Get yo' popcorn ready...and your puke buckets. Not that this wasn't a surprise.
Web Exclusive: Owens Trashes McNabb In New Book (http://www.nbc10.com/news/9474176/detail.html)
QuoteIn the book, Owens paints McNabb as a hypocrite, a weak leader and someone who was jealous of Owens and blocked Owens' return to the Eagles after a four-game suspension.
And Owens paints himself as a heroic but sometimes flawed figure who was wronged by McNabb, arbitrator Richard Bloch, coach Andy Reid and the Eagles.
"I accept that I played a role in tearing apart the Eagles season, but the blame was not all mine," Owens said.
But Owens puts most of the blame on McNabb.
Quote"I couldn't believe it," Owens said about a pass play where McNabb decided not to throw him the ball. "Donovan had time to get the ball to me. ... Donovan ignored me, he ignored Coach Reid's design."
Owens said he returned to the huddle and ask McNabb about the play, and McNabb responded with an obscenity to Owens in front of teammates.
In his opinion, Owens then knew McNabb was deeply jealous of his popularity in Philadelphia.
"I was getting so much of the Philadelphia glory that used to be his," Owens said.
QuoteAnd he also claims that the "majority" of Eagles players wanted him back on team, and that Reid made an effort to bring him back after Owens' suspension was announced.
But Owens believes McNabb forced Reid to drop that effort.
"McNabb viewed taking me back as an affront to his control of the team," Owens said.
Owens also said he was told by a team coach to careful around McNabb because the All-Pro quarterback got "nervous and tight" in big games.
Sounds more to me like TO was the jealous one and now he's just trying to turn it around on McNabb.
No one should spend any money on that book. No one. A copy should be stolen and printed on the net for everyone to read.
Also, as much as I loved T.O., I have a deep, dark hate for the guy. I think he's a great candidate for paralysis.
The guy comes across like he's as mature as my three year old... :boom
QuotePhil Sheridan | Dallas, beware: T.O. tome trashes Eagles, but he is Cowboys' problem.
By Phil Sheridan
Inquirer Columnist
No doubt Terrell Owens' plan is to disrupt yet another Eagles season with the carefully timed release of T.O., his 242-page prepared statement.
A preliminary glimpse, however, suggests that this thing is really much worse news for the Dallas Cowboys, Owens' new team, than it is for the Eagles.
Why? Because the moral of this particular story is that Owens is still every bit the no-class, no-clue team-wrecker he was in Philadelphia. The man portrayed by Owens and coconspirator Jason Rosenhaus is a sociopath, coldly unconcerned with the consequences of his actions and guided by a self-deluding logic all his own.
If you're Jerry Jones or Bill Parcells or especially Drew Bledsoe and you read this mess, you have to be very, very afraid.
It is clear in retrospect that we in Philadelphia were negligent in the summer of 2004, when Playboy magazine published the interview in which Owens implied that former San Francisco teammate Jeff Garcia was gay. Friends in the Bay Area pointed out that Owens eventually would turn on Donovan McNabb, too, but that seemed crazy at the time.
Hey, we were young and foolish. The Eagles had their best team in a generation and everything looked possible. Owens was in his full-on charmer mode, thrilling fans at Lehigh with his speed and grace and vacuum-cleaner hands. This unfortunate choice of words - "If it looks like a rat and smells like a rat..." - was just a remnant from whatever had transpired with the 49ers. Not our concern.
Wrong.
See, there are two possibilities. Either Terrell Owens is a fundamentally good person (and great athlete) who struggles occasionally with authority and inadvertently causes commotions, or Terrell Owens is a fundamentally selfish and cruel person (and great athlete) who can hide behind a wide smile and charming persona for short periods of time.
In 2004, from the perspective of a Philadelphian, Owens looked like a misunderstood guy who had learned from his mistakes. And, hey, the Niners were a disaster area, right?
In 2006, we know better. And if you had any doubts, his latest ghostwritten autobiography should sweep them away for good.
(How many books do you think Owens has read in the last three years? Is there any chance he's read as many as he's had published?)
It would take most of today's Sports section to address all of Owens' claims. Some, of course, could only be affirmed or denied by getting statements from the other people involved. That was not possible on short notice, made necessary by the puzzling marketing strategy of releasing the title only to random Wal-Marts.
(Your humble narrator was inside five of the megastores yesterday. They were all, um, Wal-Marty.)
The one constant throughout Owens' version of events, carefully phrased by the less-distinguished Rosenhaus brother, is that he is never to blame for anything. He has the mind-set of the average 4-year-old, before concepts such as right, wrong and personal accountability have had a chance to take root.
He signs a contract with the Eagles against the advice of the NFL Players Association, but that's not his fault. He continually agitates McNabb, just as he used to do with his San Francisco quarterbacks, but that's McNabb's fault. He has the ability to read McNabb's mind, assuming that McNabb is jealous of Owens' popularity. In his quest for more money, he criticizes McNabb's Super Bowl performance in the most cowardly fashion, then hides behind the fact he didn't use McNabb's name.
It goes on and on like that.
McNabb was wrong, coach Andy Reid was wrong, the 49ers were wrong, his former agent was wrong, Eagles president Joe Banner was wrong, the arbitrator who upheld his suspension was wrong - the world is wrong and Terrell Owens is right.
There's a name for that kind of logic: insanity. Unless you're a Galileo or Albert Einstein, and it's safe to say Owens is not.
For a lot of Eagles fans, a fresh round of Owens-related nonsense will be as welcome as another thunderstorm. He's gone. He signed with the dreaded Cowboys. Enough already.
Surely Owens' first priority is to sell books by creating a fresh round of controversy. His second, though, is to toss a big ol' stink bomb into the Eagles' camp. He's proven how much damage he can do to this team when he's here, so why not try a little long-distance sabotage?
But the joke ultimately will be on the Cowboys. Just as the Playboy interview should have sounded alarm bells here, the 242-page prepared statement should scare the hell out of the Cowboys.
The guy in that book, the human toxic-waste spill, is now in their locker room, fouling up their chemistry.
That third book should be a real doozy.
Quote from: hbionic on July 06, 2006, 01:39:18 AM
No one should spend any money on that book. No one. A copy should be stolen and printed on the net for everyone to read.
Wrong. No one should even bother reading it for free.
P.S. Even though it loosely relates to McNabb, T.O. threads should NOT be in this section.
Am I the only one who wishes that this was posted in the Good Riddance thread?
Quote from: hbionic on July 06, 2006, 01:39:18 AMAlso, as much as I loved T.O., I have a deep, dark hate for the guy. I think he's a great candidate for paralysis.
Agreed.
Oh my god! An athlete wrote a self-aggrandizing book about mildly interesting shtein that happened a year ago that the media is eating up and regurgitating it rather than finding anything new and interesting to write me about?!
Who cares?
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 06, 2006, 07:35:25 AM
Quote from: hbionic on July 06, 2006, 01:39:18 AM
No one should spend any money on that book. No one. A copy should be stolen and printed on the net for everyone to read.
Wrong. No one should even bother reading it for free.
P.S. Even though it loosely relates to McNabb, T.O. threads should NOT be in this section.
Alright Captain Obvious.
as much as i hate the guy im betting there is some truth there about McNabb in his book.
Quote from: phillywin2k5 on July 06, 2006, 08:47:56 AM
as much as i hate the guy im betting there is some truth there about McNabb in his book.
Truth nuggets floating in a sea of bullshtein, smell like bullshtein, and are bullshtein stained.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 06, 2006, 07:35:25 AMP.S. Even though it loosely relates to McNabb, T.O. threads should NOT be in this section.
Awww...now you make me want to leave it here just out of spite.
But seriously, it's about as much Eagles related as most of the threads in here lately. So unless there's a real compelling reason to move it, it can sit here for a while. Mmmkay?
theres no question mcnabb was a little girl about the whole thing....as he is with anything that doesnt go exactly his way....but that doesnt excuse what TO did and it is ultimately his fault
in the end what you had was a chest puffing out of control ego wr paired with a soft batch qb...and thats just not going to ever work...why you think andy always surrounds mcnabb with #3 wr's...
Quote from: Susquehanna Birder on July 06, 2006, 09:13:18 AM
Awww...now you make me want to leave it here just out of spite.
But seriously, it's about as much Eagles related as most of the threads in here lately. So unless there's a real compelling reason to move it, it can sit here for a while. Mmmkay?
Ha! Nice to see I have that kind of reverse pull around here.
While we're at it, would you please NOT ban The Waco Kid? Thanks. He's my friend.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 06, 2006, 07:35:25 AMT.O. threads should NOT be in this section.
Agreed.
they absolutely should be in this section when the thread revolves around how TO has and is effecting the EAGLES
if it has to do with how TO is impacting the cowboys then you take it to the nfl johnson
Yeah so we disagree. Carry on.
same old words from the last venting on this situation, it doesnt change. how bout just dont give the guy the satisfaction and stop writing about it. You know TO is eating a bowl of Fruity Pebbles laughing hysterically reading this--he loves it
so now the media gets to ask the same questions at the podium with the most popular answer being=="we've moved on--so should you"
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 06, 2006, 10:00:53 AM
they absolutely should be in this section when the thread revolves around how TO has and is effecting the EAGLES
if it has to do with how TO is impacting the cowboys then you take it to the nfl johnson
Thanks IGY, I was beginning think I logged into Obsessivecompulsivefield.com. :paranoid
It hurts my scrotum knowing that pigfarger, via his book, is still going to have an impact on this team. The media was already set to overanalyze McNabb this year & once that all of TO's accusations are made public, the media is going be ready to pounce on every errant throw or perceived indecision.
