So with the drafting of this guy Kolb I have to ask the question has McNabb ever gotten a fair shot to win the big one in Philly?
This is what I mean.
His entire time in Philly McNabb has been nothing but spectacular given what he has had to work with.
Think about it. When the defense was championship quality ReidandCo. were almost maniacal in their refusal to put a top flight reciever or running back on the team with him to take pressure off the young QB.
When the offense finally got good enough the defense couldn't hold up.
He has never had a top flight A-list RB to work with (I know Westy is great now but he had his best year when McNabb was hurt and the Eagles had no choice but to run the ball) or even a decent running game that could be counted on in a pinch.
I for one don't believe McNabb ever got a fair shake and the makeshift lines and lack of a running game and top flight recievers contributed to his being hurt as often as he was.
What do you think?
This thread eats more anus than picking Kolb at #36.
Quote from: FastFreddie on April 28, 2007, 08:44:41 PM
This thread eats more anus than picking Kolb at #36.
You are probably right but I just had to get it out of my system.
It's ok. There's a lot of that today.
Quote from: Displaced on April 28, 2007, 08:43:22 PM
So with the drafting of this guy Kolb I have to ask the question has McNabb ever gotten a fair shot to win the big one in Philly?
This is what I mean.
His entire time in Philly McNabb has been nothing but spectacular given what he has had to work with.
Think about it. When the defense was championship quality ReidandCo. were almost maniacal in their refusal to put a top flight reciever or running back on the team with him to take pressure off the young QB.
When the offense finally got good enough the defense couldn't hold up.
He has never had a top flight A-list RB to work with (I know Westy is great now but he had his best year when McNabb was hurt and the Eagles had no choice but to run the ball) or even a decent running game that could be counted on in a pinch.
I for one don't believe McNabb ever got a fair shake and the makeshift lines and lack of a running game and top flight recievers contributed to his being hurt as often as he was.
What do you think?
no i dont think he has. ppl might say well "the patriots did more with less" offensively but you know what mcnabb does not equal brady and he is not better than brady. plus the patriots, and other teams who won thru defense mostly, had some dominant defenses. the ravens, bucs, and pats all had great defenses. our defense was solid but it was never dominant like those defenses.
it just really confuses me. we have mcnabb yet they refuse to surround him with talent offensively. they have the money. they have the resources. they did it once with TO and they will never do it again.
(http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:dkU3-ZXc-o0v_M:http://www.cumberlink.com/content/articles/2007/03/15/ap/sports/football/d8nss25g0.jpg) says "Hi!!"
(Yes, I know he isn't TO, but he is a good receiver. Best we've had in the last 4 years not counting TO)
Quote from: Magical_Retard on April 29, 2007, 12:05:27 AM
Quote from: Displaced on April 28, 2007, 08:43:22 PM
So with the drafting of this guy Kolb I have to ask the question has McNabb ever gotten a fair shot to win the big one in Philly?
This is what I mean.
His entire time in Philly McNabb has been nothing but spectacular given what he has had to work with.
Think about it. When the defense was championship quality ReidandCo. were almost maniacal in their refusal to put a top flight reciever or running back on the team with him to take pressure off the young QB.
When the offense finally got good enough the defense couldn't hold up.
He has never had a top flight A-list RB to work with (I know Westy is great now but he had his best year when McNabb was hurt and the Eagles had no choice but to run the ball) or even a decent running game that could be counted on in a pinch.
I for one don't believe McNabb ever got a fair shake and the makeshift lines and lack of a running game and top flight recievers contributed to his being hurt as often as he was.
What do you think?
no i dont think he has. ppl might say well "the patriots did more with less" offensively but you know what mcnabb does not equal brady and he is not better than brady. plus the patriots, and other teams who won thru defense mostly, had some dominant defenses. the ravens, bucs, and pats all had great defenses. our defense was solid but it was never dominant like those defenses.
it just really confuses me. we have mcnabb yet they refuse to surround him with talent offensively. they have the money. they have the resources. they did it once with TO and they will never do it again.
Unfortunately, with McNabb coming off of two straight injury-blighted seasons, major knee surgery, and being on the wrong side of 30, you are probably right. His time may be nearing an end in Philadelphia.
I still think that McNabb is of a quality that can win a Super Bowl. I'm just fearful that ring may come elsewhere.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on April 29, 2007, 12:09:35 AM
Quote from: Magical_Retard on April 29, 2007, 12:05:27 AM
Quote from: Displaced on April 28, 2007, 08:43:22 PM
So with the drafting of this guy Kolb I have to ask the question has McNabb ever gotten a fair shot to win the big one in Philly?
This is what I mean.
His entire time in Philly McNabb has been nothing but spectacular given what he has had to work with.
Think about it. When the defense was championship quality ReidandCo. were almost maniacal in their refusal to put a top flight reciever or running back on the team with him to take pressure off the young QB.
When the offense finally got good enough the defense couldn't hold up.
He has never had a top flight A-list RB to work with (I know Westy is great now but he had his best year when McNabb was hurt and the Eagles had no choice but to run the ball) or even a decent running game that could be counted on in a pinch.
I for one don't believe McNabb ever got a fair shake and the makeshift lines and lack of a running game and top flight recievers contributed to his being hurt as often as he was.
What do you think?
no i dont think he has. ppl might say well "the patriots did more with less" offensively but you know what mcnabb does not equal brady and he is not better than brady. plus the patriots, and other teams who won thru defense mostly, had some dominant defenses. the ravens, bucs, and pats all had great defenses. our defense was solid but it was never dominant like those defenses.
it just really confuses me. we have mcnabb yet they refuse to surround him with talent offensively. they have the money. they have the resources. they did it once with TO and they will never do it again.
Unfortunately, with McNabb coming off of two straight injury-blighted seasons, major knee surgery, and being on the wrong side of 30, you are probably right. His time may be nearing an end in Philadelphia.
I still think that McNabb is of a quality that can win a Super Bowl. I'm just fearful that ring may come elsewhere.
yeah i know he is 30+ plus now but i still feel McNabb is in his prime. the saddest part about it is that the eagles know this but they refuse to help him out offensively. now if he comes back healthy and plays like he did last season, even without TO, they can have a decent OFFENSE but there is no point of the DEFENSE can not stop anyone.
its just sad that we have a franchise QB but the franchise refuses to help him win.
now i am totally depressed.
Quote from: Magical_Retard on April 29, 2007, 12:05:27 AM
it just really confuses me. we have mcnabb yet they refuse to surround him with talent offensively. they have the money. they have the resources. they did it once with TO and they will never do it again.
It's been that way since the day they drafted him and he came in for Dougy Fresh and was throwing to guys like Charles Johnson.
Now the FO is sticking their asses in Dmacs face with this pick.
so, will mcnabb step it up now that they drafted kolb....or will he cry like an oversensitive beeyotch?
Wanna know the real reason why they took Kolb?
It has nothing to do with the supposed fragile psyche of Donovan. Nor did it have anything to do with the injury thing either.
It's all about the cap number, baby. McNabb's contract runs through 2010 and he'll be 34 years old. Still young enough to get another big contract. Look at the salaries QBs are being paid now. Are they going to renegotiate his contract and pay a 34yr old QB like a king? Nope. So by 2010 Kolb will be ready, at least they hope so, and they'll extend his rookie contract and he'll be the starter. Watch.
Donovan's cap numbers:
2007: $8,835,000 (5.5 mil base salary)
2008: $9,635,000 (6.3 mil base salry)
2009: $9,206,000 (9.2 mil base salary)
2010: $10,006,000 (10 mil base salary)
Considering Donovan's durability issues in his late 20's, I'm ok with him being jettisoned by the time he's 34.
It's not like his body is going to start healing faster or resisting injury better.
I think the key is they have to protect him. They have to develop the kind of offense the Broncos had at the end with Elway. The offensive line they have can do the job if that is the mentality they have from the outset. They have to establish it right from the first minicamp and carry it through. I am not saying they don't use the quick strike they had last year but they need to run some teams down and beat them up a little, on both sides of the ball but especially on offense.
According to Eskin today, who I caught a little bit of around 5pm;
The weeks prior to McNabb blowing his knee out were spent discussing a contract extension for him.
The only way to truly give McNabb a fair shake would obviously be to get Keyshawn Johnson.
Quote from: Displaced on April 29, 2007, 04:12:16 PM
I think the key is they have to protect him. They have to develop the kind of offense the Broncos had at the end with Elway. The offensive line they have can do the job if that is the mentality they have from the outset. They have to establish it right from the first minicamp and carry it through. I am not saying they don't use the quick strike they had last year but they need to run some teams down and beat them up a little, on both sides of the ball but especially on offense.
i agree with you but was last yrs knee injury even a protection issue? he seemd to have torn it on a routine play and wasnt even hit hard.
my main concern with mcnabb is that we over use him in the sense we ask him to pass too much.
we have westbrook, buckhalter, and hunt now and while the first 2 arent role models of "healthy" i think we have capable bodies to run at least 30 times a game with westbrook getting the bulk of the carries.
GCobb on the stupid media firestorm that once again is surrounding Donovan;
QuoteI talked to a source close to Donovan McNabb yesterday and a member of the Philadelphia Eagles PR staff and they both said McNabb is busy working out and refusing to get caught up in another mole hill being turned into a mountain by the local sports media. They said he's not seething about the Eagles picking Kevin Kolb with their first pick, like was reported by Comcast Sportsnet. Some of the things I've learned about McNabb's coming and going this weekend and on Monday and Tuesday have made me wonder if this episode is a case of one hand not knowing what the other was doing.
Andy Reid says he called Donovan McNabb after making the pick of Houston quarterback Kevin Kolb and left a message because he was unable to get in touch with him. Les Bowen of the Philly.com reports that Reid and McNabb finally caught up with each other on Tuesday. You'd think by putting these two stories together that Reid was trying to get in touch with the veteran quarterback and McNabb was avoiding the coach, but that's not the case. I've learned that Donovan was working out under the guidance of Eagles personnel on Saturday when the Eagles made the pick of Kolb. He was at the Eagles Nova Care facility on Monday working out again. I don't see how Andy Reid couldn't have spoken to him if he wanted to do so, on Saturday or on Monday. The Nova Care Complex is big but it isn't that big. Bowen reports Andy finally talked to Donovan on Tuesday.
I don't think Reid tried that hard to get in touch with McNabb because he didn't think it was that big a deal. He just wanted to leave a message as a minor gesture, so they would be on the same page about them grabbing a young QB early in the draft. But we know that everything concerning Donovan here in Philly, is made to seem to be sinister and contrived. If McNabb is working out under the supervision of Philadelphia Eagles personnel, then you'd figure that Andy Reid should know that or be able to find that out. As I said yesterday, Donovan isn't hiding out anywhere and he hasn't been out on the run like a fugitive, the way some would have to believe. Here you have another case of the local sports media creating a big mountain out of nothing. That's why I kind of understand McNabb's reluctance to play along with the game.
After listening to and reading all the Philly nonsense, you'd think McNabb was avoiding seeing the coach but he's obviously not if he is working out every day at the Nova Care Complex under the guidance of the Birds training staff. The Eagles have a mini-camp coming up on May 12th and I know McNabb will be there watching and probably talk to the media during that weekend. But that's not good enough for our local sports media because they want him to play into all these media-created episodes and come running out to respond each time there's some nonsense started. The media wants to be able to dictate when he talks. I've learned that Donovan refuses to let all the speculating and rumor creating dominate his thinking because he knows he's got to focus on getting back to full strength. If he doesn't get ready to play then that would be a serious issue. What do you think McNabb should do? Should he bow down to the local sports media and answer every rumor and speculation? Or shoud he focus on recovering from an ACL tear and get ready to play football?
If Donovan were to come out and speak now or were to have called a news conference or have put out a statement, would that stop people from speculating and putting words in his mouth. The guy can't win for losing here in Philly because just as soon as he says something, all of the local sports media, now-turned psychologists will start to pick apart his every word, and every blink of the eye.
How mentally weak of McNabb to not come out and talk about this.
Let me just save a lot of folks the trouble and say "Waaaaaaaaahhhhh" for those who'll no doubt still go on thinking that McNabb is all pissy over the Kolb pick.
whether hes pissy or not...and im pretty sure he is...he needs to come out and make a statement...yeah the media is nuts over the eagles in this town but as a player you gotta know this...so come out and give a couple interviews saying youre not worried about it and you look forward to tutoring young kolb ect ect ect
mcnabb brings this all on himself by not saying anything and instead having his father make inflammatory statements on his behalf...and i dont wanna hear how he has no control over his parents....his parents needs to shut their mouths permanently and mcnabb needs to step up and stop being a little baby and just speak...had he done that this wouldnt even be an issue right now....what 30+ year old pro athelete not named eric lindros has his parents speaking to the media all the time and making blog entires on his behalf...its all so gay...grow a set donovan
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on May 02, 2007, 06:58:22 AM
GCobb on the stupid media firestorm that once again is surrounding Donovan;
QuoteI talked to a source close to Donovan McNabb yesterday and a member of the Philadelphia Eagles PR staff and they both said McNabb is busy working out and refusing to get caught up in another mole hill being turned into a mountain by the local sports media. They said he's not seething about the Eagles picking Kevin Kolb with their first pick, like was reported by Comcast Sportsnet. Some of the things I've learned about McNabb's coming and going this weekend and on Monday and Tuesday have made me wonder if this episode is a case of one hand not knowing what the other was doing.
Andy Reid says he called Donovan McNabb after making the pick of Houston quarterback Kevin Kolb and left a message because he was unable to get in touch with him. Les Bowen of the Philly.com reports that Reid and McNabb finally caught up with each other on Tuesday. You'd think by putting these two stories together that Reid was trying to get in touch with the veteran quarterback and McNabb was avoiding the coach, but that's not the case. I've learned that Donovan was working out under the guidance of Eagles personnel on Saturday when the Eagles made the pick of Kolb. He was at the Eagles Nova Care facility on Monday working out again. I don't see how Andy Reid couldn't have spoken to him if he wanted to do so, on Saturday or on Monday. The Nova Care Complex is big but it isn't that big. Bowen reports Andy finally talked to Donovan on Tuesday.
