the daily news today published 5 reasons to be optimistic/pessimistic about the future of the birds...discuss....
5 reasons to be pessimistic
1. The defense is in disarray
All those Eagles injuries had very little impact on the defense, which just wasn't very good, for reasons no one seemed quite able to pinpoint. Most disturbing was that respected coordinator Jim Johnson and everyone else around the organization thought this was going to be a great unit. It's hard to say whether a significant defensive-line addition and a better outside linebacker or two will totally turn things around, or whether offenses have evolved in ways that make Johnson's schemes less effective. When teams max protect, for example, it's hard for a blitzmaster to wreak havoc. And suddenly, consistently stopping the run seems more important than it might have been a few years back.
2 The Donovan McNabb factor
Donovan McNabb is coming off his worst season since he became a full-time starter. Not only has McNabb now suffered significant injuries in two of the last 4 years, his leadership has been questioned amid the ugly denouement of the Terrell Owens affair. Whether he deserves it or not, McNabb is now in a position where fans and perhaps even teammates will scrutinize every incompletion, every facial expression. Much more than physical healing has to take place here.
3 Struggles with finding players in the draft
Other than McNabb, the Eagles have little to show for the 1999, 2000 and 2001 drafts. And 2003 isn't looking great, either.
Corey Simon (first round, 2000) is gone. So are, among others, Freddie Mitchell (first round, 2001), Barry Gardner (second round, '99), John Welbourn (fourth round, '99), Bobbie Williams (second round, 2000), Quinton Caver (second round, 2001), and Derrick Burgess (third round, 2001).
In fact, from those 1999-2001 drafts, the Eagles currently have McNabb, injured wideout Todd Pinkston (second round, 2000) and injured running back Correll Buckhalter (fourth round, 2001).
In a league where success flows from good drafting, the picks from those years should be forming the team's foundation right now, its nexus of late-20s players in their primes. And all that remains from the 2003 draft are injured defensive end Jerome McDougle (first round), tight end L.J. Smith (second round) and wideout Billy McMullen (third round).
4 Defenses adjusting to Westbrook
Opposing defenses seemed to adjust better to Brian Westbrook this season.
Maybe it was partly the offensive line or Donovan McNabb's struggles, but Westbrook, when he was healthy, was less explosive than in the past. Other than McNabb, he is the biggest key to the Eagles' offense.
5 What about Jevon Kearse?
Jevon Kearse was healthy almost all year, to very little avail.
When the Birds gave Kearse $66 million over 8 years two offseasons back, they were pretty certain that if he could bounce back from injuries, they'd have a dominant defensive end for several years. The first year was just fine, not unbelievable, but solid. The second year was not. Most disturbing was that Jim Johnson talked about Kearse needing to add to his arsenal of moves, noting that teams have figured out how to handle Kearse's speed. Kearse turns 30 next season.
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5 reasons to be optimistic
1 The circus is leaving town
By the time the Eagles convene for training camp at Lehigh, Terrell Owens will be off their roster and the fans' radar (we can hope). It's hard to see where internal offseason controversy might come from, other than the usual, "Why didn't they sign/draft so-and-so?" After the past few years, this will be a welcome change; there is no franchise tag or big restricted free-agency decision to make from the current roster, no star whose presence at training camp is in doubt. The national media will not be shining its spotlight nearly so brightly.
2 The cap situation and free agency
The Eagles have cap room and a pretty good history of identifying areas where they need help. Last offseason notwithstanding, the Birds have made big changes, particularly on their defense, each of the past several years and have managed that change pretty well. For all their well-known reluctance to overpay their own players, they've never been stingy when pursuing free agents they really wanted. It will be a shock if they don't bring in key reinforcements.
3 The development of Reggie Brown
The rookie wideout can play. He isn't a top No. 1 NFL receiver yet, but he's fast and tough and he's going to get better. His development was the only positive to come from the T.O. debacle... unless you're of the opinion that the Eagles will never again listen to anything Marty Mornhinweg suggests. Then there are two things.
