1. Reggie Brown has turned it on after a slow first couple weeks. He looks like a legit #1 receiver now. Still drops one too many balls, but he is slowly but surely getting better.
2. Despite the defense looking so bad, we gave up one TD on the Moats fumble which put them on great field position, one long TD to Lewis on a bad coverage, and a FG on a drive that should've ended on a sack by Cole(instead a 12 men on field penalty). That is 17 points that were handed to the Saints on a platter. Maybe the Eagles defense didn't play that poorly after all. It didn't play good, but looking at the ways in which the Saints were set up to score points, then maybe all is not at a loss for the defense.
This defense seems to play well in spurts, which I think is the biggest issue right now. Looking at last week, the Eagles only allowed 3 points in the 2nd half to a very potent Cowboys offense. This defense has shown the potential to shut people down, just not consistently. So if we deal with the Lewis situation and cut down on those weekly 50 yard plays he gives up, then things should start to look up and develop consistency.
This is still your bend but don't break defense, only with mental mistakes and Lewis' incompetency we are breaking. Once we get these issues ironed out we should be ok.
3. Stallworth and Hood should be back soon. Not that the offense needs a surge right now. Especially in the receiver department. But Stallworth brings that speedy threat that opens up the offense even more than it already is. Hood coming back is the big key. As one of the better nickel corners in the league, he should instantly improve the struggling secondary.
4. The Eagles have yet to be beaten soundly. That has to count for something. Yes, they didn't play the best of opponents, but they had a great chance to win both games. This is a big problem right now and we all know this is something that needs to be fixed, but the fact is when you are in a game until the very end you have a shot to win. Also this team has shown the character to battle back from early deficits.
5. Akers made a long field goal and Dirk Johnson punted well today.
6. It was hard to find positives after this game. Even though the Eagles came back and lost a close one, this game had fewer positives than the Giants game. I can only name about 2 or 3 players that actually played well this game, and we still only lost by 3. McNabb played well, Reggie Brown played well, and that is pretty much it. Maybe you throw Lito in there.
That's it. Some were grasping at straws, but oh well. Time to get ready for Tampa.
Shut up.
Is Bunkley really Spadaro?
Lock.
Good points, Bunkley78. Some people are still too busy with the self-flagellation, though.
REMAIN CALM! ALL IS WELL!
(http://static.flickr.com/90/209333985_14124ab9d4.jpg)
(http://www.findserenitynow.com/images/biggerhomebottle.jpg)
About the only positives I can come up with other than Reggie's play is
I didn't lose any $$ on this game
I have Reggie, Joe Horn, and L J on both my fantasy teams, although I only played Horn in one league.
The main positive from this game is that the taterskins lost to the Titans.
And that they play again in 6 days.
I'm still pissed but it wasn't a horrible loss. It sucks to lose and you obviously want to see them win them all but that damn Sean Payton did it again. He's the Eagles kryptonite.
I shtein on positivity, especially after failure. It's for Hoydas. Washington lost, but so did the goddamned Eagles. Meanwhile, Dallas and NY won. Man up and embrace the fact that this team is a pretender, not more. Otherwise, they'd have beat the Saint. And the Giants. I have no reason to believe it's going to get any better in the coming weeks.
It's still Reid at head coach, isn't it? He'll still pull the same dumb farg plays out of his fat ass, won't he? I see no reason to feel good today.
And I'm not gonna apologize for it, either.
Its too early to pull the pretender/contender stuff, IMO.
Pittsburgh backed into the playoffs last season and then caught fire. The key is to just get into the playoffs. Obviously you want to make it as easy as possible (by getting a bye or HFA) but just being one of the 6 is what we want.
The NFC outside of Chicago is a clusterfarg. A whole bunch of teams are in the mix and its up to the Eagles to pull away. I think they can because they have Donovan McNabb and a potent offense. They need to fix the goddamn defense though. The pass rush is great - the pass defense is poor.
"Losers always whine about there best. Winners go home and farg the prom queen."
The Rock
Carla was the prom queen.
Really?
(click) Yeah.
my positives? we are still 4-2 and first in the nfc east. at the end of the season i think we can still have the 2nd best record in the nfc and at the very least be in the playoffs.
Quote from: Diomedes on October 16, 2006, 11:44:39 AM
I shtein on positivity, especially after failure. It's for Hoydas. Washington lost, but so did the goddamned Eagles. Meanwhile, Dallas and NY won. Man up and embrace the fact that this team is a pretender, not more. Otherwise, they'd have beat the Saint. And the Giants. I have no reason to believe it's going to get any better in the coming weeks.
It's still Reid at head coach, isn't it? He'll still pull the same dumb farg plays out of his fat ass, won't he? I see no reason to feel good today.
And I'm not gonna apologize for it, either.
I agree, I am so sick of Andy Reid, I really wish we could have a different HC. The thing that bothers me the most is that he hardly ever coaches well in big games.
Honestly, I don't know that he doesn't "coach"well. The problem is when his gameplan doesn't work. If he installs an effective gameplan, it's lights out. If the opponent stops his gameplan, he's totally lobotamized, drooling on his fat ass on the sideline.
He's a horrible game day coach. Just awful. Addicted to the pass, never heard of clock management. Can't tell a good WR or LB from a pile of dog shtein.
Otherwise I think he's great. Gets players to buy in, play like a team, etc. He's stable, his teams are always competetive, even when they suck. I'll take 6-10 "off" years any day compared to what happens to other teams when they have lousy coaches. See Oakland, for example.
I'm torn between sticking by him, figuring that if he keeps the team relatively competetive, maybe they'll win despite his idiotic game calling. Or just wanting him gone.