I don't think Reid tried that hard to get in touch with McNabb because he didn't think it was that big a deal. He just wanted to leave a message as a minor gesture, so they would be on the same page about them grabbing a young QB early in the draft. But we know that everything concerning Donovan here in Philly, is made to seem to be sinister and contrived. If McNabb is working out under the supervision of Philadelphia Eagles personnel, then you'd figure that Andy Reid should know that or be able to find that out. As I said yesterday, Donovan isn't hiding out anywhere and he hasn't been out on the run like a fugitive, the way some would have to believe. Here you have another case of the local sports media creating a big mountain out of nothing. That's why I kind of understand McNabb's reluctance to play along with the game.
After listening to and reading all the Philly nonsense, you'd think McNabb was avoiding seeing the coach but he's obviously not if he is working out every day at the Nova Care Complex under the guidance of the Birds training staff. The Eagles have a mini-camp coming up on May 12th and I know McNabb will be there watching and probably talk to the media during that weekend. But that's not good enough for our local sports media because they want him to play into all these media-created episodes and come running out to respond each time there's some nonsense started. The media wants to be able to dictate when he talks. I've learned that Donovan refuses to let all the speculating and rumor creating dominate his thinking because he knows he's got to focus on getting back to full strength. If he doesn't get ready to play then that would be a serious issue. What do you think McNabb should do? Should he bow down to the local sports media and answer every rumor and speculation? Or shoud he focus on recovering from an ACL tear and get ready to play football?
If Donovan were to come out and speak now or were to have called a news conference or have put out a statement, would that stop people from speculating and putting words in his mouth. The guy can't win for losing here in Philly because just as soon as he says something, all of the local sports media, now-turned psychologists will start to pick apart his every word, and every blink of the eye.
(http://www.philaflava.com/forum/images/smiles/didntread4gd.gif)
And IGY knows "pissy" and "bitch-made!" :D
IGY,
McNabb doesn't have to say a goddamn thing. He isn't at the media's beck and call whenever something goes down. Because you know what? If he comes out and holds a PC there's a group of haters (the same ones blasting him for being quiet) who rip away for him talking and not concentrating on football.
And you act like he gets on the phone with his parents and tells 'em to start talking. Yeah they need to shut up but its not like Donovan has them issuing statements for him. They speak when the reporters call them or invite them on DNL to be grilled.
McNabb needs to keep his mouth shut, rehab, and come to camp ready to go. He doesn't need to be Brett Favre and pull the "I ain't gonna mentor no one" nor does he need to be a Doug Pederson and carry Kolb's golf bag either. He needs to keep his mouth hushed and work.
of course he can keep his mouth shut and say absolutely nothing and let his parents do all the talking and fan the flames...thats his absolute right
or he can give one interview to the outlet of his choice and end all this asap...he wont do that tho because hes afraid of what hes gonna say...which will be something akin to what his father said or even worse
but what will happen is that he and his family will continue to hurl veiled disses of the eagles fans and the city then they will continue to wonder why people think their son is such a whiny bastich
One thing that I have always been curious about is why is it okay for us (fans) to blast players but when they take some shots back some get all offended?
I hear it on the radio all the time. Its kinda like "yo, we can rip you but god forbid if you rip us back"
Donovan takes a ton of shtein here - so what if he takes a shot or two back? And why do you keep insisting that he has his parents speaking for him? Whats he gonna do? Put a muzzle on them?
PFT:
QuoteCan someone tell us when Donovan McNabb became the coach, G.M., president, or owner of this team? Because we missed the news release.
Why does McNabb have this organization clutched by the short and curlies? The mere fact that the organization feels compelled to walk on eggshells around him makes us think that the time has come for a change.
And why should McNabb get a double-extra helping of deference from the team, the media, or anyone? Because of the Super Bowls he has won? Because of the MVP awards on his mantle?
In our view, McNabb is a good quarterback with periodic flashes of greatnesses but who has yet to deliver when it counts the most, and whose body gives out on him too frequently for him to be the long-term solution for a team that is securing its young talent well into the next decade.
The fans simply want a winning team, and an NFL championship would be nice. McNabb is becoming too much of a distraction, both due to his quiet-but-obvious selfishness and his proneness to injury.
Think about the comments that periodically come from his parents. Surely, McNabb has the ability to get them to put a sock in it, if he so chooses. By not telling them to mind their business, McNabb is creating the impression that they are his messengers as to subjects on which he's not ready to get his hands dirty.
The mere fact that the team drafted Kolb tells us that the organization has at least had the internal conversation as to whether McNabb is the long-term solution. The manner in which McNabb reacts to this latest development could go a long way toward helping the powers-that-be make their decision.
mclindross needs to grow a set & tell his parents to stfu.
that is all.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 11:24:03 AM
of course he can keep his mouth shut and say absolutely nothing and let his parents do all the talking and fan the flames...thats his absolute right
or he can give one interview to the outlet of his choice and end all this asap...he wont do that tho because hes afraid of what hes gonna say...which will be something akin to what his father said or even worse
but what will happen is that he and his family will continue to hurl veiled disses of the eagles fans and the city then they will continue to wonder why people think their son is such a whiny bastich
That's crap and you know it.
Example: The whole TO firestorm. For weeks he kept his mouth shut about what happened, never slandered anyone and kept things in house. And he got shtein for that. Then, he chose to give an interview to ESPN, which was aired/published leading up to the superbowl, where he said what was on his mind, and did not hold anything back. And the same people jumping on him to to say something, came out and said "Well why did he go to espn, and not a local guy?" or "He should have picked a better time to do it"
So he did exactly what you think he should do now...and got ripped for it.
These are the same voices that went on about the Eagles coddle McNabb, that they are afraid to give him any real job security threat, that the QB job is his without questions. Those cries did a complete 180 on that the second Kolb was picked.
What difference does it make how he feels about the pick of Kolb? You said it before, it doesn't matter the moviation...you play, or you don't. It's pretty well known that vets ALWAYS see rooks as threats to their jobs. If he hates Kolb...fine. If they sleep together...fine. It makes no difference when it comes to the game. If anyone else on the team plays ANY differently depending on who the QB is? They should be cut.
You don't know what McNabb s thinking...or what he is doing. So stop pretending. Because some fatass reporter (eckle, brookover, franks, bowen, etc....) speculates enough and ads just enough conjecture to sound like they are actually "reporting" on something...does not mean they actually are.
TO was a situation where another person was attacking him repeatedly and he took it up the ass
this is a situation where the eagles made a draft pick he didnt like
apples and oranges
if mcnabbs daddy didnt come out with his ridiculous comments the other day and instead mcnabb had come out and said a couple quick comments about the draft like every other quarterback in the league would do if their team drafted a qb then this would be over
but instead he sent one of his parents to do his dirty work...making him look paranoid/upset/pissed about the pick and in general making himself look more and more bitchmade
31 other teams would be lined-up. LINED-UP, I SAY!
:-D
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 01:05:25 PM
TO was a situation where another person was attacking him repeatedly and he took it up the ass
this is a situation where the eagles made a draft pick he didnt like
apples and oranges
if mcnabbs daddy didnt come out with his ridiculous comments the other day and instead mcnabb had come out and said a couple quick comments about the draft like every other quarterback in the league would do if their team drafted a qb then this would be over
but instead he sent one of his parents to do his dirty work...making him look paranoid/upset/pissed about the pick and in general making himself look more and more bitchmade
for mcnabb its a lose lose situation. if he says something he loses cause the media will be like "ohh he spoke...he felt compeled to address it...hes seething" and if he doesnt the same ppl will say "omg he is quiet and doesnt say anything that must mean he is seething". its all bs. the media doesnt have much to talk about. they must have loved TO...he was always ready for a interview or press conference.
you want a pefect example? last playoff run ppl kept speculating about his relationship with Garcia and that he might be unhappy with garcia's success. what did mcnabb say? he came out in multiple interviews and said he has a great relationship with garcia and that hes rooting for him and the team as he recovers. how did you and others in the media respond? by saying "yeah well hes just saying that but hes soft and he doesnt like that garcia is helping them win". how do you really know so much about him?
has anything his parents have said been a distraction to the team or the games they play?
and why isnt there any accountability for those who claim mcnabb was pissed and seething?
and now that stupid PFT article. mcnabb is a distraction? its a distraction when a player doesnt speak and just quietly goes about his buisness? doesnt get in trouble with the law? hes selfish cause he doesnt talk to the press much? the real distraction is the off season cause these hacks have nothing to write about and so they sit around analyzing every single sentence, noun, verb, or adjective uttered so they can break it down and hope to come out with a controversy.
personally i dont care if mcnabb is softer than soft served ice cream...it doesnt affect his play on the field. he takes the hits, plays hurt, and gives it his all. thats all i really care about.
oops double post.
i dont recall anyone ever saying that mcnabb didnt like garcia...he was pissed that the city took to garcia so well....and his mom and mcnabb made comments to that issue...again such a petty thing...if he hated one of his teammates pesonally that would be one thing but to again be upset with the fans...the mean nasty philly fans...is so played out and weak
i dont think mcnabb is a distraction to his team at all...TO was a distraction to his team...but i do think mcnabb worrys more about the eagles fans and if people like him than he does football....i also think mcnabb wants to win but i think when all is said and done and hes superbowless hes gonna have a sense of satisfaction inside because those icehole philly fans didnt get a title
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 01:26:07 PM
i dont think mcnabb is a distraction to his team at all...
....i also think mcnabb wants to win
Well that right there is the start, and end to all issues relevant regarding this situation.
Everything else is just crap to talk about on the radio or type out on the internet over.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 01:26:07 PM
i dont recall anyone ever saying that mcnabb didnt like garcia...he was pissed that the city took to garcia so well....and his mom and mcnabb made comments to that issue...again such a petty thing...if he hated one of his teammates pesonally that would be one thing but to again be upset with the fans...the mean nasty philly fans...is so played out and weak
i dont think mcnabb is a distraction to his team at all...TO was a distraction to his team...but i do think mcnabb worrys more about the eagles fans and if people like him than he does football....i also think mcnabb wants to win but i think when all is said and done and hes superbowless hes gonna have a sense of satisfaction inside because those icehole philly fans didnt get a title
when did he say he was upset with the fans cheering for garcia?
all i remember his mom saying was that its hard cause the team is doing good but her son is on the sideline.
i dont remember but did mcnabb say anything back in 03 when they kept chanting for AJ?
hes not a distraction in the locker room ala TO...but his lack of intestinal fortitude definitely affects his ability to perform on the field...his lack of leadership compared to someone like garcia is also something that would help the team...numerous players spoke out loud last year how with garcia in "it was just different"
also his desire to win is not in question but as ive mentioned before his desire to not want to lose is non existent
both these things are not radio and internet mumble jumble
want a good example look at b dawk....hes ultra talented with heart soul and a hate of losing to match...hes going to the hall of fame...mcnabb dosnt match his talent with any fo that stuff....hes going to end up being just another quarterback in he nfl
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 01:38:29 PM
hes not a distraction in the locker room ala TO...but his lack of intestinal fortitude definitely affects his ability to perform on the field...his lack of leadership compared to someone like garcia is also something that would help the team...numerous players spoke out loud last year how with garcia in "it was just different"
also his desire to win is not in question but as ive mentioned before his desire to not want to lose is non existent
both these things are not radio and internet mumble jumble
want a good example look at b dawk....hes ultra talented with heart soul and a hate of losing to match...hes going to the hall of fame...mcnabb dosnt match his talent with any fo that stuff....hes going to end up being just another quarterback in he nfl
(http://www.philaflava.com/forum/images/smiles/didntread4gd.gif)
all i remember his mom saying was that its hard cause the team is doing good but her son is on the sideline.
do you honestly believe that blog entry was written without mcnabbs knowledge/approval???
if you do then we really will just have to agree to disagree
imo mcnabb and his parents carefully plan what each other says...often using one of the parents to say stuff mcnabb doesnt want to say himself
theyve all hated eagles fans since the day he was booed at the draft and have never gotten over it and never will...in fact their hatred has clearly manifested itself over time and just continues to get stronger
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 01:44:00 PM
theyve all hated eagles fans since the day he was booed at the draft and have never gotten over it and never will...in fact their hatred has clearly manifested itself over time and just continues to get stronger
Do you blame them? We're mostly narrow-minded, obstinate ass hats. I'd hate us too.
With the media twisting silence & turning benign comments into perceived hostility, I'd have stopped talking to them back in 2003.
They don't seem to mind reaping the benefits of him playing football in Philly, though, do they?
They're victims! Victims, I say!!
Do you blame them? We're mostly narrow-minded, obstinate ass hats. I'd hate us too.
well i blame them for their petty nonsensical actions...but at the same time i fully admit its not an easy place to play...
however i would expect that you rise somewhat above it when youre getting 125 million dollars to do so
i respect scott rolen much more than mcnabb...rolen was like farg this place no amount of money can keep me here...granted he had more of a problem with the front office than the fans but he hated the city...
mike schmidt hates us and yet he was a hall of famer and won a title here....and he did it the right way...he was up front over his dislike of the fans and media (the thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day) and he was comical with it (the costume)
guys like mcnabb just dont get it
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 02, 2007, 02:35:32 PM
They don't seem to mind reaping the benefits of him playing football in Philly, though, do they?
They're victims! Victims, I say!!
You don't need to love something to have a financially beneficial relationship with it. Just ask your wife. :-*
Quote from: Beermonkey on May 02, 2007, 03:53:21 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 02, 2007, 02:35:32 PM
They don't seem to mind reaping the benefits of him playing football in Philly, though, do they?
