Whats the deal with the Iowa floods in comparison to the New Orleans floods. Are people in Iowa used to getting flooded? Is the local government better equipped to handle floods. I mean its the same situation, right? A levee broke? What is the difference between to two situations and how come this isn't the cluster farg that New Orleans was.
I don't know how well the two events compare.
One difference is that Iowa is white as a ghost. Another, it's not nearly as poor. Perhaps that's redundant.
I think Iowa had better notice...that is, the flooding has taken place over several days and everyone knew the waters were rising to the levees and possibly they could be breached.
New Orleans didn't know for a fact it was going to suffer a direct hit from the hurricane until the day before or so, and thought that it had survivied more or less in tact immediately following it..until the levees broke.
I don't know anything though....
Des Moines is in a 500 year flood plain, and apparently it's due.
They had a lot more warning, very few people were evacuated by boat/helicopter (or not rescued as the case was in NO).
Apparently 20% of the corn and soy crop is a total loss, and the farmers are going to get their teeth kicked in this year.
From a numbers standpoint, I guess it could be as costly as Katrina, but the human suffering isn't even close.
hard working middle to working class americans that arent minorities are suffering. im sure bush will notice this one.
I wonder if there will be televison fund raisers. It's middle "white" america, it will be forgotten about and ignored on a national level. unless Des moines has a large black population, then we can expect K. west to show up and rail on the government, along with the standard J.Jackosn, and Sharpy photo op.
It will be interesting to see how t he local level government responds.
god didnt flood iowa because he hates the gays
id also like to add that the iowa floods didnt come equipped with 100 mph winds that flattened much of the city and also that this could be the single dumbest thread ever started on the internet...unless yeti was trying to be funny and not honestly asking the difference btwn a F5 hurricane and a flood
C'mon IGY. The flooding in Iowa could easily match the financial losses suffered after Katrina, when you include lost crops on top of the damage to buildings. Hell, if you include all the flooding in the Midwest (never mind the tornado damage from the storms that caused the flooding), it might even eclipse it. The response has already been much better meted out in Iowa, and the human cost and suffering way less. I don't forgive the horrid response in NO, but this is an equally bad event.
That all said, Phillymic, that bullshtein comment is low even for you. I don't usually get my ire up, but that pisses me off. The bible-thumping fundy Christian machine will be there to take care of poor old Iowa. And those towns will be rebuilt way before NO recovers. Bank on it.
send me a PM in five years when entire sections of cities are still abandoned and unliveable
Quote from: MadMarchHare on June 15, 2008, 05:19:29 PM
That all said, Phillymic, that bullshtein comment is low even for you. I don't usually get my ire up, but that pisses me off. The bible-thumping fundy Christian machine will be there to take care of poor old Iowa. And those towns will be rebuilt way before NO recovers. Bank on it.
What part of my comment? Yes the locals will rally and help out the flooded out victims at a better rate then N.O. Are you saying that churches and bible thumpers didn't help out in N.O.? I bet you there have been a large amount of churches working in and helping out in the aftermath of Katrina still today. My whole point was it won't get the national attention afterward like Katrina did, and imo the local elected government is probably going to do a better job then Nagal and the leaders of the katrina hit areas. Let me know when there is a telethon set up to help Iowa.
Financially this may be bigger then Katrina, even out in Illinois the crop devestation is huge. A lot of fields around me are flooded and some farmers were talking on friday that they expect to lose at least 50% of what they put it this year. Buy corn in bulk people!
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 15, 2008, 05:30:46 PM
send me a PM in five years when entire sections of cities are still abandoned and unliveable
5 yrs. wasn't there parts of N.O. like that before Katrina?
nope
oh, ok, just checking.
lol you two
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 15, 2008, 05:11:58 PM
id also like to add that the iowa floods didnt come equipped with 100 mph winds that flattened much of the city and also that this could be the single dumbest thread ever started on the internet...unless yeti was trying to be funny and not honestly asking the difference btwn a F5 hurricane and a flood
I'm not being funny IGY. Don't get defensive. Two levees broke. One in NO. One in Iowa. I'm going by what I see on T.V. In NO people sat around waiting to get rescued. In Iowa it looks like people are rescuing each other. zesty boats pulling people off a zesty houses. Didn't they have boats in NO? Did they get blown away during the hurricane so nobody was in a position to help each other. Or did they make the mistake of waiting for the government to help them? And the city wasn't flattened. People in NO were sitting on their roofs for a week. The people trapped in Iowa were getting rescued from their neighbors. What's the difference between the two events? I've been to both places and I think there is more of a "Help your fellow man" feel to Iowa and a "farg over or be farged over" feel to New Orleans. It might be people in citys fend for themselves and people in rural areas pitch in and help each other out.