Quote from: Diomedes on October 16, 2006, 08:29:52 PM
He's a horrible game day coach. Just awful. Addicted to the pass, never heard of clock management. Can't tell a good WR or LB from a pile of dog shtein.
Otherwise I think he's great. Gets players to buy in, play like a team, etc. He's stable, his teams are always competetive, even when they suck. I'll take 6-10 "off" years any day compared to what happens to other teams when they have lousy coaches. See Oakland, for example.
I'm torn between sticking by him, figuring that if he keeps the team relatively competetive, maybe they'll win despite his idiotic game calling. Or just wanting him gone.
Couldn't agree more. He has brought unprecedented long-term success to the Eagles but his stubbornness is infuriating. Run the farging rock Andy, draft a LB in the first round.
Quote from: Drunkmasterflex on October 16, 2006, 08:21:10 PM
Quote from: Diomedes on October 16, 2006, 11:44:39 AM
I shtein on positivity, especially after failure. It's for Hoydas. Washington lost, but so did the goddamned Eagles. Meanwhile, Dallas and NY won. Man up and embrace the fact that this team is a pretender, not more. Otherwise, they'd have beat the Saint. And the Giants. I have no reason to believe it's going to get any better in the coming weeks.
It's still Reid at head coach, isn't it? He'll still pull the same dumb farg plays out of his fat ass, won't he? I see no reason to feel good today.
And I'm not gonna apologize for it, either.
I agree, I am so sick of Andy Reid, I really wish we could have a different HC. The thing that bothers me the most is that he hardly ever coaches well in big games.
Drinking too much Lonestar?
Quote from: Diomedes on October 16, 2006, 08:29:52 PM
He's a horrible game day coach. Just awful. Addicted to the pass, never heard of clock management. Can't tell a good WR or LB from a pile of dog shtein.
Otherwise I think he's great. Gets players to buy in, play like a team, etc. He's stable, his teams are always competetive, even when they suck. I'll take 6-10 "off" years any day compared to what happens to other teams when they have lousy coaches. See Oakland, for example.
I'm torn between sticking by him, figuring that if he keeps the team relatively competetive, maybe they'll win despite his idiotic game calling. Or just wanting him gone.
Thats exactly how I feel, only it is the day after a loss so I want him to go. The thing is his formula of passing that much will not work. There has never been a Super Bowl winning team that passes this much.
passing too much or reid really didnt cost us the game this time. it was the defense. we finally have a damn good offense and now our defense is average to mediocre.
Who cares if he doesn't run. We have the #1 offense in the league. We'll probably need to run the ball effectively sooner or later, but we'll cross that road when we get to it. For now the defense just isn't playing well.
Way too much blame on Reid right now. He is a top 5 coach in this league. I wouldn't want anyone else but Belichick coaching this team right now.
he's a top 5 coach? maybe until Sunday, then he falls back to bottom 10
Sundays are where the games are won and Andy has one of the best win percentages in NFL history. Andy is under a microscope because he is the head coach of the Eagles, but every fan base questions their coaches play-calling after every loss. We just don't follow all other 31 teams under a microscope.
Case in point: The Cowboys scored 3 points in the second half last week against the Eagles. They stopped running the ball pretty much the entire 3rd quarter. All coaches have trouble adjusting in games. Andy wins ball games and that is all that matters.
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 16, 2006, 09:52:53 PM
passing too much or reid really didnt cost us the game this time. it was the defense. we finally have a damn good offense and now our defense is average to mediocre.
I know, I am just venting some frustration today.
Here's some positivity for you...at least we aren't Cardinals fans. :-D
Ahh, those halcyon CardTrader days. He must be having an awesome morning.
Quote from: Zanshin on October 17, 2006, 09:13:55 AM
Ahh, those halcyon CardTrader days. He must be having an awesome morning.
yep (http://www.kffl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186560)
Quote from: MadMarchHare on October 16, 2006, 08:29:21 PM
Honestly, I don't know that he doesn't "coach"well. The problem is when his gameplan doesn't work. If he installs an effective gameplan, it's lights out. If the opponent stops his gameplan, he's totally lobotamized, drooling on his fat ass on the sideline.
actually the exact opposite of that happened on sunday.
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 16, 2006, 09:52:53 PM
passing too much or reid really didnt cost us the game this time. it was the defense. we finally have a damn good offense and now our defense is average to mediocre.
the defense sucks. there is no way to really sugar coat it.
Quote from: Wingspan on October 17, 2006, 09:44:29 AM
the defense sucks. there is no way to really sugar coat it.
Bingo.
i just dont get why the defense sucks...we have a better DLINE than we ever had had, even with kearse out, and we have the same 2ndary that went the probowl. and its not even the run anymore...the pass is killing us now.
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 17, 2006, 10:46:31 AM
i just dont get why the defense sucks...we have a better DLINE than we ever had had, even with kearse out, and we have the same 2ndary that went the probowl. and its not even the run anymore...the pass is killing us now.
I am trying to figure that one out too. The rush has been awesome to decent at times, but you are not going to get pressure every down. For some reason, we just can't cover anyone...I have re-watched a couple games and I cannot figure it out. Maybe Lito and Brown just aren't as good as everyone thought they were.
Quote from: Butchers Bill on October 17, 2006, 10:50:34 AM
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 17, 2006, 10:46:31 AM
i just dont get why the defense sucks...we have a better DLINE than we ever had had, even with kearse out, and we have the same 2ndary that went the probowl. and its not even the run anymore...the pass is killing us now.