They're victims! Victims, I say!!
You don't need to love something to have a financially beneficial relationship with it. Just ask my wife. :-*
Oh, snap.
shut up...all of you
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 02:52:34 PM
mike schmidt hates us and yet he was a hall of famer and won a title here....and he did it the right way...he was up front over his dislike of the fans and media (the thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day) and he was comical with it (the costume)
guys like mcnabb just dont get it
Hopefully he'll kick a fan in the nuts so we can all move past this to focus on his inaccuracy.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 02, 2007, 03:54:44 PM
Quote from: Beermonkey on May 02, 2007, 03:53:21 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 02, 2007, 02:35:32 PM
They don't seem to mind reaping the benefits of him playing football in Philly, though, do they?
They're victims! Victims, I say!!
You don't need to love something to have a financially beneficial relationship with it. Just ask my wife. :-*
Oh, snap.
D-
Mine gets no financial benefit, other than what she finds in the wash.
If we keep this up long enough, mussa's gonna go postal.
i'm sure he has another pressing HDTV or OnDemand question
Salisbury & Clayton were just yapping about the McNabb situation. Salisbury used the term "slap in the face" in describing the Eagles picking Kolb.
He also suggested that Andy & Donovan need to sit down and talk things out so this doesn't ruin the season or their relationship.
I suspect Bristol, Connecticut isn't a prime target for nuclear terrorism, but if wishes did come true...
If terrorists really knew about American life, it would be.
I wonder how long it will take the city to turn on Kolb once he takes over?
Tough, fiery guy with an atiitude who fans perceive as being blue collar + marginal talent = love in Philly
Quieter type guy who refuses to get into media pissing matched + very good talent = hate in Philly.
I already don't like him. Boo Kolb! Booo!
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on May 03, 2007, 01:19:51 AMQuieter type guy who refuses to get into media pissing matched + very good talent = hate in Philly.
Which Philadelphia quarterback took this angle?
You aren't talking about McNabb. He's pissing with the best of him in his own passive aggressive, soft minded way.
Exactly. He doesn't talk much, but when he finally does, he displays just how weak-minded he is.
According to Donovan's brain, everyone's out to get him.
kolb is my myspace friend....so i have to like him.
Quote from: Displaced on April 28, 2007, 08:43:22 PMhas McNabb ever gotten a fair shot to win the big one in Philly?
Yes.
i guess this pic goes here.
(http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/861/tm1animationfh8.gif)
:-D
That ain't right, dude.
wow
This topic is ridiculous because McNabb was part of a very talented team in 2002, 2003 and 2004 that had legit shots at championships. However, having said that, the front office hasn't done everything it could in two major ways:
1. They never bothered to find McNabb a receiving threat to grow with. The drafted Mitchell, but he obviously wasn't a star and they knew that fairly early on. They got TO, but knew that they he was going to be on a short leash and certainly never planned on having him around for the long term. McNabb is a good quarterback with GREAT ability and if he had had some talent on the outside to get some experience and chemistry with, he would be a much better player than he is.
2. They farging coddled him. At no point in his professional career has he been held accountable for any of his failures. He was labeled 'The Franchise' the instant he was drafted. When he has not played well, no one inside the orgaization has ever said anything even remotely negative about him. When he passive aggressively whines about shtein no one says anything. He's been handled kids gloves since his arrival and has never been forced to toughen up or grow up. And that, more than anything, is how the organization has failed MacNabb.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 04, 2007, 08:50:39 AM
:-D
That ain't right, dude.
i'm not taking credit for the pic or saying i agree with it...i jacked it from the emb.
it's kinda funny though. :paranoid
They never bothered to find McNabb a receiving threat to grow with
i have no problem with the wide receiver excuse...i will only say that there has always been a large portion of eagle fans who say how great mcnabb is then say he hasnt been given wr's....you cant have it both ways...either hes not that great of a qb and needs great wr's or hes a great qb whos failed
i mean mcnabb was so great to get a team without wr's to a league champisonhip game but as soon as he got there the wr's all of sudden started to hold the team back...i dont buy it
look around at the teams that have won superbowls over say the last ten years...theres been teams without great wr that have won titles
They farging coddled him
the question here is did they coddle him because he was andys signature pick and they didnt want to show his faults or did they coddle him because they know better than anyone that hes softbatch
When it comes down to it, my biggest complaint about Donovan is that he let's haters get to him a lot more than he should:
Cataldi in 1999
Limbaugh
Philly NAACP
None of that was actually "adversity". Tom Brady got drafted in the 6th round. That's adversity.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 04, 2007, 09:16:14 AM
They never bothered to find McNabb a receiving threat to grow with
i have no problem with the wide receiver excuse...i will only say that there has always been a large portion of eagle fans who say how great mcnabb is then say he hasnt been given wr's....you cant have it both ways...either hes not that great of a qb and needs great wr's or hes a great qb whos failed
i mean mcnabb was so great to get a team without wr's to a league champisonhip game but as soon as he got there the wr's all of sudden started to hold the team back...i dont buy it
look around at the teams that have won superbowls over say the last ten years...theres been teams without great wr that have won titles
I agree 100% with all of this. You don't need great receivers to win the big one and less talented teams have earned superbowl wins. My point was simply that McNabb has never had a chance to develop chemistry with a receiver b/c he's never had the same receiving corps, let alone a star, to play with for more than a year or two at a time and I'm pretty sure he'd be a lot further along if he had been given some stability.
definitely
i guess imo the bottom line is mcnabb is overrated and needs more help than most people would admit including andy reid
theres also the matter of andy reid not only overrating mcnabb but overrating his own offensive system....but thats another thread
When I read a question like this, all I can see is Donovan laughing after throwing an INT or ugly incompletion, as though he doesn't have a care in the world.
Fair shot? Yeah...he's had a more than fair shot.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 04, 2007, 09:16:14 AM
They never bothered to find McNabb a receiving threat to grow with
i have no problem with the wide receiver excuse...i will only say that there has always been a large portion of eagle fans who say how great mcnabb is then say he hasnt been given wr's....you cant have it both ways...either hes not that great of a qb and needs great wr's or hes a great qb whos failed
i mean mcnabb was so great to get a team without wr's to a league champisonhip game but as soon as he got there the wr's all of sudden started to hold the team back...i dont buy it
look around at the teams that have won superbowls over say the last ten years...theres been teams without great wr that have won title.
This argument just doesn't follow logically.
The fact that he has accomplished as much as he has without the great supporting cast speaks volumes about his individual ability.
Remember something...winning in the regular season and the first round of the playoffs is a whole different thing altogether than winning the Conference Championship game or the Superbowl. When you get there the teams with the greatest overall team or the team that is simply hot and playing the best football of the season wins.
Yes ther have been teams without great WRs that won the Superbowl but that is part of my original point. The Ravens did it with average receivers but had great play from them when it counted most and rode a dominating defense to the Chip. Same can be said for the Bucs as well as the Patriots.
The Stealers rode a great running game as did the Broncos.
I think it is fair to say that if put at the helm of any of those teams McNabb would have had as much success.
My beef or more accurately my point is that for whatever reason the Eagles did not field the kind of team that made up for it's deficencies the way these other teams did during McNabb's tenure up to this point.
Running Game: Broncos, Ravens, Patriots, Stealers, Rams
Dominating defense: Ravens, Bucs. Pats, Stealers
Dominating recieving core: Colts, Rams
Quote from: Displaced on May 04, 2007, 08:51:41 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 04, 2007, 09:16:14 AM
They never bothered to find McNabb a receiving threat to grow with
i have no problem with the wide receiver excuse...i will only say that there has always been a large portion of eagle fans who say how great mcnabb is then say he hasnt been given wr's....you cant have it both ways...either hes not that great of a qb and needs great wr's or hes a great qb whos failed
i mean mcnabb was so great to get a team without wr's to a league champisonhip game but as soon as he got there the wr's all of sudden started to hold the team back...i dont buy it
look around at the teams that have won superbowls over say the last ten years...theres been teams without great wr that have won title.
This argument just doesn't follow logically.
The fact that he has accomplished as much as he has without the great supporting cast speaks volumes about his individual ability.
Remember something...winning in the regular season and the first round of the playoffs is a whole different thing altogether than winning the Conference Championship game or the Superbowl. When you get there the teams with the greatest overall team or the team that is simply hot and playing the best football of the season wins.
Yes ther have been teams without great WRs that won the Superbowl but that is part of my original point. The Ravens did it with average receivers but had great play from them when it counted most and rode a dominating defense to the Chip. Same can be said for the Bucs as well as the Patriots.
The Stealers rode a great running game as did the Broncos.
I think it is fair to say that if put at the helm of any of those teams McNabb would have had as much success.
My beef or more accurately my point is that for whatever reason the Eagles did not field the kind of team that made up for it's deficencies the way these other teams did during McNabb's tenure up to this point.
Running Game: Broncos, Ravens, Patriots, Stealers, Rams
Dominating defense: Ravens, Bucs. Pats, Stealers
Dominating recieving core: Colts, Rams
exactly...those teams with ok to good WRs had either dominating DEFENSES or RUNNING games which the coaches actually used. with mcnabb its been that he hasnt really had the great WRs and instead of realizing this and running the ball to make up for the lack of WRs we keep passing. defensively we were solid but i wouldnt say dominating...esp against the run.
with that said when you get to 4 straight to NFC champ games you expect to win the big one at least once. the pats did overmatch them but mcnabb and the eagles did not live up to expectations on at least 2 out of those 4 runs. mcnabb had a lot do with that with his INTs which i blame him and the WRs for.
in the end its not that he hasnt had a fair shot or a team capable of winning it all, its just that the teams he has had were never utilized correctly.
i love the revisionist history with the eagles defense.....they had some great defenses...plenty good enough to win the superbowl much less get to it
from 2000-2004 the eagles defense ranked the following in pts 4, 2, 2, 7, 3
their running game with duce and westbrook was fine as well...you certainly can blame coaching here as reid didnt utilize it as much as he should but again they had a fine running game finishing in the top in rushing a couple of those years
the bottom line is that mcnabb hasnt been a good enough qb to win a championship throwing up some real bad games in some real big spots...were the wr's not good enough yes...but it wasnt that they werent good enough to win a superbowl it was that they werent good enough to win a superbowl with a qb like mcnabb...someone who isnt very accurate doesnt play under pressure that well and isnt a guy thats gonna elevate his receivers he needs receivers that will elevate him
has he been given the best shot possible as some other QB's. No
has he been given a good shot. yes
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 04, 2007, 10:49:04 PM
i love the revisionist history with the eagles defense.....they had some great defenses...plenty good enough to win the superbowl much less get to it
from 2000-2004 the eagles defense ranked the following in pts 4, 2, 2, 7, 3
their running game with duce and westbrook was fine as well...you certainly can blame coaching here as reid didnt utilize it as much as he should but again they had a fine running game finishing in the top in rushing a couple of those years
the bottom line is that mcnabb hasnt been a good enough qb to win a championship throwing up some real bad games in some real big spots...were the wr's not good enough yes...but it wasnt that they werent good enough to win a superbowl it was that they werent good enough to win a superbowl with a qb like mcnabb...someone who isnt very accurate doesnt play under pressure that well and isnt a guy thats gonna elevate his receivers he needs receivers that will elevate him
like i said....aside from the st louis game and the carolina game (no westbrook and WRs being beaten up all game) our team really had no excuses. but im not going to blame mcnabb completely for those. but he did have a lot to do with that. it also had to do with the WRs who are either not in the league anymore or are 3-4 on the depth chart on other teams who rarely got open. as for the defense they were great and kept us in games most of the season but just cause your ranked behind baltimore or tampa bay does not mean your at their level. esp the baltimore defense...it was a force. they won with trent dilfer. does that mean dilfer is better than mcnabb? at least baltimore knew what they had and how to make it work.
you like to propagate this myth that McNabb did not make these WRs better. has anyone? pinkston and mitchell are no longer in the league. trash is buried in washington. McNabb could have played better but he did no have a lot to work with. you yourself claim the NFC was so weak and thats why we made it so far each year so a lot figured into it.
and of course a lot falls on reid for having duce, buck (he was pretty good when healthy), and westbrook and pretty much refusing to use them unless it was in the passing/screen game.
anyway this is kinda pointless...if McNabb wins the big one sometime it will be all forgotten like it was with others and if he doesnt then he is forever cursed to be analyzed by everyone as if he was a psych patient. i just personally think that with the resources available to this FO, they could have done more to make us win now (or back then).
As I mentioned in another thread once, I don't give two shteins about any individual on this team. I want the Eagles to win a ring so I can enjoy it. And I don't really care who on the team does that. If they're part of the problem, ship 'em. And the number one problem on this team is Reid.
but im not going to blame mcnabb completely
no one is
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 05, 2007, 09:12:47 AM
but im not going to blame mcnabb completely
no one is
well you might not be but the majority of the anti mcnabb fanbase thinks everything is his fault.
QuotePhil Sheridan | McNabb's treatment should trouble Kolb
By Phil Sheridan
Inquirer Columnist
Injured quarterback Donovan McNabb (right) was on the sideline with Eagles coach Andy Reid during a Giants game in January.
ERIC MENCHER / Inquirer Staff Photographer
Injured quarterback Donovan McNabb (right) was on the sideline with Eagles coach Andy Reid during a Giants game in January.
As the week dragged on and the jackals tore at Donovan McNabb for doing absolutely nothing at all, thoughts naturally turned toward poor Kevin Kolb.
If he listened to anything but country hits on his radio, surfed anything but houstoncougars.com on his computer or overheard a single public conversation during his time here, young Mr. Kolb must have been very happy to get home to Texas. His enthusiasm for returning to Philadelphia is likely another matter.
This is what awaits you, Mr. Kolb. Be very afraid.