The media was already set to overanalyze McNabb this year & once that all of TO's accusations are made public, the media is going be ready to pounce on every errant throw or perceived indecision.
ive been saying this on the board since the end of last year...and ive said again and again that the biggest concern for the eagles this year is whether donovan will be able to mentally handle that pressure....im not sure he can and it could spell doom for the birds this year
T.O. has done all the damage he's going to do with the Eagles. He's the enemy now and if I were him, I'd be more concerned about what's coming his way on October 8th courtesy of the Eagles defense than what either Donovan McNabb or Andy Reid feels about him.
Nice thought, Rome, but do you honestly believe Brown or Sheppard can handle TO? I don't. I don't think TO will have banner numbers against the Birds, though, because Bledsoe is gonna be splattered all over the backfield. But it won't be because TO gets owned.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 06, 2006, 11:01:21 AM
T.O. has done all the damage he's going to do with the Eagles. He's the enemy now and if I were him, I'd be more concerned about what's coming his way on October 8th courtesy of the Eagles defense than what either Donovan McNabb or Andy Reid feels about him.
If I were him I'd worry about the fans as much as the Eagles defense. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls a hammy right before the game...
I think you guys are overanalyzing the situation yourselves. Stop it with the mental pressure about a guy thats not on the team. Its a different year. Thats like bringing up Freddie Mitchell again...pointless.
farging sticks and stones from a book hurting a mans psyche a year gone....cmon now
We've known this book was coming out for several months. The fact that ESPN and the Philly media is all over it should surprise no one.
Better now than in August/September. Get it over with, and get on with the season.
TO is Dallas' problem now. Let him stay there.
Quote from: MadMarchHare on July 06, 2006, 11:09:28 AM
Nice thought, Rome, but do you honestly believe Brown or Sheppard can handle TO? I don't. I don't think TO will have banner numbers against the Birds, though, because Bledsoe is gonna be splattered all over the backfield. But it won't be because TO gets owned.
(http://images.nfl.com/photos/img9190024.jpg)
Quote from: reese125 on July 06, 2006, 11:27:25 AM
I think you guys are overanalyzing the situation yourselves. Stop it with the mental pressure about a guy thats not on the team. Its a different year. Thats like bringing up Freddie Mitchell again...pointless.
farging sticks and stones from a book hurting a mans psyche a year gone....cmon now
Lets 'ASK FREDDIE'
Let's wrap this thread in a neat little bow, light it on fire and launch it into space.
my catapault is broken
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 06, 2006, 11:48:27 AM
Quote from: MadMarchHare on July 06, 2006, 11:09:28 AM
Nice thought, Rome, but do you honestly believe Brown or Sheppard can handle TO? I don't. I don't think TO will have banner numbers against the Birds, though, because Bledsoe is gonna be splattered all over the backfield. But it won't be because TO gets owned.
(http://images.nfl.com/photos/img9190024.jpg)
Dawkins, of all people, is not going to go headhunting. He'll play all out, as usual. Again, won't matter if Bledsoe needs to be scraped off the turf with a spatula.
I'd settle for a nice Dawkplex. 8)
If I were him I'd worry about the fans as much as the Eagles defense. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls a hammy right before the game...
half the fans still want him on the team
I think you guys are overanalyzing the situation yourselves. Stop it with the mental pressure about a guy thats not on the team. Its a different year. Thats like bringing up Freddie Mitchell again...pointless.
farging sticks and stones from a book hurting a mans psyche a year gone....cmon now
mcnabb is still salty over the draft and the race issue stuff...you think hes gonna drop the TO shtein in less than a year...not gonna happen...plus it doesnt matter if he has dropped it but comes out in week one or two and lays some eggs...thats when the media and fan onlsaught will commence...and mcnabb is not someone who can handle that kind of stuff very well
This kind of discussion amongst Eagles fans is probably T.O.'s best-case scenario and wet dream from writing this piece-of-slop book. Good job, people. The terrorist wins.
See, me, well, I just don't care.
who's T.O.?
See, me, well, I just don't care.
i only care if it gets the qb all out of sorts...because that negatively affects my team...the rest of it is worthless
I wonder when Jesse Jackson will inject himself into this obvious black-on-black crime situation.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 06, 2006, 09:38:47 AM
Quote from: Susquehanna Birder on July 06, 2006, 09:13:18 AM
Awww...now you make me want to leave it here just out of spite.
But seriously, it's about as much Eagles related as most of the threads in here lately. So unless there's a real compelling reason to move it, it can sit here for a while. Mmmkay?
Ha! Nice to see I have that kind of reverse pull around here.
While we're at it, would you please NOT ban The Waco Kid? Thanks. He's my friend.
You are such a littly fairy. Are you offended because i disagree with you? And then you want me banned for that too? Grow a set. If you are such a crybaby, stop reading a public forum!!
Quote from: The Waco Kid on July 06, 2006, 03:23:30 PM
You are such a littly fairy. Are you offended because i disagree with you? And then you want me banned for that too? Grow a set. If you are such a crybaby, stop reading a public forum!!
Exhibit A - You're an easy target.
I was going to use SunMo, but he'd know I was kidding. You, on the other hand... not so bright.
you want me banned? :(
Get Lelie!
me?
The book in conjuncture with Hugh's comments this morning basically show that TO infact never properly matured in life. I would have loved TO to remain an Eagle if and only if things were like they were during the SB run. However he isn't so I really don't care anymore.
TO is a Dallas Cowboy and the Cowboys are pooh. Therefore, TO is just another nut in that turd that I want the Eagles to flush down the drain.
QuoteWAL-MART RELEASED T.O.'S BOOK EARLY
As it turns out, the Philadelphia media got its hands on the tell-all-that-apparently-says-nothing-new penned by T.O. and Jason Rosenhaus not via high-tech sleuthing but because a retailer put the book on the shelf six days early.
Oops.
A source close to the situation tells us that the books were sent out in crates marked "Embargo: Do Not Open Until July 11," which was the planned release date. At one or more Philadelphia-area Wal-Mart stores, however, the admonition was disregarded and the book was put on the shelf.
As a result, we're told that publisher Simon & Schuster has given the green light to sell the book right now, notwithstanding the July 11 release date.
The contents of the book have been the hot topic on Philadelphia talk radio. We're planning to swing by the local bookstore later today to see if we can get our hands on a copy of it (since we're getting kind of low on toilet paper).
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 06, 2006, 12:43:02 PM
If I were him I'd worry about the fans as much as the Eagles defense. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls a hammy right before the game...
half the fans still want him on the team
I think you guys are overanalyzing the situation yourselves. Stop it with the mental pressure about a guy thats not on the team. Its a different year. Thats like bringing up Freddie Mitchell again...pointless.
farging sticks and stones from a book hurting a mans psyche a year gone....cmon now
mcnabb is still salty over the draft and the race issue stuff...you think hes gonna drop the TO shtein in less than a year...not gonna happen...plus it doesnt matter if he has dropped it but comes out in week one or two and lays some eggs...thats when the media and fan onlsaught will commence...and mcnabb is not someone who can handle that kind of stuff very well
I just don't get where people think he has a week psyche the dude has persevered through a lot. I don't think he ever really let the race thing bother him and I think he uses the draft as motivation. As far as the TO stuff I can't say that I know how that will play out. If McNabb was so weak minded 3 seasons ago when he was going through that really tough stretch at the beginning of the season he never would have turned it around.
Quote from: Drunkmasterflex on July 06, 2006, 05:22:11 PM
I don't think he ever really let the race thing bother him
That's why he's the one who made it about race and called it "black on black crime"?
He let it bother him. Don't kid yourself.
didnt his dad say that specifically? i really dont remember as i have paid less and less attention since about week 10 of last season
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 06, 2006, 05:33:04 PM
Quote from: Drunkmasterflex on July 06, 2006, 05:22:11 PM
I don't think he ever really let the race thing bother him
That's why he's the one who made it about race and called it "black on black crime"?
He let it bother him. Don't kid yourself.
I thought that was more of a joke than anything, but maybe you are right.
http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/SF/6944079
time for a redo.
Holy crap, the excerpts from the book make him sound even MORE like a whiny little bitch ass.
"wahhhhhh, Donovan didn't throw me the ball!"
"Waaaaaaahhhh, Hugh said mean things to me!"
"Wahhhhhh, Donovan wasn't the same Donovan that was my friend!"
Is it possible that my opinion of him has sunk even lower?
farg T.O. and everything about him.
who?
Quote from: Wingspan on July 06, 2006, 07:13:18 PM
who?
Trent Cole.
For God's sake, man, pay attention over there.
Quote from: MURP on July 06, 2006, 05:59:08 PM
http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/SF/6944079
time for a redo.
Wasn't that the game Westbrook injured his wrist and kept him out of the game vs. the panthers in the nfc championship game?
Quote from: hbionic on July 06, 2006, 07:53:53 PM
Quote from: MURP on July 06, 2006, 05:59:08 PM
http://www.nfl.com/teams/story/SF/6944079
time for a redo.