I am trying to figure that one out too. The rush has been awesome to decent at times, but you are not going to get pressure every down. For some reason, we just can't cover anyone...I have re-watched a couple games and I cannot figure it out. Maybe Lito and Brown just aren't as good as everyone thought they were.
well that much i think we all knew. they werent as good as the hype but still they are decent. back in 04 we would be up by a lot and very quickly and most teams would play catch up and become one dimensional. our offense is pretty good again...maybe if we can go up and go up early we can do that again? but then that doesnt make much sense either since in the giants game we let the lead slip away.
Quote from: MURP on October 17, 2006, 09:35:41 AM
Quote from: Zanshin on October 17, 2006, 09:13:55 AM
Ahh, those halcyon CardTrader days. He must be having an awesome morning.
yep (http://www.kffl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186560)
LMAO...I'd forgotten that I had him on my ignore list.
Quote from: Wingspan on October 17, 2006, 09:44:29 AM
the defense sucks. there is no way to really sugar coat it.
Teams have figured out how to exploit their weaknesses and it doesn't seem like they have the ability to counter anymore.
It's depressing as hell, actually.
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 16, 2006, 09:52:53 PM
passing too much or reid really didnt cost us the game this time. it was the defense. we finally have a damn good offense and now our defense is average to mediocre.
it's a team game...sometimes you need to have your offense chew up more time on the clock to cover up for your weak defense by keeping the opponent's offense off the field.
Quote from: hunt on October 17, 2006, 11:51:24 AM
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 16, 2006, 09:52:53 PM
passing too much or reid really didnt cost us the game this time. it was the defense. we finally have a damn good offense and now our defense is average to mediocre.
it's a team game...sometimes you need to have your offense chew up more time on the clock to cover up for your weak defense by keeping the opponent's offense off the field.
while i agree to a point, i also see this as a excuse for the defense. the offense didnt rush them to the field to start of the game. when the offense came back and took the lead they didnt blow the coverage in the 2ndary. there has to be more accountability on the defensive side. for yrs we have dreamed of a dynamic offense with WRs who are more capable than the likes of thrash and pinkston and we finally have one and now our defense, which has many of the same players, same coordinator, and same style is letting us down. its not like the offense back then was chewing up the clock and letting the D rest.
it is a team game and it would help if the offense had more 9-11 play drives but im not going to complain about a offense that can score and blame them for our defense's lack of ability to stop drives.
With everything said above. The Eagles still had a chance to win the game against the Saints. If it wasn't for 12 men on the field who knows what would have happened. Maybe the Eagles still would have lost but you never know. With all the mistakes that were made in the game and still have a chance at the end says a lot about the Eagles ability.
This team will turn it around. They will make the playoffs.
Anyone expecting the Super Bowl maybe be asking a bit much, but still you never know.
Quote from: SOARIN EAGLE on October 17, 2006, 12:47:54 PM
With everything said above. The Eagles still had a chance to win the game against the Saints. If it wasn't for 12 men on the field who knows what would have happened. Maybe the Eagles still would have lost but you never know. With all the mistakes that were made in the game and still have a chance at the end says a lot about the Eagles ability.
This team will turn it around. They will make the playoffs.
Anyone expecting the Super Bowl maybe be asking a bit much, but still you never know.
exactly...i might be considered a homer but the 2 defeats we have had this season arent the type where u look at them and go wow we were outmatched and dominated. these are 2 games we should have had and we didnt, and a championship team doesnt give up leads like that but coming from where we were last yr im still pleased with a 4-2 record. looking at our schedule we need to win the next 4 games and be at 8-2 before we hit the really brutal stretch of our season.
Quote from: hunt on October 17, 2006, 11:51:24 AM
Quote from: Magical_Retard on October 16, 2006, 09:52:53 PM
passing too much or reid really didnt cost us the game this time. it was the defense. we finally have a damn good offense and now our defense is average to mediocre.
it's a team game...sometimes you need to have your offense chew up more time on the clock to cover up for your weak defense by keeping the opponent's offense off the field.
Lack of TOP being the fault of the offense is a myth...
Houston Game
Eagles - 32:51
Texans - 27:09
4 Longest Sustained Drives
8:56 PHI - 16 Plays (end game after 11 play houston drive)
6:16 HOU 10 Plays (opening drive)
5:54 PHI 13 Plays (after houston 3-and-out)
5:10 HOU 7 Plays (after 7 play eagle TD drive)
Giants Game
Giants 46:13
Eagles 28:45
4 Longes Sustained Drives
9:55 NYG 13 Plays (after eagle 3-and-out in OT /end game)
5:19 NYG 9 Plays (after 5 play eagle drive)
4:26 PHI 11 Plays (1st drive of game)
4:11 PHI 7 Plays (1st drive of 2nd half)
San Fran Game
Eagles 24:39
49ers 35:21
4 Longest
6:16 SF 11 Plays (after an 8 play eagle drive)
5:50 SF 10 plays (after eagle 3-and-out)
5:08 SF 16 plays (after eagle 3-and-out 2 minutes)
4:40 PHI 8 plays (after SF 3-and-out)
Packer Game
Packers 32:43
Eagles 27:17
4 Longest
6:39 PHI 15 Plays (opening 2nd half)
4:53 GB 10 Plays (after eagle 6 play drive w/ fumble inside the 10)
4:09 GB 10 plays (after eagle 3-and-out)
4:04 GB 8 plays (after eagle TD, which was immediately after the buckhalter fumble, then green bay fumble)
Dallas Game
Cowboys 36:59
Eagles 23:01
4 longest
5:43 DAL 12 plays (after eagle fumble/5 play drive)
5:40 DAL 10 plays (after eagle TD, immediately following a 1 play dallas drive in which they fumbled)
4:10 DAL 12 plays (after eagle 5 play drive)
3:53 DAL 11 plays (after eagle 3 and out)
Saints Game
Eagles - 25:57
Saints -34:03
4 longest
8:26 NO 16 plays (after 8 play/4 minute eagle drive)
5:56 NO 11 plays (opening drive)
4:49 NO 9 plays (after eagle 6 play drive/4 minutes)
4:49 PHI 11 plays (after saints 3-and-out)
The Defense has forced,
19 3-and-outs this season, and they have produced a turnover on the opening sequence of plays in a drive
5 times. (total 24 "quick opponent drives) to which the eagles offense came on the field and got at least 1 first down or scored immediately 18 times. thats a pretty high % -
75%the offense is giving the defense time to rest, the defense has just been horrible. Even on the quick scores, you have the extra point, 2 commercial breaks, and the kickoff in between.
