Okay, this isn't a contest or anything so don't stress out about this. :-D
Just for fun, let's see who gets closest in terms of when Westbrook will sign his new contract extension.
We all know it's going to happen, so let's see who's the prognosticator of prognosticators on this board.
I'll say August 19th @ 2:00 PM.
Winner gets a fresh chocolate chip cookie. ;)
Aug 20, 7:30 PM
I predict that he will not outperform his next contract and will not go to the team offering to take a pay cut when that happens.
August 30th, 10:30 AM
August 16th, 4:35 EST.
September 3, 3:49 AM.
October 18, 2005 at 4:00 pm (bye week)
word will leak the afternoon of sept 7th...the presser on sept 8th
September 6th (my birthday) at 3:33 PM CST
^^^
my first guess but the day after labor day scared me...why?...i have no idea
September 12 @ 9:00 PM EST ;)
Sept 8th . .2pm - gets done before the season starts.
November 15, 2005 @ 1630 hours.
August 29 @ 2:30pm est.
Tomorrow!! :yay
;)
Hard to say or predict but I certainly hope it's very soon. This guy is the key to our offense NOT TO. And unlike TO we can't afford to lose Westy or have him unhappy & what not. I say pay the guy & lets go kick some a55!!
September 1 @ 1:00pm
September 6th, 2005.
1:30pm... BOOK IT!
It doesn't and they decide to go with Moats next year :evil
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on August 16, 2005, 04:14:12 PM
I'll say August 19th @ 2:00 PM.
An hour and seventeen minutes to go.
C'mon, Andy & Joe! There's a cookie riding on this deal!!
Big Red might make the extra effort if you share the cookie with him. And by share I mean give it to him.
Cookies, my arse... I promised Andy a pair of grilled cheese sammiches if he holds out til the 6th.
It's in the bag.
I'm saying next Thursday, August 25 @ 4:00 pm.
I predict that the time and date of Westbrook's extension will coincide with when he signs the dotted line. Unless of course they don't use a dotted line. In which case it would be a complete, unbroken line.
Quote from: EagleFeva on August 19, 2005, 02:04:37 PM
Cookies, my arse... I promised Andy a pair of grilled cheese sammiches if he holds out til the 6th.
It's in the bag.
It's Junkfood Friday good luck using food as a bargaining device. :-D
Quote from: JailBird-man on August 19, 2005, 02:23:20 PM
Quote from: EagleFeva on August 19, 2005, 02:04:37 PM
Cookies, my arse... I promised Andy a pair of grilled cheese sammiches if he holds out til the 6th.
It's in the bag.
It's Junkfood Friday good luck using food as a bargaining device. :-D
We're talkin' about Andy here, man... food is
ALWAYS a bargaining device. ;D
September 2 @ 3:00PM. Betting he'll get about what Rudi Johnson got, just not so much up front.
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on August 20, 2005, 08:48:49 PM
September 2 @ 3:00PM. Betting he'll get about what Rudi Johnson got, just not so much up front.
farg. A grand total of five people in the hunt still......kind of makes me a little nervous this hasn't been addressed with our r0XoRz cap space.
Quote from: 4and26 on August 16, 2005, 05:20:19 PM
Sept 8th . .2pm - gets done before the season starts.
I'm still in the hunt .. . ..what do I win ???
Gay sex with Chuggie.
I don't want to confuse people into thinking he's a woman.
Still in it as of 09/08/05 at midnight:
4and26
DonHo
Temple Owl
The Waco Kid
Philly Crew
Any bets?
I bet he gets traded to the Colts for Corey Simon.
It will be announced 11/10/05 at 4:55pm
Quote from: rjs246 on August 16, 2005, 04:18:05 PM
I predict that he will not outperform his next contract and will not go to the team offering to take a pay cut when that happens.
I would like to point out that I am still in the running to be right on this...
I going to guess one hour before the MNF game.
How about never?
He just gave an impromptu PC saying that he and Fletcher shut down negotiations because the money isn't close.... :o
Quote from: BigEd76 on September 08, 2005, 11:59:37 AM
How about never?
He just gave an impromptu PC saying that he and Fletcher shut down negotiations because the money isn't close.... :o
wonderful news. ::)
Raise your hand if you're shocked.
He wants to get paid like a pro-bowler and I for one don't think that he should and it sounds like the front office doesn't think he needs that kind of loot either.
I love Westbrook and the things he can do, but he's a gadget. He doesn't run well between the tackles or pick up tough yards when we need them. He hasn't shown the ability to tote the rock 25 times a game, and even if he can do that, AR doesn't want him to, so why pay him like a back who will be shouldering a 25+ carry a game load. Whatever. I hope they sign him to an extension, but he doesn't need to be paid like an elite back.
Shocked that he didn't come to his senses after his agent told the public that it was a fair deal.
WTF is he thinking? He's not going to get paid like Lamont Jordan, who was grossly overpaid by the Raiders. When will players REALIZE this on this team?
Oh well. Moats, Gordon, and draft pick next year.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 12:20:08 PM
Shocked that he didn't come to his senses after his agent told the public that it was a fair deal.
WTF is he thinking? He's not going to get paid like Lamont Jordan, who was grossly overpaid by the Raiders. When will players REALIZE this on this team?
well if he knows as long as he goes through this season with similar success, some team out there will pay him what he wants.
maybe he does realize this on this team. i dont think thats an issue. the eagles set a value on a player, and expect a player to always agree? that'll never happen 100% of the time.
and this time, westbrook disagrees.
Quote from: Wingspan on September 08, 2005, 12:26:11 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 12:20:08 PM
Shocked that he didn't come to his senses after his agent told the public that it was a fair deal.
WTF is he thinking? He's not going to get paid like Lamont Jordan, who was grossly overpaid by the Raiders. When will players REALIZE this on this team?
well if he knows as long as he goes through this season with similar success, some team out there will pay him what he wants.
maybe he does realize this on this team. i dont think thats an issue. the eagles set a value on a player, and expect a player to always agree? that'll never happen 100% of the time.
and this time, westbrook disagrees.
The problem with that thinking is that next year you have Shaun Alexander and Edgerrin James who are going to be FAs just to name a couple. If any team thought Westbrook was worth the kind of money he was asking for, they would have signed him as an RFA and given the draft pick to the Eagles. I mean, look how long it took Chicago to sign Benson. Besides, the Eagles could franchise him next year if they so wish. I just hope he doesn't suffer the same fate as Damon Moore.
Obviously, we can't make final analysis on this situation until...
1. ...we see how Moats and Gordon look this year.
2. ...it is clear that this is not just a hiccup in the negotiations and Westbrook is certainly not going to play for the Eagles next year.
3. ...the money demands from both sides become apparent.
That said, I would prefer if the Eagles could get a deal done with him. Letting him go could finally be the one that comes back to bite this FO in the arse.
Not overly surprising.
He's slated to be franchised tagged next year regardless.
IF Moats is everything that they hope he is, Westbrook becomes expendable. As of right now it's not even close since Moats has been a fumbler and doesn't catch nearly as well (and is only a rookie who has never played a meaningful professional snap), but he is much better at running for tough yardage between the tackles and has similar speed. If he produces and improves in his trouble areas we may have seen the last of Brian Westbrook. And that would kind of suck.
Get James :D
of course, here comes the "Bash Brian" crew to defend the Eagles no matter what...
the Eagles are f'n this up, he is the most important offensive weapon outside of Donovan and they need to pay him as such. it's not about how many carries he gets, he is on a team that only runs the ball roughly 30% of the time, but he catches the ball, makes plays, and scores touchdowns
Hey, I like Westbrook; and I've always been a big proponent of his. But if he's looking for a much bigger deal than what Houston just gave Dominick Davis, he's out of line. The Eagles are good year after year because they make good fiscal decisions-- paying a player well over his market value isn't part of their plan, and it shouldn't be.
From everything I've read, the deal they offered Westbrook topped that Davis deal-- and he's an idiot to not jump all over that. I still like him, and I still want him around-- but not at the expense of overpaying him.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:06:22 PM
of course, here comes the "Bash Brian" crew to defend the Eagles no matter what...
That's BS. I'm not bashing Brian or defending the Eagles no matter what so stuff it.
Quote
the Eagles are f'n this up, he is the most important offensive weapon outside of Donovan and they need to pay him as such. it's not about how many carries he gets, he is on a team that only runs the ball roughly 30% of the time, but he catches the ball, makes plays, and scores touchdowns
He is important. He does make plays. He should be paid. But he wants to be paid like an elite back, which he is not. And if there's one thing this team has shown over and over again its that they won't pay a player more than they believe he is worth. Period. If they can't get closer on the money or if Moats steps up as a playmaker as well, that's it. You know it. I know it. Better get used to it.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:06:22 PM
of course, here comes the "Bash Brian" crew to defend the Eagles no matter what...
Um... I don't see too many of them here.
lol...no one is bashing westbrook. he's a great player, and the eagles would most definetely take a step back without him.
that said, if the eagles see his value as one thing, and he sees it very differently. what exactly are we going to do about it other than your typical ex-eagle grave dancing threads that go in the general NFL section. hey, if westbrook gets the money he wants, good for him. hopefully it's as an eagle. but if someone offered you a job in another company for a considerable amount more money, you'd take it right? i would.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:06:22 PM
of course, here comes the "Bash Brian" crew to defend the Eagles no matter what...
Must you start every post with an ignorant little comment? No one is bashing Westbrook on here. We all agree he should be paid and paid fairly, but are you willing to have them OVERPAY?
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:06:22 PM
of course, here comes the "Bash Brian" crew to defend the Eagles no matter what...
the Eagles are f'n this up, he is the most important offensive weapon outside of Donovan and they need to pay him as such. it's not about how many carries he gets, he is on a team that only runs the ball roughly 30% of the time, but he catches the ball, makes plays, and scores touchdowns
I don't see anyone "bashing" Brian.
I agree with your post for the most part. Westbrook is the second most important cog in the offense. He has the skills to get
what is required from the coaches done. If Westy had the abilty to run between the tackles and the durabilty to do so, he still wouldn't get 25+ carries in this offense. For what we want a back to do, I can think of maybe two other backs in the league who could pull it off better than the way Westy does it. That would be LT or Domanick Davis. Both elite backs, both with elite paychecks. The difference obviously is that Davis and Tomlison are durable, and can pund the ball with a lead. Westy can't claim to do so. I think they should extend him, give him more money, but he doesn't deserve the elite money. Sadly, another team will probably give him that, but also want him to run it between the tackles, which would grind him and his career into dust.
Without a guy like Westbrook, teams can concentrate on taking the deep ball away from T.O, and settle back in coverage. We either need a threat like him, or a serious power runner. I'd rather have Westy and do things the way we have been for the past few years.
Man, I'm really just hung up on this Dominick Davis thing. I mean, that deal should have made this negotiation really easy. Similar backs, similar roles on the team, similar age...it basically set the market for the deal. It should have been a slam dunk from there.
PhillyFaninDC...you think Davis is a durable pounder? What games were you watching?
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 01:10:13 PM
That's BS. I'm not bashing Brian or defending the Eagles no matter what so stuff it.
i wasn't speaking about necessarily you, i meant the whole gang that comes out during a time like this: Howard, Spads, and gang
Quote
He is important. He does make plays. He should be paid. But he wants to be paid like an elite back, which he is not.
but he is an elite back, he's an elite back to this team. he is Marshall Faulk, Preist Holmes, LT, Shaun Alexander, he is those guys, to the way this team plays. if this was the Falcons, i say yeah, he isn't an elite back, they run the ball a ton and that isn't his strong suit. but to this team, he is the man, and they need to pay him that way.
as far as what was offered by the Eagles, no one knows. just because the Eagles say he recieved an offer similar to Davis doesn't mean it's the truth.
I would like to thank a lot of you for reminding me that the FO never does anything wrong.
Sometimes it bothers me that we let great players go because we're cheap, but then I realize that they never make a bad decision.
Thanks again.
Quote from: Zanshin on September 08, 2005, 01:16:26 PM
PhillyFaninDC...you think Davis is a durable pounder? What games were you watching?
that choice of words has had me laughing for 5 minutes.... :-D
whats this thread about again?
Quote from: Zanshin on September 08, 2005, 01:16:26 PM
PhillyFaninDC...you think Davis is a durable pounder? What games were you watching?
He doesn't have the problems Westy does running between the tackles, and he'll be more durable doing it. He's no short yardage back, but compared with Westbrook at 5'8" 209 (Davis is 5'10" 229") he has better tools to run it straight up.
Hey, teams had the ability to pry him from the Eagles this year...and that didn't happen. It's not about whether he's elite for the Eagles; it's about market value. Can he get more from another team that he would from the Eagles? And would he have similar success there? I guess we'll find out. But James was available this year...Alexander could have been had; the market just isn't the same for RBs these days.
Quote from: phattymatty on September 08, 2005, 01:20:17 PM
I would like to thank a lot of you for reminding me that the FO never does anything wrong.
Sometimes it bothers me that we let great players go because we're cheap, but then I realize that they never make a bad decision.
Thanks again.
Again, your sarcasm blows. Great players let go because the FO Is cheap? Who is a
great player let go in THIS FO's history?
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:22:33 PM
Quote from: Zanshin on September 08, 2005, 01:16:26 PM
PhillyFaninDC...you think Davis is a durable pounder? What games were you watching?
He doesn't have the problems Westy does running between the tackles, and he'll be more durable doing it. He's no short yardage back, but compared with Westbrook at 5'8" 209 (Davis is 5'10" 229") he has better tools to run it straight up.
Davis has been more injury prone than Westbrook over the last few years, for sure. And I don't think Davis is THAT much more effective running inside.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:17:12 PM
as far as what was offered by the Eagles, no one knows. just because the Eagles say he recieved an offer similar to Davis doesn't mean it's the truth.
His agent had told the press that the deal was a fair one.
From CBS.Sportsline:
QuoteBrian Westbrook cut off contract talks with the Philadelphia Eagles on Thursday because the two sides are far apart on a long-term extension. "Me and my agent have told the Eagles' management that we're no longer interested in talking to them as far as the contract situation," Westbrook said. "We don't feel as though we've received a proposal from them that really represents the value that I bring to this team and my market value. I think that in the last two and a half, three years that I've been here, I've brought a lot to this team."
So what now? Does he play? Trying to put pressure? I just hope he stops with the media bullshtein. Look where that went with T.O. Man, I just want these millionares to shut the farg up and play the game.
Quote from: phattymatty on September 08, 2005, 01:20:17 PM
I would like to thank a lot of you for reminding me that the FO never does anything wrong.
Sometimes it bothers me that we let great players go because we're cheap, but then I realize that they never make a bad decision.
Thanks again.
Dude, that's a little bit ridiculous. Who have they let go that went on to do anything significant since Andy Reid took over? I'd say that their ability to assess their personel is pretty remarkable and they've earned a little bit of trust.
No one wants Westbrook to go. No one is saying that the Front Office should let him go. We're just saying that they aren't going to pay him more thatn the value they put on him. They just won't. Everyone bitches and pisses and moans every time they get into a contract dispute with a player, but its the same thing every time. The player thinks they're worth something, the front office doesn't, end of conversation.
Westbrook is awesome, and he makes this offense better and exciting, but he isn't the kind of back that can demand huge money.
Westbrook's a guy I'd overpay a little. Maybe 10% more than his true value.
I think these are the problems:
1. Rudi Johnson's contract -- Westbrook sees this, and he thinks he should be a notch above. Hell, I agree he's a notch above Rudi Johnson. I also, however, believe the super-cheap Bengals made a very large error and overpaid Rudi quite a bit. They're keeping a potential playmaker off the field in Chris Perry, and I think we've already seen the best from Johnson. But, you can't blame Westbrook for wanting more than Rudi. Blame the Bengals for paying Rudi.