I get what you're saying, Yeti, and I've been thinking about it since you posted this. Both were hugely devastating - I read that the Iowa floods will easily surpass $1B in damages, but Katrina caused over $80B in damages. However, NO had three days notice that a hurricane was coming, while Iowa had no real warning that the rivers would flood as high as they did. Now, towns and cities down river on the Mississippi and Missouri rivers have about a week to prepare for the coming floods.
However, a couple things come to mind about why they seem so different.
a) In NO, ~1M people were affected directly, and in Iowa it's been around 25,000 evacuated (based on some numbers I've read), so the scope is very different.
b) In Iowa, people were able to drive away when an evac order was issued, but in NO many people didn't have private transportation, and the bussing situation went from bad to worse in a matter of hours.
However:
c) In Iowa, you see people working to save themselves and their community, where in NO the perception was that people sat around waiting for the government to help. Not everyone, IGY, but there did seem to be a disproportionate people looking for help instead of helping
d) No looting in Iowa
Is FEMA involved in Iowa? Honest question.
I don't know if it has anything to do with the effects, but NO is in much worse shape sea level-wise than Iowa. That could have something to do with it.
how did i know from the start this would turn into a thinly vieled black people are lazy thread
lol @ sitting around and waiting for the govt...thousands of people went thru extraordinary circumstances to do whatever they could to get themselves and their families from their destroyed neighborhoods to the superdome and the airport...what were they supposed to do walk to chicago?
and neighborhoods on the gulf coast were absolutely leveled...thousands of people died in katrina like 20 have died in iowa...liteally half the city of new orleans was sent to other parts of the country FOREVER...new orleans population went from 500k down to about 150k after the hurricane...POOF! well over half of an entire city gone just like that ....people in iowa will get their basements pumped and be back living in their homes in a few weeks
as for not having advanced warning bullshtein...everyone knew the river was gonna flood....shtein it happened in 1993...this particularly flood was much worse than anything theyve had recently but rivers flood there all the time...its not like new orleans which had last had levee breaks before any of the katrina victims were born
and if you dont think theres been looting in cedar rapids youre nuts...theres always going to be bad people in situations like that...the difference is when white people loot it doesnt get shown by the media in the same light and when they do it its fighting for survival when blacks do it its a bunch of animals running wild...there were white people who looted in new orleans...hell some white cops got caught looting and subsequently fired...did you see that replayed on the nightly news 4000 times?
again bwahaha @ comparing an F5 hurricane hitting a city of a half million people to a river flooding in the mid west...but we all know thats not what this thread is really about
I respect the opinions of everybody on this board. That's why I asked the question here. And the question pretty much was the local government and people in Iowa better equipped to handle a flood. To imply that my question was racially motivated I find highly offensive.
your initial post was fine and wasnt insensitive imo it was just a laughable comparison...the thread has since turned ugly
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 15, 2008, 05:11:58 PM
id also like to add that the iowa floods didnt come equipped with 100 mph winds that flattened much of the city and also that this could be the single dumbest thread ever started on the internet...unless yeti was trying to be funny and not honestly asking the difference btwn a F5 hurricane and a flood
Yeah seriously... I read to this point and was just waiting for someone to mention that
And honestly, can we get the hell over NO already
I really think the scale of people effected is the key here. In NO your talking about a high concentration of people over a geographical area all trying to evacuate. Roads jammed, buses full and the superdome smelled like musty feet. In the coverage I don't remember seeing people sit in their front yard waiting to be picked up. They were trying to get to pick up areas to get out of town if they didn't have transportation. I don't think there's a major city in America that could handle that kind of evacuation to be honest. Especially considering the large amount of lower income folks present in every major US city.
Iowa doesn't have that kind of concentrated population so it's easier to handle. They also probably don't have that number of lower income folks needing a ride.
Imagine what a flood would do to Chicago. I guarantee it would be the same type of cluster you see in NO.