4 The Super Bowl hangover ends
Carolina proved this season that life goes on for a Super Bowl runner-up that missed the playoffs the year after the big game. In fact, the Oakland Raiders are the only recent Super Bowl losers (XXXVII) who fell apart and haven't come back at all. Of course, unless the Panthers or the Giants win next month's Super Bowl, there still won't have been a Super Bowl loser to come back and win it since the Bill Parcells Patriots lost Super Bowl XXXI, then the Bill Belichick Pats won XXXVI, if you want to count that. It isn't that hard to get back into the hunt, though.
5 The damage caused by the injury situation
It's really unlikely the Eagles will end next season with 13 players on IR and four more on the other two lists for guys who aren't able to play.
I saved this one for last because I don't want to promote the notion that you can simply write this debacle off to injuries, but obviously they played a role. If the Eagles brought in no one but kept their key people healthy next season, they'd have a decent shot at the playoffs. Not at the Super Bowl, but at the playoffs. That's not what they should do, of course, or what I think they will do.
yeah, having mcnabb as a QB is a reason to be pessimistic....what a load of shtein.
Oh no, fans are going to start questioning his every incompletion. He's going to crumble under the pressure.
Oh no, fans are going to start questioning his every incompletion
i actually posted this exact thing a couple weeks ago...its absolutely going to happen...but that doesnt mean mcnabb has to let it effect him...but there is a worry that....
He's going to crumble under the pressure.
Anyone that questions McNabb's ability is pathetic and isn't a true fan. You tell me if you'd rather have Aaron Brooks or Chris Simms or even Jake Delhomo out there. Puuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuleeze!
Quoteunless you're of the opinion that the Eagles will never again listen to anything Marty Mornhinweg suggests.
A snot bubbler if ever I read one...
:-D
since when havent the fans been overly critical of mcnabb and his every inaccurate throw, incomplete pass, or int?
even then most will admit that they believe in him and that next season will be better by default because he will be healthy.
the most ridiculous of all of them is the defesnes adjusting to westbrook...he had nine td's and 1200 total yards in 3/4 of a season and they are adjusting to him??
Let's address the pessimism.
#1. Totally valid. We'll have to see how they deal with it.
#2. Somewhat valid. No one, not IGY or the author, is questioning McNabb's ability. They're questioning his will. Injuries aside, McNabb didn't smile a whole lot this season, and IMHO, he stinks when he ain't laughing. KC game, as an example. Going into the half, he's smiling - end result, win. Denver, Dallas, not the case at the half - losses. This is why I don't complain when they're on the sideline joking around. It means they're loose, and that has done nothing but benefit the team. He needs to put the misery of this year, and the other unbelievable bullshtein he's had to endure, behind him, and start having fun again.
#3. Yeah, yeah, yeah, they haven't retained guys from the late 90s, early 2000s. So what? Some of them were busts, some moved on because they wanted far too much money. Simon and Burgess were hardly busts, but they wanted more than they were apparently worth at the time. On the flip side, they've gotten some amazing production from castaways and UDRFA. And Sheppard/Brown/M Lewis/Westbrook/Patterson/Brown/Andrews/Moats all look pretty fine so far (notwithstanding the roasting the secondary took this season). I'm not overly concerned here.
#4. Adjusting to Westbrook, if it's true, would be bad. Because all our other RBs are clones of Westbrook. If this is true, others will have to step up and shake him free.
#5. Kearse may need new moves because he's slowing down with age. At least that's how I took Johnson's statements. Speed kills, but it's a young man's game.
I'll wait and see if any of this pessimism is warranted. We won't know until next November or so.
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 03, 2006, 04:04:25 PM
the most ridiculous of all of them is the defesnes adjusting to westbrook...he had nine td's and 1200 total yards in 3/4 of a season and they are adjusting to him??