2. Westbrook in Restricted Free Agency -- The flip side is that the Eagles saw Westbrook gain very little/no interest on the market when a team would have only had to surrender one first-round pick to get him. Additionally, players like Edgerrin James and Shaun Alexander could probably have been had for a first-rounder, and teams weren't biting. Why is this? It's easy. It's really not as hard to find a serviceable running back as it is to put together a line that can make a back look good. The Pats acquired Dillon to improve their team for only a 2nd round pick, but they had won Super Bowls without him. The last team to win a Super Bowl on the legs of a franchise back was Baltimore, and they also had one of the best defenses in the history of the NFL.
I believe that right now, the Eagles need Westbrook more than he needs them. That said, the Eagles have him on contract through this year, and there will be a lot fewer unknowns after the season ends. Unfortunately, that means the Eagles will have to pay even more to keep him if Moats proves very little... and if he does look good, Westbrook is probably gone.
So, from where I'm sitting, I do believe the Eagles are making a mistake here. I think they could pay Brian a good, large, relatively fair amount of money right now, and prevent what is probably a lose-lose down the road.
All that said, I have no idea what the numbers are that he's demanding, and if it's anything like Deuce McAllister money, the kid needs to pull his head out of his ass and realize he'll never be worth as much as Deuce McAllister to any team, especially the Eagles, who usually plan for life without the "greedier" players instead of paying them.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 01:23:41 PM
Quote from: phattymatty on September 08, 2005, 01:20:17 PM
I would like to thank a lot of you for reminding me that the FO never does anything wrong.
Sometimes it bothers me that we let great players go because we're cheap, but then I realize that they never make a bad decision.
Thanks again.
Again, your sarcasm blows. Great players let go because the FO Is cheap? Who is a great player let go in THIS FO's history?
Trotter
LMAO...you have to be kidding.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:26:13 PM
Trotter
Yeah, he was really great in DC. System player. Terrible example.
and for the record, i do believe the FO has earned some trust with the likes of Taylor, Vincent, and Hugh...
however, i think they are messing this one up
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 01:28:26 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:26:13 PM
Trotter
Yeah, he was really great in DC. System player. Terrible example.
terrible example? how? how did the genius FO replace him? they didn't.
and just because he blows out a knee, he sucks? ok.
So what now? Does he play? Trying to put pressure? I just hope he stops with the media bullshtein. Look where that went with T.O. Man, I just want these millionares to shut the farg up and play the game.
what are talking about...did you read his press conference comments...this is night and day btwn TO and westbrook
btw westbrook is not a millionaire
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:26:13 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 01:23:41 PM
Quote from: phattymatty on September 08, 2005, 01:20:17 PM
I would like to thank a lot of you for reminding me that the FO never does anything wrong.
Sometimes it bothers me that we let great players go because we're cheap, but then I realize that they never make a bad decision.
Thanks again.
Again, your sarcasm blows. Great players let go because the FO Is cheap? Who is a great player let go in THIS FO's history?
Trotter
You don't do so good with history do you? Trotter SUCKED in D.C. He is in a scheme that works to his strengths. Nothing more. If he were going to a team that wants him to drop back in pass coverage, and "float", not so great.
i would over pay westbrook.
he cant be making too much as a 3rd rd pick...especially for what he's done for the eagles.
he deseverves something a little higher than the normal Banner Jedi Mind Trick Contracts
(this is the offer you're looking for....move along)
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:29:21 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:26:13 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 01:23:41 PM
Quote from: phattymatty on September 08, 2005, 01:20:17 PM
I would like to thank a lot of you for reminding me that the FO never does anything wrong.
Sometimes it bothers me that we let great players go because we're cheap, but then I realize that they never make a bad decision.
Thanks again.
Again, your sarcasm blows. Great players let go because the FO Is cheap? Who is a great player let go in THIS FO's history?
Trotter
You don't do so good with history do you? Trotter SUCKED in D.C. He is in a scheme that works to his strengths. Nothing more. If he were going to a team that wants him to drop back in pass coverage, and "float", not so great.
it's not about what the players do elsewhere, it's about how they are replaced on this team. they never replaced Trotter until they got.... oh wait, Trotter.
Yeah, but you're a durable pounder.
I'd overpay a little...but not ridiculously so.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:28:32 PM
however, i think they are messing this one up
I agree with you about Westbrook for now. The issue is that you're relatively new to this board and were very "vocal" about them letting Simon go, so we see you as someone who cries bloody murder any time the Eagles lose someone, only to later realize the error of your ways when the player leaves... the opposite of a FO apologist, if you will.
With Taylor, Vincent, and Hugh... did you think the Eagles were also making the wrong decision with those players, or were you on board with them letting them go all along?
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 08, 2005, 01:29:17 PM
So what now? Does he play? Trying to put pressure? I just hope he stops with the media bullshtein. Look where that went with T.O. Man, I just want these millionares to shut the farg up and play the game.
what are talking about...did you read his press conference comments...this is night and day btwn TO and westbrook
btw westbrook is not a millionaire
All I am saying is that I want him to keep it in house and quiet. I wasn't comparing him and his situation to T.O. The media will jump all over another "problem" in Philly, and I am tired of hearing about it. That said, get a farging clue and read the whole post. :boo
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:29:17 PM
terrible example? how? how did the genius FO replace him? they didn't.
and just because he blows out a knee, he sucks? ok.
They didn't replace him, and we got just as far without him (two years in a row) as we did with him. He was AWFUL in DC. Even before his injury. Ask any skins fan.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:31:02 PM
it's not about what the players do elsewhere, it's about how they are replaced on this team. they never replaced Trotter until they got.... oh wait, Trotter.
No, its about the money he WANTED, the money the Eagles OFFERED, the money the Skins OVERPAID, and the money he ended up getting here this offseason.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:31:42 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:28:32 PM
however, i think they are messing this one up
I agree with you about Westbrook for now. The issue is that you're relatively new to this board and were very "vocal" about them letting Simon go, so we see you as someone who cries bloody murder any time the Eagles lose someone, only to later realize the error of your ways when the player leaves... the opposite of a FO apologist, if you will.
With Taylor, Vincent, and Hugh... did you think the Eagles were also making the wrong decision with those players, or were you on board with them letting them go all along?
i was on board. i thought maybe they should've kept Vincent for the nickel but other than that i was ok with Taylor and Vincent.
i thought Hugh was a small mistake, but obviously was wrong on that. the one thing about that is that he is another player they didn't replace the following year. they had to wait an extra year until they got Kearse. but Hugh did nothing in Jacksonville, so that's a win for FO.
i still think they should've kept Corey for the franchise tender, but only time will see how that plays out.
Trotter is also a better and smarter player now than he was in his first stint with the Eagles.
Trying to learn Marvin Lewis's defense and having to fight to get his starting spot back both taught him quite a lot.
For the record, Trotter always sucked. Still does.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:31:02 PM
it's not about what the players do elsewhere, it's about how they are replaced on this team. they never replaced Trotter until they got.... oh wait, Trotter.
Actually it is. Trotter was a product of the system. Nothing more. he left and sucked. We went just as far without him. The team didn't miss a beat. A horrible example. Keep trying....you might nail one.
All I am saying is that I want him to keep it in house and quiet. I wasn't comparing him and his situation to T.O. The media will jump all over another "problem" in Philly, and I am tired of hearing about it. That said, get a farging clue and read the whole post
the wont even rate a blip on the media radar...westbrook said 'im not angry im disappointed'...meaning he wants to stay with the team but is not getting the offer he wanted
anyway why do you care what the media says
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:34:06 PM
Trotter is also a better and smarter player now than he was in his first stint with the Eagles.
Trying to learn Marvin Lewis's defense and having to fight to get his starting spot back both taught him quite a lot.
i agree. there's no doubt that he didn't play as well in DC. but while the FO was patting themselves on the back, Levon Kirkland and Barry Gardener, and then Simoneau were getting abused.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:34:06 PM
Trotter is also a better and smarter player now than he was in his first stint with the Eagles.
Trying to learn Marvin Lewis's defense and having to fight to get his starting spot back both taught him quite a lot.
Exactly. Now, he probably gets instructions from JJ like, "Trot, you see that center? Good, run over him."
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:34:52 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:31:02 PM
it's not about what the players do elsewhere, it's about how they are replaced on this team. they never replaced Trotter until they got.... oh wait, Trotter.
Actually it is. Trotter was a product of the system. Nothing more. he left and sucked. We went just as far without him. The team didn't miss a beat. A horrible example. Keep trying....you might nail one.
so if player X is a pro-bowler in your system, leaves because of a money dispute and players Y and Z are not even close to as good in your system, that's not a personel mistake?
"And Trotter jumps on the pile 6 yards downfield for another assisted tackle. What a great play!"
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:36:14 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:34:06 PM
Trotter is also a better and smarter player now than he was in his first stint with the Eagles.
Trying to learn Marvin Lewis's defense and having to fight to get his starting spot back both taught him quite a lot.
i agree. there's no doubt that he didn't play as well in DC. but while the FO was patting themselves on the back, Levon Kirkland and Barry Gardener, and then Simoneau were getting abused.
That's true.....but did it affect the outcome of the season? Was there a dropoff of overall team performance from losing Trotter?
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:38:38 PM
That's true.....but did it affect the outcome of the season? Was there a dropoff of overall team performance from losing Trotter?
overall team performance? no. defensive performance? I say yes.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:37:53 PM
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:34:52 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:31:02 PM
it's not about what the players do elsewhere, it's about how they are replaced on this team. they never replaced Trotter until they got.... oh wait, Trotter.
Actually it is. Trotter was a product of the system. Nothing more. he left and sucked. We went just as far without him. The team didn't miss a beat. A horrible example. Keep trying....you might nail one.
so if player X is a pro-bowler in your system, leaves because of a money dispute and players Y and Z are not even close to as good in your system, that's not a personel mistake?
It's a mistake only if it will cripple the teams chances the equaling or bettering their performance. The FO and Coaches didn't feel Trotter leaving would....and guess what? It didn't.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:40:12 PM
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:38:38 PM
That's true.....but did it affect the outcome of the season? Was there a dropoff of overall team performance from losing Trotter?
overall team performance? no. defensive performance? I say yes.
Overall team performance > Defensive performance
Maybe they can stash the money they're going to save from Wetbrook and hide it under the bed with the 5 mil they saved by letting Corey go.
Interest rates are great right now. No use in putting it towards locking up some guys long term.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:33:56 PM
i was on board. i thought maybe they should've kept Vincent for the nickel but other than that i was ok with Taylor and Vincent.
i thought Hugh was a small mistake, but obviously was wrong on that. the one thing about that is that he is another player they didn't replace the following year. they had to wait an extra year until they got Kearse. but Hugh did nothing in Jacksonville, so that's a win for FO.
i still think they should've kept Corey for the franchise tender, but only time will see how that plays out.
So, there's no doubt you tend to lean to siding against the front office when they decide to allow a popular, productive player seek greener pastures. The problem with that is they will continue to prove you wrong a lot more often than you get the last laugh. When I'm unsure, I would bet on this FO anytime.
That said, I still believe allowing negotiations with Westbrook to deteriorate to this extent is a mistake. Westbrook also made a huge mistake by reinforcing his distaste with the negotiations
publicly, unless his goal is to make sure he hits the open market, and he doesn't want to be tempted to re-sign.
I personally feel the Eagles are high on Lamar Gordon's future and would have taken him in 2002 if he were still on the board in the 3rd round, and not Brian Westbrook. Westbrook may have been there in the 4th, because other teams' scouting departments had written him off as a small school guy with a blown knee. The Eagles like what they've seen from Moats so far, so that only reduces the reason for them to cave and overpay Brian Westbrook.
He got frustrated with them, and he went public to shut off negotiations. It's definitely his fault for doing that, but it's the Eagles fault for allowing a key contributor to their team to get that frustrated without more of an explanation.
That's true.....but did it affect the outcome of the season? Was there a dropoff of overall team performance from losing Trotter?
it was a huge factor in losing the nfc championship...so yeah id say it affected the season
theres nothing wrong with letting people walk...if you have something to replace them with...in trotters case they let him walk and had no plan b...this is also wny i oppose the simon release
as for overall mistakes not getting a #1 wide receiver before TO was a huge mistake...that single handedly wasted two seasons of possible superbowl wins...very comparable to clarke never getting a goalie and wasting lindros years...tho andy must also get credit for bringing in TO...
Whatever. We all agree on just about everything here:
1. Trotter is a system player, the team didn't drop off when he left, he fits with us, we fit with him. Fine.
2. Westbrook is awesome for our offense.
3. The front office has never and probably will never overpay for a player that they feel they can replace.
The end. Yeesh.
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:41:46 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:40:12 PM
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:38:38 PM
That's true.....but did it affect the outcome of the season? Was there a dropoff of overall team performance from losing Trotter?
overall team performance? no. defensive performance? I say yes.
Overall team performance > Defensive performance
they gave up 27 points to Tampa in the NFCCG, Jurevicioius over the middle anybody?
Don't know why I feel the need to explain it again, but I am all for Westbrook getting he is due. I am just not for Westbrook getting what he feels he is due.
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on September 08, 2005, 01:44:20 PM
Don't know why I feel the need to explain it again, but I am all for Westbrook getting he is due. I am just not for Westbrook getting what he feels he is due.
obviously, that's where the dispute is.
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Didn't see this posted, yet.
Quote
WESTBROOK BREAKS HIS SILENCE
September 8, 2005
By BOB KENT
Starting tailback Brian Westbrook broke his silence Thursday, saying that he was "disappointed" that he and his agent have not been able to hammer out a long-term contract with Eagles management.
And though he says his camp is "no longer interested in talking to them (Eagles' front office) as far as the contract situation goes," Westbrook said that doesn't mean this is his last season in Philadelphia.
RB Brian Westbrook
"I'm not saying that," said Westbrook, in his first remarks to the media since June. "At this point, until the Eagles feel as though they can give me a proposal that really shows that they want me to stay here, our contract talks are no longer."
Westbrook is currently playing under a one-year tender and is eligible to become an unrestricted free agent after this season.
Westbrook said his camp has told the Eagles' brass that they are "no longer interested in talking to them as far as the contract situation goes because we don't feel as though we've received a proposal from them that really represents the value that I bring to this team."
Westbrook's contract situation is just another chaper in what has been a wild and whacky pre-season that has included the Terrell Owens soap opera as well as the Jerome McDougle shooting.
Prior to Thursday, Westbrook believed it was in his best interest to remain tight-lipped and let the contract negotiations go on behind closed doors. But
"I'm not angry; I'm diappointed," Westbrook said. "From my side, it feels as though I'm not being appreciated. I think everybody notices what I bring to this team; but at the same, the Eagles management have not stepped up to the plate and said, 'since you bring this, that and the other to the table, here's your reward for that."
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:47:06 PM
obviously, that's where the dispute is.
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Priest and LT average tons of yards and tons of TDs a year. They are elite players in the league, not just good players on their team. Comparing Westbrook to them is laughable.
More from ESPN for the lazy folks:
QuoteWestbrook cuts off contract extension talks with EaglesAssociated Press
PHILADELPHIA -- Pro Bowl running back Brian Westbrook cut off contract talks with the Philadelphia Eagles on Thursday because the two sides are far apart on a long-term extension.
"Me and my agent have told the Eagles' management that we're no longer interested in talking to them as far as the contract situation," Westbrook said Thursday. "We don't feel as though we've received a proposal from them that really represents the value that I bring to this team and my market value. I think that in the last 2½, 3 years that I've been here, I've brought a lot to this team."