Eight years ago, this city got off on the worst possible foot with the man who would become the best quarterback in Eagles history. The ramifications of draft day 1999 are indelible and deep, and let's just skip the debate over whether McNabb and his family should have moved on. What's done is done.
The issue here is whether anyone learns from mistakes, or whether we are doomed to keep repeating them until all the glaciers melt and we're washed away without ever witnessing another championship.
The issue here is not McNabb, it is Kolb.
He struck the right chord last week when asked about the televised reaction to his selection. There wasn't quite the angry mob that greeted McNabb's selection in '99, but there was enough booing for the Kolb family to notice. Kevin, preparing himself for the rest of his football career, calmed everyone down and told them it was time to grow "a thick skin."
Kolb had no idea at that moment just how thick it would have to be. If he caught wind of the ridiculous McNabb bashing that went on here all week, he's beginning to understand.
A quick review, for those of you who may have been engaged in other pursuits, such as earning a living, cutting the grass or spending quality time with your loved ones:
Eight days ago, the Eagles traded out of the first round of the draft - allowing Dallas to get the defensive end it coveted - and took Kolb with the 36th overall pick.
In his only known comment on the matter, McNabb reportedly e-mailed ESPN's Michael Smith that he was "befuddled" by the pick. Not angry or bitter or demanding a trade, but "befuddled." That would arguably place him among the 99 percent of fans, media, draftniks and classical oboists who were confused and surprised by the pick.
Since then, McNabb - who has never commented on an Eagles draft before his next scheduled availability at a May minicamp - has followed form and uttered not a peep about this draft.
The Daily News called his father, Sam, who said - gasp! - that he wasn't concerned by the pick and that he has no control over what the Eagles do.
Get me rewrite.
The Inquirer called his agent, Fletcher Smith, who said - the nerve! - "I think if it were truly a big deal, you'd probably have heard from [McNabb] by now."
Stop the presses.
So naturally McNabb was ripped for having other people speak for him. Never mind that reporters called his father and agent, not the other way around. And never mind that neither one of them said a cross word about Kolb, Andy Reid, Jeff Garcia or those 1933 throwback uniforms.
The weeklong filleting and roasting of McNabb was what passes for business here. But take a moment to hear or read the personal invective from Kolb's perspective. The subject of all this scorn, derision and hostility is a five-time Pro Bowl quarterback who took his team to four conference championship games and a Super Bowl before age 30, a Hall of Famer if he's able to bounce back from injury and play another five years at the same level.
If everything goes just right for Kolb in the NFL, he'll be fortunate to have a career anywhere near as good as the one McNabb is having. The odds are against him; nothing personal, it's just the cold reality that more young quarterbacks fail in the NFL than succeed. So if he overcomes those odds, if he has a certifiably brilliant career here, if he conducts himself with class, stays out of trouble and gives back to the community - if he does all that, he can look forward to being ridiculed and scorned.
Kolb can avoid that fate, of course. It is simple.
All he has to do is complete every pass, win every game, hoist a Lombardi trophy at the end of every season, wear the correct facial expression at all times, get along with every teammate no matter how horrible, never accept a single endorsement that might irritate a single Eagles fan, and be sure his parents, wife and agent never express a single thought of their own.
That, or Philadelphia could change. Which do you think is more likely?
Welcome to town, Mr. Kolb. Enjoy your stay.
Sheridan is on point.
Notorious Eagle-hater Rob Charry was all over this today. I was "fortunate" to catch some of his show on the way home this afternoon, boy what a dooshbag. He cries about how McNabb should come out and address this drafting of Kolb. Then not two seconds later he rips McNabb for saying this was a Super Bowl team during training camp last year (and I remember he was BLASTED when he came out and said that). Charry says "no bragging".
Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.
Right. The Philly media is the only sports media that's unfair, and Donovan McNabb's a saint for putting up with it even this long. Puh-farging-lease. He's making money hand over fist playing football. He shouldn't give a shtein what anyone from the media says or whether or not the Eagles are drafting backups/replacements. He should get healthy, try to figure out how to farging stay that way, and win a God-damned Super Bowl.
You people coddling the shtein out of him and feeling sorry for him are idiots.
I'm sure McNabb sleeps better at night knowing that I don't blame him for everything that goes wrong. Also, yesterday I held his hand and helped him across the boulevard.
The writing's on the wall. McNabb will go to another team and win a superbowl.
(http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/861/tm1animationfh8.gif)
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 07, 2007, 01:42:41 AM
Right. The Philly media is the only sports media that's unfair, and Donovan McNabb's a saint for putting up with it even this long. Puh-farging-lease. He's making money hand over fist playing football. He shouldn't give a shtein what anyone from the media says or whether or not the Eagles are drafting backups/replacements. He should get healthy, try to figure out how to farging stay that way, and win a God-damned Super Bowl.
You people coddling the shtein out of him and feeling sorry for him are idiots.
They are not the only unfair ones, but they toss out some stupid shtein. Especially lately.
You people taking shots at him and acting like he's a Hoyda and doesn't want to win are idiots.
Losers always whine about their best, winners go home and farg the prom queen.
Just because he WANTS to win, doesn't mean that he isn't a Hoyda.
that line is so easy, i'm not going to identify the movie. but i wanted you to know, that i know what it is
mcnabb is a bitch and hes a good player and hes wants to win....the three arent mutually exclusive...i really dont see what the big deal is
The big deal to me is that the team does not realize and use him for exactly what he is.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on May 07, 2007, 10:55:22 AM
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 07, 2007, 01:42:41 AM
Right. The Philly media is the only sports media that's unfair, and Donovan McNabb's a saint for putting up with it even this long. Puh-farging-lease. He's making money hand over fist playing football. He shouldn't give a shtein what anyone from the media says or whether or not the Eagles are drafting backups/replacements. He should get healthy, try to figure out how to farging stay that way, and win a God-damned Super Bowl.
You people coddling the shtein out of him and feeling sorry for him are idiots.
They are not the only unfair ones, but they toss out some stupid shtein. Especially lately.
You people taking shots at him and acting like he's a Hoyda and doesn't want to win are idiots.
Wrong. As has already been said, no one here is arguing that he doesn't want to win. That's just stupid. He is a Hoyda, though... or at least you thinking that Sheridan article was right on paints him as one.
mcnabb to be on with eskin today
yep i just turned on wip for the first time in months to listen
Same. Been about a year or so.
I can't wait.
expect mcnabb to say all the right things
I heard McNabb thinks IGY is a whiner.
dont make me sick my mommy on you
i was impressed with donovan
didnt say anything revolutionary...but didnt sound like a douche either and most importantly didnt try to be a comedian...he sounded different than ive heard him in a while...he came with a stronger more serious tone and without all the cliches
hopefully this continues
did he throw up in between questions?
He said 'we'
he's allowed
did he throw up in between questions?
twice
farging Hoyda
he called Eskin 'dawg'
that's not allowed
He should have called Eskin "dook johnson".
He was keepin it real
CSN video clips:
The selection of Kolb (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabbonselection.wmv)
Communication with Reid after the pick (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabbandReid.wmv)
His future with the Eagles (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabbonfuture.wmv)
Ready for the start of the season (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabbready.wmv)
His dad's remarks (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabboncomments.wmv)
His image (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabbcorporate.wmv)
Tutoring Kolb (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-McNabbandKolb.wmv)
Kolb knows it's still Donovan's team (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-Kolbinterview.wmv)
Kolb can't wait to get here (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/eagles/050807-KolbonPhillyfans.wmv)
McNabb sounds fine in all those interviews. I think he is reacting and approaching everything well. You have to be really nit-picking to say he is acting in an inappropriate manner or is "whining". Donovan has always been professional. Has he been whiny at times? Sure. But I don't think his reactions have been novel or over-the-top. I think he reacts like most people would react given the circumstances.
i liked how he sounded on howard but this interview is basically a reinactment of the wip interview....hes clearly making the rounds in search of damage control...just win a superbowl donovan and well all be happy
I'd love for Donovan to go out and win the big game. Unfortunatly there's a whole bunch of other team members and coaches there to screw things up.
Oh come on, the gave Scorcese an Oscar "just because" for that POS The Departed. Can't the NFL make some concessions for all the heat he's taken?
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 08, 2007, 09:34:13 PM
i liked how he sounded on howard but this interview is basically a reinactment of the wip interview....hes clearly making the rounds in search of damage control...just win a superbowl donovan and well all be happy
didnt you say that if he just came out and addressed it would be better?
Damage control, IGY? Exactly what damage was he controlling? GCobb was killin' it on WIP tonight. He was all over the reactions like yours and it was good to listen to. I mean, the horror that McNabb waited a whole 10 days to talk to the media after the draft! OMG!!
He didn't have to address jack shtein. But he was forced to because people (see media), once again, made it all about him.
He said the right things in each of those sitdowns. But yet its painted as damage control by you. I don't get it. WHat I do get is that there is a group of fans who will never be satisfied by what he does here. Should he ever win a SB that won't quench the thirst of the haters. It'll be talked about how it was the OL, RB or defense who really won the championship.
QuoteMcNABB AUDIBLESDoes a solo skate at ice rink, finally talks of surprise draft of QB, says it's not a big deal
By LES BOWEN
WE MIGHT NEVER know what Donovan McNabb really was thinking in those first moments after he got the cell-phone call from his brother-in-law, McNabb out with his wife and daughter at an ice-cream shop, where he learned the Eagles had just drafted his presumed successor.
By yesterday, though, 10 days later, McNabb was ready to treat the surprise selection of Houston quarterback Kevin Kolb with the team's first draft choice the way he has treated all the other various controversies that have swirled around the Eagles during his 8-year tenure. He acknowledged the changed landscape, noted there was nothing he could do about it, and set about the business of minimizing and moving on.
"I was shocked just like all the rest of the people were," McNabb said. "It was kind of shocking, to the point where you're wondering, 'Was that really our first pick, did we take a quarterback?' But it was nothing that bothered me to the point where I had to get on the phone and call [coach Andy Reid] . . . My phone started vibrating, I got text messages from everybody - friends, teammates, people from other teams. I wasn't in front of the television, so I didn't have any answers."
McNabb, 30, who is coming off ACL surgery, said that sometime after that initial flurry he realized he had a voice message from Reid saying "that it has nothing to do with me, he was the best available player on the board at that time, and you just be you, just keep rehabbin' and get yourself healthy to lead this team to the Super Bowl."
McNabb said he did not think Reid was looking for any sort of dialogue, which was why they went 3 days before discussing what the team had done.
"That was the voice mail that I got. It wasn't a 'Call me back.' It wasn't a 'Tell me how you feel.' Or 'What should we do?' It was just a 'Hey, this is what we did' . . . It wasn't like he could have changed that pick after we picked him,'' McNabb said. "Once I got that message, it was like, 'Hey, all right, we drafted a quarterback. Let's move on, let's see what else we get.' "
But McNabb's reassuring words yesterday were at odds with his surroundings. McNabb, wearing a beard that made him look like a cross between Abraham Lincoln and an Amish farmer, gave a series of one-on-one interviews to Comcast SportsNet, the Daily News and the Inquirer at the Flyers Skate Zone in Voorhees, N.J. McNabb later was interviewed by phone on WIP radio. The interviews were arranged by McNabb's new publicist, former Eagles publicist Rich Burg, who handled media requests involving McNabb for the team until Burg was dismissed last month. The Eagles had no role in the interviews, weren't told about them in advance, and were none too happy to have to spend time yesterday afternoon fielding phone calls from media outlets outraged at having been excluded.
"It's an awkward situation, I know it," said Burg, who said he felt having McNabb available to select outlets yesterday would help publicize McNabb's upcoming charity golf tournament. McNabb more or less agreed that he felt more comfortable speaking his mind outside the confines of NovaCare.
In some subtle, undefinable way, this was not the McNabb that disaffected Eagles such as Freddie Mitchell and Terrell Owens derided as an "organization man." This McNabb did not seem at all joined at the hip to Reid, particularly during the subsequent phone-in interview with WIP's Howard Eskin, during which McNabb questioned Eskin about how word got out of McNabb's sitdown with Reid at NovaCare a week earlier. Eskin is perceived to enjoy a close relationship with the coach. McNabb's clear implication was that the organization, or maybe even Reid himself, leaked news of the meeting.
Earlier, McNabb took a similar tone in speaking with the Daily News about some recent speculation concerning the Eagles' motives for drafting Kolb. One theory is that talks toward a reworked contract with McNabb last fall, before the ACL injury, did not go well, and that the Eagles, as they often do, have gone out and insured themselves against any future rift - the way Ryan Moats arrived in the 2005 draft at the same time the Eagles were having a hard time getting a deal done with Brian Westbrook.
McNabb, who is signed through 2010 to what is no longer a state-of-the-art contract, having been negotiated in 2002, said he hadn't thought about Kolb as a bargaining chip, but he had thought about how several reporters now know about last year's unpublicized contract talks. "That's funny, how that got out," he said. Again, McNabb's implication was clear.
Asked if he really was unconcerned about having Kolb on hand, if he really thought Kolb was just going to sit for 4 or 5 years until McNabb is clearly in the twilight, McNabb joked, "If it's up to me, he will. Let's be honest, you don't ever want to just give your job up."
McNabb said he had heard that the Eagles liked Kolb, and "I knew we were going to draft a quarterback," something he asserted in an ESPN radio interview in March. But he didn't think a QB would be the first priority. You can certainly infer that McNabb was hoping for something that might help him take the Birds to the Super Bowl this season.
"That was part of the 'shocking' deal, was that you'd think you would get somebody that would help you right now. It's nothing to do with Kevin Kolb," McNabb said.
Now, though, McNabb's message is this: "My job is to get myself healthy and get ready to go." He was careful to praise Reid's drafting prowess.