Wasn't that the game Westbrook injured his wrist and kept him out of the game vs. the panthers in the nfc championship game?
This was the game Emmons got hurt and we wore the black jerseys with the green pants :puke
CSN.com has more details from the book (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/view_content_box.asp?ID=33367)
Quote...problems began to develop in the Eagles' overtime victory over the Browns in Week 7. Owens said he had a chance to score a game-winning TD, but McNabb instead threw an incompletion to Todd Pinkston. A disappointed Owens told himself, "it was just a freak incident, an unintentional mistake by the quarterback," and he decided to "leave it alone and not say anything" because he figured it was "a one-time deal."
The Eagles were 7-0, so Owens moved on and "let all be good and well."
Quote"The problem was I was becoming the new favorite son of Philadelphia. The Eagles were no longer the Donovan McNabb show – he had a cohost."
Owens contends he was happy to share the spotlight, but McNabb wasn't. Near the end of the book, Owens reiterates:
"I think that was the root of the problem – Donovan's misperception that I was trying to outdo him."
QuoteOwens admits that McNabb was justified in doing so, saying a leader is supposed to "say the team would still be successful without me."
But 57 pages later, Owens admits he wanted McNabb to apologize for such remarks.
"He never apologized to me for making it seem to the media that I was not important to the team's chances of winning the Super Bowl."
.
.
.
"Looking back at his performance, no matter what has been reported correctly or incorrectly, we all came up short on that team. ... I don't care whether Donovan was tired or not. I cared about him trying his best, and that's what he did."
QuoteOwens was suspended for that week's game in Washington, a 17-10 loss after which McNabb said the Eagles might be better off without Owens.
To which Owens writes:
"So let me get this straight: The offense gets 10 points, has three shots from the taterskin seven-yard line and fails to make the play. The defense puts the offense in position to win and the offense didn't get it done. Yet somehow Donovan concludes that they played well, made plays, and were better without me?"
QuoteOwens and Reid talked, with Owens assuring Reid he would "make things right with Donovan." Owens describes the long phone call, during which Reid said to focus on a person's positive traits.
"He was right. I never let go of Donovan's negatives, and I focused on them, disregarding the fact that he has a very fun, likable personality and wants to win."
Owens could tell Reid was "conflicted and wanted me back" and tried one last time to convince to reinstate him. About an hour later, an apologetic Reid called back with bad news.
"I don't know who he spoke to, but somebody killed it. ... I couldn't believe it. Somebody told him not to take me back."
Owens concludes the team had been forced to choose between him and McNabb.
The Eagles' official statement:
Quote"We were obviously aware the book was going to be released this summer and had a pretty good idea of its contents. But the entire organization is completely focused on the 2006 season. We will continue to keep our eyes looking ahead toward a successful season and keep everything else in the past."
lol right so if a qb missing u on play its by design. and reid wanted him back? reid called him and was apologetic and was actually on his side? mcnabb doesnt control reid.
2ndly i dont see how any of this will effect mcnabbs play on the field....yeah he hasnt gotten us to the big game but a lot of good to great QBs havent....and McNabb for the most part has performed very well for us...so i dont know if the draft or other racial matters ever affected him. i also find it odd how a unusually high # of incidents occur with him.
Retard, its funny you mentioned the number of incidents that have occurred with McNeezie. I was thinking about that today. I was thinking through it all, that its easy to be called a chump and a Hoyda bitch when you don't fight back. But all that McNabb has ever shown is that he's willing to leave it all on the field. Dude's played injured, severely injured more than once. He's played through bigger pain than the average player plays with. I've always been on McNabb's side. We live and die with McNabb. Without McNabb, we don't get to most if any of the NFC Championships. Say what you want, but the guy leads by example and not his mouth. I can't wait for the next moonwalk.
So let me get this straight--McNabb--at least according to Owens--tells him to shut the f*** up in the huddle, and then calls him later in the week to tell him that he runs the team--
But some fans think that McNabb is weak? Sorry, I don't understand that.
As far as Owens "assuring Reid he'd make things right with Donovan"--wasn't the big crux of his suspension upheld was because he told the arbitrator that "I felt I didn't need to apologize to Donovan." I mean, hell, Bloch even said in his statement he felt that Owens was being too arrogant when he made that statement.
If McNabb would have "led" even more, he would have had to smack Owens. He was in a no-win situation. The only other course would have been to stay quiet and let Owens run the team. And generally QBs aren't built for that.
Quote from: Drunkmasterflex on July 06, 2006, 05:22:11 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 06, 2006, 12:43:02 PM
If I were him I'd worry about the fans as much as the Eagles defense. I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls a hammy right before the game...
half the fans still want him on the team
I think you guys are overanalyzing the situation yourselves. Stop it with the mental pressure about a guy thats not on the team. Its a different year. Thats like bringing up Freddie Mitchell again...pointless.
farging sticks and stones from a book hurting a mans psyche a year gone....cmon now
mcnabb is still salty over the draft and the race issue stuff...you think hes gonna drop the TO shtein in less than a year...not gonna happen...plus it doesnt matter if he has dropped it but comes out in week one or two and lays some eggs...thats when the media and fan onlsaught will commence...and mcnabb is not someone who can handle that kind of stuff very well
I just don't get where people think he has a week psyche the dude has persevered through a lot. I don't think he ever really let the race thing bother him and I think he uses the draft as motivation. As far as the TO stuff I can't say that I know how that will play out. If McNabb was so weak minded 3 seasons ago when he was going through that really tough stretch at the beginning of the season he never would have turned it around.
I agree completely. Igy thinks McNabb is a pushover, and has to constantly keep reminding everyone of his opinion in any thread that brings up the Eagle qb.
I just want the season to start so he can show everyone what he is capable of when healthy and shut all those kinds of people up.
Quote"He never apologized to me for making it seem to the media that I was not important to the team's chances of winning the Super Bowl."
Maaaan, what does that assanine dickhead want, a nipple to suck on?? Does he want his ninny?!?! What a farging Hoyda.
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 06, 2006, 09:18:18 AM
theres no question mcnabb was a little girl about the whole thing....as he is with anything that doesnt go exactly his way....but that doesnt excuse what TO did and it is ultimately his fault
in the end what you had was a chest puffing out of control ego wr paired with a soft batch qb...and thats just not going to ever work...why you think andy always surrounds mcnabb with #3 wr's...
Unless you're being paid as McNabb's shrink, please stop acting like you know what you're talking about and you know exactly what goes on inside McNabb's head.
Thank you.
please stop acting like you know what you're talking about and you know exactly what goes on inside McNabb's head
no
the guy is mentally soft and feminine....have you ever seen his wanna be stand up routines during interviews....yikes
speaking of mcnabb his and the eagles make a wish special feature will be on sportscenter this morning
Quote from: Munson on July 08, 2006, 09:44:46 PM
Unless you're being paid as McNabb's shrink, please stop acting like you know what you're talking about and you know exactly what goes on inside McNabb's head.
Thank you.
Until you gain some perspective on the realities of this team, please stop telling other people what to do/think.
Piss off.
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 09, 2006, 07:50:34 AM
please stop acting like you know what you're talking about and you know exactly what goes on inside McNabb's head
no
the guy is mentally soft and feminine....have you ever seen his wanna be stand up routines during interviews....yikes
McNabb's feminine? Did you mean Jeff Garcia? Sometimes I'm easily confused too.
stand up routines mean he is soft?
its part of his whole aura
no point in arguing this any further...well find out what hes made of this year when the going gets tough
yeah...i mean really, it's been such a smooth ride for him since draft day 99....
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 12:00:17 PM
yeah...i mean really, it's been such a smooth ride for him since draft day 99....
It hasn't. Correct. And he hasn't always dealt with it the way a winner should. Also correct.
that make a wish joint was fantastic...big ups to the eagles
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 12:05:08 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 12:00:17 PM
yeah...i mean really, it's been such a smooth ride for him since draft day 99....
It hasn't. Correct. And he hasn't always dealt with it the way a winner should. Also correct.
yeah well...we can't all be as perfect as internet message board critics.
I'm not saying I could do any better. In fact, it's admirable the way he's dealt with MOST things...
But the "black-on-black" crap during Super Bowl week? Sad.
His ability to run a hurry-up offense or make huge plays when the game's on the line? Questionable.
The fact that he doesn't tend to take losing seriously and fails to inspire his teammates? Infuriating.
Donovan has lacked the slight edge needed to go from good to greatness. I'm not saying it's too late for a spark to get lit under him, because other QB's have certainly peaked even later in their careers... but it sure would be nice if he could have the raw leadership and unflappable quality already - because then the "haters" would be minimal and also have no leg to stand on.
The haters would still be there. It's Philly.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 12:15:00 PM
But the "black-on-black" crap during Super Bowl week? Sad.
it was a poor choice of words.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 12:15:00 PM
His ability to run a hurry-up offense or make huge plays when the game's on the line? Questionable.
4th and 26
60 yard pass to greg lewis in the SB
rainy monday night vs green bay in 2003 i beleive with a pass to pinkston to win the game with 15 seconds left.