Westbrook, talking for the first time since reporting to training camp after a one-week holdout, had been seeking a long-term deal after signing a one-year restricted free agent offer for $1.43 million.
"It's just frustrating for me to come to work every day knowing that in the back of my mind I feel kind of disrespected by the offer that I continue to get from the Eagles," he said.
In his three-year career, Westbrook has rushed for 1,618 yards and 10 touchdowns and caught 119 passes for 1,121 yards and 10 TDs.
"I run the ball, I catch the ball, and for this team I am very valuable," Westbrook said. "I think any time a defense or any other team comes in here ... one of the players that they have to stop when they come play the Philadelphia Eagles is Brian Westbrook."
Westbrook skipped the Eagles' post-draft mini-camp and sat out the first week of training camp. He switched agents, from Anthony Agnone to Fletcher Smith, who also represents Eagles quarterback Donovan McNabb, and was looking for a five-year deal before the start of the season.
Westbrook said the numbers are far apart and two sides have never really come close to reaching an agreement.
The versatile Westbrook is coming off a breakout season in which he led the team with 1,515 total yards and was tops among NFL running backs with 73 catches for 703 yards and six touchdowns, despite sitting out the last two regular-season games. Westbrook was a key part of the Eagles' trip to the Super Bowl and caught a 10-yard touchdown pass in the 24-21 loss to the Patriots.
"I'm still going to come out here and be the best running back I can be," he said.
obviously, that's where the dispute is.
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
i tend to agree
westbrooks injury history always concerned me...but if he makes it thru this year healthy...then give him what he wants
i hate to keep going back to simon but this is why they should have kept him...theres no reason they couldnt have used simons money to sign these guys...westbrook lewis ect...after the season
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:47:06 PM
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Hoo boy. I guess we do disagree after all.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:42:30 PM
So, there's no doubt you tend to lean to siding against the front office when they decide to allow a popular, productive player seek greener pastures.
honestly, it's not even about siding either way. i just look at each situation on it's own.
would i have kept Simon on the franchise tender? yes. would i have signed him to the contract the colts gave him? no.
i would give Westbrook what he wants. unless he wants QB money, which I don't think he does.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 01:48:28 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:47:06 PM
obviously, that's where the dispute is.
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Priest and LT average tons of yards and tons of TDs a year. They are elite players in the league, not just good players on their team. Comparing Westbrook to them is laughable.
I have to agree on this.
PS...I feel very strange about agreeing with you.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:50:52 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:47:06 PM
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Hoo boy. I guess we do disagree after all.
yeah, maybe not Edge, Preist, LT...
maybe under them, but over Rudi Johnson and Tiki Barber
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 01:51:20 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 01:48:28 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:47:06 PM
obviously, that's where the dispute is.
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Priest and LT average tons of yards and tons of TDs a year. They are elite players in the league, not just good players on their team. Comparing Westbrook to them is laughable.
I have to agree on this.
PS...I feel very strange about agreeing with you.
I often sit in the shower and sob after agreeing with him.
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 08, 2005, 01:50:35 PM
.but if he makes it thru this year healthy..
Hasn't been the same thing that everyone has said for 3 years now?
I love Westy, but he hasn't had a season without injury yet.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:50:54 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:42:30 PM
So, there's no doubt you tend to lean to siding against the front office when they decide to allow a popular, productive player seek greener pastures.
honestly, it's not even about siding either way. i just look at each situation on it's own.
would i have kept Simon on the franchise tender? yes. would i have signed him to the contract the colts gave him? no.
i would give Westbrook what he wants. unless he wants QB money, which I don't think he does.
I agree with the Doctor. The Eagles can pay him a little more than they're offering without insulting the guy.
I would say right at Rudi Johnson and Tiki Barber... maybe 5-10% more than them MAX.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 01:52:24 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 01:51:20 PM
I have to agree on this.
PS...I feel very strange about agreeing with you.
I often sit in the shower and sob after agreeing with him.
Suckers.
The only baseline mentioned was LaMont Jordan's salary. I hope that was a starting point rather than a limit in Westbrook's case.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:53:28 PM
I would say right at Rudi Johnson and Tiki Barber... maybe 5-10% more than them MAX.
ok, let's spit shake on that agreement
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 01:52:24 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 08, 2005, 01:51:20 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 01:48:28 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:47:06 PM
obviously, that's where the dispute is.
and i think he is worth Edge, Preist, LT money.... to this team
Priest and LT average tons of yards and tons of TDs a year. They are elite players in the league, not just good players on their team. Comparing Westbrook to them is laughable.
I have to agree on this.
PS...I feel very strange about agreeing with you.
I often sit in the shower and sob after agreeing with him.
I warned you to stay away from that halfway house. Now you know what he really means by "the cut of your jib", eh? farging perverts.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 08, 2005, 01:55:31 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 01:53:28 PM
I would say right at Rudi Johnson and Tiki Barber... maybe 5-10% more than them MAX.
ok, let's spit shake on that agreement
*hhhaaaaauuuuuccccckkkkkk*
Deal.
Westbrook Franchise tag '06.
Quote from: MURP on September 08, 2005, 02:26:49 PM
Westbrook Franchise tag '06.
question about that...how much would it cost for a franchise tag next year do you think for a RB? Like 7-8 mil?
no way franchise tag next year.
thats alot of dough.
Quote from: MURP on September 08, 2005, 02:26:49 PM
Westbrook Franchise tag '06.
Westbrook franchise tag in March '06. Tag removed June '06.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 02:31:23 PM
Quote from: MURP on September 08, 2005, 02:26:49 PM
Westbrook Franchise tag '06.
Westbrook franchise tag in March '06. Tag removed June '06.
thats what i was thinking.
reid putting the franchise tag on you is like when michael kissed fredo on the cheek.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050908/ap_on_sp_fo_ne/fbn_eagles_westbrook;_ylt=An7OiyUe1ekNqkzd6rsWgx0LMxIF;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl
sorry if I missed it on here.
i spent over an hour arguing on the emb about it.
;D
:-D
did you read it? was your alias there?
merged
merged!
Eww, merged. I hope you all wore condoms.
just pay the man. FO looks like cheap a55holes. TO, Simon, now Westy... at some point you're supposed to reward guys, especially productive ones who aren't TO sized pain-in-the-ace media hounds. If FO can't figure this out they will continue to look bad in this regard. Yeah we got cap space and blah blah blah... So what. Just pay Westy.
Quote from: JailBird-man on September 08, 2005, 02:58:47 PM
just pay the man. FO looks like cheap a55holes. TO, Simon, now Westy... at some point you're supposed to reward guys, especially productive ones who aren't TO sized pain-in-the-ace media hounds. If FO can't figure this out they will continue to look bad in this regard. Yeah we got cap space and blah blah blah... So what. Just pay Westy.
::)
Quote from: JailBird-man on September 08, 2005, 02:58:47 PM
just pay the man. FO looks like cheap a55holes. TO, Simon, now Westy... at some point you're supposed to reward guys, especially productive ones who aren't TO sized pain-in-the-ace media hounds. If FO can't figure this out they will continue to look bad in this regard. Yeah we got cap space and blah blah blah... So what. Just pay Westy.
Who, exactly, will they "look bad" to, and why does it matter? Do you think Jevon Kearse cared that the kind of money the Eagles gave him was out of character for their FO, or do you think he just asked where to sign?
Westbrook's playing a dangerous game right now with going public, and he stands to lose more than the team does.
Racist!
the eagles offered to pay him, not the lamont jordan esque contract he wanted.
what was he offered, 9-11 mil SB and 4 a year over 5 years? damn thats nice money for 15-20 touches a game.
Posted by: FFatPatt
QuoteWestbrook's playing a dangerous game right now with going public, and he stands to lose more than the team does.
Surprised u can type w/Banner in your mouth.
::) <=== :flipoff
Quote from: Philly_Crew on August 17, 2005, 07:11:02 AM
It doesn't and they decide to go with Moats next year :evil
Although I think Westbrook should be offered around the Domanick Davis range, there is no denying how much Lamont Jordan and Rudi Johnson received. The market for this type of back may be increasing. Get Moats in your dynasty leagues.
Eagles should overpay for Brian. As long as it isn't an absolute ridiculous contract he wants, the Eagles should pay it. He's worth Lamont Jordan money for sure. He is the 2nd most important player on this team, and if he goes, so do the Eagles Superbowl hopes. We have zero chance without him.
SIGN WESTBROOK!
Quote from: Avenger on September 08, 2005, 03:16:57 PM
As long as it isn't an absolute ridiculous contract he wants,
It's probably not. The Eagles are really offering him the minimum, that's why he said they're so far apart.
I really thought we should have tried to keep S. Barber, when he went to KC.
They overpaid for him, but he was one of my favorite players.
There is no correct side to this argument. Both sides are wrong.
So, you're all wrong. We're all wrong. Westbrook's wrong. The Eagles are wrong.
Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.... WRONG.
Wrong.
Even though Westbrook said he broke off talks, I don't think it means they won't be taking any offers. To me it sounds like a ploy to get the Eagles nervous. Get Brian locked up already!
Quote from: Avenger on September 08, 2005, 03:36:14 PM
Even though Westbrook said he broke off talks, I don't think it means they won't be taking any offers. To me it sounds like a ploy to get the Eagles nervous. Get Brian locked up already!
Did they get nervous when he was holding out?
Quote from: Avenger on September 08, 2005, 03:36:14 PM
Even though Westbrook said he broke off talks, I don't think it means they won't be taking any offers. To me it sounds like a ploy to get the Eagles nervous. Get Brian locked up already!
So, what you're saying is that this "ploy" should be rewarded immediately with a top-shelf offer? Ha!
Brian farged his chances of getting his offer increased anytime soon
hard by going public today.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 03:37:53 PM
Quote from: Avenger on September 08, 2005, 03:36:14 PM
Even though Westbrook said he broke off talks, I don't think it means they won't be taking any offers. To me it sounds like a ploy to get the Eagles nervous. Get Brian locked up already!
So, what you're saying is that this "ploy" should be rewarded immediately with a top-shelf offer? Ha!
Brian farged his chances of getting his offer increased anytime soon hard by going public today.
Right, because his agent, McNabb's agent, knows how easily Reid and Banner get rattled.
Sadly, that doesn't even crack the top ten list for dumb shtein you've said.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 03:38:40 PM
Right, because his agent, McNabb's agent, knows how easily Reid and Banner get rattled.
Sadly, that doesn't even crack the top ten list for dumb shtein you've said.
And sadly, today he seems to have competition.
The Eagles never get nervous. Brian is trying to get them nervous though. If he wants to be paid then there is no other reason to "break off talks" then to try to make a team panic. It won't happen though.
I can't imagine Brian's agent telling him that going public with a break-off in negotiations was a good idea.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 03:38:40 PM
Sadly, that doesn't even crack the top ten list for dumb shtein you've said.
It is quite an impressive list.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 03:41:04 PM
I can't imagine Brian's agent telling him that going public with a break-off in negotiations was a good idea.
Who said it was Fletcher's call? This was completely Brian's decision IMO.
Quote from: Avenger on September 08, 2005, 03:42:09 PM
Who said it was Fletcher's call? This was completely Brian's decision IMO.
Right, so Brian's not very smart. He let his emotions get the best of him, and he made a decision that makes it less likely he'll get the offer he wants. I would honestly love to know what the Eagles had on the table for him to make him feel so genuinely insulted. I'm sure it was awful. Like Dominic Rhodes money.
I blame TO.
We need T-hawk and Beermonkey to fight this one out on behalf of their respective sponsors.
I actually wouldn't be surprised if Brian fires Smith and hires Rosenhaus. They have been on completely opposite pages the entire offseason. Fletcher Smith had no idea Brian was about to hold out, and Fletcher said he thought the offer was fair and Brian should accept it. It really wouldn't surprise me if Brian fired Fletcher Smith and went to Rosenhaus. Not right now, but somewhere down the road.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 03:48:54 PM
I blame TO.
That dirty bastich...
Meh, more offseason drama. :P I can't wait until Tuesday so they can talk about the games for a change. The offseason sucks ass.
I think Fletcher has been trying to be a voice of reason to BW, and he hasn't listened. He probably screwed the pooch going public.
If he wants top RB money, he can go play for Snyder.
Eskin apparently is reporting that the deal the Eagles had on the table had $8 million up front.
I can see Westbrook demanding an 8-figure bonus.
Moats is Westbrook, but better.
Quote from: MURP on September 08, 2005, 04:27:17 PM
Moats is Westbrook, but better.
Folks, we have our first convert. Let's stone him.
Moats is Jim Brown, but better.
Well, Jim Brown is a little past his prime.
Jim Brown now > Mahe.
captain obvious strikes!
Westbrook is Barry Sanders, but better.
Walter Payton now > Mahe
(http://www.staticfiends.com/suburbia/files/thumbs/t_jessica_alba_ass_2.jpg)
Jessica Alba's Ass Now > Westbrook.
Will anyone care after we win the superbowl this year? Or after we beat Atlanta?
I stopped caring August 19th @ 2:01 PM.
QuoteWESTBROOK BREAKS OFF CONTRACT TALKS
After weeks of silence, Eagles running back Brian Westbrook has sounded off on the team's failure to provide him with a long-term contract that he deems to be suitable, according to ComcastSportsNet.com.
"At this point," Westbrook said, "my agent and I have told the Eagles' management that we're no longer interested in talking to them as far as the contract situation goes because we don't feel as though we've received a proposal from them that really represents the value that I bring to this team."
"In the last 2½-3 years that I've been here, I've brought a lot to this team. I do a lot of things – I run the ball and I catch the ball. For this team, I am very valuable. You can talk to any of the [opposing] defensive coordinators or players, one of the players that they have to stop when the come play the Philadelphia Eagles is Brian Westbrook."
Surely adding to Westbrook's frustration is the fact that the team had more than $12 million in 2005 cap room as of September 1. Westbrook, a fourth-year veteran, is playing under a one-year, $1.43 million restricted free agent tender.
Westbrook unexpectedly signed his tender offer in June, but then was a no show for the start of training camp. He reported on August 8; if he had shown up a day later, he would not have earned a year of credit toward free agency, delaying his entry onto the open market until 2007.
Under the current system, the reality for running backs is that it makes more sense for teams to pay the one-year franchise tender than to invest a huge signing bonus in a guy who is one hit away from joining Mo-Clo on the sandwich line at Subway. :-D And the older a guy gets, the less likely it is that he'll command the big money.
The going rate for a high-end running back currently is in the neighborhood of $25 million over five years. Our guess is that Westbrook wants more than the market will bear -- which undoubtedly will prompt the team to use the franchise tag in 2006 while at the same time developing a young guy who can take Westbrook's place in 2007 and beyond.
Huge contracts being given to running backs is the exception now rather than the rule.
If the Eagles offered the money they're reported to have offered and Westbrook didn't sign, he's a farging idiot.
Whatever, though. Jessica Alba rulez.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on September 08, 2005, 05:03:51 PM
Jessica Alba rulez.
Adrienne sez, "What am I, chopped liver?"
(http://org-www.philadelphiaeagles.com/uploads/photos/perm/main/PKBOCPDBJIJF/adrienneGNT04_01.jpg)
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 05:07:15 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on September 08, 2005, 05:03:51 PM
Jessica Alba rulez.
Adrienne sez, "What am I, chopped liver?"
(http://org-www.philadelphiaeagles.com/uploads/photos/perm/main/PKBOCPDBJIJF/adrienneGNT04_01.jpg)
I'd smear her taint with liverwurst and lick her a lot. Does that count?