McNabb, who said he plans to be ready for the start of training camp July 27, said he would "treat professionally" his role with Kolb, whose name he said he mispronounced in his initial discussion with Reid. (McNabb said "Kolb" and Reid explained it was "Cobb." McNabb said he then decided that to be safe, he would address the new guy as "Kevin.")
"I'll speak with him, work with him, give him confidence, motivate him," McNabb said. Told that Kolb's father said McNabb was one of Kolb's idols, McNabb said: "Now I really feel old. I'm only 30, now. But it's a situation that we can't control. We all work together in the [quarterback] room. When Jeff [Garcia] was here, we all worked together. We all push each other in training camp, minicamps, we push each other during the year."
McNabb reiterated what he said during Super Bowl week, down in Miami, after a similar logjam of speculation grew around his unavailability to speak about the Eagles' playoff run behind Garcia. That time, the team canceled a scheduled McNabb news conference the week after the season ended, but the Eagles were involved when he eventually spoke. Yesterday, they had no say - although Eagles sources said the team asked McNabb if he would speak to the media Friday, at the start of minicamp. The sources said McNabb declined that opportunity.
"I felt it was kind of in my best interest to get this done now. Now, they can focus in on minicamp, I can focus on my rehab more, and then just let it go," McNabb said.
The frustrating thing for reporters is that McNabb tends to wait until speculation is running wild and news outlets are contacting his parents for comment before he steps in. Yesterday, as at the Super Bowl, McNabb's delayed remarks were less than controversial.
McNabb's view is that whatever he says will be sensationalized and mined for controversy, whenever he says it. In this instance, he said, he didn't think he had anything particularly valuable to add.
"What, really, can I say?" he asked. "How do I feel about the pick? I was shocked, but I knew we were going to draft a quarterback. What does that mean for [me]? I don't know. I'm just going to focus on my job and get ready to play."
Some critics have found fault with his parents, Sam and Wilma McNabb, being willing to speak out.
"If you ask anybody's parents a question, they're going to answer it . . . And then you hear that they're my spokesmen. My dad's a grown man, 50-plus years old. My mom, she can handle herself, too . . . [the idea that he would speak through his parents] just doesn't make sense to me," McNabb said. "I have access to talk to all you guys. I just felt like when the time comes to speak, I'll do that."
Just as Sam and Wilma talk because reporters ask them to, McNabb said, the same thing applies to what some people feel are his too-frequent references to fans booing him at the 1999 draft. "When people want to talk about the draft way back in '99, the only reason I [talk about it] is that the question is asked," he said. "I don't like to talk about it, just like people don't like to hear about it. I'm tired of talking about it, just like everyone else is."
But maybe like Kevin Kolb, the 1999 draft is lurking in the background, a thread dangling loose from the McNabb-Eagles tapestry, always waiting to be pulled.
"When people talk about anything that's happened over the previous years, you just want to move on," McNabb said. "You want to focus on what's next. What's next for me? Come back healthy, ready to go . . . My drive is to get out there and lead us to the Super Bowl." *
Another thing brought up by the detractors is the whole "but, but, but he talks about the booing all the time. Let it go!" Rhea's stupid ass is always saying that. But once again, and I have said this before, he mentions how the only time he talks about it is when someone asks him.
didnt you say that if he just came out and addressed it would be better?
it is better that he addressed it...i just wish he didnt practioce it in front of a mirror for two weeks...but thats just who he is and who hes always gonna be...hes never gonna be someone that the fans flock too and love...but like i said just win a superbowl for the city everyone will be happy (except probably donovan) and then we can move on to the cobb era
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 09, 2007, 08:01:12 AM
...hes never gonna be someone that the fans flock too and love...
I agree with this. But the reason for it is that way too many Eagles fans are complete and utter morons.
too many Eagles fans are complete and utter morons
(http://chat2.globalpinoy.com/images/emoticons/wave.gif)
i don't see the big deal., really people. is a QB even taken in the first round going to threaten a proven pro-bowl QB with more than a few years left? no friggin way. oh, but why has mcnabb not talked to the mediA!??? That MUST mean he's scared and he's a pansY That must mean he'll never take us to a SuPeRBowL....HE mUst speak to us, he must!!
shut the farg up. im sick of the mcnabb haters. he's been our best chance since Jaws...so i don't know what else your askin him, himself to do. its a team sport....no support, no super bowl.
If McNabb wins a Super Bowl for the Birds he'll be a God in Philly.
Quote from: MadMarchHare on May 08, 2007, 10:48:22 PM
Oh come on, the gave Scorcese an Oscar "just because" for that POS The Departed. Can't the NFL make some concessions for all the heat he's taken?
Not to get too far off topic, but did you really think that The Departed was a piece of shtein? You would be the first person I've 'talked' to who didn't think that it was a good movie.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 09, 2007, 08:37:01 AM
If McNabb wins a Super Bowl for the Birds he'll be a God in Philly.
Any player that has a significant part in a Super Bowl win would be a god in Philly, even Gocong.
d gunn was on wip this morning and said if you think mcnabb and his parents have said stuff since hes been here wait until he leaves...hes gonna unload
Well no farging shtein. That's like telling someone that the sun will rise in the East tomorrow.
Poppycock!
he wouldnt elaborate but he was basically saying that off camera yesterday mcnabb told him how upset he really is
this supports my opinion that mcnabb deep down doesnt really want to win a superbowl for the city he hates
i'm surprised "DGunn" was able to get anything out of McNabb during their little giggle fest.
Gunn is a terrible interviewer
when you talk to twelve different news outlets in a six hour period they all cease to become interviews and are now press conferences
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 09, 2007, 09:37:50 AM
he wouldnt elaborate but he was basically saying that off camera yesterday mcnabb told him how upset he really is
this supports my opinion that mcnabb deep down doesnt really want to win a superbowl for the city he hates
While I wouldn't be surprised if this were true, "DGunn" is very much hit-or-miss.
dgunn is a packers fan. burn!
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 09, 2007, 09:28:39 AM
d gunn was on wip this morning and said if you think mcnabb and his parents have said stuff since hes been here wait until he leaves...hes gonna unload
d-gunn said that on dnl yesterday too. mcnabb hates all of us.
The deduction that McNabb doesn't want to win a SB in Philly is laughable. And PFT is saying that the real issue here is that McNabb is pissed that the Eagles fired Rich Burg, his PR guy, because Burg tried to set up a PC at the end of the season and was denied by the team.
Burg declined an interview request by Action News for Don because they are the "official" Eagles station.
So this goes against the logic that McNabb is coddled by the organization. It also goes against the notion that he's a yes man for the Eagles.
Ashley Fox: "Eagles have lost control of star" (http://www.philly.com/inquirer/sports/20070509_Ashley_Fox____Eagles_have_lost_control_of_star.html)
whatever
oh my god, someone nuke the media in philly. for real. what a bunch of asshats. same goes for the morons that eat it up too.
he has been coddled by the organization his whole career
and with the axing of burg and the pick of cobb that is now ending
mcnabb is now seeing that andy/banner dont really give a shtein about anyone
including donovan
the writing is on the wall
mcnabb can see the bright light
his seasons are numbered
the next 12-18 months should be very interesting
Yeah - I can't wait until the Eagles struggle to find another good QB!! Good times on the horizon fa sho!
maybe the boy being out of the bubble now will cause mcnabb to play with a chip
maybe he now is on the side of his teammates and not the front office
the end of this cozy relationship bwtn the qb and the front office is a very good thing imo
I don't give a shtein either way. I want a goddamn championship because this team is the only legit shot we have. farg the other three. farg 'em right in their losing asses.
The Eagles aren't a super bowl caliber team right now yo...
The idea of Donovan playing with a chip on his shoulder gives me a woodrow.
True... he might lead the league in TD passes again like he did before he got hurt last year.
And he went 4-4 with a goofy grin on his face the whole time. Don't be coy.
I can't be. I could never grow a neckbeard like that.
Quote from: rjs246 on May 09, 2007, 11:25:01 AM
The idea of Donovan playing with a chip on his shoulder gives me a woodrow.
The idea of Donovan playing with a chip on his shoulder gives me thoughts of an only child who takes his football home when he doesn't get his way.
Also a possibility. But at least now we'll see how he reacts.
Quote from: rjs246 on May 09, 2007, 11:31:33 AM
And he went 4-4 with a goofy grin on his face the whole time. Don't be coy.
True... his play was totally the reason their record was that way. (Yes... I know about the Tampa game.)
actually he was very impressive in the first half of his games against mostly dog defenses and then he was pretty bad in the second half of his season
so a .500 record in games he started is a pretty real reflection of how he played last year
Look, I'm not going to have this conversation for the 100th time.
Yes, the defense was more to blame. Yes, the coaching was atrocious. Etc, etc.
I want McNabb to be the kind of guy who gets angry that his team is losing to the awful Bucs or the mediocre Jags and elevates his game accordingly to carry the team. But he doesn't do that.
Spadaro, in response to someone saying McNabb is no longer letting the Eagles control him:
QuoteControl him? Not control him? Because he called a press conference to get more bang for his buck outside the Complex? What are you saying? You are talking about a story three years down the line? I guarantee you that if Donovan throws 30 TD passes for the next three years, he will be here in year four. Guaranteed. Don't spend so much time worrying about it. Is Donovan stung by the draft? Probably. I don't think that is such a bad thing, and the Eagles can add competition to any position they want. Nothing wrong with that, is there?
.
.
If McNabb is bothered, hey, he has to get over it. He has other things to concern himself with than a quarterback or a press conference. I happen to take great offense to any player who complains about the way the Eagles treat him. This is an organization that treats the players great, a city that loves its players and its team, and the facilities and the coaches are first class. I don't think any player has a right to complain. Now, a player may feel upset about a contract. To me, hey, deal with it like a man or don't sign the contract in the first place. What else is there to complain about?
.
.
I will always defend Donovan. You are all speculating that he is unhappy. I don't know that to be the case. I'm just saying that I don't buy into this "player unhappiness" stuff, no matter what team. I'm sick of players "being unhappy" around the league.
.
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If you think McNabb is upset that the Eagles didn't get him any help in the off-season, I counter by saying the Eagles signed Kevin Curtis and Bethel Johnson (who may or may not be anything) and then drafted Tony Hunt and added that to the second-best offense in the league last year. I don't even buy that argument for a second. That's bogus if anyone thinks the Eagles haven't made this a great offense.
I guarantee you that if Donovan throws 30 TD passes for the next three years, he will be here in year four. Guaranteed
lololol
you know how many times mcnabb has thrown for more than 20 td's in a year....THREE....aka the numbers of consecutive years spads just said mcnabb could throw for 30
hes thrown for more than 30 once ever
he cant finish a season anymore
he averages 19 td's a season over his career
so tell lapdog this
i guarantee if mcnabb goes the next year or two throwing his average td's per year and doesnt finish another season and is scheduled to make 30 million dollars bwtn 2008 and 2010 he will not be he here. GUARANTEED!!
id like to see a balanced offense more than anything and not an offense where donovan is forced to throw 40-50 times. like i said time and time again, you don't put your players in bad positions. you take advantage of their skills., not what you think he should be doing. he's basically been a sitting duck for defenses to tee off on. our line is great, but 40-50 passes per game put donovan is a position of getting hit and getting hit often. i don't care who the QB is. he's gonna get hurt. im not ready to believe in this whole injury prone scenario and im not ready to throw the towel in on one of the best players on the team. i am ready however to throw the towle in on the play callers, whoever the farg they are.
the media is a joke. lost control? hes no longer letting them control him?
cant they write about anything besides reading into what a player might or might not feel? i can not believe how overblown the specualtion around mcnabb is.
and mcnabb does not want to win the superbowl for this city? wtf do u guys get this stuff from? how come everyone besides me has a select pass into the psyche of mcnabb?
if he really didnt like playing here or hated the fans so much he would have asked for trade...hell im sure he would have won a superbowl or 2 by now on another team with a capable playcalling staff.
mcnabb throwing for 30+ is not so out of the blue if his WRs pan out. but then again i would be more happy if he throws say 20 tds and doesnt have to do it all on his own.
QuoteRumor: Donovan McNabb (aka "Jasper Beardsley") was shocked when the Eagles spent their first round pick on a QB.
Fact: Really? Donovan is surprised that after blowing out his knee and Jeff Garcia flying the nest, that the Eagles would seek some insurance at the most crucial position in the sport? Donovan was reportedly also shocked last week when May unexpectedly followed April.
In McNabb's defense, surprising things have been afoot all over lately. For instance, did you know there is a basketball team called the Golden State"Warriors"? Apparently they play very entertaining basketball games while I am sleeping. (As you can see, I am in the midst of my annual tawdry eight-week fling with the NBA. Right now my favorite player is the Nets' Bostjan Nachbar. Because "Nachbar" looks a lot like "nacho bar". Mmmmmm, nacho bar.)
Quote from: mussa on May 09, 2007, 01:05:19 PM
id like to see a balanced offense more than anything and not an offense where donovan is forced to throw 40-50 times. like i said time and time again, you don't put your players in bad positions. you take advantage of their skills., not what you think he should be doing. he's basically been a sitting duck for defenses to tee off on. our line is great, but 40-50 passes per game put donovan is a position of getting hit and getting hit often. i don't care who the QB is. he's gonna get hurt. im not ready to believe in this whole injury prone scenario and im not ready to throw the towel in on one of the best players on the team. i am ready however to throw the towle in on the play callers, whoever the farg they are.
damn right balance the offense and McNabb cant cry about putting the offense on his shoulders. You have Westy, Buck and Hunt in the backfield. With a promising WR corp (not great, but good). You have a TE in his contract year who will try and drive his price up. And an offensive line that should be good with the run game and pass protection. McNabb got booed on draft day and show the people wrong, now hopefully he will do it again like Elway and Maddox in Denver.