2001 when he led them from 10 points down with less that 3 minutes in 2 games in a row (dallas and pitt)
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 12:15:00 PM
The fact that he doesn't tend to take losing seriously and fails to inspire his teammates? Infuriating.
in reality, unless you're in the locker room...you have no way of knowing that
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 12:41:12 PM
4th and 26
That wasn't good hurry up offense, that was a desperation miracle play. 99 times out of 100 that play doesn't succeed. I don't care who the QB is.
Quote
60 yard pass to greg lewis in the SB
During possibly the slowest hurry-up offesive series ever, followed by the two worst hurry-up performances I've ever seen.
Quote
rainy monday night vs green bay in 2003 i beleive with a pass to pinkston to win the game with 15 seconds left.
One of, McNabb's only memorable last-minute game-winning drives.
Quote
2001 when he led them from 10 points down with less that 3 minutes in 2 games in a row (dallas and pitt)
That was five years ago...
I'm more apt to blame Reid for their hurry-up failures, but McNabb's last-minute resume is perilously thin.
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 12:41:12 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 12:15:00 PM
But the "black-on-black" crap during Super Bowl week? Sad.
it was a poor choice of words.
that he REFUSES to back down from. in fact, it's one of the few things i've ever seen him be so assertive on in his career.
Quote from: rjs246 on July 09, 2006, 10:59:13 AM
Quote from: Munson on July 08, 2006, 09:44:46 PM
Unless you're being paid as McNabb's shrink, please stop acting like you know what you're talking about and you know exactly what goes on inside McNabb's head.
Thank you.
Until you gain some perspective on the realities of this team, please stop telling other people what to do/think.
Piss off.
Oh, I'm sorry. This team sucks, it's doomed without TO, they weren't good before TO and they won't be good after, there is no way that getting 11+ wins for 5 years is how good this team is...IT's definately the one year of only getting 6 wins, THAT's the real Eagles....and I'll just completely ignore all the injuries.
Piss off.
Quote from: Munson on July 09, 2006, 06:06:51 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on July 09, 2006, 10:59:13 AM
Quote from: Munson on July 08, 2006, 09:44:46 PM
Unless you're being paid as McNabb's shrink, please stop acting like you know what you're talking about and you know exactly what goes on inside McNabb's head.
Thank you.
Until you gain some perspective on the realities of this team, please stop telling other people what to do/think.
Piss off.
Oh, I'm sorry. This team sucks, it's doomed without TO, they weren't good before TO and they won't be good after, there is no way that getting 11+ wins for 5 years is how good this team is...IT's definately the one year of only getting 6 wins, THAT's the real Eagles....and I'll just completely ignore all the injuries.
Piss off.
:-D :-D :-D
I have no idea how that relates to anything rjs said.
Quote from: SunMoTzu on July 09, 2006, 01:32:18 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 12:41:12 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 12:15:00 PM
But the "black-on-black" crap during Super Bowl week? Sad.
it was a poor choice of words.
that he REFUSES to back down from. in fact, it's one of the few things i've ever seen him be so assertive on in his career.
C'mon... You know as well as I do that if he had backed down from that... it'd take less than 2 seconds for more haters to come out and call him soft because he "couldn't stand behind what he said".
Quote from: Munson on July 09, 2006, 06:06:51 PM
Oh, I'm sorry. This team sucks, it's doomed without TO, they weren't good before TO and they won't be good after, there is no way that getting 11+ wins for 5 years is how good this team is...IT's definately the one year of only getting 6 wins, THAT's the real Eagles....and I'll just completely ignore all the injuries.
Piss off.
Hey smart stuff, I hated TO in philly from the moment I found out he was coming to the team. Try again. Or, better yet, go away.
Quote from: rjs246 on July 09, 2006, 12:56:13 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 12:41:12 PM
4th and 26
QuoteThat wasn't good hurry up offense, that was a desperation miracle play. 99 times out of 100 that play doesn't succeed. I don't care who the QB is.
You can say the same thing about Tom Brady and the tuck rule. No one tries to lessen what he did in that game.
Quote
60 yard pass to greg lewis in the SB
QuoteDuring possibly the slowest hurry-up offesive series ever, followed by the two worst hurry-up performances I've ever seen.
But you can't take away the fact that he made the play. Besides, unless you're Peyton Manning... the HC makes the call for hurry up offense.
Quote
rainy monday night vs green bay in 2003 i beleive with a pass to pinkston to win the game with 15 seconds left.
QuoteOne of, McNabb's only memorable last-minute game-winning drives.
Two games against the Giants in 2001 popped immediately into my mind... the 10-9 win on the pass to Thrash and the win that won us the East. Remember, McNabb made that drive late to put us up by 3. More recently... after the horrible start in KC, he brought us storming back.
Quote
2001 when he led them from 10 points down with less that 3 minutes in 2 games in a row (dallas and pitt)
QuoteThat was five years ago...
I'm more apt to blame Reid for their hurry-up failures, but McNabb's last-minute resume is perilously thin.
I know it's dumb to even ask this question, but besides Tom Brady... who would you rather have?
The KC game I chalk up as a fluke. More accurately, it was Reid simply calling passing plays until they worked. But I'm not really sure I give that game to McNabb. The Giants game I will definitely give to McNabb.
I don't think I've ever heard anyone fall all over themselves lauding Brady's performance in the tuck rule game. And I live in New England.
There isn't a QB that I would rather have outside of Brady. But I do believe that there are a group of 5 or so QBs in the NFL right now that fall into that second tier and they are all basically interchangeable. McNabb is firmly entrenched in that group because he can't get over that big-game hump.
ah yes...the old "if it doesnt support my arguement its a fluke" game...
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 09, 2006, 07:25:02 PM
Two games against the Giants in 2001 popped immediately into my mind... the 10-9 win on the pass to Thrash and the win that won us the East. Remember, McNabb made that drive late to put us up by 3.
That game should have been out of reach - the Giants got stopped inside their own 10 three times and were forced to kick FG's. I was at the game... the fans were pissed. McNabb gets some credit, sure... but I seem to recall him getting a very short field on that last drive.
And the one later in the year (which I was also at), the only reason he was able to finish that drive was a bogus defensive holding call on the Giants.
I just can't believe any true Eagle fan would actually try to defend McNabb as a super-awesome crunch-time QB. Next, you'll be telling us that his downfield vision and decision-making are stellar beyond all belief...
He is what he is - a very good quarterback. But he is certainly not a great one. Yet.
Quote from: Wingspan on July 09, 2006, 08:43:31 PM
ah yes...the old "if it doesnt support my arguement its a fluke" game...
Coming back from such a massive deficit is always a fluke. I'll give him credit for playing very well during the comeback if that's what you want, but were any of you honestly watching that game and thinking 'Wow, McNabb is really bringing this team back!11!'? I wasn't.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 09, 2006, 08:48:19 PM
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 09, 2006, 07:25:02 PM
Two games against the Giants in 2001 popped immediately into my mind... the 10-9 win on the pass to Thrash and the win that won us the East. Remember, McNabb made that drive late to put us up by 3.
That game should have been out of reach - the Giants got stopped inside their own 10 three times and were forced to kick FG's. I was at the game... the fans were pissed. McNabb gets some credit, sure... but I seem to recall him getting a very short field on that last drive.
And the one later in the year (which I was also at), the only reason he was able to finish that drive was a bogus defensive holding call on the Giants.
I just can't believe any true Eagle fan would actually try to defend McNabb as a super-awesome crunch-time QB. Next, you'll be telling us that his downfield vision and decision-making are stellar beyond all belief...
He is what he is - a very good quarterback. But he is certainly not a great one. Yet.
Ah... I get it. When he pulls out a win, it's because there are a whole lot of other factors involved like the defense, the refs, etc. but when he can't do it and the Eagles lose, it all falls on him and it's because he's not clutch. Perfect example, in the SB... everyone says McNabb "choked" and I've heard tons of people say he single-handedly lost them the game... but no one ever wants to acknowledge the fact that the defense let the Pats score on 4 out of 5 possessions beginning in the 2nd quarter. No one ever mentions the 20 yards of run support he got from the running game... the next to no time he got from the o-line. All anyone wants to talk about are the interceptions... which don't get me wrong... are on him and they definitely did some damage to our chances, but it was far from the only factor. Y'na mean?
I'm not saying that McNabb is a "super-awesome crunch-time QB". What I'm saying is that he gets judged way too unfairly by people who supposedly have extensive knowledge of the game... and that there are 30 other QB's in the league right now that aren't likely to have put us in a better position than McNabb has over the years.
McNabb is one of the top QBs in the league today and we should be happy we dont have a QB controversy with Kyle Orton, Brian Griese, and Grossman....
The only QB I think I would take over McNabb would be Tom Brady...Peyton always chokes in the big game and Toothlesburger only got where he is on the back of his defense and running game....
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 09, 2006, 09:14:50 PM
I'm not saying that McNabb is a "super-awesome crunch-time QB". What I'm saying is that he gets judged way too unfairly by people who supposedly have extensive knowledge of the game... and that there are 30 other QB's in the league right now that aren't likely to have put us in a better position than McNabb has over the years.
Wrong. I'm judging him very fairly. I'm explaining what he has to do to become a great QB instead of a very good one.
Basically, if you put his skill with Jake Delhomme's ballsack, you'd have a hell of a QB. But both of them are only good and not great, because they lack the complete "gamer" package that the greats over the years have had.