Updated portion of the article on PE.com (Banner responds):
QuoteEagles President Joe Banner responded by saying the team remains confident a long-term deal will be worked out with Westbrook.
"He still wants to be here, we still want him to be here," said Banner, who also said that the two sides stopped talks last week. "So at some point we'll resume those conversations.
"It's not unusual. It's not a big deal. We remain optimistic in the end everything will work out."
Though Westbrook said his camp is "no longer interested in talking to them (Eagles' front office) as far as the contract situation goes," Westbrook said that doesn't mean this is his last season in Philadelphia.
"I'm not saying that," said Westbrook, in his first remarks to the media since June. "At this point, until the Eagles feel as though they can give me a proposal that really shows that they want me to stay here, our contract talks are no longer."
Basically, Westbrook's saying that the talks are over...
...until the Eagles up their offer.
My prediction:
He'll sign the first day of free agency next year.
The taterskins will give him a 4 year 73 million dollar deal with a 15 million dollar signing bonus and a new jet.
From the FWIW department-- from Spadaro:
Quotethe deal will get done. Don't know when, but it will get done. Trust me. Relax.
Also, a funny pic:
(http://www.startrekfans.net/video/westy.jpg)
Adrienne is kicking a little bit of a muffin top... just sayin'.
so now Spadaro has the inside scoop?
Quote from: MURP on September 08, 2005, 05:28:19 PM
so now Spadaro has the inside scoop?
That's right! You and I both get a sneak peek from Dave Spadaro "On The Inside"!
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on September 08, 2005, 05:09:27 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 08, 2005, 05:07:15 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on September 08, 2005, 05:03:51 PM
Jessica Alba rulez.
Adrienne sez, "What am I, chopped liver?"
(http://org-www.philadelphiaeagles.com/uploads/photos/perm/main/PKBOCPDBJIJF/adrienneGNT04_01.jpg)
I'd smear her taint with liverwurst and lick her a lot. Does that count?
Yes it does. Adrienne makes me feel all uneasy in my pants.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 05:27:38 PM
Adrienne is kicking a little bit of a muffin top... just sayin'.
You'd soil yourself if she so much as looked in your direction.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 06:17:02 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 05:27:38 PM
Adrienne is kicking a little bit of a muffin top... just sayin'.
You'd soil yourself if she so much as looked in your direction.
It'll always comes back around to the scat with you doesn't it GF? You dissapoint on so many levels. :'(
I think some people are overreacting to this. It's not the end of the world. The guy is disappointed...Banner said that he agreed with everything Westbrook said in his press conference. They showed a clip of Joey Bankroll saying that he agreed with everything he said and that they will still work at getting a deal done.
I trust the FO and have been in their corner on 99% of the stuff.
However...
They need to pay Westbrook. Leaguewide he is no Edge or Alexander. But in the Philadelphia Eagles offense he is a greater asset than either of those guys would be here. He is a greater asset than LaMont Jordan would be here. The Raiders grossly overpaid for Jordan, but that is the way the NFL works. Some dumbass team ups the market and other teams have to get in line with it because that set the market.
The Eagles NEED to get Westbrook signed. In this instance they should deviate a little bit from their hardline stance. If they lose Westbrook, they will not only lose a lot of talent and skill, but they will lose the respect of several big members of the team. McNabb called Westbrook the ultimate weapon.
Get him signed. If you're offering him an $8M bonus up it to $9M. Get it done.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 06:17:02 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 05:27:38 PM
Adrienne is kicking a little bit of a muffin top... just sayin'.
You'd soil yourself if she so much as looked in your direction.
I recognize the hot, don't get me wrong. But she isn't even my favorite Eagles cheerbabe, let alone self-soil worthy.
Just as long as you admit you'd use her thighs as handwarmers.
:boom
Kindly keep your tiny midget stumps away from Adrienne.
Thank you.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 07:15:30 PM
Just as long as you admit you'd use her thighs as handwarmers.
Obviously. I'm not one to kick a set of hot slut buns out of my bed, I'm just sayin, her muffin top, black roots and slightly smooshed up bulldog face don't give me insta-wood the way others can.
Am I going to be banned now?
Nah. We'll just tell you we're going for a car ride and dump you in the woods.
Can I drive?
Whatever. Like I've never fallen for that trick before.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 08, 2005, 07:28:44 PM
Can I drive?
You guys only wish you could stop loving me so much.
I'm infatuated with you. Look for a boiling rabbit on your stove tonight.
Delicious.
Only if you put hot sauce on the little fella.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 08, 2005, 06:55:29 PM
I think some people are overreacting to this. It's not the end of the world. The guy is disappointed...Banner said that he agreed with everything Westbrook said in his press conference. They showed a clip of Joey Bankroll saying that he agreed with everything he said and that they will still work at getting a deal done.
I trust the FO and have been in their corner on 99% of the stuff.
However...
They need to pay Westbrook. Leaguewide he is no Edge or Alexander. But in the Philadelphia Eagles offense he is a greater asset than either of those guys would be here. He is a greater asset than LaMont Jordan would be here. The Raiders grossly overpaid for Jordan, but that is the way the NFL works. Some dumbass team ups the market and other teams have to get in line with it because that set the market.
The Eagles NEED to get Westbrook signed. In this instance they should deviate a little bit from their hardline stance. If they lose Westbrook, they will not only lose a lot of talent and skill, but they will lose the respect of several big members of the team. McNabb called Westbrook the ultimate weapon.
Get him signed. If you're offering him an $8M bonus up it to $9M. Get it done.
I agree.
Another name may also be a factor in this: The 2nd highest paid RB, Portis. He received $17m in upfront cash.
My buddies and I have a tradition called Eat All Day Day, that we partake in from time to time where we just cook and eat and booze for about 20 straight hours until we can't stand up. One of the highlights last year was rabbit chili which we made in a Brooklyn apartment. Deliciously gamey. The hipsters were horrified.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 07:38:26 PM
My buddies and I have a tradition called Eat All Day Day, that we partake in from time to time where we just cook and eat and booze for about 20 straight hours until we can't stand up. One of the highlights last year was rabbit chili which we made in a Brooklyn apartment. Deliciously gamey. The hipsters were horrified.
Don't lie. You don't have any friends.
Quote from: MDS on September 08, 2005, 07:39:21 PM
Don't lie. You don't have any friends.
On the 78th iteration it finally got old. Such a shame.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 07:38:26 PM
My buddies and I have a tradition called Eat All Day Day, that we partake in from time to time where we just cook and eat and booze for about 20 straight hours until we can't stand up. One of the highlights last year was rabbit chili which we made in a Brooklyn apartment. Deliciously gamey. The hipsters were horrified.
Sure that was rabbit? Or was it one of NYC's famous rats that are the size of cats?
Quote from: Larry on September 08, 2005, 07:37:31 PM
I agree.
Another name may also be a factor in this: The 2nd highest paid RB, Portis. He received $17m in upfront cash.
And who paid him that cash? farging idiot taterskins jackass Danny Snyder.
There's always going to be contracts that are paid out that are absurd, and sadly, players will always look at them and assume that they're better than or equal to the players who signed them.
Westbrook isn't worth $17M up front. Barry Sanders wouldn't be worth that kind of cash; not at a position where guys fall apart like a cheap suit after 4 years on a routine basis.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 08, 2005, 07:42:27 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 07:38:26 PM
My buddies and I have a tradition called Eat All Day Day, that we partake in from time to time where we just cook and eat and booze for about 20 straight hours until we can't stand up. One of the highlights last year was rabbit chili which we made in a Brooklyn apartment. Deliciously gamey. The hipsters were horrified.
Sure that was rabbit? Or was it one of NYC Boston's famous rats that are the size of cats?
Fixed.
:puke
Quote from: Larry on September 08, 2005, 07:37:31 PM
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 08, 2005, 06:55:29 PM
I think some people are overreacting to this. It's not the end of the world. The guy is disappointed...Banner said that he agreed with everything Westbrook said in his press conference. They showed a clip of Joey Bankroll saying that he agreed with everything he said and that they will still work at getting a deal done.
I trust the FO and have been in their corner on 99% of the stuff.
However...
They need to pay Westbrook. Leaguewide he is no Edge or Alexander. But in the Philadelphia Eagles offense he is a greater asset than either of those guys would be here. He is a greater asset than LaMont Jordan would be here. The Raiders grossly overpaid for Jordan, but that is the way the NFL works. Some dumbass team ups the market and other teams have to get in line with it because that set the market.
The Eagles NEED to get Westbrook signed. In this instance they should deviate a little bit from their hardline stance. If they lose Westbrook, they will not only lose a lot of talent and skill, but they will lose the respect of several big members of the team. McNabb called Westbrook the ultimate weapon.
Get him signed. If you're offering him an $8M bonus up it to $9M. Get it done.
I agree.
Another name may also be a factor in this: The 2nd highest paid RB, Portis. He received $17m in upfront cash.
I don't think Portis is involved. I think the Westbrook sees that Jordan deal as the carrot on the string and he's chasing that.
I don't agree with him going public just like I didn't agree with TO's stance. But they need to pay Westbrook. Come off the pile of cash and give the 2nd most important guy in this offense a deal to keep him here.
I doubt they'd franchise him next year because that pricetag is going to be at least $9M. No way the Birds take a $9M cap hit for him.
Get the deal done.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 08, 2005, 07:39:46 PM
Quote from: MDS on September 08, 2005, 07:39:21 PM
Don't lie. You don't have any friends.
On the 78th iteration it finally got old. Such a shame.
We've basically been gonig through the motions since #50.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 08, 2005, 07:46:13 PM
I don't think Portis is involved. I think the Westbrook sees that Jordan deal as the carrot on the string and he's chasing that.
I don't agree with him going public just like I didn't agree with TO's stance. But they need to pay Westbrook. Come off the pile of cash and give the 2nd most important guy in this offense a deal to keep him here.
I doubt they'd franchise him next year because that pricetag is going to be at least $9M. No way the Birds take a $9M cap hit for him.
Get the deal done.
Portis's money does factor into it. That signing bonus is more than double Jordan's, and I don't think Westy feels he's only half the player Portis is. In fact, skill-wise, Portis and Westbrook are close, and in some aspects of the position (receiving, blitz pickup, breaking tackles) Westbrook is superior.
And they'd franchise him: we can't afford to potentially lose both Owens and Westbrook, and we have the cap flexibility to pull that off without too much maneuvering.
rjs we can be bestest friends if you want...but itll cost you.
Quote from: Larry on September 08, 2005, 07:53:50 PM
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 08, 2005, 07:46:13 PM
I don't think Portis is involved. I think the Westbrook sees that Jordan deal as the carrot on the string and he's chasing that.
I don't agree with him going public just like I didn't agree with TO's stance. But they need to pay Westbrook. Come off the pile of cash and give the 2nd most important guy in this offense a deal to keep him here.
I doubt they'd franchise him next year because that pricetag is going to be at least $9M. No way the Birds take a $9M cap hit for him.
Get the deal done.
Portis's money does factor into it. That signing bonus is more than double Jordan's, and I don't think Westy feels he's only half the player Portis is. In fact, skill-wise, Portis and Westbrook are close, and in some aspects of the position (receiving, blitz pickup, breaking tackles) Westbrook is superior.
And they'd franchise him: we can't afford to potentially lose both Owens and Westbrook, and we have the cap flexibility to pull that off without too much maneuvering.
We'll see when the final numbers are in. I believe a deal will get done between the two sides but it better get done soon before the anger sets in on both sides. I think Westbrook is just frustrated and Banner and the agent are saying the right things, but they need to get it done.
If Portis' deal was a watermark in these negotiations then I think we'd have heard about it. Westbrook said today that the sides were 3-5 million apart. And if he wants Portis money that means the Eagles would be offering upwards of $12M in upfront cash.
Regardless. I still say they need to get a deal done. I've said it before, but they cannot afford to lose Westbrook.
Quote from: MDS on September 08, 2005, 07:53:55 PM
rjs we can be bestest friends if you want...but itll cost you.
No thanks. I prefer to keep my behyman in tact.
Banner's Comments:
QuoteI think you heard Brian's comments today. We actually agreed last Thursday that at this point, we felt we could not get anything done and there was no point to have any further conversations. He still wants to be here and we still want him to be here, so at some point we will resume those conversations. We have not had any discussions on what that would be.
"So, he becomes one of hundreds and hundreds of players in the last year of their contracts. It's not unusual. It's not a big deal. We remain optimistic that in the end, things will work out.
On being worried that Brian's anger will translate onto the field: "That's your characterization. Every player in the league, in the last year of their deal would like to have a new contract. There is some degree of disappointment if you don't reach that. I think you all have seen how many players play spectacularly under those circumstances and have gone on to sign deals with their own team or sign somewhere else. To think that this is something dramatically different than that; we don't think that way at all.
"The conversations were very constructive, but that does not mean we agreed. The tone was positive. We are disappointed in the end, it did not get done. He is disappointed. But, we will revisit it. We still want him to be here and he still wants to be here and in the end we think it will have a positive outcome."
On what makes him think that they can get a deal done now, after not being able to get one done during camp: "I think we will leave the particulars of that to the negotiations. But it's not unusual at all that you can't get a deal done at one time with any given player and you can get a deal done at a later date with that player."
On having the reputation of taking a hard line in contract negotiations and whether he worries about the effect of that on the players' perception of the organization: "I think that if there was a reality to that, I would have more worry. I can't say it's irrelevant, but the reality is that we have had more players in the second and third years of their contracts than any team in the league. We have resigned more players early than any team in the league.
"We have provided lifelong financial security to our players more than any team in the league. The reality and the perception, which has been true in some instances, but not the general truth, are different. We are comfortable of where we are and how we treat people and will continue to do that."
On whether he feels Brian is like the hundreds of guys that are in the last year of their contracts: "No, I think that he is better off than those hundreds of guys. Probably 95 percent of those guys didn't get an offer from their respective teams. So, I don't think that getting an offer, I think that most people know that it was not acceptable to him, but it was a significant offer, I think the level of disrespect, if there is any, obviously we would disagree with that characterization, is minor compared to, just look at the running back position alone and see who is going to be available next year and find out how many of those guys have gotten active, significant contract extension offers.
"You will see that number is very small. If I was measuring disrespect, I would think that was disrespectful, that a significant offer that wasn't as much as I thought I was worth."
On whether he thinks Brian is making a mistake by taking this personally: "I have no problem with the process or anything Brian said today. I have no problem with him. He's had a long time where you all have asked him a lot of questions; he's very respectful to what's going on. He's very positive. Him and (agent) Fletcher (Smith), throughout the process of the negotiations, have acted completely constructively and professionally. He would like to have a contact and we wish we could get a deal done. At this point we have not been able to agree and I think he has handled the situation very well and I am hopeful that with time, we will come to the outcome that all of us want."
On whether he has to have a spectacular, injury-free year for you to be convinced that his demands are correct: "We are going to have to see what happens throughout the year. We are already convinced that Brian is a very good football player and a very valuable member of our team. Hopefully at some point, we can translate that into a contract that we both feel comfortable with."
Yo Banner, how many commas can you fit in on sentence?
cut westbrook!
And bring back Dorsey!
Burn him.
(http://www.ifp.uiuc.edu/~asethi/photos/album1/ph3.jpg)
Better sign soon Westy, or Moats will make Banner think twice....
Dave's writing up that article on Westbrook's knees right now ...
Quote from: General_Failure on September 08, 2005, 08:52:41 PM
Dave's writing up that article on Westbrook's knees right now ...
he's had it ready since they day he was drafted.
it's pretty much a form letter now, all they do is plug a name in.
The front office is farging this one up. Westbrook has proven his worth to the team and deserves to be paid accordingly.