I agree, IGY.
Westbrook is about as close to un-containable as you can get in the NFL.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 03, 2006, 04:25:56 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 03, 2006, 04:04:25 PM
the most ridiculous of all of them is the defesnes adjusting to westbrook...he had nine td's and 1200 total yards in 3/4 of a season and they are adjusting to him??
I agree, IGY.
Westbrook is about as close to un-containable as you can get in the NFL.
Yeah, completely uncontainable. Unless he happen to be running between the tackles and then he eats large amounts of dung and is the very definition of 'containable.'
Yeah, completely uncontainable. Unless he happen to be running between the tackles and then he eats large amounts of dung and is the very definition of 'containable.'
your point?...not that i even agree with you 100% but so they dont run him inside...they run him outside and use him as a receiver to the tune of double digit touchdowns 80 catches and 1600 yards total offense...thats hardly being adjusted too
My point, Mr. Sensitive, is that Westbrook is a two trick pony. He's outstanding as a receiver and well above average outside the tackles, but he's far from uncontainable. In fact, he's an injury-plagued mess who can't do what even the most mediocre backs can do, pick up 2 yards when the team needs 1.
i dont know what uncontainable means...all i know is he had a full seasons worth of stats in only 12 games this year...and he gets his every game
so i guess its fair to say that injuries are the only thing that can contain him...not the fact that defenses have adjusted to him
I know it's hard for you to grasp, but nevertheless it is also fair to say that Westbrook isn't much of a runner between the tackles.
If they had a fullback that could block and run the ball once or twice a game for positive yards Westbrook would be a little closer to uncontainable. And if that same hypothetical fullback could catch I'd soil myself in glee and some spunk.
we had a fullback like that.
then we cut him.
Quote from: rjs246 on January 03, 2006, 04:57:04 PM
My point, Mr. Sensitive, is that Westbrook is a two trick pony. He's outstanding as a receiver and well above average outside the tackles, but he's far from uncontainable. In fact, he's an injury-plagued mess who can't do what even the most mediocre backs can do, pick up 2 yards when the team needs 1.
He can't run between the tackles?
Oh, I see... maybe the reason he can't run between the tackles is because the Eagles interior linemen farging suck ass?
Nah, that couldn't be it.
Quote from: phattymatty on January 03, 2006, 05:19:37 PM
we had a fullback like that.
then we cut him.
I know. I miss Kevin Turner, too.
Why Cecil Martin never made a Pro Bowl is beyond me.
Quote from: General_Failure on January 03, 2006, 05:14:46 PM
If they had a fullback that could block and run the ball once or twice a game for positive yards Westbrook would be a little closer to uncontainable. And if that same hypothetical fullback could catch I'd soil myself in glee and some spunk.
This, I agree with.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 03, 2006, 05:32:55 PM
He can't run between the tackles?
Oh, I see... maybe the reason he can't run between the tackles is because the Eagles interior linemen farging suck ass?
Nah, that couldn't be it.
Are you saying that the Eagles' interior line has been terrible for Westbrook's entire career? That year after year, while Duce and Buck were running for positive yardage between the tackles, that Westbrook was subjected to poor blocking? Give me a break.
Westbrook isn't a great inside runner, that's not really debatable. a good inside runner has to have the ability to hit the hole immediately, if you watch Westbrook, he almost always tries to make a move or two and pick his way through the line. this is why they need the "big back" everyone talks about.
but Westbrook not being a great inside runner isn't a horrible thing, the coach just has to use him correctly. Westbrook should get screens, pitches, sweeps, and quick traps. when they need 1 or 2 yards, they need to have a tough inside runner to follow a competent fullback and pick it up. who's fault is it when Westbrook has trouble picking up 2 tough yards, his own fault, or the coaches for trying to run that play with him?
