Oh, to be an oil company

[Wingspan]

If you invest, YOU are controlling your money.

Not really.  You're giving it to a company to use as they wish.  You have no control whatsoever, short of selling the stock to get the money back. 

that is simply put, not true.

as a shareholder of any company, your voice can be heard. with annual and semi-annual shareholder meetings that you can chose to attend, the shareholders vote on corporate spendings, or at least appoint the board of directors to a company that will oversee the corporate spending to protect the shareholders interest in their investment.

[stillupfront]

If you invest, YOU are controlling your money.

Not really.  You're giving it to a company to use as they wish.  You have no control whatsoever, short of selling the stock to get the money back. 

that is simply put, not true.

as a shareholder of any company, your voice can be heard. with annual and semi-annual shareholder meetings that you can chose to attend, the shareholders vote on corporate spendings, or at least appoint the board of directors to a company that will oversee the corporate spending to protect the shareholders interest in their investment.

Dio will admit I believe to being a Socialist. I bust his balls consistently about being a "pinko commie bastich" but really we are seeing a misinfonformed mindset akin to the counter-culture revolution of the sixties. "Down with corporate america" etc. Sure corporations are out to make money. So what? It is the American way.

But the misinformation and ignorance of these hippie types paves the way for a malaise in this country concerning their fiduciary responsibility to themselves.

[Diomedes]

You are not giving the money to the corporation but to the person you are buying it from. You are buying a part ownership in the company.

After the IPO, this is true.  But so what??  It's not ultimately any different whether you give the money to the company directly, or to a prior shareholder; the value of that security is controlled and used by the corporation.  Your money, exchanged for the certificate, is no longer available for you to use.  It is controlled by the company.  As the company does, so does your money.  You control nothing but whether to sell.

The SS analogy I am making is valid and yes I am kinda changing the subject but not really. If you follow my logic here, what i am suggesting is that if you had control over your SS investment account, you could have used that money to invest in oil companies and added those profits to your retirement portfolio.

Repeat after me:  Social security is an insurance policy, not an investment portfolio.  It's purpose is not profit.  And it's a red herring for this argument.

We're talking about oil companies gouging people while recording unprecendented profits.  If the people had a choice not to support the oil companies, I wouldn't argue so strongly against these profits.  But they don't.  Oil jacks the prices and you pay, even if you ride a bicycle to work.  That increase devolves to the lowest level in all cases.  The price of coffee goes up.  The price of utilities goes up.  The price of everything we normal people need goes up.  All to protect the profit margins along the way.  "Hey...the oil prices went up, man..what else am I supposed to do but raise my price to the consumer?" says the merchant, the lanlord, the public transit system.   The people bear the load and they don't have a choice. 

that is simply put, not true.
as a shareholder of any company, your voice can be heard. with annual and semi-annual shareholder meetings that you can chose to attend, the shareholders vote on corporate spendings, or at least appoint the board of directors to a company that will oversee the corporate spending to protect the shareholders interest in their investment.

I grant you that technically, my characterization of the case is incorrect.  It is however dead on in practical application.  As a shareholder in the company, unless you happen to own the majority of the shares, your vote counts for squat nothing, and your voice is mute.  Sure, you can attend shareholder meetings, sit in back, and feel like you did something by paying for the hotel in Vegas, but what have you got for your efforts?  Nothing.  Your influence is zero.  Go ahead and try to get Exxon to invest more heavily in alternate energy sources, or less in de-bunking un-biased scientific evidence that greenhouse gasses are unnatrually cooking the world.  See how far you get.

And I remind you again: we're assuming already that people a.) have enough money to risk and b.) have an understanding of the system.  Both assumptions are dubious as best.

Dio...

It's all about Dio for you, isn't it?  Won't speak to the subject, can only attack me.  I should have known better than to get into this with you at all.  My bad.

[stillupfront]

I am not attacking you, but the Socialist mindset. That is behind this whole argument.

[rjs246]

Communism rocks.



Now farging shut up, hippies.

[stillupfront]

Hey with the money you made, you should have no problem paying for the obscene price of Gas this winter.

i work just as hard every day to earn a paycheck too. just like everyone else here. and no, i wont have a big problem with it financially with a little luck, and a big does of financial planning.  something you should think about, and i assume, since you are newly married, have done just that.  you see...i did something about it. most wont do it, they would rather martyr themselves in a "woe is me" state to get someone else to do the work for them.

and what obscene gas price? is this from CNN again? remember the dreaded $5 a gallon article that you posted here? were are those prices? fact is it dropped ALOT since that scare tactic article. i am not defending the oil companies at all. but if you have the means to protect yourself from it, you should do what you can to do it.

farg the rest of us who didn't buy stock though, you know...the ones who also work hard every day to earn a paycheck.

the same people who have eagles season tickets? digital cable with HD? broadband internet, buy a new eagles jersey every year. or drive an SUV where it's totally unnecessaty, go out and drop $50-100 in a bar over and over again, spend $100's on video games, dvds, big screen television ... all the while ignoring simple things like the cost of living ...etc...it's called priorities.

buying stock is not all that difficult. and hell, with a site like sharebuilder.com, you dont even need to buy full shares of anything. people would rather bitch about things than to take the time to maybe do a little bit of research and realize that it is an option for just about everyone with a moderate income. it's called being smart with money. people can chose to spend thier money any way they want.

yes, there is a percentage of the people in this country that legitimately can not afford your normal every day cost of living increases. and they do deserve to be helped, and given assistance, as long as they make a moderate effort to improve upon their situation. and i do help these people where i can, i donate money and time to charity all year long. i don't turn away from those who are less fortunate. .... however i am not one of these people. i was dedicated enough to have gotten a good education that i paid for 75% myself, and have used that to gain employment, everything i have, i have earned. so tell me, why should i not do what i did? i was able to afford it. i am not hurting anyone along the way. but i will not ignore my needs.

again, should i live in a poverish state because others do? should i not take advantage of what i can provide for me and my wife? why bother going to work everyday then? i can just quit, and then qualify for welfare, and then YOU can pay for my way through life, how's that?

so please lay off this woe is me mentality. i, along with everyone single person out there, have a future to think about...and i will not stop looking out for my interests because some people on a message board like to sound like a goddamned martyr. its very very transparent.

Amen brutha'

[Tomahawk]

Wingspan, can I borrow to some money to buy some stock? By stock I mean beer. And hookers.

[stillupfront]

Wingspan, can I borrow to some money to buy some stock? By stock I mean beer. And hookers.

Is beer and hookers on NASDAQ? What's the symbol? I wanna buy a few shares of that.

[MadMarchHare]

I just have total disdain for the legislation of morallity. Whether it's pornography, free speech or corporate profits.

Yet you're pro-life

[stillupfront]

I just have total disdain for the legislation of morallity. Whether it's pornography, free speech or corporate profits.

Yet you're pro-life

More like anti-murder.

[MadMarchHare]

So we should only legislate some morality?

[rjs246]

So we should only legislate some morality?

Only non-profitable morality. Duh.

[stillupfront]

So we should only legislate some morality?

No, and you see, you are playing directly into my argument.

Follow this.

Basic laws are needed. No murder. No stealing. etc. Abortion is murder. Plain and simple. There is no right to privacy spelled out in the constitution. Roe V Wade was an extreme error by the supreme court. The judicial de-legislation of murder was a mistake.

[Diomedes]

No stealing.

Now that we're back on topic...how about those thieving oil companies?

[MadMarchHare]

Wouldn't it just have been easier to kill all the pro-lifers?