Feel the excitement!
I can't wait to get my 40th Anniversary DVD :-X
Sign Briere
Holmgren is already scouting players in Finland
They've been really proactive more so this year than years before in scouting since they realized how bad they suck, and where they'd be drafting. Rumor has it they've been looking at a european defenceman for the second first round pick
Quote from: BigEd76 on April 11, 2007, 08:14:42 PM
Holmgren is already scouting players in Finland
no clones of Pitkanen
Rumor has it that they're scouting some swede? dis 12, i'm down on Joni too, but if he puts it together its scary how good he could be. He had 43pts: 4 goals, 39 assists in his worst season. Scotty Bowman called him the most talented player to come into the league and that he had more natural talent than Lindstrom.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on April 12, 2007, 10:42:51 AM
Rumor has it that they're scouting some swede? dis 12, i'm down on Joni too, but if he puts it together its scary how good he could be. He had 43pts: 4 goals, 39 assists in his worst season. Scotty Bowman called him the most talented player to come into the league and that he had more natural talent than Lindstrom.
that's been said about a lot of players who had the talent, but couldn't survive transitioning to the NHL (NFL,NBA...) I think Joni is a "nice-guy" player who does have incredible talents, but just doesn't handle criticism (or boos) well...maybe they just need to kiss his ass (instead of lighting a fire under it) to get him motivated.
Clarke rumored for Blue Jackets GM job (http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/101-04242007-1335442.html)
Holmgren says no one has asked for permission to talk to Clarke yet...
Upshall re-signed for 2 more years (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20070511_Flyers_sign_Upshall_for_two_more_seasons.html)
Great move by Homer to get him wrapped up before the Draft. Its also a great deal for the team and for Scottie who stands to earn more if he keeps playing like he did.
Tim Panaccio:
QuoteThe Flyers intend to have at least one player on their wish list locked up within the first couple hours of free agency.
=====
Toronto Globe and Mail:
QuoteIt is generally believed that the Philadelphia Flyers will be major players on the unrestricted free-agent market, targeting a new No. 1 centre and willing to pay $5 to $6 million for any one of Drury, Briere or Scott Gomez, the New Jersey Devils' centre who qualifies for unrestricted free agency this July as well. Gomez doesn't exactly fit the Flyers' stereotype, but the prospect of pairing his playmaking skills with Simon Gagne's finishing touch must be an appealing fallback position for Philadelphia, if they can't get Briere first.
=====
Courier Post:
-- Briere, Drury and Scott Gomez are on the Flyers' wish list
-- Esche, York and Matt Ellison will not be offered new deals
-- Offers will be made to Fedoruk and Denis Hamel
-- They'd like to re-sign Afanasenkov but they don't want to pay $1M for a 3rd/4th-line winger
=====
Kevin Cooney article on John Stevens looking for defensive help (http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/101-05132007-1345898.html)
What's the status of Martin Biron's thigh/contract?
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 14, 2007, 01:08:41 PM
What's the status of Martin Biron's thigh/contract?
They resigned his thigh for 2 more years back towards the end of the season.
Ben Eager signed a 2 year deal
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8_wrJpRDaU
this is awesome video of Ron Hextall highlights...what a farging bastich he was.
just turn the sound down, because the music is that terrible puffy song where he samples Zeppelin, icehole.
do they have him beating the air out of alain chevrier...that was the best
not sure, but they show Rob Brown running away from him
http://www.philadelphiaflyers.com/pressbox/archive/3121.asp
Kukkonen signs for a two year deal
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 17, 2007, 12:29:39 PM
do they have him beating the air out of alain chevrier...that was the best
It's there. Right around the 2:45 mark.
They don't make guys like Hextall anymore. Imbalanced, fiercely competitive... Now our Philly athletes are guys like Pat Burrell or Donovan McNabb - either don't give a shtein at all or are good at pretending they don't.
TO
Bernard Hopkins
I forgot how much I farging loved Hextall. I remember watching him his rookie season and thinking, "Oh crap, I love a man. My dad's gonna be so disappointed."
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on May 17, 2007, 02:48:10 PM
Bernard Hopkins
Individual sports don't count. Hopkins is as much of a Philly athlete as Smarty Jones and Barbaro.
Quote from: FastFreddie on May 17, 2007, 02:41:31 PM
They don't make guys like Hextall anymore. Imbalanced, fiercely competitive... Now our Philly athletes are guys like Pat Burrell or Donovan McNabb - either don't give a shtein at all or are good at pretending they don't.
Someone feed Chase Utley some crack.
Don't waste that kind of never-ending good vibes on a farging baseball player. If one of their hockey players could show that kind of insanity I would shtein myself with glee.
chase me home utley
Mentioning Ron Hextall in the same sentence with a baseball player should be punishable by rape. Penis-hole rape.