Quote from: mussa on May 09, 2007, 01:05:19 PM
id like to see a balanced offense more than anything and not an offense where donovan is forced to throw 40-50 times. like i said time and time again, you don't put your players in bad positions. you take advantage of their skills., not what you think he should be doing. he's basically been a sitting duck for defenses to tee off on. our line is great, but 40-50 passes per game put donovan is a position of getting hit and getting hit often. i don't care who the QB is. he's gonna get hurt. im not ready to believe in this whole injury prone scenario and im not ready to throw the towel in on one of the best players on the team. i am ready however to throw the towle in on the play callers, whoever the farg they are.
This is exactly what I was talking about when I started this thread. No other team in the league has asked their Qb to do nearly as much with nearly as little as the Eagles have asked of McNabb. Just about every time McNabb has been hurt it nhas been because the protection has broken down while his recievers were not getting open.
I remember a few years back people hanging off Kerry Collins' jock (nobody here of course just using him by way of example since I live in NY) all a twitter about how well he was playing after his debacle in Carolina nobody mentioned the fact that he was put in a position to be sucessfull by the fact that the Giants were a run heavy offense that had a passing game that was based on getting the ball out quickly or throwing it away. Once teams put just a little heat on Collins what happened? Dude set the record for fumbles in a season. He never got hurt though so I guess that made hi worth of al the praise he got.
Her title sucks, but her point is right on. SalPal was much more eloquent on ESPN.com. To paraphrase, McNabb is in a "show-me" year. If he doesn't get them where the coaches want, he's gone by end of '08 at the latest. If he gets injured again, he's done then and there.
They drafted Kolb to take over. It's up to McNabb when that happens.
Sal's article
QuoteRewind to spring 2003. The Philadelphia Eagles were in the process of cleaning house. The team and several popular 30-something players were parting ways, and it was not going over real well in the locker room.
"You try to sit back and learn from it, because you never know," said one veteran leader. "In a couple of years, it could be you."
The veteran who said that? Quarterback Donovan McNabb.
So, when McNabb said on Tuesday he was "shocked" to learn that the Eagles drafted his possible replacement with their first pick, he should've known it was coming. Under Andy Reid, this is the way Philly rolls.
Nobody knows that better than McNabb. And any objective analysis of this Eagles team -- left on the doorstep of a championship for nearly his entire tenure in Philadelphia -- would conclude that McNabb could easily be the next victim.
He will turn 31 in November. By the end of November the past two seasons, McNabb was unavailable due to injury -- a sports hernia in 2005 and a torn-up knee in 2006. And the Philadelphia landscape is littered with productive players who reached 30 and were shown the door -- Bobby Taylor, Troy Vincent, Duce Staley, Brian Mitchell, Hugh Douglas and Jeff Garcia.
Nevertheless, by drafting quarterback Kevin Kolb of Houston with their first pick in last month's draft, the Eagles sent the town and the team into a tailspin tailor-made for talk radio. Privately, many players are wondering whether this makes McNabb a lame duck -- not in 2008, or some undefined future, but right now.
"It's Super Bowl or bust for Donovan this year," said a veteran defensive player. "And everybody knows it."
And right now, McNabb is a long way from taking this team back to the Super Bowl -- because he still can't get on the field. On Saturday, the Eagles will begin the first of three minicamp practices, which include the full squad, and McNabb will be a spectator. It will be the first time since McNabb's rookie year, in 1999, that the Eagles will start preparations for a new season without No. 5 taking the first team snaps.
Ironically, this weekend, Philadelphia will get a sneak preview of the future. And that snapshot could turn into a long, simmering drama this summer. McNabb professed he will be back for training camp on July 27. But for a quarterback at his age, returning from knee injury is no guarantee. (See: Daunte Culpepper.)
Actually, he went further than that in prognosticating his return. In fact, it turned out to be one of the more interesting developments of McNabb's local press tour. He pronounced that he will be ready to go by the time the Eagles play their second preseason game on Aug. 17 at Lincoln Financial Field in Philadelphia. While fans may be happy to hear McNabb has created his own timetable for a return, Reid may not be thrilled the quarterback usurped the head coach's power to make that decision for the team.
It's important to point out here the manner in which McNabb spoke out Tuesday. It was not done at the Eagles' NovaCare Complex in Philadelphia -- the site of every other McNabb press event since the venue opened five years ago. No, McNabb spoke at a skating rink in South Jersey. It was handled not by the Eagles public relations department but by a fired former member of that staff whom McNabb has hired to help with media relations for his foundation and charity work. The four local media outlets invited to the event did not include the Eagles' official TV station, the local ABC affiliate.
Indeed, it seems that by going public the way he did, McNabb was trying to exert a little bit more control over his destiny. And perhaps show a little defiance.
But let's go back to his decision to announce that he would be ready to play by mid-August. Why would McNabb push it? Why would he rush back and possibly jeopardize his long-term health? (Again, see Culpepper.)
It always comes back to the money. In 2007, the Eagles will pay McNabb $5.5 million in salary. The following year, that number increases to $6.3 million. The Eagles hold an option for 2009, when McNabb is due $9.2 million. In 2010, he is owed a $10 million salary.
Let's assume that McNabb is the starter in 2007. That means this is an evaluation year. If McNabb plays well, stays healthy and takes the Eagles deep into the playoffs or back to the Super Bowl, he's most likely back in 2008. If not, the Eagles have no history of paying 32-year-old, injury-prone players who can't get it done for that kind of money. And if they were to consider trading McNabb, next offseason is the time to do it -- before his contract becomes too big and he becomes too old for a potential trade partner.
Add to this equation the contract that the Eagles will have to pay Kolb. By saying that Kolb is "a franchise quarterback," which is what team general manager Tom Heckert said on draft weekend, the Eagles will have to pay him accordingly -- or close to it. And, under team president Joe Banner, who manages the team's salary cap, the Eagles haven't been the type of team that pays two players starter's money -- if only one of them is starting.
That's why McNabb may be anxious to get on the field. He knows he has much to prove. But that's also why he shouldn't rush it. A setback could make it harder to get back.
"I've been running, I've been throwing and I've been cutting," McNabb said. "But it's not like the injury never happened. It's still there. I'm still getting stronger, but I'm not 100 percent, and that's the way I want to come back."
Lost in all this is something that finally dawned on Reid and his brain trust this offseason: This team can function fine without Donovan McNabb. That's the dirty little secret revealed by Jeff Garcia's magic act in the final two months of 2006.
Let's compare McNabb and Garcia. McNabb won five games and had a passer rating of 95.5. Garcia won five games with a rating of 95.8. According to the Elias Sports Bureau, that's the only time in NFL history that a team had two different quarterbacks each win five or more games and have a rating higher than 90 in the same season.
The reason? Brian Westbrook. In the second half of the season, the Eagles running back -- following tackle Jon Runyan and guard Shawn Andrews on the right side of the line -- was the linchpin of the offense once Reid turned the play-calling duties over to offensive coordinator Marty Mornhinweg. In the nine games prior to McNabb's injury, Westbrook had more than 20 carries in a game just once. After McNabb got injured, Westbrook passed the 20-carry mark three times in six games.
Westbrook gave the Eagles offense an identity. Reid -- loath to run the ball in his tenure as head coach -- brought back Westbrook's running mate, Correll Buckhalter, for the 2007 season. And he drafted a power running back, Tony Hunt, out of Penn State, signaling that the central focus of his offense is undergoing a not-so-subtle shift.
What does that mean? Well, by allowing Garcia to take his magic act to Tampa Bay, the Eagles were forced to make contingency plans for the future:
• Beef up the running game. Check.
• Secure not one, but two suitable veteran backup quarterbacks in A.J. Feeley and Kelly Holcomb. Check.
• Draft McNabb's eventual replacement. Check.
Under Reid, this is the how Philly rolls.
I read these threads and I just don't have anything to say. So I'll just say, I hope McNabb does well, and it would be alright with me if he just shut up about everything else.
Phreak said earlier in this thread something along the lines of "he didn't HAVE to speak to the media about this, but stupid people forced him to..." Well, which is it?
I think it's pretty clear that the guy doesn't understand how media works, plain and simple. He ought to stay the hell out of the spot light, and if he can possibly find it in himself, use the stuff that gets his panties in a bunch as a motivator on the field, rather than as a reason to be a bitch.
All of which has been said over and over. farging offseason.
when youre the qb of the philadelphia eagles or in any other football crazed city and the team drafts a qb with their first pick youre going to be expected to say something...to think otherwise or to say that mcnabb shoudnt have to talk on this issue (and many others) is so ridiculous it boggles the mind...and if youre gonna be the first person in that position to not talk then you better accept the consequences
The dude is a great QB, he has a tendency to struggle in big games. A fact which I largely lay at the feet of playcalling of Richie K II, more than the QB.
But the guy is a farging poofta off the field. His schtick is getting real old. Ooh, they booed me. Shut the farg up and produce a Lombardi, and the Fishtowners will be singing your praises 10 deep at the parade.
I've said it before. I don't care two shteins about a single person on this team, coach, player or other. All I want is a SB win. So I can go berserk and celebrate like an icehole, like my boss (a Red Sox fan).
Once again I ask, what schtick is this you haters talk about?
He brings up the booing when asked. You chuckleheads act as if he prefaces each statement with "Well, you know those terrible fans booed me..."
Get a clue.
Look, as I said, he's a quality person, gives a lot of time and money to charity, runs the football team well. As I said above, Reid's been the problem, not McNabb.
That being said, McNabb is 30, going on 31. He makes $9MM in 09 and $10MM in '10. Unless he has ridiculous numbers the next two years he's gone. He's been treated pretty badly by the media here since day 1, through no fault of his own. But there is no doubt it's affected him Phreak, and he's mentally wearing down. He's tired of the abuse, as any of us would be. Having his mom and dad spill shtein through the media and internet doesn't help, and probably proves he's sick of it.
If he wants to shut up the iceholes in Philly, win a trophy. That's what it'll take. If he just wants out, that shouldn't be too difficult either. I wouldn't blame him. But taking this shtein personally ain't helping him or the team. Or my chances to celebrate like a drunken idiot if the Birds win the big one.
But see, that's just it. He never said that he was taking anything personally. He rarely says anything. And even by his keeping his mouth shut draws the ire of some. All he does is win ballgames. Yes he hasn't won the SB and he needs to do that, but he still has been responsible (and Reid, as reluctant as you might be to credit him) for turning this franchise around.
31 years old in "quarterback years" is relatively young still. As long as his arm works, he'll be a good QB. He's got a very strong arm and he makes good decisions for the most part with the football as his historically low TD-INT ratio shows.
So we have a rarity, a good solid QB who says he is happy here and does not want to go anywhere, but yet is shunned by football fans and media because he talks, or doesn't talk. If he talks, he's ripped. If he doesn't talk, he's ripped.
How do we know he's tired of the abuse? He hasn't said that and I do not think he uses his parents as messengers. I believe they talk on their own. And like DOnovan said in his CSN interview who tells their parents to shut up and not talk? They react to things said about him in a protective manner. I'd like to hear them shut up too, but he shouldn't be held responsible for what they say.
I believe he has the right mentality to be the QB in this city because most of the time he doesn't respond to the criticism. It's tha fans and the media who create most of the junk that goes on with him anyhow.
He says he wants to stay here. And he said the selection of Kolb (he said before the draft that them getting a QB wouldn't bother him) isn't a big deal because this is his starting job. But yet when he says he was shocked they took one so high he's perceived as being pissed off or angry.
I maintain that when he leaves the ones who love to put him on blast now will be crying the loudest for a good QB; but they won't realize that they had one and he was run out of town
Christ, I hate this time of year. Nothing better for the press to do than create drama, so idiots can debate every little point that has no meaning anyway.
IGY -- McNabb, nor any other player, owes you or any other fan anything in terms of news conferences or press releases. Nothing is expected when a player in your position is drafted. The player is not obligated to comment, and frankly, I like it that way. Why? Because quotes like "I think everyone that wasn't in the war room was shocked with the pick" turns into "McNabb shocked Kolb was selected" to create a controversy where none exists.
Their job is to play play football. It isn't to let you know what they think. It isn't to use the press to explain themselves.
To think otherwise boggles my mind.
Mike Sielski:
QuoteEagles too paranoid over McNabb speaking
Donovan McNabb conducted his first local media sit-down in 175 days on Tuesday ... in a New Jersey ice hockey rink.
McNabb's publicist invited representatives from only four news organizations — two newspapers, a television station and a radio station — to interview him, which left me among a seething, outraged horde of media members. Mind you, we were not seething and outraged because we were excluded from the quasi-one-on-one sessions with the Eagles quarterback, but because we were forced to endure several minutes of Howard Eskin's radio show just to find out what McNabb said.
.
.
This is the sports world in which we exist now, and this is a much bigger issue for the Eagles — for Jeffrey Lurie and Joe Banner and Andy Reid and their attempts to monitor and control every word that one of their players utters — than it is for Donovan McNabb.
The jarring part of the end of McNabb's silence was not that he spoke publicly in Philadelphia for the first time since a Nov. 15 press conference at the NovaCare Complex, four days before he tore his right ACL. It was that the setting for his Tuesday chats was the Skate Zone, approximately 15 1/2 miles from the nearest facility affiliated with his employers. That's a healthy geographical distance, and it hints at a more intangible one between McNabb and the Eagles' higher-ups.
Remember: Just before this year's Super Bowl, the Eagles canceled a scheduled McNabb news conference. And according to newspaper reports, though the Eagles asked McNabb last week if he wanted to hold a press conference, they're now angry that he arranged these interviews on his own.
So, yes, this is different, McNabb's defiance of the Eagles' information blackout to talk about the drafting of Kevin Kolb and his reaction to it, but it's different only because we're dealing with the Eagles here. With one rather large exception (hint: he was given to catching touchdowns, insulting teammates, flapping his arms and ripping off the bottom halves of prepared statements), the Eagles have been remarkably effective at speaking with one voice from their locker room — and, really, from all chambers of their organization. They've done so in two ways: by limiting the media's access to the players and coaches and executives, and by acquiring athletes who are intelligent and eloquent enough to say the right things most of the time.
