The 2007 Offseason Thread

[SD_Eagle5]

If the debate is Lewis vs. Considine, why bother?

Neither of them are a complete player and neither should be starting next year.

The debate is whether Lewis was sat in favor of Considine because he wanted too much money.

[Munson]

your entire argument is based on simply prorating his statistics...sports dont work like that...if you more intelligently based your argument on mcnabbs entire body of work over his career and the way he was playing at the time of his injury you would realize he most likely was not gonna get 30

you probably would be better arguing that he would have beaten his all time non TO career high of 25....thats something you can say he "certainly" would have done

Wrong. If I was "simply" prorating his stats, then I'd be saying he'd have to get 2 TD's every game for the rest of the year with no real trend of that happening throughout the 2006 season, and therefore no statistical evidence that he COULD have thrown 2 TD's a game for the rest of the year. Problem is, the stats show that he had at LEAST 2 paassing touchdowns in every game he played in 2006 except the Jaguars game. So, as you like to say, not throwing for at least 2 TD's in a game for 2006 was the exception, not the trend.

Again, your version of McNabb "going downhill" is that he wasn't scoring early and often like he was during the first half of the season...but he was still getting his 2 passing TD's a game, no matter how bad he/the offense were starting out games. So, even when the offense started "going downhill" in the Saints game, McNabb still threw for 2 TD's, 3 TD's, 0, TD's, and 2 TD's. Just because the Tenn. game started out slow on offense (like the Bucs game and the taterskins game) does not mean they were going to be only the 2nd team in 2006 to hold McNabb under 2 passing TDs in game.

And keep in mind that the rest of the schedule had some fluff ass defenses on it.

Edit-I love when the stats don't agree with what you have to say, because all of a sudden they are somehow flawed. But when they're on your side....they're great aren't they?

[ice grillin you]

Patterson, Howard, and Walker are linemen, a position Lewis is incapable of playing.  You can't compare them apples/apples there.

you can compare them in that there were players on the team that played worse than lewis but yet paid nowhere near the consequences and in some cases actually got rewarded

Let's just say Patterson is probably very agreeable at all times and does what's asked, even if unspectacularly. 

and that gets you a big extension?

Walker getting snaps over Bunkley still scares me about Bunkley's future

considine getting snaps over lewis is equally scary

and Howard had to play a lot because Kearse was injured and McDougle sucks a lot more.

howard was on a milk carton from week three on....at the very least why not swap his and juqua thomas' roles...make howard come off the bench like they did with considine lewis

By many accounts, the Eagles wanted Lewis to play more at linebacker because his coverage skills are somewhat lax and they needed help there.  He balked.

this is a valid point....if they asked him to play linebacker and he said no and that pissed them off and they sat him down thats fine...but even if that was the case youre still killing yourself at safety by putting considine in because his coverage skills are somewhat lax and they needed help there.  He balked. 

They played Considine because he's a bit better in coverage, but he turned out to be an absolute liability near the line of scrimmage

considine was much worse as a run stopper than elwis is as a pass protector...and in pass coverage you can at least help a guy by scheming...you can hide from not tackling someone

Mike Lewis and Sean Taylor are basically the same player, or appeared so this year.  They are incomplete - will make the big play, but will give up just as many big plays.  They lack discipline, but they'll still have their IGY-like fans that fall in love with their athletic ability and don't understand they are mostly uncoachable.

taylor is infintely more athletic than lewis...hell considine is more athletic...but i agree they had similar down type years...as did roy williams...yet i didnt see the skins and cowboys bringing in inferior players to replace them


Considine can't tackle worth a damn but teams weren't scheming their offense to exploit him deep like they were with Lewis

i totally disagree....like i said the minute lewis sat down the team started giving up 200+ yards every game...it wasnt until lewis started to play more than they settled that down...then for some unknown reason they didnt play lewis against new orleans in the playoffs


we wont know until the next couple years when we see where lewis ends up and how he plays vs how considine is with the birds....but my money is on the ex probowler...but thats really not where im even trying to go...im talking about this year with the eagles and what happend to lewis...i thought it was a mistake and done for all the wrong reasons

[Munson]

Michael Lewis > Sean Considine

If Sean can put on some muscle weight and get stronger, maybe he'd be better...but I don't like the idea of the depending on that.

And IGY, Sean Taylor had a "down" year? Sean Taylor still hasn't had an "up" year, he's OVERRATED, get over it dude. He's not now, and never will be the best safety in the NFL.

[PhillyPhanInDC]

your entire argument is based on simply prorating his statistics...sports dont work like that...if you more intelligently based your argument on mcnabbs entire body of work over his career and the way he was playing at the time of his injury you would realize he most likely was not gonna get 30

you probably would be better arguing that he would have beaten his all time non TO career high of 25....thats something you can say he "certainly" would have done

Wrong. If I was "simply" prorating his stats, then I'd be saying he'd have to get 2 TD's every game for the rest of the year with no real trend of that happening throughout the 2006 season, and therefore no statistical evidence that he COULD have thrown 2 TD's a game for the rest of the year. Problem is, the stats show that he had at LEAST 2 paassing touchdowns in every game he played in 2006 except the Jaguars game. So, as you like to say, not throwing for at least 2 TD's in a game for 2006 was the exception, not the trend.

Again, your version of McNabb "going downhill" is that he wasn't scoring early and often like he was during the first half of the season...but he was still getting his 2 passing TD's a game, no matter how bad he/the offense were starting out games. So, even when the offense started "going downhill" in the Saints game, McNabb still threw for 2 TD's, 3 TD's, 0, TD's, and 2 TD's. Just because the Tenn. game started out slow on offense (like the Bucs game and the taterskins game) does not mean they were going to be only the 2nd team in 2006 to hold McNabb under 2 passing TDs in game.