I agree with what others have said - that I probably would not trade Donovan for any QB in the league straight up besides Brady... but I'd have to think really hard about Peyton Manning (also lacks edge, maybe even more so, but has 10 times the accuracy and throwing skill), Matt Hasslebeck, Carson Palmer, Roethlisberger, and even Delhomme.
The combination of McNabb and Reid inspires the Eagles to be "fine".
Settle down... settle down, I'm not talking about you, specifically. I'm talking about a large portion of the Eagles fan base in general, the supposed experts on TV and in the papers... and morons of that sort.
I wonder how great Delhomme's ballsack would look if he had to literally carry his offense the way McNabb has over the years though. While we're at it... do you really think that any of those QB's you mentioned could come close to what McNabb has done with the Eagles?
I don't.
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 09, 2006, 10:27:46 PM
I wonder how great Delhomme's ballsack would look if he had to literally carry his offense the way McNabb has over the years though. While we're at it... do you really think that any of those QB's you mentioned could come close to what McNabb has done with the Eagles?
I don't.
Delhomme has had a lot of questions at running back, no TE to speak of, and usually one good WR. All the whining about Donovan "carrying" the offense is obviously moot over the last couple of years, and even before that, he had safety outlets at RB and TE to throw the ball regularly. Not every QB has two future HoF'rs at WR's and a great running game to fall back on. I would say with definitive certainty that any of the *great* QB's of the modern era could have done what McNabb did with the same players or better.
how do we know that delhomme hasnt made steve smith a better wr...why is it always automatically assumed that every other qb has weapons and mcnabb doesnt...im not saying the eagle wr's have been great but why cant mcnabb elevate the wr's he gets...great qb's do that...has mcnabb ever turned any of his average wr's into good ones...no he hasnt because the guy isnt a very good passer...and to be a great qb you have to be a good enough thrower to improve the wr's around you...im the first person to say that reid has been an idiot in not getting better wr's...but im also getting tired of hearing how good donovan supposedly is (lol @ better than manning) but never showing that greatness due to the same old wr excuse...plenty of great qb's have never had great wr's
mcnabb over his career has been a good player who has been supported by a great defense a very good offensive line and a infrastructure that has coddled him...but never has he been the player that is going to take your team that extra notch to that championship level...in fact he has held it back from doing that...
if you wanna say brady is the only qb in the league youd take over donovan then ill say there are ten other qb's in the league that would have been to more than one superbowl with the eagles over the past five years and also would have won one
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 10, 2006, 07:32:43 AM
Delhomme has had a lot of questions at running back, no TE to speak of, and usually one good WR. All the whining about Donovan "carrying" the offense is obviously moot over the last couple of years, and even before that, he had safety outlets at RB and TE to throw the ball regularly. Not every QB has two future HoF'rs at WR's and a great running game to fall back on. I would say with definitive certainty that any of the *great* QB's of the modern era could have done what McNabb did with the same players or better.
Delhomme is not Chuck Norris, so get off his sack(not directed solely at Pat). He has always had a Mushin Muhhamed or a Steve Smith. McNabb had a happy owens for 1 year and got the SB. Delhomme also had a great D/ running game and also lost to the SuperPats. Delhomme would have had just as much BS if he was a QB in Philly. When the Panthers tank it or just play mediocre he isn't ripped by Steve Smith and called an Uncle Tom by the local Republicans. Negadelphians can keep raising up other QBs and doing the grass is greener crap all day, but we got great QB and person running our team. He is going to be here for a while so get behind or jump ship.
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 08:33:53 AM
blah...plenty of great qb's have never had great wr's
Really? I can't think of one; let alone plenty.
Elway never had great recievers
elway
marino
kelly
farve
you people do realize that great qb's sometimes make avererage wr's very good or great....the great qb's dont need to be saved by great wr's...they make the wr's better...soemthing mcnabb doesnt do...he needs a TO to be a great qb...not the otherway around
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 10:12:54 AM
elway
marino
kelly
farve
elway - Rod Smith, Shannon Sharpe, the Three Amigo's to a lesser extent.
Marino - Duper, Clayton, Fryar
Kelly - Lofton, Andre Reed
Favre - Sterling Sharpe, Javon Walker, Keith Jackson, Antonio Freeman
Quote from: Wingspan on July 10, 2006, 10:33:50 AM
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 10:12:54 AM
elway
marino
kelly
farve
elway - Rod Smith, Shannon Sharpe, the Three Amigo's to a lesser extent.
Marino - Duper, Clayton, Fryar
Kelly - Lofton, Andre Reed
Favre - Sterling Sharpe, Javon Walker, Keith Jackson, Antonio Freeman
you're proving IGY's point.
is Mark Duper a great reciever, or did playing with Marino make him better than he was?
Quote from: Wingspan on July 10, 2006, 10:33:50 AM
elway - Rod Smith, Shannon Sharpe, the Three Amigo's to a lesser extent.
Smith is a good, steady player who has produced with every QB he's ever played with. Sharpe is a TE. The three amigos were far from great.
Quote
Marino - Duper, Clayton, Fryar
This group, more than any of the others you listed was basically made by Marino. He definitely made them what they were, with the possible exception of Fryar who did well everywhere.
Quote
Kelly - Lofton, Andre Reed
Again, Kelly made these two what they were. Lofton was a run-as-fast-as-you-can-in-a-straight-line WR. Reed was a great receiver
Quote
Favre - Sterling Sharpe, Javon Walker, Keith Jackson, Antonio Freeman
Favre made these players better. Freeman? A great WR? Um no. Walker has had one great year. Sharpe and Jackson were great for a few seasons but Favre definitely made all of these guys what they were.
There are some good WRs you listed but there is a very real chance that not a single one of them will ever sniff the Hall of Fame. I wouldn't put any of them in the same 'great player' category as the QBs that were matched with them.
I just can't understand why some of you deny that McNabb does actually have his fair share of shortcomings. None of us are here saying that winning a Super Bowl would be impossible with him or that he's not a very good QB. We are saying that if he worked on his mental toughness as much as he played with ropes and beanbags, he might have already won a Super Bowl. That's about it.
he's my favorite player and i see this shtein.
Quote from: SunMoTzu on July 10, 2006, 10:50:02 AM
he's my favorite player and i see this shtein.
Took the words right out of my mouth.
i know, and it stinks in there
elway - Rod Smith, Shannon Sharpe, the Three Amigo's to a lesser extent.
Marino - Duper, Clayton, Fryar
Kelly - Lofton, Andre Reed
Favre - Sterling Sharpe, Javon Walker, Keith Jackson, Antonio Freeman
none of these were/are great wr's...
the three amigos
duper
clayton
fryar
walker (could be great one day)
freeman
lofton was great but sucked before he went to buffalo where kelly resurrected his career
reed ill give you but he didnt have any special qualities...and i would argue kelly made him not the other way around
rod smith has had a great career but id hardly classify him as a great wr...
im not gonna argue every last wr that all these qb's had because we will drown in minutia...but if you believe these guys had truly great wr's and were a product of them rather than the other way around then your blind homerism for mcnabb has fully taken your soul
the bottom line is mcnabb has never made a wr great...and i ask....if hes such a great qb...why cant he have made a pinkston thrash or charles johnson into a duper clayton or andre reed...the answer is because he isnt that good...hes not the kind of passer/player/leader who is going to elevate a player to a level better than they are
can mcnabb win a superbowl...probably...look at the people who have done it...but hes not a great qb...not even close...he lacks in to many areas to be one...but thats not whats important to me right now...what im most worried about is his psyche going into this year...and is he going to be able to handle the TO mess from last year that will follow him...and when the going gets tough this year will he hold up...
i think it will all show in the dallas game...honestly do you see mcnabb getting all hyped up and gutter for that game...come out and just take it over and stick it to TO and dallas...im sorry but i dont...i can see him acting like its just another game all week...smiling and joking...saying its one of 16...blah blah blah...but all the time dying inside about it then coming out and laying an egg on game day...afterwards saying how it still was just another game and it didnt bother him...now we have to move on because we have another game next sunday...meanwhile TO will talk ish before during and after getting his team amped up blow up for a couple scores and 100 yards...and say afterwards i told you so...
god i hope im wrong and mcnabb goes bonkers over that game acts like a man stands up gets his team ready and wrecks shop...but i dont see that in him...and thats one of the things he doesnt have and why he will never be one of the greats
basically for this year (and any other) the eagles have to have a defense like they had in 2001-2003...if mcnabb has a d that can carry him then he can win games in this league...but simply put mcnabb cannot carry a team on his back like the above qb's were able to do
you type too much. i'm not reading all that.
knowledge is king
long posts that repeat everything you've already said are queen
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 10:12:54 AM
elway
marino
kelly
farve
you people do realize that great qb's sometimes make avererage wr's very good or great....the great qb's dont need to be saved by great wr's...they make the wr's better...soemthing mcnabb doesnt do...he needs a TO to be a great qb...not the otherway around
The Eagles have a group of average recievers?
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 10:12:54 AM
elway
marino
kelly
farve
You say they never had great receivers but every one of these hall of famers played with either future HOF WR's or very close to it... and I personally never compared McNabb to any of these guys. I talk about McNabb with the group of QB's who are in the NFL now. Pulling out HOF QB's to make an argument only strengthens my point more. Why shtein on a QB that you have to reach for all-time greats to make a favorable comparison?