Quote from: Phanatic on June 16, 2008, 10:25:13 AM
I really think the scale of people effected is the key here. In NO your talking about a high concentration of people over a geographical area all trying to evacuate. Roads jammed, buses full and the superdome smelled like musty feet. In the coverage I don't remember seeing people sit in their front yard waiting to be picked up. They were trying to get to pick up areas to get out of town if they didn't have transportation. I don't think there's a major city in America that could handle that kind of evacuation to be honest. Especially considering the large amount of lower income folks present in every major US city.
Iowa doesn't have that kind of concentrated population so it's easier to handle. They also probably don't have that number of lower income folks needing a ride.
Imagine what a flood would do to Chicago. I guarantee it would be the same type of cluster you see in NO.
these are all good points....but also dont forget the rural areas that katrina hit specifically in mississippi...the destruction there was epic
(http://www.katrinadestruction.com/images/d/13887-9/storm+surge+destruction_001)
Here's a surefire shteinstorm question... but it is an honest question and I dont mean anything by it... just something I thought of the other day
Black folks in America constantly talk about equality and how there is still a lack of it in this country. Bu then why is that black people refer to themselves as African American, as opposed to just Americans? I dont say that I'm Swiss German American. I'm just American the same as any other race of person who is an American. A good friend of mine was born in South Africa and immigrated here several years ago. IMO, He is African American.
My question is... is it really equality that people are after. I don't think so
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 16, 2008, 10:31:50 AM
Quote from: Phanatic on June 16, 2008, 10:25:13 AM
I really think the scale of people effected is the key here. In NO your talking about a high concentration of people over a geographical area all trying to evacuate. Roads jammed, buses full and the superdome smelled like musty feet. In the coverage I don't remember seeing people sit in their front yard waiting to be picked up. They were trying to get to pick up areas to get out of town if they didn't have transportation. I don't think there's a major city in America that could handle that kind of evacuation to be honest. Especially considering the large amount of lower income folks present in every major US city.
Iowa doesn't have that kind of concentrated population so it's easier to handle. They also probably don't have that number of lower income folks needing a ride.
Imagine what a flood would do to Chicago. I guarantee it would be the same type of cluster you see in NO.
these are all good points....but also dont forget the rural areas that katrina hit specifically in mississippi...the destruction there was epic
(http://www.katrinadestruction.com/images/d/13887-9/storm+surge+destruction_001)
True. It was, however logistically easier to bring help to folks in rural areas and get them out if need be. There's also less to rebuild as compared to massive urban sprawl.
I think the theory that there are people out there not willing to help themselves living off the government is a bit of a misnomer. Practically on the ground that's not how things work. Folks just live there lives and most will take the easiest path. If there's a tax loop hole a millionare will exploit it at the governments expense the same as if there is an easy way for a poorer family to get some extra money around the house through welfare or whatever is available. Water takes the easiest path to the ground. So do people. If folks just deal with that and govern that way you might have things figured out.
IGY, while you were hating me for my opinions on the matter, you missed my points. I said it was a scope of magnitude in difference, and I also said that transportation wasn't available. All you did was focus on black vs. white (which I didn't say - but good job with reinventing my words). Then Phanatic said the same things without calling "your people" lazy, and you congratulate him on his post.
BTW - the flood occurred in a 500 year flood plain. By definition, these things DON'T happen all the time.
Kumbaya My Lord.... Kuuuumbaya.....
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 10:37:49 AM
Here's a surefire shteinstorm question... but it is an honest question and I dont mean anything by it... just something I thought of the other day
Black folks in America constantly talk about equality and how there is still a lack of it in this country. Bu then why is that black people refer to themselves as African American, as opposed to just Americans? I dont say that I'm Swiss German American. I'm just American the same as any other race of person who is an American. A good friend of mine was born in South Africa and immigrated here several years ago. IMO, He is African American.
My question is... is it really equality that people are after. I don't think so
i suppose then we should shut down the chinatowns and little italys that exist in america?
should we not refer to chinese people in america as chinese but rather americans...what about cuban americans?...russians in america?...the term tex mex should not be used to desctibe restaurants in america?
also i dont know a single black person that has ever referred to themselves or any other blacks as african americans...only place i ever hear it mentioned is on news casts mostly when talking about voting blocks and i believe its on census forms...seems to me its a political term not a man on the street term
man whatever... you hear it all the time. hell mcnabb uses the phrase all the time
and you dont hear people say I'm chinese American. I've never heard the term Cuban American either
your just going to side step the point?