And keep in mind that the rest of the schedule had some fluff ass defenses on it.

Edit-I love when the stats don't agree with what you have to say, because all of a sudden they are somehow flawed. But when they're on your side....they're great aren't they?

I think this whole arguement has been beated to death. Let's get off it.

[PhillyPhanInDC]

If Sean can put on some muscle weight and get stronger, maybe he'd be better...but I don't like the idea of the depending on that.

This is being pushed all over PE.com. If the dude puts on weight and muscle, he slows down. Stopping the run was never in the guys repertoire. He's a situational cover safety and a STer. In that role, hell, I'd say Considine could be damn good. But he isn't the answer as a full time SS.

[ice grillin you]

And IGY, Sean Taylor had a "down" year? Sean Taylor still hasn't had an "up" year, he's OVERRATED, get over it dude


your opinions on the eagles rank just above king coles you think im gonna listen to them on a player you hate from a team you hate

[ice grillin you]

This is being pushed all over PE.com. If the dude puts on weight and muscle, he slows down. Stopping the run was never in the guys repertoire. He's a situational cover safety and a STer. In that role, hell, I'd say Considine could be damn good. But he isn't the answer as a full time SS.

^^^^
on point

this is pretty much verbatim what i said about the guy when he was drafted...and aint a damn thing changed

[SD_Eagle5]

igy, here's what I don't get. If the Eagles wanted to punish players like Hood and Lewis for not accepting their offer, why didn't they do the same to players like Trotter, Simon, Douglas etc. You can't tell me they weren't offered an extension at some point since the Eagles tried to retain them.

[Munson]

And IGY, Sean Taylor had a "down" year? Sean Taylor still hasn't had an "up" year, he's OVERRATED, get over it dude


your opinions on the eagles rank just above king coles you think im gonna listen to them on a player you hate from a team you hate

Dude, I don't even think you know what my "opinions" on the Eagles are. I think you just want to try and label me a homer because I have defended certain players, or have played devils advocate during certain arguments on here. You, like many other of the "I'm too cool for the rest of you internet people", don't like to read entire posts, you like to pick out one certain part and purposely use it out of context. Good job, dude, your opinions are so much better. And what's worse is you throw your opinions around like they are cold hard facts.

Sean Taylor=Best safety in the NFL

So again...Sean Taylor has yet to even have an "up" year, he's OVERRATED, get over it dude. He never was, is not now, and never will be the best safety in the NFL. And as long as Brian Dawkins is still in the league, he won't even be the best safety in his division. Maybe not even the 2nd best. Ov. er. rat. ed.

[PoopyfaceMcGee]

I still don't get the big deal.  The team has at least 10 bigger problems than if Lewis stays or goes.

[Munson]

igy, here's what I don't get. If the Eagles wanted to punish players like Hood and Lewis for not accepting their offer, why didn't they do the same to players like Trotter, Simon, Douglas etc. You can't tell me they weren't offered an extension at some point since the Eagles tried to retain them.

Because the big bad Eagles FO doesn't want the Eagles to win. It's a conspiracy to protect McNabb, they didn't want the team to win with Garcia at QB and start a QB debate.

Seriously, because the team has way too much faith in Conside's abilities to get the job done, and as for Hood...The Eagles had to know he was gonna go after this year anyway, I can't imagine they expected he'd resign to play a back-up role here. So I don't see any benefits from "punishing" him.

[ice grillin you]

If the Eagles wanted to punish players like Hood and Lewis for not accepting their offer, why didn't they do the same to players like Trotter, Simon, Douglas etc.

they punished simon and trotter by tagging them even tho they full well knew they werent bringing them back

douglas they seemed to have a fine relationship with they just werent willing to pay him what he wanted...not every negotiation is going to turn contentious

lewis was easy to scapegoat cause he admittedly had some bad games and specifically a bad play vs new orleans....so in their mind they could get people to tow that company line no problem

hood they had the injury excuse...bench him cause they were pissed at him and when people asked why say his foot is still hurt

every situation is not gonna call for punishment in the form of a benching...and not every situation are the eagles gonna be incorrect in...see mccoy and his benching...they made a great move there...and there have been and will be times when the eagles shouldnt play or resign someone for perfectly valid reasons...but in the case of hood and more so of lewis this year the eagles made retarded decisions for ridiculously petty reasons...and they wonder why so many players sleep with one eye open around them

[ice grillin you]

Dude, I don't even think you know what my "opinions" on the Eagles are. I think you just want to try and label me a homer because I have defended certain players

i can name ten people on this board who defend players but arent homers...then theres more critical people like me who arent haters...and then theres a few people that defend the team at all costs 95% of the time...and one of them is you

youre homertastic dookie and you love it

[SD_Eagle5]

If the Eagles wanted to punish players like Hood and Lewis for not accepting their offer, why didn't they do the same to players like Trotter, Simon, Douglas etc.

they punished simon and trotter by tagging them even tho they full well knew they werent bringing them back

douglas they seemed to have a fine relationship with they just werent willing to pay him what he wanted...not every negotiation is going to turn contentious

I only used those 3 playes because they were pretty high profile. But if your theory was correct why wouldn't they have had benched Trotter for Gardner? I don't see how tagging a guy is punishment, their team is saying they're worthy to be paid with the top 5 at their position. Tagging a young Pro Bowl MLB or DT was a smart front office move. Maybe they didn't get anything for either but if Simon had come to terms with the Ravens the Eagles would have received a 2nd and 3rd.