"In this image-conscious league that we're in — and the Eagles are as image-conscious as anybody — when players get in front of a camera and they can put a sentence together, that's important, too," Fox Sports analyst Brian Baldinger said the other day.
McNabb has embodied that philosophy, which is why the Eagles' attempts to keep him quiet, their apparent disdain for his willingness to say what he wants, come off as paranoia. Save one misguided reference to "black-on-black crime," what has he said that might have compelled Lurie, Banner or Reid to reach for the Excedrin?
Besides, this is a battle every major sports franchise is bound to lose. It's the rare superstar now who doesn't have his own Web site, and those who don't can arrange televised or video-streamed interviews with ESPN, the NFL Network, MLB.com or another outlet that's sure to be accepting of their agendas. ... The truth is, McNabb's desire to talk is more in sync with the reality of today's sports culture than the Eagles' desire to hush him is.
Think about it: These days, would it really be all that surprising to learn a fourth-string running back had a publicist?
No more so than a $120 million quarterback speaking his mind while sitting on a Zamboni.
OMGMCNABBWANTSTOBETHEFLYERSGOALIE!
IGY -- McNabb, nor any other player, owes you or any other fan anything in terms of news conferences or press releases. Nothing is expected when a player in your position is drafted. The player is not obligated to comment, and frankly, I like it that way. Why? Because quotes like "I think everyone that wasn't in the war room was shocked with the pick" turns into "McNabb shocked Kolb was selected" to create a controversy where none exists.
you just dont get it and never will
its not about owing anyone anything its about the relationship between celebrities and the media/public...i stated mcnabb didnt have to say anything about the cobb pick...but if he chose not to....and keep in mind he ultimately and wisely did choose to speak because thats what you do in his position....but had he chose not to it would be his right but he would also have to face the media and fan speculation that came with it
the philadelphia eagles picked the heir apparent to their long time starting quarterback with their first pick in the draft...to think thats not a huge story in the city and with it comes the expectation of the parties involved to speak on it is just ignorant
cobb spoke on it
heckert spoke on it
reid spoke on it
but mcnabb shouldnt?
whats ironic here is that mcnabb himself was "SHOCKED" over the pick....so what do you think all the fans of the team and mcnabb were?...yet the guy shouldnt address it in any way
It's been said a million times. I'd rather he deal with these things in the locker room, and not in the press. Every time he talks, the press goes crazy and people like you talk about how you know what's in his head and what he's thinking and feeling. We get it Kreskin, you know what makes a black man tick.
What's funny is you always clamor for him to talk it out in the press, then when he does you say how he's a yes man, how he is the company man, or in this latest case how he rehearsed for two weeks in front of a mirror to get it right.
If he stops talking completely, and only addresses issues in the locker room where it SHOULD be and is EXPECTED to be talked about, that's all he needs to do. That's his job.
Facing media and fan speculation is a freaking cop out. Who cares what dumb-asses like us, or people that get paid to speculate, have to think or say? We don't run the team, we don't pay his bills, and we don't control a single thing that goes with pro football. Deal with fan speculation?? OMGTHEHORRORS.
If I don't get being a drama queen over McNabb and his public expectations, then I'll not get it all the entire time he is here.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 08:02:24 AM
whether hes pissy or not...and im pretty sure he is...he needs to come out and make a statement...
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 02, 2007, 11:24:03 AM
or he can give one interview to the outlet of his choice and end all this asap...he wont do that tho because hes afraid of what hes gonna say...which will be something akin to what his father said or even worse
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 10, 2007, 12:15:41 PM
its not about owing anyone anything its about the relationship between celebrities and the media/public...i stated mcnabb didnt have to say anything about the cobb pick...but if he chose not to....
You could at least put completely contradicting statements in different threads.
I'd rather he deal with these things in the locker room, and not in the press.
theres nothing to deal with here....he should have addressed the pick in a general sense not about being upset about it...had he come right out after it happened and did so none of this other stuff would have blown up
What's funny is you always clamor for him to talk it out in the press, then when he does you say how he's a yes man, how he is the company man, or in this latest case how he rehearsed for two weeks in front of a mirror to get it right.
having a personality that shines when talking to the press and being a yes man are two different issues entirely...and i applauded him for not being a yes man in this case
If he stops talking completely, and only addresses issues in the locker room where it SHOULD be and is EXPECTED to be talked about, that's all he needs to do.
again the pick of cobb isnt a locker room issue...a teams first round pick should be addressed publicly with the media/fans...that by the coach and gm....the fact that it was at the position of the long time face of the franchise is why mcnabb should have spoken on it....he didnt and it blew up to be way larger than it should have
Who cares what dumb-asses like us, or people that get paid to speculate, have to think or say?
are you for real??...if you dont think many teams and players care what goes on in the press and fansbase then youre more clueless than i thought...in fact mcnabb ended up talking BECAUSE the fans and media were questioning him...he said so in all his interviews...mcnabb is still salty over the draft in 99 but no one cares what "we" say...lolol..ok
I gotta give Wingspan credit for being the most consistent and unbiased proponent of calling someone out on their hypocrisy or stupidity (myself included).
Who is Cobb?
wing
me thinking he should talk and him not having to talk are mutually exclusive
your never ending quest to bring me down continues.....
Everyone's against you. It's a government conspiracy to keep you down. Why do you think you love drinking alcohol so much?
i get the the whole he did the interviews from non eagles facilities...but what did he really say that can be contrued as "OMG HE IS DEFIANT...HE SPOKE OUT AGAINST THE TEAM FROM A ICE SKATING FACILITY!"
talk about reading between the lines that have already been read into.
hell if no one mentioned it i wouldnt have noticed anything different in this interview compared with the one he usually has from the Eagles practicing facilities.
thank god this crap does not get to mcnabb on the field. all he has to win is the big one and maybe just maybe some of these miss cleos can shut up.
i get the the whole he did the interviews from non eagles facilities...but what did he really say that can be contrued
the eagles said they would release a statement on his behalf - he declined
the eagles fired his personal publicist - he went and hired him on his own
the eagles were completely blindsided by mcnabbs press tour on tuesday having no idea it was going to happen
i say good for mcnabb...farg banner and reid
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 10, 2007, 01:54:35 PM
i get the the whole he did the interviews from non eagles facilities...but what did he really say that can be contrued
the eagles said they would release a statement on his behalf - he declined
the eagles fired his personal publicist - he went and hired him on his own
the eagles were completely blindsided by mcnabbs press tour on tuesday having no idea it was going to happen
i say good for mcnabb...farg banner and reid
even then he said nothing negative of the team or FO. in fact he sounded like he always does. if this is defiance then man TO must be a distant memory.
well we are used to seeing mcnabb suckle andys teet
so right about now donovan is lookin like nat motherfargin turner
Why does anyone give a shtein about this non-story?
mcnabb either
breaking away from
or having beef with
andy and banner
if true
is a pretty big story
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 10, 2007, 02:10:19 PM
mcnabb either
breaking away from
or having beef with
andy and banner
if true
is a pretty big story
Of which non is proven, except in your Eagles Conspiracy Mind.
The only reason this is a story at all is because of the people that have nothing to do but beat up on a guy for not doing what they want or think he should.
No it's not. It's fodder for simpletons.
Of which non is proven, except in your Eagles Conspiracy Mind.
The only reason this is a story at all is because of the people that have nothing to do but beat up on a guy for not doing what they want or think he should.
you sound like a little kid about to cry because his gold standard franchise might not be all flowers and puppies like they have brainwashed you to believe
trust me the best thing that could happen to this team is if the qb and the coach werent so chummy and the qb found that he has a lump bwtn his legs
btw everything ive stated has happened...mcnabb has clearly done things against the organizations wishes...thats fact....what we dont know is how deep the friction is...could be nothing or could be something
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 10, 2007, 02:29:08 PM
you sound like a little kid about to cry because his gold standard franchise might not be all flowers and puppies like they have brainwashed you to believe
You're starting to sound like a goth kid
emo
I haven't said anything about the franchise being "my gold standard."
All I've said is that you are a conspiracy creating loving fool who is so disparate you need to spout ridiculousness on an Internet forum to get the attention you crave.
whats the conspiracy im creating?
Everything you post about McNabb is a conspiracists dream:
McNabb thinks ___[fill in the blank]___
McNabb is doing ___[fill in the blank]___
McNabb knows that ___[fill in the blank]___
All conjecture, spoken as if you got inside his head and the rest of us are blind because we don't know what you know.
You're a freaking drama queen, plain and simple.
yet, you feel the need to respond to each of his posts
Quote from: SunMo on May 10, 2007, 03:49:06 PM
yet, you feel the need to respond to each of his posts
I know. I hate myself for it, too.
ha
yet, you feel the need to respond to each of his posts
thats cause hes upset when someone says something about the gold standard he doesnt like
when that happens all the newspaper writers are out to get the team....WIP out to get the team...igy out to get the team...ect...everyone is wrong except for spads
the fact is nothing has been made up about what mcnabb did this week...the only thing up for argument is not if mcnabb was/is upset with the front office but how much so
i have even stated that i am fully behind mcnabbs actions this week...but thats still not good enough for the homers...there has to be a rainbow over novacare at all times and if there isnt its the media and haters to blame
remember TO...it wasnt his fault until he wasnt an eagle anymore...it was espn and sal pal and the city papers and rosenhaus and WIP and michael irvin...everyone was out to break up the team and cause problems btwn mcnabb and TO...then the team sent TO packing and all of a sudden hes the devil
its just amazing how upset and blind people get when things arent all leave it to beaver in the eagle home
Last time I'm in this, then I'm done with IG-why-won't-he-go-away.
I don't have a gold standard problem. I bitch about the Eagles and FO when I think it's warranted, just like almost everyone else.
I have a problem with you, your hyperbole, and you're shtick.
You've based your entire CF existence on creating controversy, and then backpedaling until you find an ounce of proof that backs up your wildly broad claim.
Now... I'm done.
This thread has:
* BV - Bacterial Vaginosis
* Chlamydia and LGV
* Gonorrhea
* Hepatitis (viral)
* Herpes, Genital
* HPV - Human Papillomavirus Infection
* PID - Pelvic Inflammatory Disease
* Syphilis
* Trichomoniasis
* AIDS
The end.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 10, 2007, 04:06:11 PM
yet, you feel the need to respond to each of his posts
thats cause hes upset when someone says something about the gold standard he doesnt like
when that happens all the newspaper writers are out to get the team....WIP out to get the team...igy out to get the team...ect...everyone is wrong except for spads
the fact is nothing has been made up about what mcnabb did this week...the only thing up for argument is not if mcnabb was/is upset with the front office but how much so
i have even stated that i am fully behind mcnabbs actions this week...but thats still not good enough for the homers...there has to be a rainbow over novacare at all times and if there isnt its the media and haters to blame
remember TO...it wasnt his fault until he wasnt an eagle anymore...it was espn and sal pal and the city papers and rosenhaus and WIP and michael irvin...everyone was out to break up the team and cause problems btwn mcnabb and TO...then the team sent TO packing and all of a sudden hes the devil
its just amazing how upset and blind people get when things arent all leave it to beaver in the eagle home
(http://www.philaflava.com/forum/images/smiles/didntread4gd.gif)
I have a problem with you, your hyperbole, and you're shtick.
rather than making up conspiracy theories that dont exist and then claim im creating them you could have just said the above at the start and we could have saved both of us a lot of time
in the future instead of debating with me just because you dont like me you can instead put me on ignore and save us both a lot of time...i do it with king cole and trust me its a great thing
i love how if you call the media and eagles fans idiots when it comes to coming up with wild theories about mcnabb its "OMG YOU LOVE THIS FO AND CANT STAND TO HEAR ANYTHING NEGATIVE ABOUT THEM".
its not that at all. all of us have taken our shots at the FO, Reid, and yes even McNabb when we feel its warranted. i would much rather be talking about McNabb horrible passes from time to time and the fact he is reluctant to run or something actually related to football and McNabbs play. its not that I put this FO, Reid, or McNabb above the team which I root for. Its this ludicrous crap that fills the off season that really annoys me. i wonder what shirt McNabb was wearing...maybe he wasnt wearing green and OMG he is defying the FO! he also has that baron davis look going a bit OMG HE WANTS TO BE TRADED TO SAN FRAN FOR ALEX SMITH STRAIGHT UP!
McNabb might not be the best when it comes to handing the media but thats cause he isnt a jackass like TO was/is. Yes a lot of crap was stirred up when TO was here, or wherever he is whenever he is, but the difference a imbecile like TO takes the bait and goes on every channel and every interview and disses his teammates and coaches.
what i think some ppl really mean is that McNabb is not enough like TO. im sure ppl would love it he were and was a "TALKER".
its funny cause had McNabb had won a superbowl by now no one would even be over analyzing every single movement, statement, or thought he has. and that really shows how much this crap is just built up to fill the void.
i love how if you call the media and eagles fans idiots when it comes to coming up with wild theories about mcnabb
ive still yet to hear from the homers what these "wild theories" and "conspiracys" actually are
they sound like nice buzz words to me but can you give me an example of one of them
two on point articles on this situation..
r diddy
http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/view_content_1p.asp?ID=49825
hoffman
http://www.philly.com/dailynews/columnists/rich_hofmann/20070510_Rich_Hofmann___HEALTHY_LATITUDE.html
Diddy= Good Article
Hoffman= Typical DN Trash
Those articles aren't legit. I didn't see any quotes from Sam or Wilma.
