformed with this Healthcare Reform bill after it got gutted by the Hoyda dems who didn't just man up and push it through the way it should be?

ATV · October 17, 2009, 03:22:02 PM

This is one of the reasons we're going to get a public option...

"If you are going to mandate that people must buy insurance, why would you throw them into the lion's den of the insurance industry without some leverage with a public option?" - Nancy Pelosi

Yes, now that the bill has left the realm of the overblown finance committee every day it's looking more and more likely it will pass by 50+ votes. I'm very much looking forward to dusting off my "FAIL"s for Bowzer, the insurance companies, and every Repubelican which votes against it (which will probably be all of them).

bowzer · October 17, 2009, 05:14:45 PM

Quote from: ATV on October 17, 2009, 03:22:02 PM
This is one of the reasons we're going to get a public option...

"If you are going to mandate that people must buy insurance, why would you throw them into the lion's den of the insurance industry without some leverage with a public option?" - Nancy Pelosi

Yes, now that the bill has left the realm of the overblown finance committee every day it's looking more and more likely it will pass by 50+ votes. I'm very much looking forward to dusting off my "FAIL"s for Bowzer, the insurance companies, and every Repubelican which votes against it (which will probably be all of them).

Didn't you say the bill would be passed into law before the year end? Or even quicker?

There won't be a public option.

ATV · October 17, 2009, 06:04:33 PM

I don't recall ever arguing when it would be passed. At least I never intended to.

There will be a public option. Else there will be no bill. There must be a bill, therefore there will be a public option. I'm not sure where this logic breaks down for you. I assume that you assume a bill can pass without one. I don't think there are sixty votes or even fifty votes for a bill without one.

bowzer · October 17, 2009, 07:47:38 PM

Quote from: ATV on October 17, 2009, 06:04:33 PM
I don't recall ever arguing when it would be passed. At least I never intended to.

There will be a public option. Else there will be no bill. There must be a bill, therefore there will be a public option. I'm not sure where this logic breaks down for you. I assume that you assume a bill can pass without one. I don't think there are sixty votes or even fifty votes for a bill without one.

Great logic... you should be a lawyer. Health care reform can be passed without a public option. The healthcare bill in its current form sucks.

Democrats from swing states in highly contested elections in 2010 aren't going to go for a public option bill as its political suicide.

You lose.. game over.. and if you are so confident on the public option why won't you bet on it. Whoever is wrong leaves the general board for 6 months.

Munson · October 17, 2009, 07:52:11 PM

Voting for something that about half the country supports isn't political suicide...

ATV · October 17, 2009, 08:26:29 PM

You're right - There are some Democrats in the Senate who aren't going to vote for a public option. Unfortunately for you there aren't more than 9 of them. Game over.

Rome · October 17, 2009, 09:36:24 PM

The only people who are against health care reform are the corksuckers who make mint off the sickness and suffering of others. They're the same douchebags who are spending billions organizing the ignorant sheep who you see protesting Obama.

phillymic2000 · October 17, 2009, 10:35:41 PM

Quote from: Munson on October 17, 2009, 07:52:11 PM
Voting for something that about half the country supports isn't political suicide...

Half? wow, since when.

ATV · October 18, 2009, 02:51:44 AM

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/06/public-support-for-public-option.html

mpmcgraw · October 18, 2009, 02:57:55 AM

nate silver is the shtein.

That's the first credible source I can ever remember you giving. your getting better.

ice grillin you · October 18, 2009, 10:03:12 AM

its pretty much common knowledge support for a public option has always and still is in the 65% range

the problem is

1. the people who support it are sitting on their recliners at home and watching the teabaggers rage against it instead of getting out and making their side heard

2. the media has given an inordinate amount of coverage to the teabaggers to the point where people like bowzer think its actually the popular opinion

3. america is really dumb

ATV · October 20, 2009, 01:55:59 AM

...On the issue that has been perhaps the most pronounced flash point in the national debate, 57 percent of all Americans now favor a public insurance option, while 40 percent oppose it. Support has risen since mid-August, when a bare majority, 52 percent, said they favored it. (In a June Post-ABC poll, support was 62 percent.) ...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/19/AR2009101902451.html?hpid=topnews

bowzer · October 20, 2009, 06:48:53 PM

Quote from: ice grillin you on October 18, 2009, 10:03:12 AM
its pretty much common knowledge support for a public option has always and still is in the 65% range

the problem is

1. the people who support it are sitting on their recliners at home and watching the teabaggers rage against it instead of getting out and making their side heard

2. the media has given an inordinate amount of coverage to the teabaggers to the point where people like bowzer think its actually the popular opinion

3. america is really dumb

Sixty five percent???

Did you just pull that number out of your ass.

Oh yes.. you did.

bowzer · October 20, 2009, 06:53:27 PM

Quote from: ATV on October 20, 2009, 01:55:59 AM
...On the issue that has been perhaps the most pronounced flash point in the national debate, 57 percent of all Americans now favor a public insurance option, while 40 percent oppose it. Support has risen since mid-August, when a bare majority, 52 percent, said they favored it. (In a June Post-ABC poll, support was 62 percent.) ...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/19/AR2009101902451.html?hpid=topnews

Remember when I was bashed for posting a Washington Post poll.. saying it was skewed for the right.

farging hypocrites only using a poll when it back's up your bull shtein.

I think you forget this part of the article.

QuoteBut in a sign of the fragile coalition politics that influence the negotiations in Congress, Obama's approval ratings on health-care reform are slipping among his fellow Democrats even as they are solidifying among independents and seniors. Among Democrats, strong approval of his handling of the issue has dropped 15 percentage points since mid-September.

These numbers underscore the challenges ahead for the president and Democratic leaders in Congress as they attempt to maintain support among liberals and moderates in their own party while continuing to win over at least a few Republican lawmakers.

Overall, 45 percent of Americans favor the broad outlines of the proposals now moving in Congress, while 48 percent are opposed, about the same division that existed in August, at the height of angry town hall meetings over health-care reform. Seven in 10 Democrats back the plan, while almost nine in 10 Republicans oppose it. Independents divide 52 percent against, 42 percent in favor of the legislation.

.