I babysat for Hextall's kids...lol. He and his wife Diane were cool as hell.
you ever babysit for a lacrosse player....i think not
If Hextall ever saw you using 'lol' he would eat your children and tattoo the image of him eating your children to the inside of your eyelids.
and he'd slash your mother in the back of the knees
If Hextall ever saw you using 'lol' he would eat your children and tattoo the image of him eating your children to the inside of your eyelids.
you having a hockey goalies penis in your mouth is lol
i love hextall
BUT HES A HOCKEY GOALIE
The fact that you would somehow try to mock lacrosse while you're posting over and over again in a baseball thread makes me laugh. Baseball is the worst sport ever and lacrosse is basically identical to hockey in most ways.
But at least you're staying true to your old school, ignorant roots. Uncle Chester would be proud.
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 18, 2007, 10:02:03 PM
If Hextall ever saw you using 'lol' he would eat your children and tattoo the image of him eating your children to the inside of your eyelids.
you having a hockey goalies penis in your mouth is lol
i love hextall
BUT HES A HOCKEY GOALIE
This is even more laughable than anything else I've made fun of you for. Hockey goalies are farging whack jobs. But you, know, baseball player are totally hard asses too. Definitely.
jimmy rollins would eat ron hextall for lunch with his pimp spoon....ooooo i wear a scary mask and beat up other 5'8 145 hockey goalies...
just stop it
and hextall isnt nuts...have you ever seen or heard him off the ice...hes nuts when he has seven layers of protection and is fighting another goalie....thats just crazy dood
Jimmy Rollins is a farging shortstop. Just stop it.
both of you Sun Mos stop it
love it
Quote from: rjs246 on May 18, 2007, 10:11:53 PM
Jimmy Rollins is a farging shortstop. Just stop it.
He's also black
Quote from: SD_Eagle on May 18, 2007, 10:15:09 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on May 18, 2007, 10:11:53 PM
Jimmy Rollins is a farging shortstop. Just stop it.
He's also black
And a baseball player... does that make him confused? A traitor?
More like a sellout.
I still have my Hextall jersey.
getting a goalie jersey is like getting a kickers jersey
i have a blood splattered terry carkner jersey
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 18, 2007, 10:28:16 PM
getting a goalie jersey is like getting a kickers jersey
Not even close
hextall might be the only exception but you still shouldnt have done it
Quote from: ice grillin you on May 18, 2007, 10:10:29 PM
jimmy rollins would eat ron hextall for lunch with his pimp spoon....ooooo i wear a scary mask and beat up other 5'8 145 hockey goalies...
just stop it
and hextall isnt nuts...have you ever seen or heard him off the ice...hes nuts when he has seven layers of protection and is fighting another goalie....thats just crazy dood
:-D :-D
Where can I buy one of these pimp spoons?
Hextall was on WIP a year or so ago and Cataldi was interviewing him. Angelo is like "so Ron, what are you up to these days we haven't heard much from ya" and he's like "Uhhhh, I work for the Flyers in the front office".
Cataldi looked like a douche
Quote from: SD_Eagle on May 18, 2007, 10:26:46 PM
More like a sellout.
I still have my Hextall jersey.
Allow me to lay the trump card here that is my BRIAN BOUCHER jersey. I win.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on May 19, 2007, 04:44:31 AM
Cataldi looked like a douche
Hey... first time for everything, right?
Ray Emery would kick everyones ass, end of story.
http://www.sportsline.com/nhl/story/10197217
I love Tocchet even more. The smart thing is they didnt take bets on the NHL, then again what type of person has a gambling addiction so bad that they need to bet on hockey.
New Flyers official site:
http://flyers.nhl.com
They went uniform like MLB and NBA
Minor trade: Matt Ellison to the Predators for future considerations
Supposedly there will be an announcement tomorrow that Joe Mullen (Phantoms) and Craig Berube (Flyers) will switch places on the coaching staffs.
Also, the Ottawa Sun reported that if Forsberg returns to the NHL next season, it'll be with the Predators, Avalanche or Flyers. The Flyers will not re-sign him though...
jack mcilhargey was hired as an assitant....he played for the flyers back in the late 70's for three years maybe and was a maniac...i have some classic fights of his vs the isles..specifically nystrom and gillies...he wasnt a very good fighter but would go with anyone and was a lunatic
jack mack holla
Quote from: BigEd76 on June 05, 2007, 11:32:24 PM
Supposedly there will be an announcement tomorrow that Joe Mullen (Phantoms) and Craig Berube (Flyers) will switch places on the coaching staffs.
Also, the Ottawa Sun reported that if Forsberg returns to the NHL next season, it'll be with the Predators, Avalanche or Flyers. The Flyers will not re-sign him though...