It's hard to judge without hearing what the offers have been and what Westbrook wants (perhaps those amounts were posted earlier, but laziness prevents the inclination to read the ten pages I missed). Regardless, the Eagles should sign him even if it means overpaying him. It's not like it will break the bank and it will alleviate the need to "risk" it with Moats.
I guess none of this really matters until the season is over though.
Eskin reported that the Eagles offer was 8M SB, 1M in first year salary, and an average of 4.2M over the first three years--Westbrook is reportedly looking for at least 5M a year.
Quote from: bobbyinlondon on September 09, 2005, 06:13:19 AM
Eskin reported that the Eagles offer was 8M SB, 1M in first year salary, and an average of 4.2M over the first three years--Westbrook is reportedly looking for at least 5M a year.
If it's something like that, work together to come to some sort of compromise. Knowing that the FO probably won't fully cave in to anyone, they need to go as far as possible to make an agreement with Westbrook in this scenario. 800K isn't that big of a gap to have to bridge, and being obstinate in this case would be extremely detrimental to the team.
[SAS}How-EVAH![/SAS] If the difference is something along the lines of Westbrook wanting a SB in the line of Portis ($17 M?), don't plan on the FO going even remotely close to that one. Westbrook is a main cog of the offense, but they will let him walk far before allowing him to totally blow their cap strategy.
I wouldn't expect the team to offer more than about 10,
maybe 12 million in bonuses. And I would agree with them on not offering any more.
Yup...
Listening to WIP and they say (comparing to Jordan's deal):
Jordan: 5 yrs, $25 mil. $7 mil SB ($18 mil over the 1st 3 yrs)
Westbrook (Reportedly): 5 yrs, $24 mil. $8 mil SB ($13 mil over the 1st 3 yrs)
I'm with Phreak and T-Hawk on this one. The Eagles just flat out need to get this one done. Don't necessarily care if they were to overpay a little bit. I've seen this (current) offense go w/o McNabb, I've seen them go w/o Owens. I've seen this offense grind to an almost stop w/o Westbrook. We CANNOT let him leave.
I like Moats and all that, but that doesn't make Westbrook expendable. He should be used to compliment Westbrook... not replace him. Westy's a special player in our system and you just dont replace that with someone who simply looks like him. To tell you the truth, the fact that the Eagles are considering doing so makes me a little uneasy.
later westbitch.
I still hate the whole public contract negotiations. I can't stand to hear athletes bitching (right or wrong) about their pay. Even if I'm unhappy in my real life job I don't tell everyone about it. And I have no sympathy for a rich person whining about their money.
However, I still think the Eagles would be royally, royally farging up if they let him go. I bought into most of their other decisions, but I said this last year too - they need to sign Brian Westbrook long term. Get the fargin thing done. Period.
From today's Inky:
Quote"When you're talking 3, 4, 5 million dollars, that is a big difference," he said. "I was a third-round pick, so I didn't get $12 million to sign. I got chump change to sign. I've been here for three years, I've contributed to a Super Bowl team, and I think, at this point, I have to find a way to make some money."
The curse of being a middle-round pick is that a player does not get a huge signing bonus. After three seasons in the NFL, Westbrook had made about $1.3 million. With the $1.43 million he is scheduled to make this year, he will have made $2.73 million after four seasons. Cornerback Lito Sheppard, the Eagles' first pick the same year Westbrook was drafted, made $3,725,000 as a rookie.
While the Eagles want to sign Westbrook to an extension, they have a figure that they think he is worth and they are not likely to deviate too far from it, which is why this saga still has a chance to end in a football divorce after this season.
A team source said last month that the Eagles had offered Westbrook a signing bonus of about $9 million, with the first three years of the proposed deal being worth $13 million. The same source said yesterday that the Eagles had improved that offer.
If Westbrook is saying the sides are at least $3 million apart, it means that he wants a three-year deal worth at least $16 million. That's what LaMont Jordan, a running back who had been with the New York Jets, got from the Oakland Raiders as a free agent during the off-season, and Westbrook can easily argue that he has a better resume.
The Eagles compare Westbrook to Houston's Domanick Davis, a 5-foot-9, 221-pound tailback who recently signed a four-year deal that is believed to be worth $12 million over the first three seasons
They're offering him a fair deal. $9M to sign is more than I thought he'd be offered. But if he wants $10M...give him $10M. Get it done.
And for Gods sake pro athletes...shut up about your "plight". It is getting old.
I don't agree with him going public just like I didn't agree with TO's stance. But they need to pay Westbrook
he went public when he didnt show up for camp...what he said the other day was insignificant
the problem with the eagles front office is their god complex...they think they can create their own rules and slot players...and they can to a certain extent...but at some point you have to factor in the other teams rules and pay your player based somewhat on his position around the league...
the birds have for the most part been successful with their plan b's...but eventually youre going to have trotter situations crop up again..where the player(s) you replace the lost player with arent as good...whats going to happen here is westbrook will be required to sign the eagles slot rb price...and when he refuses...they are going to be eff you...moats is our plan b...and moats isnt going to be nearly as good
when ill really lose it though is if they dont get westbrook done early in the year...what is the friggin point of releasing simon then using his money to sign westbrook after the season...because simon was on a one year tender his money comes off the books immediately after the year...so you could have had him this season then still signed westbrook...but if they lose simon for this year and then lose westbrook next year they should be hung
I actually agree that Westbrook deserves a little extra for ridiculously outperforming his rookie contract.
$10 million bonus? Yes, he's earned that.
$15-16 million total over the first 3 years of the contract? Yes, he's earned that.
If that's what it will take to get it done, I believe the Eagles should and will do that. Basically, it's Lamont Jordan money with a bigger signing bonus (because Westbrook has proven himself and produced for this team already at a very high level, whereas Jordan was more of an unknown) and slightly less money in the first 3 years... because giving that much up-front is much more valuable to the player anyway.
IGY,
It's not just the Eagles, bro. It is the NFL way of doing business. Every team does stuff like this. The Eagles are certainly more shrewd than others, but the fact is that every one of the 32 teams pulls this stuff.
I admire the way they do business though. I like being a fan of a team who doesn't blow their wads on crummy players and then sit in cap hell for years (TEN) or teams who stupidly blow their wads on zesty player (WAS).
But they need to get Westbrook done. I think they will. I think there is a negotiating ploy taking place by Westbrook/Smith walking away from the table. I think they'll get it done by the deadline to use cap money this year (OCT).
But they better get it done. The man is too important to the success of this team to brush him off.
i dont think that its only about the sb and the yearly avg's
with what happened with the TO deal last year...i have a feeling the eagles are putting all kinds of little clauses in the deal...probably to protect themselves from an injury...but i bet they are clauses that no one else in the league ever asks a player to sign
granted TO signed the deal on his own...but i can guarantee you the image portrayed around the league is that banner hoodwinked him...and to watch out for fine print in eagle contracts
the fact is because of the way the eagles work there is absolutely no trust btwn their FO and players/agents around the league
Interesting how everyone here mocks the taterskins for overpaying like iceholes yet whenever one of ours wants to get overpaid, you immediately bitch about the front office not giving in and being cheap.
Newsflash: They know more than you so shut your faceholes. If they think Westbrook is worth "X" then that's what he's worth and no amount of caterwauling on your part is going to change that.
I think that the Eagles know exactly what Westbrook is worth and he will get that.
I also think they haven't yet put that offer on the table.
Washington overpays for bums (Sanders, George, Bruce Smith, Santana Moss, etc.)
Philadelphia never overpays. It's time to take a chance on a guy who is worth it. If this was a guy who isn't worth it I wouldn't be hollering about it.
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 09, 2005, 09:06:04 AM
i have a feeling the eagles are putting all kinds of little clauses in the deal...probably to protect themselves from an injury...but i bet they are clauses that no one else in the league ever asks a player to sign
where does that info come from?
It's not just the Eagles, bro. It is the NFL way of doing business. Every team does stuff like this. The Eagles are certainly more shrewd than others, but the fact is that every one of the 32 teams pulls this stuff
i dont think anyone slots players like the eagles do...until that banner interview...i believe it was before the steeler game...id never heard of that from anyone before in the nfl...and when he said it it sounded real good...on the face of it it makes sense...but at some point you have to come off that...and i dont believe the eagles do/will
Quote from: MURP on September 09, 2005, 09:10:19 AM
where does that info come from?
Dude, he has a feeling. Don't question the innate ability. Knowledge is king, and he's in the throne.
HOLLA
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 09, 2005, 09:11:52 AM
It's not just the Eagles, bro. It is the NFL way of doing business. Every team does stuff like this. The Eagles are certainly more shrewd than others, but the fact is that every one of the 32 teams pulls this stuff
i dont think anyone slots players like the eagles do...until that banner interview...i believe it was before the steeler game...id never heard of that from anyone before in the nfl...and when he said it it sounded real good...on the face of it it makes sense...but at some point you have to come off that...and i dont believe the eagles do/will
I recall hearing an interview awhile back from another GM that said that his team also had salary slots for players. I do not recall who it was because it was in a magazine about two years ago. But it stuck out to me because it was similar to what the Eagles did. I think it might've been Rich McKay when he was the Bucs GM, but not sure.
Dude, he has a feeling. Don't question the innate ability. Knowledge is king, and he's in the throne.
HOLLA
listen to this man
Newsflash:
i thought it was a mass fax??
They know more than you so shut your faceholes. If they think Westbrook is worth "X" then that's what he's worth and no amount of caterwauling on your part is going to change that.
thats fine and dandy....but moats better be as good as westbrook
Brian's claiming that defensive coordinators label him as the guy they have to game plan against on a week-by-week basis. It's a good thing TO isn't good enough. It scares me if LJ has a huge year. He'll be the next delusional player thinking the offense revolves around him and he'll want Jeebus money. Fun.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 09, 2005, 09:08:16 AM
I think that the Eagles know exactly what Westbrook is worth and he will get that.
I also think they haven't yet put that offer on the table.
(http://images.usatoday.com/money/_photos/2004/12/27/inside1-guinness.jpg)
Ryan Moats, 2005 > Priest Holmes, 2003
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 09, 2005, 09:14:10 AM
Dude, he has a feeling. Don't question the innate ability. Knowledge is king, and he's in the throne.
HOLLA
listen to this man
Newsflash:
i thought it was a mass fax??
They know more than you so shut your faceholes. If they think Westbrook is worth "X" then that's what he's worth and no amount of caterwauling on your part is going to change that.
thats fine and dandy....but moats better be as good as westbrook
Did you eat paint chips when you were a kid?
Seriously.
:-D
Lamar Gordon, 2005 > Duce Staley, 2002
me, 2005 > you, life
give westbrook 25 carries per game & let him prove his running ability/durability before you throw the bank at him. the guy hasn't even come close to 1000 yards rushing in a season. he should be flattered if the eagles are comparing him to dom davis.
Quote from: mhunt on September 09, 2005, 09:30:15 AM
give westbrook 25 carries per game & let him prove his running ability/durability before you throw the bank at him. the guy hasn't even come close to 1000 yards rushing in a season. he should be flattered if the eagles are comparing him to dom davis.
I disagree to a point. Yes, I agree that he needs to play a full season minus injury before they throw the bank at him. That's my biggest fear. They lock up 15 mil in guaranteed money and he continues to get hurt every year. A deal for him would be high risk/high reward, so its a tough situatino. BUT, he should be compared to Dom. Davis...I just don't think he should be compared to guys like Tomlinson.
Throw him the money either way. He's not a 25-carries-a-game guy but he makes up for that with his receiving skills and matchup problems that he creates. If all's he did was run it 18 times a game and had stone-hands...I'd agree with you.
But he catches 70 balls a year. That is worth the extra 7 touches per game that he gets in the passing game versus the run game.
why do people keep talking about 25 carries a game? the Eagles don't run the ball enough for him to get that.
he gets approx 18-23 "touches" a game and usually has over 100 yards on those touches...
QuoteBrian's claiming that defensive coordinators label him as the guy they have to game plan against on a week-by-week basis.
it's true, almost every D-coordinator or head coach says it.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 09, 2005, 09:40:45 AM
why do people keep talking about 25 carries a game? the Eagles don't run the ball enough for him to get that.
he gets approx 18-23 "touches" a game and usually has over 100 yards on those touches...
QuoteBrian's claiming that defensive coordinators label him as the guy they have to game plan against on a week-by-week basis.
it's true, almost every D-coordinator or head coach says it.
Thats why I said his role as a pass catcher have to be factored in and they should pay him.
He isn't going to run it 25 times. But he'll run it 18 and catch 7 balls. And that, to me, is the same as having a guy run it 25 times.
Depending on the defense's personnel, they game plan for #36 or #81 first, the other 2nd and #5 3rd.
If McNabb ran more, he'd be #1 almost all the time. But he doesn't.
its called avg yards per touch....look it up...then look up westbrooks nfl rank in that category....cha ching
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 09, 2005, 09:43:15 AM
Thats why I said his role as a pass catcher have to be factored in and they should pay him.
He isn't going to run it 25 times. But he'll run it 18 and catch 7 balls. And that, to me, is the same as having a guy run it 25 times.
i totally agree. that's why I say he is as valuable to the Eagles as LT, Priest, Edge, Shaun Alexander are to their respective teams.
and they have all this cap money, overpaying for 1, young, core player will not set them in cap hell. I am not asking them to be the taterskins, I am asking them to sign one player that is a gamebreaker.
They don't need to overpay Westbrook. Because what he's worth (and what they honestly believe he's worth to them) will end up being exactly the contract he signs in a month or so... I hope.
westy ran it 13.6 times per game & caught 5.6 passes per game....almost 20 touches/game but still not what a "franchise" rb gets.
btw, dom davis had 125 more carries than westbrook and 5 fewer catches.
Has Davis had injury issues like Westbrook throughout his career?
(Not being wise here. I honestly don't know.)
Westbrook was 8th in the league in yards per game last year.
ahead of such RB as Portis, Rudi Johnson, Deuce McCallister, Ahman Green, and Jamal Lewis.
Ahman and Jamal were both battling injury for the better part of last year. Deuce was not healthy for over a month too.
And I've said all along I don't think Rudi is as good as advertised.
Quote from: mhunt on September 09, 2005, 09:51:10 AM
westy ran it 13.6 times per game & caught 5.6 passes per game....almost 20 touches/game but still not what a "franchise" rb gets.
btw, dom davis had 125 more carries than westbrook and 5 fewer catches.
But Westbrook went to the Pro Bowl! He's the bestest ever in the Eagles system! He deserves a million kabillion bagillion dollars! Franchise! Franchise! Verbal ejaculation!
Westbrook is worth Dom Davis money. I think that would be extremely fair compensation for him. If I was the Eagles, I probably would overpay just a bit more, like maybe an extra million and a half on the signing bonus, giving him more guarenteed money, but besides that offer Westbrook must be smokin' crack to think he'll get anymore more than that.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on September 09, 2005, 09:43:15 AM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 09, 2005, 09:40:45 AM
why do people keep talking about 25 carries a game? the Eagles don't run the ball enough for him to get that.
he gets approx 18-23 "touches" a game and usually has over 100 yards on those touches...
QuoteBrian's claiming that defensive coordinators label him as the guy they have to game plan against on a week-by-week basis.
it's true, almost every D-coordinator or head coach says it.
Thats why I said his role as a pass catcher have to be factored in and they should pay him.
He isn't going to run it 25 times. But he'll run it 18 and catch 7 balls. And that, to me, is the same as having a guy run it 25 times.
His role as a receiver makes him one of the most dangerous weapons in the league, and one of the most valuable as well (I believe he's fully capable of making it to the 1000/1000 club, which would put him in MVP territory).