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 10:37:49 AM
Here's a surefire shteinstorm question... but it is an honest question and I dont mean anything by it... just something I thought of the other day
Black folks in America constantly talk about equality and how there is still a lack of it in this country. Bu then why is that black people refer to themselves as African American, as opposed to just Americans? I dont say that I'm Swiss German American. I'm just American the same as any other race of person who is an American. A good friend of mine was born in South Africa and immigrated here several years ago. IMO, He is African American.
My question is... is it really equality that people are after. I don't think so
This is a thread about flooding, not about race. Stay on topic or start a new thread. Thanks.
Clearly not the way Concretefield operates
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 11:19:41 AM
your just going to side step the point?
you have no point other than serious psychological issues with black people and youre not someone i feel like discussing this with...if that makes you feel better about yourself and allows you to say youre "right" then im happy for you
i dont have a psychological issue with black people. I just get tired of people playing the race card all the time. Injustice is injustice.
I guess when it comes right down to it, i just get annoyed with people who continually say that what happened in NO happened because it was poor black folks that were living there. What if that had nothing to do with it. Its not like the helicopter flew over looking for white people and then flew off
Quote from: Yeti on June 16, 2008, 11:26:16 AM
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 10:37:49 AM
Here's a surefire shteinstorm question... but it is an honest question and I dont mean anything by it... just something I thought of the other day
Black folks in America constantly talk about equality and how there is still a lack of it in this country. Bu then why is that black people refer to themselves as African American, as opposed to just Americans? I dont say that I'm Swiss German American. I'm just American the same as any other race of person who is an American. A good friend of mine was born in South Africa and immigrated here several years ago. IMO, He is African American.
My question is... is it really equality that people are after. I don't think so
This is a thread about flooding, not about race. Stay on topic or start a new thread. Thanks.
As long as VIGY is here,
every thread is about race.
Quote from: Cerevant on June 16, 2008, 01:06:34 PM
Quote from: Yeti on June 16, 2008, 11:26:16 AM
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 10:37:49 AM
Here's a surefire shteinstorm question... but it is an honest question and I dont mean anything by it... just something I thought of the other day
Black folks in America constantly talk about equality and how there is still a lack of it in this country. Bu then why is that black people refer to themselves as African American, as opposed to just Americans? I dont say that I'm Swiss German American. I'm just American the same as any other race of person who is an American. A good friend of mine was born in South Africa and immigrated here several years ago. IMO, He is African American.
My question is... is it really equality that people are after. I don't think so
This is a thread about flooding, not about race. Stay on topic or start a new thread. Thanks.
As long as VIGY is here, every thread is about race.
youre are from a country with
only white people so your opinions on the subject of race are null and void
I am from Pennsylvania fleshpopbreath.
Canada has about 20% "visible" minorities and the US has 26%. Oh, that's right...if you aren't "black" you must be white.
theres not even a small chance youre from america now go trap some more small game or something
he's white so he must be the "hunting" type.
Funny... if i insinuated that you must like fried chicken, i'd be accused of being a racist
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 01:51:40 PM
he's white so he must be the "hunting" type.
Funny... if i insinuated that you must like fried chicken, i'd be accused of being a racist
:-D
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 16, 2008, 01:51:40 PM
he's white so he must be the "hunting" type.
Funny... if i insinuated that you must like fried chicken, i'd be accused of being a racist
that fact that it is impossible to you that a white person should or could possibly defend black people says all i need to know about your kind
god ignorance annoys me
dude! How can you determine from one comment that I wouldnt defend black people? And how the hell does that constitute ignorance on my part?
I'd gladly defend anybody regardless of their color. Color doesnt mean much to me, but a persons actions do.
All I was saying is that what you said to Cerevant was just as racist as you say everyone else is.
Call me what u want man, but I'm not a racist. Heck my neighbors are way more black than white and I could care less. In fact some of them are the greatest people i know.
Honestly IGY, for a person that usually posts pretty good stuff, that last post of yours was terrible and didnt make any sense
you think im black simply because im defending black people as if a white person could never do that...thats unbelievably ingorant
and nothing i said to cervent was even remotely racist...him being a canuck...a people who love to hunt small game is a race thing?
cool
Katrina was worse since black people cant swim...FTL
you cant compare the diasters because these towns along the rivers had plans, Nagin farged his city over by waiting until the last second to evacuate, and you can not leave a major city in short notice as everyone found out.