Quote from: Sun_Mo on January 03, 2006, 06:00:11 PM
but Westbrook not being a great inside runner isn't a horrible thing, the coach just has to use him correctly. Westbrook should get screens, pitches, sweeps, and quick traps. when they need 1 or 2 yards, they need to have a tough inside runner to follow a competent fullback and pick it up. who's fault is it when Westbrook has trouble picking up 2 tough yards, his own fault, or the coaches for trying to run that play with him?
Major problems. MAJOR problems.
I wouldn't write off Westbrook being an inside runner just yet. As previously mentioned it takes some time to see what he can do once they get a commitment to running it and getting a good FB to lead him.
Look at the holes he was getting when Jon Ritchie was blocking for him.
Good FB + commitment to running + Westbrook maturing = potential to run it inside.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on January 03, 2006, 06:00:11 PM
Westbrook isn't a great inside runner, that's not really debatable. a good inside runner has to have the ability to hit the hole immediately, if you watch Westbrook, he almost always tries to make a move or two and pick his way through the line. this is why they need the "big back" everyone talks about.
but Westbrook not being a great inside runner isn't a horrible thing, the coach just has to use him correctly. Westbrook should get screens, pitches, sweeps, and quick traps. when they need 1 or 2 yards, they need to have a tough inside runner to follow a competent fullback and pick it up. who's fault is it when Westbrook has trouble picking up 2 tough yards, his own fault, or the coaches for trying to run that play with him?
Good post. If Westbrook dove into the hole instead of getting cute, perhaps he'd be a better inside runner. If he had a fullback worth his roster spot. If the coach committed to the run. If, if, if.
man the media is really taking this season too seriously. do they realize injuries can make or break a team? especially when a good number of injured are pro-bowl, mvp type players? man! i agreee we need to make some changes. most importantly we need to have a back who can pound between the tackles...ala DUCE :'(. We need to establish a running game so we are not killing our defense. Those 3 and outs killed us this year, plus all the penalties.
I think the teams needs to get healthy, regroup mentally, pick-up a few key FA's and maybe trade up for a top 5 pick. i think this season frankly has been a joke...i think they pretty much gave up and realized they are not half the team without McNabb, and the pieces just fell from there. i think they will regroup and McNabb is going to come out with a fury to prove all the iceholes wrong and have a hell of a year and get us back to the superbowl. I am really excited about next year! :yay
GO fargIN BRIDS!!~!! :cfhead :cfhead :cfhead :cfhead :cfhead
The defense does a good enough job of killing itself with those early game 7 minute drives it lets up.
Quote from: mussa on January 03, 2006, 06:48:30 PM
man the media is really taking this season too seriously. do they realize injuries can make or break a team? especially when a good number of injured are pro-bowl, mvp type players? man! i agreee we need to make some changes. most importantly we need to have a back who can pound between the tackles...ala DUCE :'(. We need to establish a running game so we are not killing our defense. Those 3 and outs killed us this year, plus all the penalties.
I think the teams needs to get healthy, regroup mentally, pick-up a few key FA's and maybe trade up for a top 5 pick. i think this season frankly has been a joke...i think they pretty much gave up and realized they are not half the team without McNabb, and the pieces just fell from there. i think they will regroup and McNabb is going to come out with a fury to prove all the iceholes wrong and have a hell of a year and get us back to the superbowl. I am really excited about next year! :yay
GO fargIN BRIDS!!~!! :cfhead :cfhead :cfhead :cfhead :cfhead
Man...i totally agree. This BS about the "window nailed shut" is ridiculous. It's going to be hilarious when every media member predicts them to fall on their face next season again and then have the Eagles go out and put up 13 wins again. Farg the media! They are far too bandwagon.
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 03, 2006, 03:12:10 PM
the daily news today published 5 reasons to be optimistic/pessimistic about the future of the birds...discuss....