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 10:12:54 AM
you people do realize that great qb's sometimes make avererage wr's very good or great....the great qb's dont need to be saved by great wr's...they make the wr's better...soemthing mcnabb doesnt do...he needs a TO to be a great qb...not the otherway around
I totally understand that concept... but I challenge you to give me ONE wide receiver that McNabb has had over his career that any of those QB's could have elevated anywhere near the level of an Andre Reed, Rod Smith or Shannon Sharpe.
McNabb simply needs help around him... something that every "great" QB has had at some point during the height of their respective careers.
I think TOs book is going to be great. It can be used for:
TOilet paper
bird cage liner
target practice
starting fires
OR
We could give it to a derelict to use as TOilet paper then line the bird cage for a week then set it on fire and throw it at #81 on the other team on Oct. 8.
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 10, 2006, 11:00:58 AM
lofton was great but sucked before he went to buffalo where kelly resurrected his career
he only went to the pro bowl 7 times before going to the bills.
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 10, 2006, 01:28:14 PM
I challenge you to give me ONE wide receiver that McNabb has had over his career that any of those QB's could have elevated anywhere near the level of an Andre Reed, Rod Smith or Shannon Sharpe.
L.J. Smith. Brian Westbrook. Na Brown.
he only went to the pro bowl 7 times before going to the bills.
he was a shell of his former self for several years before he got with kelly and was in most peoples eyes finished...kelly single handedly gave him life for a couple years
but you knew that is what i meant
its easy to focus on where mcnabb has failed, but it is a team sport and if he fails, someone else needs to step up, and we havn't had that. its william penn and his curse. suck it.
fox sports take on mcnabb and the other nfl qb's...
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/5764156
Interesting stuff on the rookie QB projection formula.
McNabb's numbers were unimpressive because he was overrated or just lacked receivers? His numbers were always good when he had a good receiver/receivers to throw to they were very good to awesome. Whatever no matter what he does there are always to going to be people that make excuses as to why he is not good.
His yards and TDs were above average. His completion percentage, which isn't a sexy number but an obviously important one in an offense that relies on the passing game as part of its running game (christ, just typing it makes me want to throw up on myself), was always at or below average for a top QB.
Putting KC QB's ahead of Philly's is questionable. Maybe Denver too, but Plummer had a good season last year.
I laughed at this:
QuoteKoy Detmer likes to hold things.
Quote from: rjs246 on July 10, 2006, 07:37:38 PM
His yards and TDs were above average. His completion percentage, which isn't a sexy number but an obviously important one in an offense that relies on the passing game as part of its running game (christ, just typing it makes me want to throw up on myself), was always at or below average for a top QB.
Yes, but his completion percentage is usually pretty close to 60% and when he had a year with him in TO in accord it was well over 60%. For whatever reason AR and Co have never felt obligated to surround him with premium receivers. Could you imagine if he were in Indy's or the Moss lead Vikings offense. Hell, would ever give him the Steelers WR corps and he would put up huge numbers.
To me Donovan's failures as a player are more reflections of AR as a coach, he often has not played to McNabb's strengths.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 10, 2006, 08:11:54 PM
Putting KC QB's ahead of Philly's is questionable. Maybe Denver too, but Plummer had a good season last year.
I laughed at this:
QuoteKoy Detmer likes to hold things.
Trent Green threw for over 4000 yards with the worst WRs in the world last year. Plummer, for his many faults, has been a better QB since he got to Denver. I don't have a problem with either of those.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 10, 2006, 10:47:43 AM
I just can't understand why some of you deny that McNabb does actually have his fair share of shortcomings. None of us are here saying that winning a Super Bowl would be impossible with him or that he's not a very good QB. We are saying that if he worked on his mental toughness as much as he played with ropes and beanbags, he might have already won a Super Bowl. That's about it.
and i just cant understand how everyone some how knows mcnabb's problems, his mental toughness, or his over ability to will his team to a victory. the dude has played on a broken ankle, rushed back to make it to the team to play in the playoffs, played thru thumb injuries, a sports hernia....how much more thougher does he need to be? mental toughness? how does anyone know whats going on his head? cause of what TO says? we are to believe TO now?
yeah mcnabb is never a get in ur face type of leader but he doesnt need to be. not every great qb is like that. its not like the recipe to a great QB is having to be a fiery in ur face type of guy.
and igy does mcnabb need to give soundbites during the week leading up to the dallas game for you to think this game is more to him than just another game? u really want a player to come out and basically admit this game means more than others. we all know all players have certain games or teams they play against and have it mean more but publicly admitting it? u dont think the rest of the team will be up for it anyway? what would u have mcnabb do? act like a ass? act like TO? say crap about him? i really dont get this line of thinking...if anything if they do lose i would want the mentality that yeah ok it was 1 game and we can move and thats what we will do. ill admit TO brought attitude to this whole team but when u have WRs like pinkston and thrash any attitude will do. what happens if we beat dallas? u want mcnabb to act like TO and gloat and go on tv and talk more crap. i dont know i rather not have mcnabb ever do that.
2ndly about the WRs...its a combination...McNabb can work with limited talent and i think at the same time McNabb isnt amazing enough to elevate just anyones game. torrence small? johnson? thrash? pinkston? these guys could barely beat bump and run coverage and u expect Mcnabb to elevate their games? maybe the HOF QBs can but ill gladly admit McNabb is either not that good or not there yet. McNabb has other flaws as in when he holds on to the ball too much sometimes instead of taking off or when he throws at ppl's feet. i dont think even the biggest McNabb fan would claim him to be the best.
at the same time look at the WRs your claiming he should have elevated the games off. Thrash is 3rd or worse on the depth chart in washington. torrence small and johnson were nothing special b4 they came here...while they were here...and after they left here. pinkston is afraid to catch the ball sometimes and i doubt would start for any team no matter how great thier WR is.
so is steve smith a product of delhomme or vice versa? prolly both but i think ppl are giving way too much credit to QBs in the case of some of the better WRs out there.
OK so McNabb is a descent enough QB who requires the right weapons to be successful because he's not good enough to make an average receiver great.... So what!
Why hasn't the coaching staff gone out and gotten teh awesome receiver for the offense to build around? We have teh awesome running back receiver who can't run between the tackles and teh awesome receiving TE who can't block and likes to fumble. Then we have teh one dimensional Pinkston who is good at running down the field really really fast if no one breathes on him. We have Reggie Brown with all that potential and a flash of talent but who really knows what will happen. That new guy Gaffney who might be good. Not sure as he's never had a QB with enough time to get the ball off.
There are a lot of problems with the Eagles offense. McNabb is one of the few areas that we can say we're solid. In the NFC East I'd take McNabb over Eli, Brunnel and Bledsoe. Nothing is perfect nor is it going to be. If I were the Eagles I'd work on other areas of the offense...
Trent Green is a good QB, but What does Trent Green have to work with...... the WR's are not very good, but KC has one of the best running games in the NFL, one of the best Olines in the NFL, one of the best TE's in the NFL.... certainly takes the pressure off.
Everyone who posted in this thread commenting about TO's book and then somehow turning it into an argument about McNabb is an idiot. Except me. I've got the smurts.
and igy does mcnabb need to give soundbites during the week leading up to the dallas game for you to think this game is more to him than just another game?
yes
u really want a player to come out and basically admit this game means more than others
yes
I'd like to see that, too. Not because of Owens, though. Just because it's Dallas.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on July 11, 2006, 01:32:34 AM
Everyone who posted in this thread commenting about TO's book and then somehow turning it into an argument about McNabb is an idiot. Except me. I've got the smurts.
We had to change the subject, because it wasn't "Eagles Talk" before.
According to the T.O. Book I think all entries from here on should start with "According to the T.O. Book".
That should solve everything.
how about we delete this thread. i seriously don't give a flying farg what he says, neither do the eagles. or move it to the rest of the nfl. its displaced
elway - Rod Smith, Shannon Sharpe, the Three Amigo's to a lesser extent.
Marino - Duper, Clayton, Fryar
Kelly - Lofton, Andre Reed
Favre - Sterling Sharpe, Javon Walker, Keith Jackson, Antonio Freeman
Everyone of the recievers listed above are better, most way, way better, than any reciever McNabb has ever had except TO.
Quote from: mussa on July 11, 2006, 11:28:50 AM
how about we delete this thread. i seriously don't give a flying farg what he says, neither do the eagles. or move it to the rest of the nfl. its displaced
I approve this message.
I'm hoping that Dawkins gets the chance to break T.O. in half when Dallas comes to town.
Question:
Which would you rather have happen?
1. A Super Bowl win for the Eagles
or
2. T.O. lying dead on the field at the Linc on October 8th.
Both?
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 12, 2006, 11:01:45 AM
Question:
Which would you rather have happen?
1. A Super Bowl win for the Eagles
or
2. T.O. lying dead on the field at the Linc on October 8th.
Every single true Eagles fan should answer #1 without hesitation. farg T.O.
Super Bowl
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 12, 2006, 11:01:45 AM
Question:
Which would you rather have happen?
1. A Super Bowl win for the Eagles
or
2. T.O. lying dead on the field at the Linc on October 8th.
Eagles Win and T.O. dies from auto-erotic asphyxiation in a hotel w/Michael Irvin on the same night.
Quote from: JailBird-man on July 12, 2006, 11:59:40 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 12, 2006, 11:01:45 AM
Question:
Which would you rather have happen?