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 16, 2008, 02:46:30 PM
and nothing i said to cervent was even remotely racist...him being a canuck...a people who love to hunt small game is a race thing?
Yeah, I would guess that given the millions of Indian and Pakistani born Canadians, I would consider your statement stereotyping, if not outright racism.
See sport, racism isn't just about black people. I know that is hard for you to grasp.
(http://www.crwflags.com/FOTW/images/c/ca_indian.jpg)
Quote from: Cerevant on June 16, 2008, 04:34:22 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 16, 2008, 02:46:30 PM
and nothing i said to cervent was even remotely racist...him being a canuck...a people who love to hunt small game is a race thing?
Yeah, I would guess that given the millions of Indian and Pakistani born Canadians, I would consider your statement stereotyping, if not outright racism.
See sport, racism isn't just about black people. I know that is hard for you to grasp.
I don't think IGY understands that white people can have racism work against them just like any other race.
I've said this before I'll keep saying it....black people today are far more racist then white people anymore...at least on the east coast. I'm sure it's more the other way in the South.
Where'd my flood thread go? With the rest of the world gunning for us you'd think we could put race behind us.
And not the way you are thinking munson.
Your flood thread drowned in a shteinstorm of typical :CF bullshtein
this type of tomfoolery doesn't happen at bleedingreennation.com
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 16, 2008, 04:47:05 PM
(http://www.crwflags.com/FOTW/images/c/ca_indian.jpg)
Thanks for conceding the point, junior.
Quote from: SunMo on June 16, 2008, 08:29:14 PM
this type of tomfoolery doesn't happen at bleedingreennation.com
That's because they don't allow black people like IGY to post there.
I think anyone who thinks white wide recievers can't play well in the NFL are racist. They're just like people who think that a black qb will never win anything.
;)
Quote from: Yeti on June 16, 2008, 07:34:40 PM
Where'd my flood thread go? With the rest of the world gunning for us you'd think we could put race behind us.
And not the way you are thinking munson.
it probably would have worked better had you strictly just done a flood thread instead of doing a hurricane flood comparison thread because then people had the chance to jump all over the lazy shiftless always looking for a govt handout people of big cities vs the salt of the earth help your neighbor blue blooded middle americans
plus arent these floods bad enough to talk about on their own without being compared to anything
Just for the record, in all my previous posts on this thread, i never said black people were lazy. There are plenty of lazy white people.
I guess my only question IGY is why does the lazy black thing bother you so much? Does the lazy white thing do the same?
God is punishing people for being boring enough to live in Iowa.
personally, i'm a huge corn fan
Quote from: ThirdStreetMafia on June 17, 2008, 08:35:45 AM
I guess my only question IGY is why does the lazy black thing bother you so much? Does the lazy white thing do the same?
it has nothing to do with color branding a certain people a certain way is wrong no matter who it is...ive never heard white people as a race or large group characterized as lazy...you wanna call king dunlop lazy go ahead i could care less its when it starts to venture into stereotyping that pisses me off
corn fritters = (http://www.philaflava.com/forum/images/smiles/icotreetopdc1xi.gif)
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 16, 2008, 08:22:12 AM
and if you dont think theres been looting in cedar rapids youre nuts...theres always going to be bad people in situations like that...the difference is when white people loot it doesnt get shown by the media in the same light and when they do it its fighting for survival when blacks do it its a bunch of animals running wild...there were white people who looted in new orleans...hell some white cops got caught looting and subsequently fired...did you see that replayed on the nightly news 4000 times?
IGY, you were absolutely right with this. I was watching the news this morning, and as the good Iowans were shown sandbagging, I saw a couple of blacks in the background taking a TV and a case of King Cobra.
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 17, 2008, 09:48:11 AM
when it starts to venture into stereotyping that pisses me off
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 16, 2008, 02:46:30 PM
and nothing i said to cervent was even remotely racist...him being a canuck...a people who love to hunt small game is a race thing?
(http://www.amasquerade.com/images/products/international/lumberjack.jpg)
I'm done. You win. Hooray IGY... IGY wins...
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2008/06/mississippi_floodwaters_in_iow.html
damn!
(http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x45/DrDeath_pics/iowa2.jpg)
That black dude is stealing the white guy's bicycle!
theres no black people in grand rapids!! he must be a gov't worker
:-D :-D :-D
... waiting on IGY....