the eagles offense has only gone 3-and-out 16 times. they've turned it over in less than 3 plays once.
do you have stats for total plays on offense/defense??? i'd like to see where the eagles rank.
Quote from: hunt on October 17, 2006, 03:06:03 PM
do you have stats for total plays on offense/defense??? i'd like to see where the eagles rank.
the defense has been on the field for 433 plays, most in the nfl...dead last.
the offense has been on the field for 367 plays, 8th most.
thanks. i had a feeling their D has been on the field for more plays than any other team.
Quote from: Wingspan on October 17, 2006, 03:10:18 PM
Quote from: hunt on October 17, 2006, 03:06:03 PM
do you have stats for total plays on offense/defense??? i'd like to see where the eagles rank.
the defense has been on the field for 433 plays, most in the nfl...dead last.
the offense has been on the field for 367 plays, 8th most.
to add to that, they are #6 in the NFL in first downs/game
#1 in yards/play
and 29th in time of possession, right?
I wonder about the TOP thing;
If they are scoring fast and putting points on the board do you rather see that type of explosive offense or do you rather see a time consuming offense that may or may not score? If the routes are open and you see a guy for points how can you pass that up?
TOP is not helped when the defense starts the game by letting up a long drive. I don't buy into the whole "they're getting worn out" thing. They stink on ice.
Quotethe offense is giving the defense time to rest, the defense has just been horrible.
Yep.
I find the notion that the Eagles are scoring "too quickly" absurd. The defense should be ready to go after a touchdown. The fact is, seemingly every time the Eagles score a touchdown, the defense gives up a big play, or even worse, a long ass drive down the field.
That's gotta stop. If it doesn't, you can tie this season off at the knot.
I seem to recall 2004 being similar to this year in the sense that back then the offense was potent and scored a lot early and often. But the difference is, as many have pointed out, is the defense. Back then they would stop teams. Or they'd allow yards and then when teams got into the RZ they'd give up FGs and not TDs.
You don't run and run and run or throw dink and dunks if it isn't working in order to ignore scoring. Score as much as you can.
The simple thing here is that the defense MUST play better. That's all there is to it.
I like everyone else simply can't figure out why this defense is letting teams pass all over them. Michael Lewis has been part of the problem, but it obviously is more than that. I think Trotter is a problem as well, as much as I love him. He can't play the pass well at all. He was responsible for quite a few completions to Horn that game. On the first TD he was right there and couldn't make a play on the ball. I also think Dhani Jones is being exploited too in the passing game.
Also you combine the issue of players breaking initial tackles and getting an extra 5 yards on short pass plays, that magnifies the problem. Those are the best reasons I can come up with.
The onus is definitely on the D this year. It is especially frustrating that two horrendous 4th quarters really cost the Eagles an undefeated season up to this point. Granted, that is a problem in and of itself that needs to be addressed immediately.
What is also frustrating is that it seems like the defense isn't adjusting to the new emphasis of the 'hurry-up' offense. There was a time when the Eagles scored in the 4th quarter, took the lead, like they did on Sunday, and the defense would step in a shut the opponent down. Now, the very next drive the Saints go deep and the Eagles D gives up an incredibly easy score. When your offense gives you a touchdown lead in the 4th, you better come out and shut down the opposing team's offense and get your team the ball back. There is no determination. Complete letdown.
The D doesn't have that urgency in the 4th quarter. They seem lax, unmotivated, and disinterested. They don't have that tenacity to put teams away. They seem too worried about losing the lead than actually shutting a team down. The D needs a confidence booster, I highly doubt it is simply because they are 'tired'. It's not just late in the game, but teams have been moving the ball pretty easily all season.
I don't know about lax, uninterested or disinterested. I hate to say it, but maybe - just maybe - the defense just isn' good.
This could well be what the Eagles get this year. Great DL, mediocre LBs and DBs.
Dawkins is great, Sheldon and Lito are somewhere between good and very good, Lewis sucks.
The DBs aren't mediocre.
Dawkins is not great anymore and Sheldon has been kind of mediocre so far this year.
Dawk is still great. I don't know what you've been watching, but I wouldn't expect you to understand what you were watching anyway.
The defense (outside of "TD Lewis") doesn't stink. They just play too soft in coverage coming off the LOS and the blitzes have gone from exotic to predictable. They give too big a cushion on the short routes and Lewis is invisible on long routes. The D can play well (we've seen it and they've shown it) they're just wildly inconsistent at the moment.
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 17, 2006, 08:27:02 PM
Dawkins is great, Sheldon and Lito are somewhere between good and very good, Lewis sucks.