1. A Super Bowl win for the Eagles
or
2. T.O. lying dead on the field at the Linc on October 8th.
Eagles Win and T.O. dies from auto-erotic asphyxiation in a hotel w/Michael Irvin on the same night.
Now that would be cool. :-D
id rather see TO die, because thats more realistic than us winning the super bowl this year. and please stop this thread :boom
that's the second time you've asked to close this thread. how about you just don't open it anymore
Quote from: mussa on July 12, 2006, 12:37:13 PM
id rather see TO die, because thats more realistic than us winning the super bowl this year
No one asked which was more realistic. Try again.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 10, 2006, 02:36:48 PM
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 10, 2006, 01:28:14 PM
I challenge you to give me ONE wide receiver that McNabb has had over his career that any of those QB's could have elevated anywhere near the level of an Andre Reed, Rod Smith or Shannon Sharpe.
L.J. Smith. Brian Westbrook. Na Brown.
Reading is fundamental, dog.
You get no argument from me on Na though. He really should have been all-world.
He was all-world. The stupid NFL talent scouts (all of them, from all 32 teams) are blind!1098hf29qafourteen8!
Quote from: JailBird-man on July 12, 2006, 11:59:40 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 12, 2006, 11:01:45 AM
Question:
Which would you rather have happen?
1. A Super Bowl win for the Eagles
or
2. T.O. lying dead on the field at the Linc on October 8th.
Eagles Win and T.O. dies from auto-erotic asphyxiation in a hotel w/Michael Irvin on the same night.
Do he'd be dead as a result of blowing himself with Michael Irvin watching it happen?
Eh - okey dokey.
:yay
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 12, 2006, 09:11:41 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 10, 2006, 02:36:48 PM
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 10, 2006, 01:28:14 PM
I challenge you to give me ONE wide receiver that McNabb has had over his career that any of those QB's could have elevated anywhere near the level of an Andre Reed, Rod Smith or Shannon Sharpe.
L.J. Smith. Brian Westbrook. Na Brown.
Reading is fundamental, dog.
You did throw Shannon Sharpe into your argument though and he was a TE. Of course, I'm sure you really meant Sterling. :P
Brian Westbrook might as well be a wide reciever as much as we run the ball.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on July 12, 2006, 11:08:14 PM
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 12, 2006, 09:11:41 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 10, 2006, 02:36:48 PM
Quote from: EagleFeva on July 10, 2006, 01:28:14 PM
I challenge you to give me ONE wide receiver that McNabb has had over his career that any of those QB's could have elevated anywhere near the level of an Andre Reed, Rod Smith or Shannon Sharpe.
L.J. Smith. Brian Westbrook. Na Brown.
Reading is fundamental, dog.
You did throw Shannon Sharpe into your argument though and he was a TE. Of course, I'm sure you really meant Sterling. :P
Typing is fundamental, dog. :-\
I'll take the Super Bowl win, thanks.
Nevermind TO. He's insignificant.
like this thread ;)
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 12, 2006, 11:01:45 AM
Question:
Which would you rather have happen?
1. A Super Bowl win for the Eagles
or
2. T.O. lying dead on the field at the Linc on October 8th.
No contest. Super Bowl
I was mis-quoted ::) :-D
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/football/nfl/07/14/bc.fbn.t.o.sbook.ap/index.html
I was mis-quoted in my auto biography!!
Quote from: 4and26 on July 14, 2006, 02:39:44 PM
I was mis-quoted ::) :-D
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/football/nfl/07/14/bc.fbn.t.o.sbook.ap/index.html
Mis-quoted... by Jason
ROSENHAUS. Hilarious.
Quote"I'll read anything," said Hicks, holding a copy of "T.O.", "that has to do with football leadership."
So why was he reading that?
I am getting closer every day to changing my pic to the following:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/f/f9/Nguyen.jpg/300px-Nguyen.jpg)
I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore!
do people really fall asleep on the school bus?
and if/when they do
do other people really spit in their mouths?
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 14, 2006, 03:51:20 PM
do people really fall asleep on the school bus?
and if/when they do
do other people really spit in their mouths?
where's the korean soccer babe dude??????????
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 14, 2006, 03:51:20 PM
do people really fall asleep on the school bus?
and if/when they do
do other people really spit in their mouths?
Teaching middle school, I can say that the answers are yes, and yes.
wow....must be something the new jacks practice cause i never saw anything of the sort
Quote from: 4and26 on July 14, 2006, 02:39:44 PM
I was mis-quoted ::) :-D
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/football/nfl/07/14/bc.fbn.t.o.sbook.ap/index.html
I was about to launch into a rant about you posting that until I saw this on the bottom of the page:
(http://i.a.cnn.net./si/multimedia/photo_gallery/0607/gallery.incaseyoumissedit/images/71428920.jpg)
:drool :drool :drool
Shown on NBC10 Sports Final: TO during an interview about his book: "there's not that many lies in it"
i dont know if this belongs in this thread but i must say the football pundits are just as guilty of always buying into this "TO will change" banter. during the sportscenter nfl depth chart rankings any time dallas was brought or TO all i would hear was that drew doesnt take crap from anyone (which is funny since TO claims McNabb was a bully who cusses him out) and how TO will blossom in Dallas". its similar to some of the stuff i became accustomed to hearing 2 offseasons ago and what really made me favor my view as being pro TO...as b4 the signing and the training camp i was very against bringing him to the eagles.
now the dallas fans are listening to this. they hear merril hodge and sean salisbury.....2 asses who have no qualifications to be experts at anything tell the fanbase how amazing he will be and wont have trouble in big D. yet these same pundits will turn around and blame the dallad front O, make fun of the decision of signing TO, and basically come off as never having supported the move in the first place.
why do these idiots get a free pass? is espn not able to find real experts? ppl who actually have some credibility?
Quote from: BigEd76 on July 17, 2006, 12:04:23 AM
Shown on NBC10 Sports Final: TO during an interview about his book: "there's not that many lies in it"
:-D :-D
Skip finally comments on the book (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=bayless/060717)
QuoteT.O.'s Book an Instant Classic
By Skip Bayless
Page 2
I was wrong about Terrell Owens. He's a great guy.
(Wait, I didn't say that. I was misquoted. I said "right" and "bad," but my ghostwriter, Casper, wrote "wrong" and "great." Idiot. I just fired him.)
Sorry.
I had promised myself I would ignore Terrell Owens' latest book, but when I finally stopped laughing over the weekend, I just couldn't help myself. Maybe he's so much smarter than most media members -- especially me -- that he made this statement at a Friday book signing just to generate more publicity for his ... I'm sorry, this thing doesn't deserve to be called a book.
It's just 242 pages of I'm-always-right-and-everybody-I-ever-come-into-contact-with-is-out-to-get-me.
Including, even, his agent's younger brother? Next question! Drew Rosenhaus' brother Jason apparently recorded hour upon hour of Owens' appalling self-delusion, then transcribed it and broke it into chapters.
Yet -- and are you sitting? -- Owens claims Jason misquoted him when Owens "writes" of his recovery from a broken leg to play in the Super Bowl: "If you'll forgive me for saying so ... nothing short of heroic."
Now Owens says: "It was one of the words Jason used. I can't say that I called it heroic."
Stop the presses! Terrell Owens, worried he'll come off as immodest? If so, what did he call it? Nothing short of OK?
No.
Knowing Owens, he was offended that Jason chose not to use his word -- probably "miraculous," maybe "godlike." For once, Jason probably tried to save Owens from himself -- Terrell from T.O. But of course, Owens was too busy missing Dallas Cowboys minicamps to proofread the final version.
So, despite the "author's" early promise in the book -- "These are my words, straight from me to you" -- Owens publicly blames his ghostwriter for changing a word.
So T.O.: He'll even blame his agent's brother for messing up the book that people in Dallas are lining up to buy!
Buckle your chinstraps, Dallas. The battle continues to rage within this team wrecker -- Terrell vs. his alter ego. T.O. is one of the most arrogantly confident players in sports. Terrell is one of the most insecure. But Terrell always wins out and begins pointing fingers because he wants to be able to blame someone else if he fails.
He'll even stoop to publicly ridiculing his agent's brother, his ghostwriter.
In San Francisco, it was Jeff Garcia's and Steve Mariucci's fault. In Philadelphia, it was Donovan McNabb's and Andy Reid's fault. In Dallas, it will be ?
I cannot wait for football season.
And that's why I cannot blame Cowboys owner Jerry Jones for taking the plunge on Terrell Eldorado Owens. Jerry's desperate. He's paying Bill Parcells top dollar, and he isn't getting much playoff bang for his buck. After three years in Dallas, Parcells is 0-1 in the postseason. Yep, just one playoff game, a 29-10 loss at Carolina that ended his first season.
So Jerry forced Owens right down the throat Parcells was clearing. I have a better chance of coaching Terrell Owens than his-way-or-the-highway Parcells does, and Owens has called me names that would make Marco Materazzi blush.
But Parcells has had three years of chances. Now it's Owens' turn. Either Parcells can -- for the first time in his coaching career -- keep saying, "You're right, T.O." Or he can walk.