The NFL is changing. It's not about getting a big back, rushing him 25-30 times a game, and controlling the clock...today's NFL is about mismatches, getting big plays, having gamebreakers which opens up things for other players. Westbrook fits in nicely with the latter, which is why he will get paid one way or the other..
Westbrook could do this and Westbrook could do that.
The dude has never run for over 900 yards in a season.
He had a whopping 3 rushing touchdowns last year.
He's been hurt EVERY SINGLE YEAR that he's been in the league.
But seriously, lets pay him as an elite player.
He's awesome. I love him in our offense. I would gladly hug him and whisper sweet nothings in his ear. But come on, guys. Let's be reasonable.
Yep. Dom. Davis money should be the benchmark. I know it's a broken record thing...but I'm really having a hard time understanding how either side could disagree with that.
Davis is not a gamebreaker; Westbrook is. You don't get playmakers on the cheap.
if defenses gave one tenth the attention to davis that they do to westbrook hed never catch a ball again
westbrook gets game planned for and still blows up the spot
plus all westbrook does when he gets the ball is score...and last time i checked pts=wins
davis scored 14 td's last season...westbrook scored 9.
but based on what i'm reading here, i'm sure that won't change any of your minds. :-D
Just look at the Green Bay game, that's what B-West can do that no other running back can do
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 09, 2005, 09:32:38 AM
Quote from: mhunt on September 09, 2005, 09:30:15 AM
give westbrook 25 carries per game & let him prove his running ability/durability before you throw the bank at him. the guy hasn't even come close to 1000 yards rushing in a season. he should be flattered if the eagles are comparing him to dom davis.
I disagree to a point. Yes, I agree that he needs to play a full season minus injury before they throw the bank at him. That's my biggest fear. They lock up 15 mil in guaranteed money and he continues to get hurt every year. A deal for him would be high risk/high reward, so its a tough situatino. BUT, he should be compared to Dom. Davis...I just don't think he should be compared to guys like Tomlinson.
Is that Spanish?
Davis 370 touches, 6 plays over 20 yds
Westbrook 250 touches, 14 plays over 20 yds
Ones a pickup truck, the other's a Ferrari. You're not gonna get them at the same price.
i was right. :-D
Our we supposed to be impressed that Davis can score on a bunch of goalline plunges? :-D
i'm just trying to chip away at the blind homerism...i guess it's not working. :P davis has more touches, 250+ more total yards, and 5 more td's but people here still think westbrook is better. :paranoid
i'm not going to waste any more of my time on this topic. :-D
Quote from: mhunt on September 09, 2005, 11:18:14 AM
i'm just trying to chip away at the blind homerism...i guess it's not working. :P davis has more touches, 250+ more total yards, and 5 more td's but people here still think westbrook is better. :paranoid
i'm not going to waste any more of my time on this topic. :-D
if you had this current roster and you had a coach with a philosophy like Andy Reid, who do you take on the open FA market? Westbrook or Dom Davis?
dom davis.
and damn you for making me reply 1 more time to this thread. ;) :-D
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 09, 2005, 10:50:23 AM
Just look at the Green Bay game, that's what B-West can do that no other running back can do
Terrel Owens clearing out the secondary by drawing double and triple teams didn't help?
As I said, one's a pickup truck the other's a Ferrari.
Westbrook belongs in a class of players like Owens, Moss, & Gates: players that cannot be covered by one person alone....this opens up things for other teammates. This is the point that many are missing.
Davis is your typical workhorse back. You shut down his running, he's done. You shut down Westbrook's running -- as in the superbowl -- he still is a valuable weapon; he was uncoverable in that game.
Quote from: TexasEagle on September 09, 2005, 11:24:21 AM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on September 09, 2005, 10:50:23 AM
Just look at the Green Bay game, that's what B-West can do that no other running back can do
Terrel Owens clearing out the secondary by drawing double and triple teams didn't help?
splitting out Westbrook to a WR position where nobody could cover him, except a cb, is more what i was thinking...
of course TO helps Westbrook, Westbrook helps TO, they both help DMac
Quote from: Larry on September 09, 2005, 11:27:51 AM
As I said, one's a pickup truck the other's a Ferrari.
Westbrook belongs in a class of players like Owens, Moss, & Gates: players that cannot be covered by one person alone....this opens up things for other teammates. This is the point that many are missing.
Davis is your typical workhorse back. You shut down his running, he's done. You shut down Westbrook's running -- as in the superbowl -- he still is a valuable weapon; he was uncoverable in that game.
Remember that one-handed grab he had? Even the best of WRs would have had difficulty in catching it.
last week i saw dom davis saving a new born that was stuck in the middle of the runway while a 747 was taking off, while westbrook was at home playing "catch the cinder block" with a 1 year old.
oh, and was also biting the heads of of puppies.
Let's make this easier. You're the GM. Post the contract you would give Westbrook.
My effort...
Signing Bonus: $10 million ($5.5 million as a roster bonus, $4.5 million as a signing bonus)
March 2007 Roster Bonus: $3 million
Salaries:
2005 - minimum (about $650k)
2006 - $1.5 million
2007 - $1 million
2008 - $4.2 million
2009 - $4.75 million
That's 5 years, $25.1 million, with $13 million in bonuses and $16.15 million over the first three years.
Lets just cut him and get it over with.
So that's in essence a three year deal for $16MM. Because while that looks good on paper, those salaries in 08/09 are clearly not going to be paid.
Let's make this easier. You're the GM. Post the contract you would give Westbrook.
My effort...
Signing Bonus: $10 million ($5.5 million as a roster bonus, $4.5 million as a signing bonus)
March 2007 Roster Bonus: $3 million
Salaries:
2005 - minimum (about $650k)
2006 - $1.5 million
2007 - $1 million
2008 - $4.2 million
2009 - $4.75 million
That's 5 years, $25.1 million, with $13 million in bonuses and $16.15 million over the first three years
you just put this thread...the board...and possibly the entire internet over the top
slow ya roll kid
Quote from: MadMarchHare on September 09, 2005, 11:56:56 AM
So that's in essence a three year deal for $16MM. Because while that looks good on paper, those salaries in 08/09 are clearly not going to be paid.
Wrong. If Westbrook continues to be productive, those are salaries he'd actually see... especially if the cap expands big-time in 2007 as some are saying it might. His cap numbers for 08/09 would be $5.1m and $5.65m, respectively. That's really not that much. The beauty of this deal is that it evens the cap hit for the team pretty well... but if Westbrook DOES prove to lose effectiveness after 2007, they could save some scratch.
Hell, those salary amounts in 08/09 are so reasonable, I'd think there's a chance Westy could initiate a request for a new deal right about then. Any higher is stupid for both parties, at this point... because he'd never see them anyway.
all of these problems, now and in the future can be fixed if the eagles just cut everyone, have a team of undrafted free agents with 1 year deals.
each season, 53 new players...pretty simple...banner, are you listening?
I'd offer Westbrook McAlister money but on a shorter-term deal. In other words, I'd use the cap windfall we have this year to absorb most of that money via a roster bonus (as was done last season with Owens).
Everyone else can pretend they know/care about this situation, but no one will step up and put a contract on the table. C'mon, folks. What contract would you offer Westbrook? Vague references to other contracts are trash.
I would offer him a bazillion, quintillion dollar bonus and $17 million dollars a year for 31 years.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 09, 2005, 01:19:18 PM
I would offer him a bazillion, quintillion dollar bonus and $17 million dollars a year for 31 years.
Sounds good. I, for one, think he will still be very productive at the age of 59.
QuoteSheldon Mickles, of the Advocate, reports New Orleans Saints RB Deuce McAllister's $50.1 million contract included $12.5 million in bonuses, with a $7 million signing bonus, a $4 million option bonus in 2006 and a $1.5 million roster bonus due next March. Base salaries for the first five years of the deal are $600,000 (2005), $1.45 million (2006), $2.6 million (2007), $3.6 million (2008) and $5.2 million (2009). Roster bonuses of $1 million each are due in 2007 and 2008.
Match the upfront money. Take a big chunk of the $12m in cap space and wrap it up as a roster bonus in order to mitigate the long-term risk.
Quote from: Larry on September 09, 2005, 01:14:33 PM
I'd offer Westbrook McAlister money but on a shorter-term deal. In other words, I'd use the cap windfall we have this year to absorb most of that money via a roster bonus (as was done last season with Owens).
i would actually like to see the eagles offer westbrook, mccallister's money.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 09, 2005, 01:21:05 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on September 09, 2005, 01:19:18 PM
I would offer him a bazillion, quintillion dollar bonus and $17 million dollars a year for 31 years.
Sounds good. I, for one, think he will still be very productive at the age of 59.
Word life.
Quote from: Larry on September 09, 2005, 01:21:19 PM
QuoteSheldon Mickles, of the Advocate, reports New Orleans Saints RB Deuce McAllister's $50.1 million contract included $12.5 million in bonuses, with a $7 million signing bonus, a $4 million option bonus in 2006 and a $1.5 million roster bonus due next March. Base salaries for the first five years of the deal are $600,000 (2005), $1.45 million (2006), $2.6 million (2007), $3.6 million (2008) and $5.2 million (2009). Roster bonuses of $1 million each are due in 2007 and 2008.
Match the upfront money. Take a big chunk of the $12m in cap space and wrap it up as a roster bonus in order to mitigate the long-term risk.
How is that a $50.1 million contract? All that's described there is a 5 year, $27.95m contract.
There are probably a bunch of NLTBE bonuses hidden in the deal to bump up the final number, which isn't the important part; it's the cash upfront that matters.
Wait, I get it.
They left out $22.15 million in salary that there's no way in hell McAllister will ever see?
OK. That said, giving Westbrook $12.5 guaranteed money in the first 2 years, especially structured similarly to the Saints, is a bit much IMO. No way Westbrook will or should see $12+m in bonuses in the first two years.
Besides, he should actually prefer to get $9.5-10 mill in 2005 over that tiered structure.
id trade Westbrook for Randy Moss and then offer Moats 51 million over 1 year.
Quote from: MURP on September 09, 2005, 01:32:06 PM
id trade Westbrook for Randy Moss and then offer Moats 51 million over 1 year.
I'd trade him for Urlakker then offer L. Gordon a $20 million signing bonus.
HOLLA
Quote from: rjs246 on September 09, 2005, 01:19:18 PM
I would offer him a bazillion, quintillion dollar bonus and $17 million dollars a year for 31 years.
just out of curiosity, what would be the cap hit if you cut him in year 17 ?
Quote from: terpseagles on September 09, 2005, 01:40:08 PM
just out of curiosity, what would be the cap hit if you cut him in year 17 ?
Four.
Gargano was saying on the radio that he doesn't think the approx. 9mil signing bonus is the issue. it's the yearly salary. he made a good point, Westbrook said in the press conference that they are around 4 - 5 million apart over the life of the deal? split it down the middle and get going.
Spadaro:
QuoteNo more commenting, if possible. This deal will get done. Book it ... In time, it will get done.
QuoteNope, I'm not worried. I think the Eagles want to get the deal done, and when they want to get a deal done, they get it done.
Stop worrying, everybody! All is well!
I'd take the extra 12 mil in cap money and use it to buy beer.
Then pay Westbrook with the change I find in my couch cushions.
this thread annoys me. its so ghey.
spads says 'book it' in one line and 'i think' the eagles want to get it done in the next
what he should say involving any issue with the team is 'everything will work out for the best' because no matter what the eagles do its the right move and thus 'for the best'
god i hate that man
this thread annoys me. its so ghey
it was passable until FF posted a sneak preview of an entire nfl contract
Much better to put the money where your blab is than to pretend you actually know anything.
So, if the contract will get done, then I guess more predictions could be made.
wonder what makes Spads so sure it will get done. Banner giving him secrets again?
I don't put much stock in anything Spads says.
He's always so damn optimistic.
he couldnt be getting secrets cause he only 'thinks' the eagles even want to sign westbrook...much less whether they actually will sign him
oh btw.....BOOK IT!!!
I don't put much stock in anything Spads says.
He's always so damn optimistic.
lololol
post of the century
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 09, 2005, 02:57:29 PM
I don't put much stock in anything Spads says.
He's always so damn optimistic.
lololol
post of the century
eh...that's sort of in his job description.
I think Spadaro is just so sick of the whining from the fans. Everyone knows it will get done. There is no chance he is not on the team this year. Absolutely none. The Eagles wouldn't let him go.
The issue certainly isn't this year.
Quote from: Avenger on September 09, 2005, 03:03:34 PM
I think Spadaro is just so sick of the whining from the fans. Everyone knows it will get done. There is no chance he is not on the team this year. Absolutely none. The Eagles wouldn't let him go.
No shtein, EVERYONE knows hes going to be on the team this year. Why wouldnt he?
The only thing worse than you queers complaining about Spadaro is me having to read it when I get home.
STOP COMPLAINING. He's the Eagles front office fluffer. That's his fricken job, for God's sake.
:-D
Quote from: Dillen37 on September 09, 2005, 03:05:27 PM
Quote from: Avenger on September 09, 2005, 03:03:34 PM
I think Spadaro is just so sick of the whining from the fans. Everyone knows it will get done. There is no chance he is not on the team this year. Absolutely none. The Eagles wouldn't let him go.
No shtein, EVERYONE knows hes going to be on the team this year. Why wouldnt he?
You just repeated my same point. Thanks, captain obvious.
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 09, 2005, 01:23:49 PM
How is that a $50.1 million contract? All that's described there is a 5 year, $27.95m contract.
....I got 41.95.
Quote from: Avenger on September 09, 2005, 05:58:55 PM
Quote from: Dillen37 on September 09, 2005, 03:05:27 PM
Quote from: Avenger on September 09, 2005, 03:03:34 PM
I think Spadaro is just so sick of the whining from the fans. Everyone knows it will get done. There is no chance he is not on the team this year. Absolutely none. The Eagles wouldn't let him go.
No shtein, EVERYONE knows hes going to be on the team this year. Why wouldnt he?
You just repeated my same point. Thanks, captain obvious.
You know, I just looked back at your original post and I have absolutely NO idea why I said that. No idea.
Quote from: mhunt on September 09, 2005, 10:47:03 AM
davis scored 14 td's last season...westbrook scored 9.
but based on what i'm reading here, i'm sure that won't change any of your minds. :-D
Davis also only averaged 3.9 yards per carry (302 for 1188) last year.
He also only scored 1 TD on his 68 receptions (68-588)
Westbrook averaged 4.6 yards per carry (177 for 812) last year
He scored 6 TDs on his 73 receptions (73-703)
And Westbrook only played in 13 games to Davis' 16.
And Westbrook scored 13 TDs in 2003. In 15 games.
Quote from: Dillen37 on September 09, 2005, 06:51:50 PM
Quote from: FFatPatt on September 09, 2005, 01:23:49 PM
How is that a $50.1 million contract? All that's described there is a 5 year, $27.95m contract.
....I got 41.95.
That's because you double-counted the bonuses.
QuoteSheldon Mickles, of the Advocate, reports New Orleans Saints RB Deuce McAllister's $50.1 million contract included $12.5 million in bonuses, with a $7 million signing bonus, a $4 million option bonus in 2006 and a $1.5 million roster bonus due next March. Base salaries for the first five years of the deal are $600,000 (2005), $1.45 million (2006), $2.6 million (2007), $3.6 million (2008) and $5.2 million (2009). Roster bonuses of $1 million each are due in 2007 and 2008.
7 + 4 + 1.5 = the 12.5 they initially refer to
Your math is still off an additional $1.5m despite that, but I'm guessing that's where the bulk of your error is.
No, it's one plus two plus one plus one.
Quote from: General_Failure on September 09, 2005, 11:35:30 PM
No, it's one plus two plus one plus one.