The DBs aren't mediocre.
Right now, the Eagles are
27th in passing yards allowed per game.
You're right. They're not mediocre right now. They're worse.
I am not saying Dawk is not still a very good player, but if you think he is as good as he was a few years ago you are just kidding yourself.
I am still worried about the way Deuce ran over the defense. We did pretty good stopping Bush on running plays, but who doesnt?
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 17, 2006, 08:45:47 PM
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 17, 2006, 08:27:02 PM
Dawkins is great, Sheldon and Lito are somewhere between good and very good, Lewis sucks.
The DBs aren't mediocre.
Right now, the Eagles are 27th in passing yards allowed per game.
You're right. They're not mediocre right now. They're worse.
You are mixing apples and oranges. If you think the quality of the DBs somehow is a direct result of our ranked pass defense, you are kidding yourself. There are plenty of other variables involved. Stats don't explain the entire situation.
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 17, 2006, 09:10:22 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 17, 2006, 08:45:47 PM
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 17, 2006, 08:27:02 PM
Dawkins is great, Sheldon and Lito are somewhere between good and very good, Lewis sucks.
The DBs aren't mediocre.
Right now, the Eagles are 27th in passing yards allowed per game.
You're right. They're not mediocre right now. They're worse.
You are mixing apples and oranges. If you think the quality of the DBs somehow is a direct result of our ranked pass defense, you are kidding yourself. There are plenty of other variables involved. Stats don't explain the entire situation.
How am I mixing apples and oranges by judging the defensive backs by the one stat for which they are primarily responsible?
The quality of the DBs are mediocre. Period.
Explain how the aren't. Prove to me that the tandem of Dawkins-Lewis-Brown-Sheppard are somehow good-to-great, and yet the Eagles are barely beating the dregs of the NFL in passing defense.
Dawkins is still good. Not great like he was, but good.
Lewis can't cover a quadruple-amputee at this point.
Brown is OK at covering, and has been thdreadful at tackling.
Sheppard makes the flashy plays, but gets burned too often.
Rod Hood is out - Lord knows when he'll be ready to play again. Next week? November? 2052?
Joselio Hanson is getting meaningful minuted on defense. :-D
Can they play better than they have? Perhaps. But, to this point, they haven't.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 17, 2006, 09:17:42 PM
Dawkins is still good. Not great like he was, but good.
I dont know what you are watching, but you dont understand what you were watching.
:-\
Quote from: Wingspan on October 17, 2006, 03:10:18 PM
Quote from: hunt on October 17, 2006, 03:06:03 PM
do you have stats for total plays on offense/defense??? i'd like to see where the eagles rank.
the defense has been on the field for 433 plays, most in the nfl...dead last.
the offense has been on the field for 367 plays, 8th most.
That offense stat has to be looked at more closely, considering only 14 (give or take 2) teams have played 6 games.
There have been times when WRs or TEs have been wide open downfield, you obviously can't ignore that. Other times, it has taken an almost perfect throw from McNabb to even have a chance of being completed, while other receivers were wide open underneath. The players are there on offense to take a 5-10 yard pass for extra YAC, McNabb needs to just hit the open man.
The defense is a little complicated. I hate zone, JJ seems to be calling it more and more. Their CBs need to be in press man coverage. Everybody knows Lewis has been horrible in pass coverage. There is no way a LB is going to consistently cover a WR like Horn.
Dawkins - I don't get this good but not great stuff anymore. He is playing as good this year as he has EVER played. People who say that are goig strictly by last season. He is at the absolute peak of his game right now.
Brown - Has been great at covering this year, but yes, has been poor at tackling. This has never been a problem for Brown in his career. He has always been a very good tackler. So going by 4 years of football before this season, I'd have to say he is just in a funk and will come out of it. You don't play 4 years of football as a good tackler and suddenly lose it when you are as young as he is.
Sheppard - Got burnt last year. Hasn't this year. Has played great this season. As long as he continues playing this way, he is pro bowl caliber this season.
Lewis - has been awful. Considine will probably be starting. We'll see how he does.
Hood - Best nickel corner in football. Has been hurt, but you can't include him because he hasn't been playing. When he does play he is arguably our best corner.
Hanson - After the bad start against the Giants, has played very very well. Is physical and is in the top 10 in passes defended. Played a great game against the Cowboys. Has been a solid corner for us.
I don't know how you can say this secondary has been mediocre as a unit. One player has been completely awful(Lewis) one has been bad at tackling, but great at everything else(Brown) and everyone else has been perfectly fine. The only player we see get burnt in this secondary week to week is Lewis. When have we seen Dawk, Sheldon or Lito get burnt? Last time was week 2 against the Giants where Sheldon got beat by Plaxico.
Blame the linebackers for the underneath stuff that we are giving up, because fopr the most part our down the field defense has been fine except for Lewis. Trotter can't pass defend and neither can Dhani. McCoy has been banged up for 2 weeks now so it's hard to grade him thus far.
Only two teams have given up more passing plays of 20+ yards than the Eagles (21): Washington (25) and Green Bay (28). San Fran and the J-E-T-S have given up as many (21)
Only three teams have given up more first downs passing than the Eagles: Jets, San Francisco and Detroit.
Are these just on the DBs? No. But they haven't been a part of the solution thus far, either.
I'm just getting tired of the same problems year in and out for this team. It's the small things like clock management, not getting plays in fast enough, blown timeouts (which is my biggest problem right now) that have not changed since Andy got here.
I guess one positive is that we have some WRs that can actually play other than that we probably lead the league in drops (I'm not sure if we do but it wouldn't surprise me.)