If Parcells can't get Jerry back to the Super Bowl for the first time since January 1996, Jerry at least will return to the spotlight. By signing the guy who first put himself on the map by shaming the Texas Stadium star, Jerry has again made his Cowboys the center of the NFL universe. No training camp will attract more media than Cowboys camp -- and they've failed to make the playoffs the last two years!
That's T.O. I admit it: I'm addicted to Team Obliterator.
Of course, reporters will gather like vultures because they'll await the first shot Owens takes at Parcells or quarterback Drew Bledsoe or even Jerry Jones. Owens can't help himself. You know he'll begin camp by saying he's finally found true happiness with a team that respects him. Then ?
I'm sorry, I can bfalady tpepe -- barely type -- because I can't quit laughing.
He "writes" in his "book" that an unnamed Eagles offensive coach warned him before Philadelphia's game at Pittsburgh in 2004 to be supportive of McNabb because he can "get nervous and tight in big games." That one was pretty big. The Eagles were 7-0, the Steelers 6-1.
Yet once the Steelers took control, Owens made a big show on the sideline of appearing to lecture McNabb, who kept trying to walk away as Owens followed. Supportive? No, Owens wanted to show the media and fans that he was trying to tell the quarterback what he did wrong and why he should be better than this.
Of course, Owens hadn't exactly been running wide open all afternoon. But he can be as shrewd as he can be thick-headed. He smelled blood: his "soulmate," Donovan's. And he was subtly shifting the blame onto the quarterback who had lost three straight NFC title games.
Yet at least McNabb -- without Owens -- had lifted his team into three straight title games. And without the injured Owens, McNabb would win the NFC on his fourth try.
But with Owens, you just can't win.
Yet that's the blessed irony of his "book." It manages to vindicate McNabb! Publicly, McNabb always came off like the guy who was just too nice to punch the bully T.O. in his big mouth. Publicly, McNabb kept taking it and taking it from Owens without taking a stand. Publicly, it looked like McNabb was losing the respect of his team.
Yet poor Owens "writes" that in the huddle, McNabb told him to "shut the (bleep) up."
Good for McNabb! Wish we'd known that then.
Poor Owens "writes" that McNabb called him at home to tell him this was his team.
Good for McNabb! Wish we'd known that then.
Prediction: With McNabb healthy and in charge again, the Eagles will finish with a better record than T.O.'s Cowboys.
But don't tell that to poor Cowboys fans right now. They're so desperate, they're a little delusional, too. The Associated Press quoted a high school football player from the Dallas area who was reading the "book" as he waited in line for Owens to autograph it.
The kid said he had just finished a book on Roger Staubach and that, "I'll read anything that has to do with football leadership."
Please tell me the kid was misquoted.
irony with the thickness
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 17, 2006, 03:52:39 PM
irony with the thickness
Well, it's only ironic because of how ill Bayless' hate of T.O. made us when we were all on the bandwagon.
It still makes me ill ... with the illness. Skippy needs to learn to let it go.
Well, it's only ironic because of how ill Bayless' hate of T.O. made us when we were all on the bandwagon.
ummm...yeah
Bayless is useless and I'm saying that as someone who was NEVER on the TO bandwagon.
this is true
but its funny seeing eagle fans who said he was the biggest hack ever now highliting his columns
yea skip bayless! i hate that guy, but for once he wrote something of the truth.
Owens admits he dishes out more than he can take (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2522338)
I doubt your sincerity?
The more he talks about McNabb the more respect I gain for Donovan if thats at all possible. Donovan told him to "shut the farg up" in the huddle? And people have the nerve to say he doesn't have a backbone?
Generic McNabb answer when asked about TO: "Hey, it didn't work out. I'm focused on the upcoming season"
TO answer: "Donovan was jealous of me"
I hate to use a Star Wars analogy here, but since I'm such a gigantic dork I'm gonna go with:
TO= Anakin Skywalker
Donovan= Obi Won Kenobi
gigantic dork you are sd_eagle
Quote from: SD_Eagle on July 18, 2006, 11:44:38 AM
I hate to use a Star Wars analogy here, but since I'm such a gigantic dork I'm gonna go with:
TO= Anakin Skywalker
Donovan= Obi Won Kenobi
That reference is about as dorky as the time in D&D when I traded a +3 Long Sword of Inferno for some Dwarven Chain Mail of Buggery. :(
Quote from: mussa on July 18, 2006, 11:52:12 AM
gigantic dork you are sd_eagle
I'll bring Yoda out of retirement for that:
(http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f98/SD_Eagle5/yoda-saber.gif)
Who's the bigger dork the dork or the dork who follows him?
Quote from: Phanatic on July 18, 2006, 06:04:57 PM
Who's the bigger dork the dork or the dork who follows him?
The dork who needs to ask.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on July 18, 2006, 06:14:59 PM
Quote from: Phanatic on July 18, 2006, 06:04:57 PM
Who's the bigger dork the dork or the dork who follows him?
The dork who needs to ask.
Nice... (I hate you)
Shut up.
Dork. :P
this is not the thread i am looking for...move along
The things you can find on Ebay...
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d178/jerome99rip/78_1.jpg)
It would be more funny if it read, "I WAS MISQUTOED."
That's some pun-like humor, right there.
Quote from: FFatPatt on July 20, 2006, 06:57:29 PM
It would be more funny if it read, "I WAS MISQUTOED."
That's some pun-like humor, right there.
No, because that would be stupid.
Nuh uh.
Don't argue with Chuggie. If anyone around here knows st00pid, it's him.
Quote from: phillywin2k5 on July 06, 2006, 08:47:56 AM
as much as i hate the guy im betting there is some truth there about McNabb in his book.
I agree.
Die thread, die.
its f-in amazing thats this guys face still makes the front page of the Inquirer, like the writers truly want this season to be a disaster with more and more questions about the past. They are like the black dude on the movie Cant Hardly Wait...."you rememer the time...."
give it up already, get creative for christs sake and start asking questions about real Eagles players.....like Koy Detmer
T.O.'s taking a bath on his house in Moorestown! (http://pod01.prospero.com/n/pfx/forum.aspx?nav=messages&tsn=41&tid=858&webtag=kr-phillytm)
Read all about it.
romey you kill everyone in the media for continuing to bring up TO's name yet youre posting articles about how much he kight lose on a friggin house...and every chance you get you bring him up how much you want him to die
i think TO needs a restraining order against you
Quote from: ice grillin you on August 10, 2006, 01:04:39 PM
romey you kill everyone in the media for continuing to bring up TO's name yet youre posting articles about how much he kight lose on a friggin house...and every chance you get you bring him up how much you want him to die
i think TO needs a restraining order against you
I think you need to stop swinging from T.O.'s awkwardly-undersized johnson. Eagles fans are allowed to have mixed feelings of occasional hatred for him, and you're not the boss of any of us. Shut up.
Ha.
I'll post whatever I want, IGY.
You do the same, okay?
Do you guys need to go into time-out? Maybe take a juice-box break? Go get your binkies and lay down and FF will get you some Juicy Juice.
FF had Juicy Juice and nobody told me?
i want a Pacific Cooler Capri Sun
Juicy Juice sucks.
SunnyD Baja Orange?
Now you're talkin'...
(http://www.sunnyd.com/images/nutrition/baja_orange/product_image.gif)
:drool
Actually liking a Sunny Delight product AND referring to it as the quasi-hip "SunnyD" should be grounds for an immediate banning.
Juicy Juice for all!
No Tang jokes yet. How disappointing.
I did want to add that I'm a real estate appraiser by profession and I find it extremely hilarious that the knucklehead is going to lose millions on a house that was severely overpriced to begin with.
That has nothing to do with T.O. I just enjoy it when rich people lose millions because of arrogance and ignorance.
:yay
Id rather have the "purple stuff"
Quote from: reese125 on August 10, 2006, 01:26:19 PM
Id rather have the "purple stuff"
Yes, that's probably grape Kool-Aid. Which is also better than anything made by Sunny Delight.
I'm getting tired of you dissing Sunny D, man.
:boom
I think you need to stop swinging from T.O.'s awkwardly-undersized johnson. Eagles fans are allowed to have mixed feelings of occasional hatred for him, and you're not the boss of any of us. Shut up.
haha
i was on the TO hate wagon when you were still swimming in your daddys nuts...difference is im not obsessed with him...heads who go on and on about TO are the first ones who will bitch about the media not shutting up about the whole thing
pay attention dunn
i know who i am
who are you?
You've never been on the T.O. hate wagon.
You love him more than Gibbs, so quit frontin', yo.
who are you?
joe
You've never been on the T.O. hate wagon.
ever since the garcia gay bashing.....yes im gay
^^^ :-D ^^^
Touche, IGY.
It takes a man of zero intelligence and zero backbone to accuse another man of being gay in a televised interview. Wow, I had forgotten how much I actually hate TO. Thanks for the reminder, IGY.
QuoteI takes a man...
I know it was just a typo but that was funny, rjs.
farger.
Quote from: rjs246 on August 10, 2006, 02:44:07 PM
It takes a man of zero intelligence and zero backbone to accuse another man of being gay in a televised interview. Wow, I had forgotten how much I actually hate TO. Thanks for the reminder, IGY.
You're obviously obsessed with T.O., and therefore, IGY has some sort of back-assed argument to make with you.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on August 10, 2006, 02:49:16 PM
QuoteI takes a man...
I know it was just a typo but that was funny, rjs.
Ha!