Master of Allusion. The maid should be next weeks BOTW.
Oui oui!
Quote from: mhunt on September 09, 2005, 11:18:14 AM
i'm just trying to chip away at the blind homerism...i guess it's not working. :P davis has more touches, 250+ more total yards, and 5 more td's but people here still think westbrook is better. :paranoid
i'm not going to waste any more of my time on this topic. :-D
I agree. The Eagles should cut Westbrook and sign Terrell Davis.
(http://www.thealmightyguru.com/Reviews/Clue/Images/Clue-Character-Yvette.jpg)
I'm gonna guess..... today. tomorrow :paranoid
fixed
there some guy who just called WIP and said there is a press conference tomorrow to announce it, but I didn't hear Gargano's response. it was weird though.
id love it if they announced the re-do of westbrooks contract and the termination of owens at the same presser...what a breath of fresh air that would bring over the team/organization
Can we trade him to Washington to get Thrash back?
QuotePredict The Date/Time That Westbrook Receives His Contract Extension.
I'll say it will be whenever he proves he can play a whole season without getting hurt, or when hell freezes over, whichever comes first.
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 02:58:24 PM
I'll say it will be whenever he proves he can play a whole season without getting hurt, or when hell freezes over, whichever comes first.
oh, did you see that in your crystal ball?
Bitch fight!
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:02:55 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 02:58:24 PM
I'll say it will be whenever he proves he can play a whole season without getting hurt, or when hell freezes over, whichever comes first.
oh, did you see that in your crystal ball?
I don't have one, I'm still waiting for you to tell me were you got yours. Let me make another guess, was it Dollar General??
I heard from The Great Mezmo that Wal-Mart has them on sale. You probably got screwed.
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 03:04:47 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:02:55 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 02:58:24 PM
I'll say it will be whenever he proves he can play a whole season without getting hurt, or when hell freezes over, whichever comes first.
oh, did you see that in your crystal ball?
I don't have one, I'm still waiting for you to tell me were you got yours. Let me make another guess, was it Dollar General??
wow, your a sensitive little thing aren't you.
learn how to take a joke mary.
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:08:33 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 03:04:47 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:02:55 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 02:58:24 PM
I'll say it will be whenever he proves he can play a whole season without getting hurt, or when hell freezes over, whichever comes first.
oh, did you see that in your crystal ball?
I don't have one, I'm still waiting for you to tell me were you got yours. Let me make another guess, was it Dollar General??
wow Wow, your you're a sensitive little thing aren't you.
learn Learn how to take a joke mary Mary.
Speaking of sensitive...
I am sensitive! Now I'm gonna' have to go look at internet porn, I'm so damn sensitive.
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on November 02, 2005, 03:15:09 PM
Quote
wow Wow, your you're a sensitive little thing aren't you.
learn Learn how to take a joke mary Mary.
Speaking of sensitive...
who are you again?
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:28:00 PM
who are you again?
I'm the farging Avatar fairy. Here is one you'll probably like....
(http://www.megacalendars.com/images/posters/Vin%20Diesel%20AA885.jpg)
When Vin Diesel finishes a meal, the plate is cleaner than it was before the food was put on it.
Quote from: PhillyPhaninDC on November 02, 2005, 03:15:09 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:08:33 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 03:04:47 PM
Quote from: Sun_Mo on November 02, 2005, 03:02:55 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 02:58:24 PM
I'll say it will be whenever he proves he can play a whole season without getting hurt, or when hell freezes over, whichever comes first.
oh, did you see that in your crystal ball?
I don't have one, I'm still waiting for you to tell me were you got yours. Let me make another guess, was it Dollar General??
wow Wow, your you're a sensitive little thing aren't you.
learn Learn how to take a joke mary Mary.
Speaking of sensitive...
Quote from: shorebird on November 02, 2005, 03:22:12 PM
I am sensitive! Now I'm gonna' have to go look at internet porn, I'm so damn sensitive.
Hey, do any of you bitches have 'sensitive' in your custom user title? I didn't think so. You have nothing on my sensitiveness. :P
Dude, that Grammar Nazi thing was pretty funny. Especially the All Your Base reference.
It was certainly a lot better than the ginormous pic of Ving Rhaymes
Quote from: rjs246 on November 02, 2005, 04:28:22 PM
Dude, that Grammar Nazi thing was pretty funny. Especially the All Your Base reference.
(http://www.whiterook.net/images/Imagery/GrammarNazi.jpg)
Just for you.
The Grammar Nazi must feel sorry for me, 'cause he's taken' it very easy on me, and I know I'm an easy target.
Thanx for nut makin fun of ma Eastern Sho' Edjumucashon.
I read on another board the following two items:
1. Westbrook is on the John Thompson show right now in the DC area giving his side of the contract situation.
2. Eskin said that Westbrook turned down the Eagles' "new, signifcant offer"--apparently, he WANTS MORE THAN LAMONT JORDAN got from the Raiders.
If this is true, it's just like Billy Wagner's negotiations with the Phils--first he wanted 24M, then after the All-Star break it went up to 27M, then at the end of the season, it went up to 30M, and when the Phils apprently were ready to meet his price, he announced he was filing for FA.
I checked with "Mr. NC" for an update and there's not really anything new to report....says Brian has been a pain in the ass to deal with in terms of negotiations.....
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 03, 2005, 04:43:36 PM
I checked with "Mr. NC" for an update and there's not really anything new to report....says Brian has been a pain in the ass to deal with in terms of negotiations.....
Well there's a farging shock.
Fantastic.
Meh. RBs are dime a dozen. Farg Westrbook.
farging Westbrook. He thinks he's playing hardball. Teeball, is more like it. Go cry to someone who gives a shtein. Maybe the Cardinals will give him money in the offseason and he can rot in Arizona in front of all seven of their fans... of course, being overpaid to underproduce in Arizona, surrounded by Arizona women might not be the purgatory I was going for, but you get the point.
theres no shortage of teams out there that would unload massive money at westbrook
the wagner analogy is a good one...the eagles had their chance to sign him and they blew it...of course now westbrook it going to up the ante as he approaches free agency...theres no upside for him to sign at this point in time...expect a franchise tag and all kinds of ugliness come the offseason
Franchise tag? Come on. He's not that important in anyone's mind. Except maybe yours?
I asked about that. They're probably going to franchise him...
Franchise tag? Come on. He's not that important in anyone's mind. Except maybe yours?
franchise tag has more to do with protecting yourself than it does with the importance of the player...was corey simon that 'important'
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 03, 2005, 04:58:37 PM
I asked about that. They're probably going to franchise him...
Alrighty then. Nevermind what I said.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 03, 2005, 04:58:43 PM
Franchise tag? Come on. He's not that important in anyone's mind. Except maybe yours?
franchise tag has more to do with protecting yourself than it does with the importance of the player...was corey simon that 'important'
Sure, sure. But as a player, he's not worth what it would cost to pay him top five money. You could plug any number of dudes into this system and not use them just as well.
Brian Westbrook is
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 03, 2005, 04:58:37 PM
I asked about that. They're probably going to franchise him...
You farging kidding me? $8-$9 million off the cap and no promise of him hanging around? Ugh.
But as a player, he's not worth what it would cost to pay him top five money
not really...the franchise tag is one year and the way the eagles hoard money it would be no problem to pay him a top five salary for one season...this is the reason that letting simon go was so ridiculous
screw westbrook. the eagles should sign ahman green so when Buckhalter comes back they'll have a killer lineup of :-D
It's Mahe time!
It sounds like either:
1. Westbrook doesn't wanna be here because he's sick of Andy's BS.
2. He's just a pain and a stubborn idiot.
If we don't get a deal done then we need to franchise him. There's no guarantee we can sign Alexander or Edge, and if we don't sign either and Westbrook leaves we have no one. Plus Westbrook knows the system.
I hope the Eagles way overpay for him. I'd rather overpay and farg up the cap and let him walk and not make it to the SB next year(and we won't without Westbrook).
Westbrook doesn't wanna be here because he's sick of Andy's BS
if westbrook leaves everyone will be sick of andys bs...if they arent already...but thats what andy thrives off of...if he could hed try and win with 53 undrafted free agents just to say i told you my way would win with anyone
when westbrook is leading the nfl in total yardage next year for another team i just hope people remember saying how he wasnt worth it and that hes a greedy sob
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 05:04:50 PM
It sounds like either:
1. Westbrook doesn't wanna be here because he's sick of Andy's BS.
2. He's just a pain and a stubborn idiot.
If we don't get a deal done then we need to franchise him. There's no guarantee we can sign Alexander or Edge, and if we don't sign either and Westbrook leaves we have no one. Plus Westbrook knows the system.
I hope the Eagles way overpay for him. I'd rather overpay and farg up the cap and let him walk and not make it to the SB next year(and we won't without Westbrook).
I hate reading your posts so much, I started to punch my monitor in hopes my fists o' fury would reach you. After I broke my hand, I realized that wasn't such a good idea. Unfortunately now I have two black eyes and a bloody nose.
Explain what you hate exactly.
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 05:18:06 PM
Explain what you hate exactly.
It's probably pretty much everything about you. I know that's what it is for most of us.
Well you guys hate pretty much everyone and everything so that's nothing new.
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 05:27:21 PM
Well you guys hate pretty much everyone and everything so that's nothing new.
That's not so. I like a lot of people and things, but clearly you're not one of them. It's not really your fault.
I luv me sum me.
I'm sad that I was on my way home and didn't get a chance to pile on TO_is_GOD until now. So consider this me piling on.
I think we should bring back Amp Lee.
I hate him more than you hate him. I win.
So anyway, am I the only one who doesn't mind them overpaying for Westbrook? I think it needs to get done no matter what. Pay him more than Lamont Jordan. He's too important to be let go, and if we have to mess up the cap to do it, then fine.
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 05:50:34 PM
So anyway, am I the only one who doesn't mind them overpaying for Westbrook?
Yes. I wouldn't mind them overpaying for James or Alexander. Proven number one backs who are adept at running and receiving. I would very much mind them over paying the scat-back-on-steroids Westbrook.
This all could've been obviated had the initial offer been similar to Lamont Jordan's contract instead of using the latter as a ceiling.
The market sets the market, not what some beancounter thinks a player should make.
Quote from: Larry on November 03, 2005, 06:45:43 PM
This all could've been obviated had the initial offer been similar to Lamont Jordan's contract instead of using the latter as a ceiling.
The market sets the market, not what some beancounter thinks a player should make.
That's all well and good while you're reading about the advantages of capitalism in Econ 203, but obviously this team doesn't operate that way.
and that's why if they don't change they'll never win a championship.
SIGN WESTBROOK!
I DON'T CARE WHAT HE WANTS!
Quote from: rjs246 on November 03, 2005, 05:44:48 PM
I'm sad that I was on my way home and didn't get a chance to pile on TO_is_GOD until now. So consider this me piling on.
you're like jon runyon that way
Blah blah blah blah whine (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=wickersham_seth&id=2212395)
He's 100% right. They are being their usual cheap selves. I'm not saying he won't get signed, but each day that he's not it lowers the chances. They have NO excuse not to get him signed. Absolutely no excuse. If he goes unsigned them I'm convinced they aren't committed to winning, and I don't respect teams that don't give it all to win. The more I hear about this Westbrook situation, the more tired I am getting of the Eagles management. They walk around arrogantly thinking they are the gold standard when they haven't won shtein. Then they low-ball big-time players of theirs thinking they can move on without them.
WELL GUESS WHAT ANDY AND JOE! YOU HAVEN'T WON shtein!
I know Andy was rumored to demand Banner to get the Westbrook deal done. I find that hard to believe since Andy is the GM and Banner would do what Andy says. They are starting to get players in the locker room tired of the way they do business. If the Eagles don't sign Westbrook and let TO go at the end of the year, then I hope the entire team turns on them. They deserve to pay and deserve whatever happens to them.
Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit, but I am beyond angry with this team. I want a farging Superbowl. McNabb is almost 30 and we are running out of time. He should've been signed by now. Give him more than Lamont Jordan he's worth it. If he gets signed that's all well and good, but right now he's not and I'm tired of it.
Running out of time? Just because McNabb is almost 30? Get a grip.
all of this shtein is just ruining the season for me, i don't know about anybody else.
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 11:40:17 PM
Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit, but I am beyond angry with this team. I want a farging Superbowl. McNabb is almost 30 and we are running out of time. He should've been signed by now. Give him more than Lamont Jordan he's worth it. If he gets signed that's all well and good, but right now he's not and I'm tired of it.
Again, I implore you... Please try to switch teams next year. The Eagles are much more likely to do well with fewer fans like you. Maybe if Westbrook leaves, you can start rooting for
his new team? That'd be super. Thanks.
So we can't win without Westbrook, eh? Does that mean he's the key and TO is expendable, or should we overpay for both loudmouth twats?
how can you even put westbrook and TO in the same sentence...all westbrook has said is that he doesnt like the money the team has offered and that they lowballed him back in the summer...
at the same time banner said he thought the offer was fair...does make him a loud mouthed twat
contract disagreements happen every day in sports..a player isnt allowed to speak on that???...he never called anyone a hypocrite never ripped his qb...never blasted the eagles as an organization...never called them liars..ect...its not even close to the same thing
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 04, 2005, 09:17:42 AM
how can you even put westbrook and TO in the same sentence...all westbrook has said is that he doesnt like the money the team has offered and that they lowballed him back in the summer...
at the same time banner said he thought the offer was fair...does make him a loud mouthed twat
contract disagreements happen every day in sports..a player isnt allowed to speak on that???...he never called anyone a hypocrite never ripped his qb...never blasted the eagles as an organization...never called them liars..ect...its not even close to the same thing
and he's only answering questions. he's not going to every TV network in the land to plead his case. in fact, many of the reporters wish he would talk more, for the most part he's been avoiding the press.
Quote from: FFatPatt on November 04, 2005, 08:23:53 AM
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 11:40:17 PM
Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit, but I am beyond angry with this team. I want a farging Superbowl. McNabb is almost 30 and we are running out of time. He should've been signed by now. Give him more than Lamont Jordan he's worth it. If he gets signed that's all well and good, but right now he's not and I'm tired of it.
Again, I implore you... Please try to switch teams next year. The Eagles are much more likely to do well with fewer fans like you. Maybe if Westbrook leaves, you can start rooting for his new team? That'd be super. Thanks.
I beseech you to take his statement to heart.
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 11:40:17 PM
WELL GUESS WHAT ANDY AND JOE! YOU HAVEN'T WON shtein!
Except for:
Many Regular Season Games
NFC East Division Titles
1st Round Playoff Games
2nd Round Playoff Games
NFC Championship title.
None of which we won, with any regularity, for a very long time before them.
I just don't understand some Eagles fans.
Do you not remember what is was like when we were 3-13 and all you would have killed for a playoff appearance? or even just a non-Cardinals division win?
Or were you just not a fan then?
This make-or-break bullshtein that I hear is so retarded and I have been hearing it for years now.
What will happen if they don't win a superbowl this year? Or next year? How many years have people been saying that?
Will the team dissapear? Will tehy turn into a professional ice-dancing team?
Or will you just take your ball and go home and not be an Eagles fan anymore?
Don't be such a bitch.
Quote from: methdeez on November 04, 2005, 01:07:36 PMExcept for:
Many Regular Season Games
NFC East Division Titles
1st Round Playoff Games
2nd Round Playoff Games
NFC Championship title.
None of which we won, with any regularity, for a very long time before them.
I just don't understand some Eagles fans.
Do you not remember what is was like when we were 3-13 and all you would have killed for a playoff appearance? or even just a non-Cardinals division win?
Or were you just not a fan then?