I guess as long as we have #5 we have a chance to win. But, IMO, we will win because of him. Not because of Andy.
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 17, 2006, 09:26:33 PM
Dawkins - I don't get this good but not great stuff anymore. He is playing as good this year as he has EVER played. People who say that are goig strictly by last season. He is at the absolute peak of his game right now.
Brown - Has been great at covering this year, but yes, has been poor at tackling. This has never been a problem for Brown in his career. He has always been a very good tackler. So going by 4 years of football before this season, I'd have to say he is just in a funk and will come out of it. You don't play 4 years of football as a good tackler and suddenly lose it when you are as young as he is.
Sheppard - Got burnt last year. Hasn't this year. Has played great this season. As long as he continues playing this way, he is pro bowl caliber this season.
Lewis - has been awful. Considine will probably be starting. We'll see how he does.
Hood - Best nickel corner in football. Has been hurt, but you can't include him because he hasn't been playing. When he does play he is arguably our best corner.
Hanson - After the bad start against the Giants, has played very very well. Is physical and is in the top 10 in passes defended. Played a great game against the Cowboys. Has been a solid corner for us.
I don't know how you can say this secondary has been mediocre as a unit. One player has been completely awful(Lewis) one has been bad at tackling, but great at everything else(Brown) and everyone else has been perfectly fine. The only player we see get burnt in this secondary week to week is Lewis. When have we seen Dawk, Sheldon or Lito get burnt? Last time was week 2 against the Giants where Sheldon got beat by Plaxico.
Blame the linebackers for the underneath stuff that we are giving up, because fopr the most part our down the field defense has been fine except for Lewis. Trotter can't pass defend and neither can Dhani. McCoy has been banged up for 2 weeks now so it's hard to grade him thus far.
You're out of your mind.
Dawkins-- Still good, but peak of his game? Come on. He used to be a guy you could line up at either S spot or CB. He's much more limited these days.
Lewis-- Has been horrendous.
Brown-- The fact that he hasn't had problems tackling in the past doesn't mean shtein when you're talking about his year. And he's had his problems.
Sheppard-- He hasn't been burnt this year. Hey, that's awesome. You know what, I sat out a bunch of games this year, and I wasn't burnt either. I rock.
Hood-- Banged up, and even when healthy, I don't think he's the best nickle corner in the league.
Hanson-- Come on. You really have a ton of faith in this guy at this point. He's still a project. I think he's done alright, but c'mon.
The secondary has been okay at best, particularly when you factor in injury.
Agree to disagree about Hood and Dawk. I think Hood is by far the best nickel in the league and one of the best corners in the league period. Hood is a stud who would be a pro bowl corner if the Eagles didn't already lock up Lito and Sheldon for long term deals.
Dawk has been doing it all this year. I don't see him being a step slow at all. He is covering, hitting, flat out doing it all this season. Has been a monster in the red zone and goal line situations. Last year he had a down year, but I think he's playing as well as he's ever played this season.
I hate to agree with Bunkley here about anything, but I agree with what he's saying about Dawkins, for the most part. Last year (or maybe it was 2004) was Dawkins' best statistical year in his last 3, and this year he's been doing great as well. I think everyone's problem is once we figured out that Dawk was the best FS in the game at one point, we've held him to this high standard where he must make every play he's in the area of. Even the best don't do that, but he's been damn close. He might be a tad slower, but other then that I havn't seen much decline in his game. And even if his play HAS declined, his leadership and the heart he plays the game with are unmatched.
Never hate to be on the right side of the fence. ;)
But yeah, just go back to the San Fran game and watch the goal line stand to see what Dawk is still made of.
It might not be outside the realm of possibility that this group is just less talented. There have been flashes of what this defense can do, I think, and that is what makes the inconsistencies all the more frustrating. That what leaves me to believe that they don't play with urgency when needed. The Eagles battle back, to an early 4th quarter lead, the offense is clicking, and the the D lets up a big TD play to tie it up early. Then, they can't force a 3 and out and let the Saints eat up the last 8 minutes of the fourth quarter. There seems to be a motivational aspect there missing.
There needs to be some sort of adjustment, either player personnel wise or maybe scheme wise, because this defense is just giving up too many big plays and allowing too many sustainable drives.
But you have to figure that the mistakes play a HUGE part of it too. Mistakes result in big plays. Big plays result in momentum. If Moats doesn't run into Wynn or Lewis doesn't mess up, then we aren't even talking about the pass defense right now, because they only score 13 points and we win.
Things are just magnified when we lose. If we lost that Dallas game in OT, this defense would've been crucified, but it wasn't because Lito had a lucky INT.
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 18, 2006, 02:17:38 AM
then we aren't even talking about the pass defense right now
You have no farging clue where you are right now, do you.
Quote from: Zanshin on October 17, 2006, 10:15:48 PM
Sheppard-- He hasn't been burnt this year. Hey, that's awesome. You know what, I sat out a bunch of games this year, and I wasn't burnt either. I rock.
Sign Zanshin!
I think this loss can be summed up very simply, we lost a very close game on the road too what is looking like a very, very dangerous Saints team. This ain't your Daddy's Saints anymore. They are good.
Other than stupid penalties, the one thing that stands out to me, is Reid going to the friggen' soft zone immediately after we score late in the game. I guess he doesn't have very much confidence in the ability of our CB's in man coverage, I don't know, but as soon as we go zone, BAM! Score.
Quote from: shorebird on October 18, 2006, 05:49:58 AM
I think this loss can be summed up very simply, we lost a very close game on the road too what is looking like a very, very dangerous Saints team. This ain't your Daddy's Saints anymore. They are good.