5 reasons to be pessimistic
1. The defense is in disarray
2. The Donovan McNabb factor
3. Struggles with finding players in the draft
4. Defenses adjusting to Westbrook
5 What about Jevon Kearse?
5 reasons to be optimistic
1 The circus is leaving town
2 The cap situation and free agency
3 The development of Reggie Brown
4 The Super Bowl hangover ends
5 The damage caused by the injury situation
1P. The defense is the thing that needs to be fixed the most. Like mentioned they were relatively healthy this year and they were a terrible disappointment. It all starts up front. If you have zero pressure your secondary is going to be Izell Jenkins'd time after time. So I would agree with this point and I think that most of the plastic surgery this off-season needs to be on this side of the ball.
2P. This one should be in the optimistic category. I know there are a ton of McNabb haters out there and I'm not saying he doesn't deserve some heat because he does. But the level of criticism he is getting is unwarranted and ridiculous. Every QB in the NFL has his flaws, but McNabb's are magnified and talked about as if the guy should be a 3rd string guy. I see the "Start McMahon" contingent has shut their mouths lately, eh? Should Donovan catch heat for some dumb decisions? You bet. But he should not be looked as pessimisticly at all.
3P. I do not have the time right now, but I will find the time to do this research. Writers and some fans in Philadelphia like to rip the drafts, but I am going to get out my handy dandy Draft Encyclopedia and compare and contrast the Eagles drafts to the other 31 teams since 1999 and see who has the most guys on their rosters.
4P. Ridiculous. Who wrote this? Les Bowen? No one is adjusting to Westbrook. Les is wrong on this one big time.
5P. Kearse needs help. I also think that he should be moved around more often so offenses cannot scheme against him. Jim Johnson should move him to RDE and joker as well as play him at LDE. Tommy Brasher is likely to retire so maybe a new DL coach will help Kearse see some things to improve upon and make changes in his moves and approaches. When there is a pocket collapsing DT and a competant DE across from him he's a force. I am not giving up on The Freak yet. When Trent Cole was doing his thing did you notice it opened thigs up for Kearse? I did.
1O. This is a good thing. Did you guys read how Reid has now told players to give new players the 3rd degree on how things are done around here? I like that move by Andy.
2O. Always a good thing to have the money to make changes. Not only can they sign players but they can afford to cut deadweight like Mr. Double-Oh 55.
3O. This one should not be underrated. Reggie Brown flourished with Mike McMahon as his QB for christs sake! When he gets another year under his belt and a good QB his level of play will jump ten fold. Who says he cannot be a Chris Chambers/Steve Smith/Chad Johnson type guy. I use those guys because they are all studs who were drafted out of round 1.
4O. I underestimated this big time. I thought it was a myth and just a coincidence that teams struggled after the SB. But Carolina and others have shown that you need a year to regroup.
5O. Reid said early on, and we know this, that you have to be healthy. The amount of injuries this year were abnormal. Get healthy and add to the core players is what I am looking forward to.
I really am getting sick of all the closet cowboys and skins fans around here. those ugly farging starter jackets are out of style for a reason. thats when your team was good last. :chair
No doubt, it's idiocy at it's best.
Great post Freak :yay
Eagles need (1) Recieving threat..looks like more TE around in Draft
(2) DL pass rushher
(3) Good backup QB
(4) OT
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 03, 2006, 04:04:25 PM
the most ridiculous of all of them is the defesnes adjusting to westbrook...he had nine td's and 1200 total yards in 3/4 of a season and they are adjusting to him??
Damn... I was thinking the exact same thing as I read that one. Ridiculous.
Wasn't one of Westbrook's first career rushing TDs up the middle for sixty-some yards against the Buffalo Bills?
Quote from: Tomahawk on January 04, 2006, 01:31:33 PM
Wasn't one of Westbrook's first career rushing TDs up the middle for sixty-some yards against the Buffalo Bills?
One run does not a between-the-tackles-runner make. That being said, Westbrook is the least of this team's worries. Get a good blocking fullback and either groom Gordon or find another power back, and the running attack should be potent. Assuming it gets practiced and used.