This make-or-break bullshtein that I hear is so retarded and I have been hearing it for years now.
What will happen if they don't win a superbowl this year? Or next year? How many years have people been saying that?
Will the team dissapear? Will tehy turn into a professional ice-dancing team?
Or will you just take your ball and go home and not be an Eagles fan anymore?
Don't be such a bitch.
Well said, Fred.
I just don't understand some Eagles fans.
Do you not remember what is was like when we were 3-13 and all you would have killed for a playoff appearance? or even just a non-Cardinals division win?
you do understand that if andy were relived of his coaching duties they would not be required to hire rich kotite back
there are better coaches out in the world than andy reid
ill be the first to thank him that he wasnt rich kotite then ill send him on his way and get a coach that would have won a superbowl sometime in the last 5 nfc championship games
oh and as a departing gift ill give him a basset hound ballooon animal for winning 'many regular season games'
Quote from: Diomedes on November 04, 2005, 02:07:38 PM
Quote from: methdeez on November 04, 2005, 01:07:36 PMExcept for:
Many Regular Season Games
NFC East Division Titles
1st Round Playoff Games
2nd Round Playoff Games
NFC Championship title.
None of which we won, with any regularity, for a very long time before them.
I just don't understand some Eagles fans.
Do you not remember what is was like when we were 3-13 and all you would have killed for a playoff appearance? or even just a non-Cardinals division win?
Or were you just not a fan then?
This make-or-break bullshtein that I hear is so retarded and I have been hearing it for years now.
What will happen if they don't win a superbowl this year? Or next year? How many years have people been saying that?
Will the team dissapear? Will tehy turn into a professional ice-dancing team?
Or will you just take your ball and go home and not be an Eagles fan anymore?
Don't be such a bitch.
Well said, Fred.
Bravo, bravo. you too Dio.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 04, 2005, 02:12:01 PM
I just don't understand some Eagles fans.
Do you not remember what is was like when we were 3-13 and all you would have killed for a playoff appearance? or even just a non-Cardinals division win?
you do understand that if andy were relived of his coaching duties they would not be required to hire rich kotite back
there are better coaches out in the world than andy reid
ill be the first to thank him that he wasnt rich kotite then ill send him on his way and get a coach that would have won a superbowl sometime in the last 5 nfc championship games
oh and as a departing gift ill give him a basset hound ballooon animal for winning 'many regular season games'
Who is better? Who would have won more. Belichek is already spoken for. I don't see any NFL coaching talent out there who is superior to Andy.
Who is better? Who would have won more. Belichek is already spoken for. I don't see any NFL coaching talent out there who is superior to Andy.
we already did this thread....rock a search
Quote from: FFatPatt on November 04, 2005, 08:23:53 AM
Quote from: TO is GOD on November 03, 2005, 11:40:17 PM
Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit, but I am beyond angry with this team. I want a farging Superbowl. McNabb is almost 30 and we are running out of time. He should've been signed by now. Give him more than Lamont Jordan he's worth it. If he gets signed that's all well and good, but right now he's not and I'm tired of it.
Again, I implore you... Please try to switch teams next year. The Eagles are much more likely to do well with fewer fans like you. Maybe if Westbrook leaves, you can start rooting for his new team? That'd be super. Thanks.
It ain't gonna happen. I live and die with the Eagles. If they do great I'll be happy, if they do bad, then I'll feel like shtein. Ripping the team is part of being a fan. Despite disagreeing with things they do I'll still always be a fan. I'll rip them in the process, but I do it because I care. I want them to win so bad, that it makes me so angry when I think they do something wrong.
It's like disciplining your kid. If you catch him doing something really bad at a young age, you'll get very angry with him. Not because you hate him, but because you care about his well being and want him to grow up to be a good person. Any parent who doesn't get angry just doesn't care about their kid.
Burn yourself.
Quote from: FFatPatt on November 04, 2005, 04:31:41 PM
Burn yourself.
Now that's just solid advice. TO_is_GOD, I imagine this will be painful, and since your pain threshold is so incredibly low (as evidenced by your bitchy posts) I suggest incrementally increasing you tolerance for pain by putting cigarettes on first your arms and legs, then your eyes. Once you can stand that take it to the next level, Marge, by using cigars. After which you could hop in a tub full of napalm.
Count me as one who thinks that Bwest isn't worth Lamont Jordan money. Even with the limited playing time Jordan has seen, it's plain to see he's two backs in one, a fast shore handed reciever, and a punishing 'A gap' runner. The more playing time he gets, the more he proves it, imo. Bwest just isn't gonna' run the ball up the middle and get that 3rd and 2 first down. That and his injury history tell me he's not worth what Jordan is getting. Shoot, Jordan has yet to prove on the stat sheet that he's worth what he's getting.
westbrook in any offense much less the eagles offense pisses all over lamont jordon...westbrook is a difference maker..a player that numerous other teams have said they game plan for...no one is ever going to game plan for lamont jordon...argue if you want about the dollars you want him to get but dont make yourself look silly and say that lamont jordon is a better player than westbrook
I just don't agree with that at all. Bwest in no way is that much better than Jordan, imo. Time will most likely prove me correct.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 05, 2005, 11:10:05 AM
dont make yourself look silly and say that lamont jordon is a better player than westbrook
I never said that Jordan is better than Bwest. He's better at running up the middle, theres no doubt about that. He's just as good catching the ball out of the backfield. He might not have the same elusiveness of Bwest, but he has the speed. He has yet to get injured that I know of, thats the big diff right there.
Again, don't try and put words in my mouth, I said Bwest is not worth Jordan money, and Jordan has yet to prove he's worth what they are paying him.
He's just as good catching the ball out of the backfield
at minimum you need a suspension for this and i would probably even support a banning
westbrook is a superior player both in running and catching the ball and its not even close...again if you dont think he should get jordan money then thats your opinion but he is a much better player and is going to get jordans money and more from someone...and thats a fact
There is no comparison between these two. They are COMPLETELY different backs. This debate is a joke.
Quote from: shorebird on November 05, 2005, 11:18:30 AM
I just don't agree with that at all. Bwest in no way is that much better than Jordan, imo. Time will most likely prove me correct.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 05, 2005, 11:10:05 AM
dont make yourself look silly and say that lamont jordon is a better player than westbrook
I never said that Jordan is better than Bwest. He's better at running up the middle, theres no doubt about that. He's just as good catching the ball out of the backfield. He might not have the same elusiveness of Bwest, but he has the speed. He has yet to get injured that I know of, thats the big diff right there.
Again, don't try and put words in my mouth, I said Bwest is not worth Jordan money, and Jordan has yet to prove he's worth what they are paying him.
I don't know what you're talking about there. He may only have 499 yards rushing but he has 7 rushing TD's and then he also has 314 receiving yards and two TD's. I'd say that's earning your money, especially when you are on a pass oriented offense. Who else has 9 TD's?
Westbrook is the most difficult RB in the NFL to match-up against because of his receiving ability. RBs who can pull a double-move and fake out elite corners like Charles Woodson are unique; this is where his value lies.
Without Westbrook, Reid, Childress, et al, will find it much more difficult to create the mismatches they've depended upon to trigger the big plays.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 05, 2005, 11:24:12 AM
He's just as good catching the ball out of the backfield
at minimum you need a suspension for this and i would probably even support a banning
westbrook is a superior player both in running and catching the ball and its not even close...again if you dont think he should get jordan money then thats your opinion but he is a much better player and is going to get jordans money and more from someone...and thats a fact
Bullshtein, the thing about Jordan is that he's a punishing back who also has great recieving ability. You don't know anything about him if you think otherwise. His hands were good enough to pass for TD's in college.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on November 05, 2005, 12:10:26 PM
There is no comparison between these two. They are COMPLETELY different backs. This debate is a joke.
Is it a joke that Bwest compares himself to Jordan when he says he wants Jordan like money?? It's been the subject of the last three pages of this thread.
They are somewhat different though, Jordan is more versatile in the fact that he can run inside, and has the speed to run outside as well, and catch the ball out of the backfield with the best of them.
Quote from: The Waco Kid on November 05, 2005, 12:37:57 PM
Quote from: shorebird on November 05, 2005, 11:18:30 AM
I just don't agree with that at all. Bwest in no way is that much better than Jordan, imo. Time will most likely prove me correct.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 05, 2005, 11:10:05 AM
dont make yourself look silly and say that lamont jordon is a better player than westbrook
I never said that Jordan is better than Bwest. He's better at running up the middle, theres no doubt about that. He's just as good catching the ball out of the backfield. He might not have the same elusiveness of Bwest, but he has the speed. He has yet to get injured that I know of, thats the big diff right there.
Again, don't try and put words in my mouth, I said Bwest is not worth Jordan money, and Jordan has yet to prove he's worth what they are paying him.
I don't know what you're talking about there. He may only have 499 yards rushing but he has 7 rushing TD's and then he also has 314 receiving yards and two TD's. I'd say that's earning your money, especially when you are on a pass oriented offense. Who else has 9 TD's?
You have a point there, but I'd wait until he has a full season under his belt to pass that kind of judgment. But your right, 813 all purpose yards and 9 td's ain't nothing to sneeze at.
For what it's worth, Bwest has 304 rushing yards and 423 receiving yards for 727 all purpose yards, with 5 td's. Those stats are very comparable to Jordans except Lamonts 9 td's jump him ahead by a considerable amount if your looking at thier overall worth.
Comparing these two backs is silly. It's like comparing Marvin Harrison and T.O.
Westbrook deserves close to Lamont Jordan money. A little bit under, the same, a little bit over... that's the issue.
He'll probably get his extension within the next 24 hrs. That may fire the team up. :yay
Quote from: Larry on November 05, 2005, 02:35:08 PM
He'll probably get his extension within the next 24 hrs. That may fire the team up. :yay
I wish, but I doubt it.
Quote from: FFatPatt on November 05, 2005, 02:43:41 PM
Quote from: Larry on November 05, 2005, 02:35:08 PM
He'll probably get his extension within the next 24 hrs. That may fire the team up. :yay
I wish, but I doubt it.
They should just to spite Owens. I'd laugh a hearty belly-laugh.
I don't see how it's silly to compare two players who play the same position, have similar numbers, but different running styles.
With our lack of a running game this year, I'd almost rather have Jordan on this team.
Quote from: shorebird on November 05, 2005, 02:53:35 PM
I don't see how it's silly to compare two players who play the same position, have similar numbers, but different running styles.
With our lack of a running game this year, I'd almost rather have Jordan on this team.
right because our lack of running game is because of bwest now? i bet u a million bucks, which i can then donate to the TO needs more money foundation, that even if we have lamant jordan we wouldnt be even running. its more the playcalling and reid's thinking than anything else.
With our lack of a running game this year, I'd almost rather have Jordan on this team
why
the eagles dont run
so youd rather have the inferior pass catcher???
DGunn on CSN reported that a contract between the Eagles and Westbrook is "imminent"
no shock there. classic PR move. ;)
Damn, i'm gonna be off by like 8 or 9 days. Do i win anything?
Quote from: The Waco Kid on November 05, 2005, 07:07:25 PM
Damn, i'm gonna be off by like 8 or 9 days. Do i win anything?
a permanent banning.
Oh that is so threatening. Puleeeeeeeeeeze.
Quote from: The Waco Kid on November 05, 2005, 07:07:25 PM
Damn, i'm gonna be off by like 8 or 9 days. Do i win anything?
Season tickets to the Baylor Bears.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on November 05, 2005, 07:11:23 PM
Quote from: The Waco Kid on November 05, 2005, 07:07:25 PM
Damn, i'm gonna be off by like 8 or 9 days. Do i win anything?
Season tickets to the Baylor Bears.
Sweeeeeeeeeeet!! Just what i was hoping for..you guys rule.
You get to watch ex-Eagle Guy Morriss coach the Bears.
And you also get a gift certificate to Whataburger.
Even better!
An unjustified banning...how great.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 05, 2005, 05:10:31 PM
With our lack of a running game this year, I'd almost rather have Jordan on this team
why
the eagles dont run
so youd rather have the inferior pass catcher???
I guess we'll find out Sunday if we have a running game, because we will have to have one to win. I guess I was going a little overboard saying that we have no running game when Bwest really hasn't had the chance to get the ball more than 20 times a game. Thing is, when we had Duce, we had that off tackle runner and the combo of Duce and Bwest was a winning one. I'd still like to have that guy to get you three yards in a cloud of dust when you need it.
It will be interesting to see what Bwest ends up getting, especially with TO sitting and watching him get a new deal.
Westbrook's actually going to sign? I'll believe it when I see it. And then when I do see it, BOOO!
Quote from: General_Failure on November 05, 2005, 09:46:19 PM
Westbrook's actually going to sign? I'll believe it when I see it
Exactly.
Eagles will announce B Westbrooks new contract Monday morning. Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
Quote from: DoMeGood on November 05, 2005, 11:00:40 PM
Eagles will announce B Westbrooks new contract Monday morning. Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
Source?
Quote from: PhillyGirl on November 05, 2005, 11:01:35 PM
Quote from: DoMeGood on November 05, 2005, 11:00:40 PM
Eagles will announce B Westbrooks new contract Monday morning. Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
Source?
Great, thanks for the brillant nugget of information without a source. Appreciate it.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on November 05, 2005, 11:01:35 PM
Quote from: DoMeGood on November 05, 2005, 11:00:40 PM
Eagles will announce B Westbrooks new contract Monday morning. Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
Source?
Me. That's all you need to know. :D
Want to make a bet on it?
I believe him.
Quote from: DoMeGood on November 05, 2005, 11:00:40 PM
Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
what was the last deal he was offered?
One kick through the fence with a regular sized boot.
Quote from: MURP on November 06, 2005, 01:54:21 AM
Quote from: DoMeGood on November 05, 2005, 11:00:40 PM
Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
what was the last deal he was offered?
less than his new one.
Quote from: MURP on November 06, 2005, 01:54:21 AM
Quote from: DoMeGood on November 05, 2005, 11:00:40 PM
Not Lamont Jordan money but slightly better than the last deal he was offered.
what was the last deal he was offered?
Total package of $14M over 3 yrs. The new deal will be slightly over $17M with opportunity to exceed with incentives. I think the signing bonus is $11M.
Sweet. I hope you're right.
What's the total length of the contract? 5 or 6 years?
Where exactly are you getting this info....seriously. You are just saying it with no source or anything.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on November 06, 2005, 08:21:46 AM
Where exactly are you getting this info....seriously. You are just saying it with no source or anything.
It's simple, really. He reads about the DGunn report, and figures he can get some message board "props points" by calling a very likely event as if he actually has an "inside" source. We all know the general likely range of the contract numbers, so it's easy to throw numbers out there as if he actually knows the real numbers.
Quote from: FFatPatt on November 06, 2005, 08:23:44 AM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on November 06, 2005, 08:21:46 AM
Where exactly are you getting this info....seriously. You are just saying it with no source or anything.
It's simple, really. He reads about the DGunn report, and figures he can get some message board "props points" by calling a very likely event as if he actually has an "inside" source. We all know the general likely range of the contract numbers, so it's easy to throw numbers out there as if he actually knows the real numbers.
Since when do brand new posters, with zero credibility and no backup source, get any kind of say on this board? Posting bullshtein is should be grounds for a ban.
And Phreak:
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on November 06, 2005, 05:03:17 AM
Sweet. I hope you're right.
What's the total length of the contract? 5 or 6 years?
You buy into this crap? :-D
Phreak is baiting him. Derrrrrrr.
I know. And I don't "know" like some of these fruits claim to. I really know.
when Westy actually signs a contract, feel free to start a new thread.
(http://www.modelhelicopters.co.uk/acatalog/ZAP71.JPG)