Other than stupid penalties, the one thing that stands out to me, is Reid going to the friggen' soft zone immediately after we score late in the game. I guess he doesn't have very much confidence in the ability of our CB's in man coverage, I don't know, but as soon as we go zone, BAM! Score.
i dont know how much reid controls the D...i think he leaves that up to johnson completely.
This secondary has been shredded by every team that has played them. Anyone arguing that they are anything other than steaming piles of shtein right now needs to have their head examined.
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 18, 2006, 02:17:38 AM
But you have to figure that the mistakes play a HUGE part of it too. Mistakes result in big plays. Big plays result in momentum. If Moats doesn't run into Wynn or Lewis doesn't mess up, then we aren't even talking about the pass defense right now, because they only score 13 points and we win.
Things are just magnified when we lose. If we lost that Dallas game in OT, this defense would've been crucified, but it wasn't because Lito had a lucky INT.
Yeah, but it impossible to take one aspect out of the game and then say "well, the Eagles would have won because they wouldn't have scored, this, this, and this" -- If you delete one aspect in a temporal arrangement you lend yourself to changing the entire succession. You can't say, "well, if this wouldn't of happened the Eagles would have won." Because you're just speculating on what the Eagles would have done.
All you need to know is that the Eagles were up 24-17 in the fourth quarter, everything else prior to that is irrelevant, and if they would have taken care of the Saints after that score they would have won. The pass defense is why the Eagles lost, because if they would played better Drew Brees doesn't throw a bomb to Joe Horn and ties the game. Moreover, it was the pass defense and the run defense for that matter that allowed the 16 play, 8 minute drive at the end of the game which put the Saints in the position to kick an easy chip-shot field goal for the win.
Stating that the pass defense or the defense in general is not to blame for the loss, I think, is complete bunk.
It is absolutely to blame for the loss and it absolutely needs to improve. I'm just saying that this secondary has the ability to be tops in the league. They just aren't playing like it. Mistakes are a big part of it and the other part is Michael Lewis.
This secondary is not nearly as good as we were led to believe. To hold on to the hope that they are singularly talented and just need to 'get it together' is stupid and contrary to all evidence.
Quote from: rjs246 on October 18, 2006, 04:53:15 PM
This secondary is not nearly as good as we were led to believe. To hold on to the hope that they are singularly talented and just need to 'get it together' is stupid and contrary to all evidence.
They sure were decent 2 years ago. That has to count for something!
!
1
It surely does count for something. We have the same personnel and obviously their talents haven't diminished because they aren't in that age area yet.
Dawkins is.
Beat me to it.
Dawkins is playing better this season then he did in 2004.
Yeah, I'm not buying Dawkins play falling off noticeably. He's not the best safety in the league anymore, but I think he's been one of the better players on the D this whole year with the exception of the Saints game, but even then, he didn't make many gaffs.
I'm not saying his play has fallen off or not. While he's obviously not where he was 3 or 4 years ago... he's still easily among the tops in the NFL. I'm just making the point that Dawk is now at the point where age could start to effect his play... which Bunkley seems to want to ignore.
Quote from: EagleFeva on October 18, 2006, 09:06:34 PM
I'm not saying his play has fallen off or not. While he's obviously not where he was 3 or 4 years ago... he's still easily among the tops in the NFL. I'm just making the point that Dawk is now at the point where age could start to effect his play... which Bunkley seems to want to ignore.
I think age is already affecting his play, but he's still the best we have on this team.
Quote from: shorebird on October 18, 2006, 05:49:58 AM
Other than stupid penalties, the one thing that stands out to me, is Reid going to the friggen' soft zone immediately after we score late in the game. I guess he doesn't have very much confidence in the ability of our CB's in man coverage.
sorry, I know JJ calls the D. It's one of those things that eat at me.
the reason they bring Considine in at safety and move Dawk to linebacker in passing downs is because Dawk can't get there on the blitz from the safety position anymore. it also helps him out when covering backs or tight ends to be closer to the line.
Telling Bunkley that Dawkins play has fallen off is like telling the Pope that Jesus had sex with his mother.
You keep saying his play has fallen off but you never explain in what aspect. He can still cover pretty much the entire field. He is great in run support, he still is as hard a hitter as he ever was, he still makes smart decisions.
So if you are going to say he isn't what he was 3 or 4 years ago, then follow that up with what he can't do anymore, because I told you multiple times what he still does as well as he has ever done.
Please shut up.
No.
Pretty please?
Hey, if you can't make a case then don't get in an argument you can't win. ;)
Wow... you're serious aren't you? :-D
Since Bunkley is pretty terrible at actually providing some info...
Here are Brian Dawkins numbers since 2000.
Season Team G Solo Ast Total Sack YdsL Int Yds IntTD DefTD FFum PD Sfty
2000 Philadelphia 13 55 17 72 2.0 18 4 62 0 0 1 10 0
2001 Philadelphia 15 58 12 70 1.5 11 2 15 0 1 2 17 0
2002 Philadelphia 16 66 29 95 3.0 27 2 27 0 0 5 12 0
2003 Philadelphia 7 28 7 35 0.5 6 1 0 0 0 0 6 0
2004 Philadelphia 15 62 8 70 3.0 15 4 40 0 0 2 12 0
2005 Philadelphia 16 69 11 80 3.5 26 3 24 0 0 4 24 0
So, 2005 was his best statistical year since 2002. 2004, a much better eEagles team, was almost just as good.