Diddy= Good Article
Hoffman= Typical DN Trash
whats in hoffmans piece that makes it trash vs diddys
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 11, 2007, 08:23:52 AM
Diddy= Good Article
Hoffman= Typical DN Trash
whats in hoffmans piece that makes it trash vs diddys
QuoteYES, THERE is this perceived distance now between Donovan McNabb and the Eagles.
That sentence right there makes Hofmann's piece trash. He interjects opinion from the start rather than offering facts that support that opinion.
actually he offered lots of facts thruout the article...the same facts r diddy used....the pick of cobb the rpess conf in jersey ect.....and even then he only calls it a perceived distance
r diddy said this
McNabb certainly appeared to be distancing himself from the organization
again whats the difference
or does it come down to one guy wiritng for a philly paper which we all know are conspiracists and the can do no wrong nfl hall of famer r diddy writing the other one
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 11, 2007, 08:23:52 AM
Diddy= Good Article
Hoffman= Typical DN Trash
whats in hoffmans piece that makes it trash vs diddys
Yeah, actually both these articles echo the same sentiments & seem to provide an objective analysis of the situation w/o all the added "drama".
nm
Yeah, actually both these articles echo the same sentiments & seem to provide an objective analysis of the situation w/o all the added "drama".
i agree
both guys say there are big time signals that a change in their relationship may be taking place...but its still just appearance....wheres theres smoke there isnt always fire...but its definitely smoking
Just my dislike for the DN :-D Plus Ray Diddy is a god
Diddy:
QuoteFirst, McNabb has reason to be irritated. The Eagles used their top draft pick on a quarterback for the future. Meanwhile, Indianapolis, fresh off a Super Bowl victory, used its top pick on wide receiver Alex Gonzalez. Last year, the Colts drafted running back Joseph Addai. In New England, Bill Belichick is surrounding Tom Brady with a new cast of receivers including Randy Moss and Donté Stallworth. Last year, the Patriots invested their top pick on running back Laurence Maroney, who had an excellent rookie season.
That's what most teams do for a franchise quarterback: they surround him with more weapons. With the selection of Kolb, the Eagles went in another direction, and McNabb has a right to ask, "What's going on?"
spot on
That's horseshtein. Keeping Stallworth would have been one thing, but who would the Eagles have taken in the late 1st / early 2nd that would have really helped McNabb this year or next?
An argument could be made for Robert Meachem, but with Curtis and Brown both around long-term, you're going to have one pissed off WR in a year or so... or you have another 1st round flop.
An argument could also be made for Olsen, but that wouldn't really help THIS YEAR.
Frankly, McNabb has everything he needs to succeed on offense. Even Jeff Garcia succeeded with the offense last year. The defense is what really needed to be addressed, so McNabb can get the ball back. While the Eagles didn't do that either until the late 2nd round, they did go out and get a DT right after the draft that will contribute more than anyone from the draft would have... and they'd already added two solid players in Reagor and Spikes.
McNabb has no reason to bitch. He's got a good offensive line, a couple of great "safety valve" receivers in Westbrook and Smith (this year at least), and a legitimate pairing of starting WR's. If he can't score points with this offense, it's his fault... not the front office's.
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 11, 2007, 09:39:07 AM
That's horseshtein. Keeping Stallworth would have been one thing, but who would the Eagles have taken in the late 1st / early 2nd that would have really helped McNabb this year or next?
An argument could be made for Robert Meachem, but with Curtis and Brown both around long-term, you're going to have one pissed off WR in a year or so... or you have another 1st round flop.
An argument could also be made for Olsen, but that wouldn't really help THIS YEAR.
Frankly, McNabb has everything he needs to succeed on offense. Even Jeff Garcia succeeded with the offense last year. The defense is what really needed to be addressed, so McNabb can get the ball back. While the Eagles didn't do that either until the late 2nd round, they did go out and get a DT right after the draft that will contribute more than anyone from the draft would have... and they'd already added two solid players in Reagor and Spikes.
McNabb has no reason to bitch. He's got a good offensive line, a couple of great "safety valve" receivers in Westbrook and Smith (this year at least), and a legitimate pairing of starting WR's. If he can't score points with this offense, it's his fault... not the front office's.
i agree with the article and you. i agree with the article where it points out that where as teams such the pats and colts are reloading to make more runs at the superbowl the eagles always seem to be trying to outhink everyone, including themselves. im sure mcnabb has many times sat back and wondered...esp in the days of small/johnson and trash/pinkston/mitchell.
but also mcnabb has become a lot more efficient with what he has around him and he has plently of capable targets going into this season. heck the offense has not been the problem for a couple of seasons now, even without TO. we were scoring last season. they problem on offense is the playcalling esp on the short yd situations. other than that i think we have the players to be able to score 20+ pts in every single game.
the real test for this upcoming season is going to be the D. do we finally have a DLINE that can provide pressure on its own without the blitz? i really hope so cause if the D can not get it done it does not matter how well McNabb plays, we wont get too far.
and at least the article pointed out it wasnt that garcia did anything different or better, its just the coach finally realized that they have a pretty good RB who they should use more. if we run the ball with westbrook like we did at the end of the season (and even then there were moments where we passed too much) i think we could have a pretty good balanced offense.
and igy maybe conspiracy theory is a buzz word but you know what i meant....a lot of these articles and "stories" are just what the writers infer or think the player is thinking. it could be true but then again it could be just that....making up stories. things that really do not affect McNabb or the team when is under center ready to play.
if you think the eagles have enough around mcnabb on offense then thats one thing
but how can ask what more could they have done
you basically answered your own questions...they didnt sign stallworth and they didnt draft a WR in any round
their version of an improved offense this year was replacing donte stallworth with kevin curtis
you can think thats enough but you cant call what r diddy is saying horseshtein because he makes an excellent point in that they didnt make any moves to help mcnabb...instead they drafted his replacement
there were basically 3 positions they could've drafted were you can legitimately say they aren't trying to help him, kicker, punter, quarterback.
they chose quarterback.
If Kolb was drafted to be a "ligament farm" (and I firmly believe that he was) than you can argue that he was here to help McNabb.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 11, 2007, 10:54:35 AM
if you think the eagles have enough around mcnabb on offense then thats one thing
but how can ask what more could they have done
It's simple. Only so many players can be on the field at the same time.
Offensive Line? Check. No need for improvement.
Tight Ends? Check. L.J. and Schobel are plenty good.
Running Backs? Check. Westbrook is #1 and plenty of other styles of guys to choose behind him.
Wide Receivers? CHECK. I know you're down on Curtis... mostly because he's white and his name's not Donte Stallworth, but the guy is a very good player. Reggie Brown is a very good player. Then, there are some guys behind them that can fill the 3/4/5 roles just fine.
McNabb doesn't need "help" out there on offense beyond what they have. He needs to stay healthy, and the defense needs to give him more chances and not allow teams to eat clock against them. The Eagles have made a ton of effort the last few seasons to shure up the front seven, and they continued that this off-season. If you recall, last year the DLine was KILLING it before Kearse went down.
Again, I'm not sure how much *help* you all think McNabb needs. It's obvious the general consensus is that the Kolb pick sucked, and that's fine... but in general, it's not like the FO didn't do anything this off-season:
Lost:
Stallworth - by far the biggest loss, but he still couldn't be counted on last year to be ready to play
Darwin Walker - infuriatingly inconsistent and unhappy with his contract
Jeff Garcia - Would you have paid him $5m to stay?
Reno Mahe - Finally.
Dhani Jones - Thank God.
Michael Lewis - He's an athlete and a hard hitter at times, but he looked completely lost in coverage last year.
Rod Hood - probably the most underrated loss... this could hurt the team more than the rest combined
Added:
Kevin Curtis - he's at worst a reliable and precise route-runner and at best an occasional gamebreaker
Montae Reagor - good insurance in case Bunkley continues to be unimpressive
Ian Scott - great late addition to the rotation and the run defense
Takeo Spikes - should be 100% back from a 2-year-old injury, it's basically impossible to argue he's not an upgrade over the LB's from last year
Bethel Johnson - decent find for the return game, maybe
draft class - Guys like Abiamiri, Bradley (yes, even tho he's white), and Hunt could add depth and change-of-pace immediately. Others were drafted with a keen eye on the future (Gaddis, Barksdale, Kolb).
Seriously, considering some of the off-seasons this team has had (hello 2005 and only adding Mike McMahon), I can't see any reason to complain. If McNabb is an elite quarterback and if key players like Jevon Kearse, Lito Sheppard, and Brian Westbrook stay healthy... What's really missing that the Eagles could have effectively addressed?
didnt we also lose shawn barber.
Good point. He actually did a nice job last year.
That said, I don't think it dramatically changes the fact that the FO actually made an effort this off-season to improve the team. Some people just can't get past losing Stallworth and picking Kolb, obviously.
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 11, 2007, 11:50:57 AM
Good point. He actually did a nice job last year.
That said, I don't think it dramatically changes the fact that the FO actually made an effort this off-season to improve the team. Some people just can't get past losing Stallworth and picking Kolb, obviously.
yeah i would have actually liked to have kept him, until at least training camp
where did barber go? i dont remember any team picking him up.
I think the Texans picked barber up.
Dhani Jones, however, is still looking for a job.
McNabb doesn't need "help" out there on offense beyond what they have
as i mentioned in my initial response you could have started and stopped with that...i disagree...but its yours and the front offices opinion and its a valid one
but r diddy and sun werent commenting on if they have enough so much as could they have done more than what they did...and the answer is a resounding yes
Just help me understand where you think they went wrong:
Is it simply not re-signing Stallworth, or was there another specific player you wanted them to get?
I don't think that McNabb needed anything on offense, espeically when compared to the defense. However, if they were going to go offense with the first pick, which they did, they should have made an effort to help McNabb out.
There, how's that for talking out of both sides of my mouth.
Quote from: rjs246 on May 11, 2007, 01:00:45 PM
There, how's that for talking out of both sides of my mouth.
Solid C- effort.
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 11, 2007, 12:54:24 PM
Just help me understand where you think they went wrong:
Is it simply not re-signing Stallworth, or was there another specific player you wanted them to get?
Stallworth is part of it, but it's more the fact that they could've taken any defensive player with their first pick in the 2nd round, especially a linebacker or lineman, and he would've been somebody who can contribute this year and help this team.
they took a guy who will only help the team when Donovan's gone, which is why it's understandable for Donovan to be annoyed.
its not about specific players is about getting better than what they got
stallworth
draft wr's
get a legit #2 and/or #3 wr
moss
reggie brown
kevin curtis
hank friggin baskett
jason avant
you feel as tho that couldnt have been improved on...i disagree...theres really no need to continue this
baskett curtis (as a #1/2) and avant all could be legit and you would have been right...im not discounting that as a possibility...im just saying they didnt go all out to improve what they had last year
Peet
Pete?
Mathias?
Kate?
Tyrone?
It's Stan. Stan Moss.
SunMo wins.
Not really, because it's Peat! :flipoff
Ike Reese was on with Ant and Steve yesterday...
"Its going to take Donovan leaving before he's really appreciated here"
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on May 11, 2007, 08:23:50 PM
Ike Reese was on with Ant and Steve yesterday...
"Its going to take Donovan leaving before he's really appreciated here"
That's 100% true. Randall is a perfect example. I remember the Vet always erupting into "Ran-doll" chants. It wasn't until after he left that a lot of fans appreciated what he did, which was almost nothing in terms of overall success when compared to McNabb. Philly fans piss me off sometimes.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on May 11, 2007, 08:23:50 PM
Ike Reese was on with Ant and Steve yesterday...
"Its going to take Donovan leaving before he's really appreciated here"
That's a ludicrous and lame cliche. It doesn't surprise me in the least that a pro athlete would feel that way, though.
Philly fans piss me off sometimes.
stop it....all fans on occasion appreciate guys more after the leave...in fact its not just a sports thing..."you dont know what youve got till its gone" is as old as the country...
theres a lot of things you can say about philly fans but that isnt a fair criticism
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 11, 2007, 08:49:41 PM
Philly fans piss me off sometimes.
stop it....all fans on occasion appreciate guys more after the leave...in fact its not just a sports thing..."you dont know what youve got till its gone" is as old as the country...
theres a lot of things you can say about philly fans but that isnt a fair criticism
I agree with the first part of your statement. There's no doubt about it. At the same time though, Philly fans seem to be harder on their star players more than anyone else. I'm not saying that Philly fans are all hating on McNabb but I think sometimes they're a lot harder on him then they need be.
Philly fans seem to be harder on their star players more than anyone else
agreed....its because philly fans more than any other city care about personality and likeability so where in another city all a star has to do is produce in philly he has to produce AND be loved on a more personal level by the fanbase
Thus, Philly fans piss me off sometimes. Being a superstar isn't enough. You gotta be likable as well.
i dont know i love it...it makes us unique...i am exactly like that as well...i wont say likeability is more important to me...but its ultra important and if a player i cant get with (no homo) wins its not the same...its so easy to just like a guy cause he has great stats (lindros, mcnabb) ...but theres something special about a guy you can love AND hes a great player...(iverson, tocchet)
Meh. I just think that a player should be judged based on his performance. If he happens to have a charasmatic personality as well, then so be it. But it's all about performance and winning, not a popularity contest.
to each his own...i wanna like the guys im supposed to root for
So do I. But at the same time, I'm not gonna hate on a guy because he doesn't have a great personality. And that's the problem I have with a lot of the McNabb hate. A lot of it is based on his persona rather than his performance.
And that's the problem I have with a lot of the McNabb hate. A lot of it is based on his persona rather than his performance.
thats me in a nutshell...altho i think hes overrated as a player the main reason ive soured on him is because i dont like his personality...i used to love him all around and now not so much...i still want him to win and i root for him but its not the same
I'm falling out of love with you.
NO!
Ok. But you're not marrying my rich african daughter.
(http://www.philaflava.com/forum/images/smiles/dcracistemo0mp.gif)