So far this year he's on pace to have over 80 tackles, and 2-3 INT's. Hasn't had a sack yet, but I'm sure that will change as the year goes on.
Brian Dawkins is still playing at as high a level as he has been playing for the laast 3-5 years. He is not to blame for any of the secondary woes, unless you want to pick at a few plays here and there that he will give up per year. You know, becausue NFL Saftey's never let a WR catch a ball, etc.
That's all very well and good, but it really says nothing. Even the worst team in the NFL has guys that make tackles. That doesn't mean they didn't give up 500 points for the season and 6000 yards.
Quote from: SunMo on October 18, 2006, 09:59:25 PM
the reason they bring Considine in at safety and move Dawk to linebacker in passing downs is because Dawk can't get there on the blitz from the safety position anymore. it also helps him out when covering backs or tight ends to be closer to the line.
Not really.
He's there because he is one of the best blitzers and when he's down in the box as a LB it forces an offense to have to look for him. Since he moves around it confuses the blocking schemes and either frees Dawk up or someone else.
Quote from: Bunkley78 on October 18, 2006, 10:09:47 PM
You keep saying his play has fallen off but you never explain in what aspect. He can still cover pretty much the entire field. He is great in run support, he still is as hard a hitter as he ever was, he still makes smart decisions.
So if you are going to say he isn't what he was 3 or 4 years ago, then follow that up with what he can't do anymore, because I told you multiple times what he still does as well as he has ever done.
it's baffling how the eagles have ever given up 1 point.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on October 19, 2006, 03:14:34 AM
Not really.
He's there because he is one of the best blitzers and when he's down in the box as a LB it forces an offense to have to look for him. Since he moves around it confuses the blocking schemes and either frees Dawk up or someone else.
well if he could still get there from the Safety position, they would keep him there where he was effective.
Quote from: General_Failure on October 19, 2006, 02:28:08 AM
That's all very well and good, but it really says nothing. Even the worst team in the NFL has guys that make tackles. That doesn't mean they didn't give up 500 points for the season and 6000 yards.
But not every team has a FS getting 3-4 sacks a year, 3-4 INTs, and a guy who has averaged 4 FF a yaer for hte last three years.
The point being that Brian Dawkins is probably the least to blame for the defensive problems, and he is still playing at a very high level.
Who blamed Dawkins?
I guess I should have said we should probably forget the bitching about Dawkins and concentrate on the guys who are playing badly. I'm just saying that Dawkins, besides maybe losing a half a step of speed, is still playing and producing about the same as he has been his whole career. No one has been able to say either way why they think he's "losing it" or not, but I just wanted to put some numbers out there to help show why I think he isn't exactly "losing it" yet.
Did he used to dominate that side of the ball and force other teams to account for him on every play? Yes.
Is Dawkins playing badly? No. Is dawkins the reason for the defense's woes? No. Is Dawkins dominating the defensive side of the ball now like he used to? No.
There. Can you all farging shut up now?
Quote from: rjs246 on October 19, 2006, 04:12:58 PM
Did he used to dominate that side of the ball and force other teams to account for him on every play? Yes.
Is Dawkins playing badly? No. Is dawkins the reason for the defense's woes? No. Is Dawkins dominating the defensive side of the ball now like he used to? No.
There. Can you all farging shut up now?
No.
Ideally, you don't want many tackles collectively as a team. Less tackles means less plays which in turn means that your defense isn't on the field as much and hence the opposing team's offense isn't chewing up time and putting points on the board.
I guess having a few tackles could mean that your defense sucks too because they give up a ton of big plays and quick scores. It's just one of those pardoxes.
Eh, who the farg cares.
It's clear Dawkins isn't to blame. Whatever loss in his athletic ability is easily compensated in his leadership skills. However, it makes you wonder what's wrong with everyone else on the defensive side. If Dawk can't fire you up, then I don't know who can. It could be that they just plain ol' suck.
Didn't Trotter have over a hundred tackles one year in Washington, mostly from behind?
Quote from: MadMarchHare on October 20, 2006, 07:12:22 PM
Didn't Trotter have over a hundred tackles every year, mostly from behind?
Yes.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD LOCK THIS THREAD
farg positivity.
Worst thread ever.
Positivity is for the gheys. This morning I looked at my bottle of Maker's Mark and it was half empty. After watching this game I took the liberty to finish the job.
Positives:
No one died of heat exhaustion.
Quote from: King Cole on October 22, 2006, 05:26:57 PM
Positives:
No one died of heat exhaustion.
Shut the farg up.
Die.
Positive: there was something worse than the Eagles today...that play-by-play announcer...that guy was the worst ever.
seriously, this loss, combined with the giants loss of a few weeks ago which still makes me mad, is the worst stretch of eagles football in a long time, even more than when we actually sucked really bad. at least we knew what was coming then.
Quote from: SunMo on October 22, 2006, 06:04:04 PM
Positive: there was something worse than the Eagles today...that play-by-play announcer...that guy was the worst ever.
He's the Cowboys PBP guy. Their version of Merrill Reese
he was horrendous but he also was a big time eagle homer...i dont know if baldy rubbed off on him or what but he might as well have been merril reese....im shocked thats hes the cowboys pbp guy
was he that bad? couldn't hear a thing in the sports bar. they had the Steeler/Falcon game on full blast.
I couldn't hear him, what with the blood pressure rising and thumping loudly in my ears.
What I really want to know, is what ever happened to that block of cream cheese? Those fargsticks were obsessing over that like it was a tyranosaur egg ready to hatch.
McNabb puked it up with that spoiled cheesesteak at the LOS.
Positives:
At least I'm not a Cardinals fan.