I would love to sign forsberg as a second liner for 2.5 mil 1 year deal. Heck if he plays for Modo, and we're in playoff territory, i'd love to see him brought on specifically for the playoffs. I'm not saying they're going to win a cup next year, but i'd spend the money on a 1 year deal for a player of his caliber.
nitty cent inked to a two year deal today
thats good, i was kind of worried he was gonna stay in finland
http://www.canada.com/topics/sports/hockey/story.html?id=0af77f7c-d6e3-41d1-b5a9-7ae0f924bbc0&k=79543
Rumors out there that the Flyers may try to sign Thomas Vanek away from Buffalo. If the Sabres don't match, the Flyers give up their #1, #2 and #3 picks in 2008.
It also looks like they've zeroed in on Kyle Turris with the #2 pick on Friday...
QuoteEdmonton Oilers
Strengths: After adding three of the New York Islanders top prospects at the NHL trade deadline the Oilers' offensive prospects potential is at an all-time high. Andrew Cogliano finished eighth in NCAA scoring as a sophomore, Robert Nilsson led two AHL teams in scoring last season. Taylor Chorney, Jeff Petry, Tom Gilbert and Cody Wild are a few of the impressive puck-moving, offensive-minded blue liners in the system. Thanks to an incredible rash of injuries last season, the Oilers saw 14 rookies make their debut and gain valuable experience.
Weaknesses: The Oilers are heavy on the high risk/high reward spectrum, especially up front. Goaltenders in the system appear to be developing but none are sure-fire NHL starters. Some of the players who had a chance with the big club didn't perform as expected, and Rob Schremp's rookie season in the AHL was forgettable until the final month.
Top Five Prospects: Andrew Cogliano (C), Robert Nilsson (LW), Rob Schremp (C), Taylor Chorney (D), Marc Pouliot (C)
Key Graduates: Ladislav Smid, Matt Greene, Patrick Thoresen
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/articles/9672 (http://www.hockeysfuture.com/articles/9672)
It depends what Edmonton would throw in. They have 3 first round picks, and a talented group of young players. Personally i would still hold onto Joni unless they get an offer that they could not refuse. Joni is the ultimate reward or bust. There is not any other young DMen with his offensive upside, but defensively he sucks. He sucked last year and still has 43pts. I keep thinking that the Joni we saw 2 years ago before his groin/hernia injury is the Joni that we will see. The guy was dominant, seems to go with how the team goes. When the team is playing well, he becomes that much more dangerous. The downside to that is when the team is struggling he doest step up, or play smart.
flyers traded the nashville #1 pick for hartnell and timonnen
outstanding move
Those guys suck. The pick would have been way more valuable.
I'm kidding. I love the move, obviously. Straight salary dump by Nashville?
Uh oh... from Hartnell's Wikipedia page:
QuotePresident George W. Bush is one of the people he would like to meet.
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 18, 2007, 03:12:34 PM
flyers traded the nashville #1 pick for hartnell and timonnen
outstanding move
Really? Wow.
i knew about the Timonnen stuff, but what about Hartnell, good player?
Straight salary dump by Nashville?
pretty much
both are free agents to be
basically, that trade boils down to Forsberg for Upshall, Parent, Hartnell, Timonen, and a 3rd rounder
Quote from: SunMo on June 18, 2007, 03:19:03 PM
i knew about the Timonnen stuff, but what about Hartnell, good player?
Hartnell's a 25-year-old right winger, a former Nashville #1 pick.
Here (http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/players/2418) are his stats.
hartnell is a power forward type...reminds me a lot of scott mellanby when he was young
i believe he has a concussion history tho
hes only 25 which is great
20+ goal scorer, plays both ways, 90-100 PIMs, great +/- this year and only 25. Nice.
Timonen is a bit of a risk-taker and has bad +/- numbers, but he's boys with Sami Kapanen, FWIW.
Hartnell is definitely a Philly-type player and is a great get. I hope he doesn't go the way of ol' Jello Head.
Fortunately the Flyers have always had luck with concussion-prone players...
Getting Timonen before he hit the market is a bold stroke. Well done. :yay
hartnell got a little fridge fedoruk in him
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjcW8dCt4uw
i knew that wasn't going to be a good thing
how do you get beat up by jiri fischer?
You think you could take him?
not even a question
this is a lot of money...but more than that the dual 6 year contracts are to long imo
Philly then signed Timonen to a six-year, $37.8 million contract and Hartnell to a six-year, $25.2 million deal.
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 18, 2007, 03:12:34 PM
flyers traded the nashville #1 pick for hartnell and timonnen
outstanding move
I don't know if its outstanding but I'll be interested to read/see more of them.
you mean you wanna see them play over the next six years before you deem it a good move or not?
a number one pick for two of the top FA's on the market is OUTSTANDING
tho i do question giving a 32 year old a six year deal
He could have gotten $7M/yr on the open market. The Flyers did a move like this before with Phoenix for exclusive rights to Roenick.
I think they still have over $10 to play with as well. Gomez?
4 of Nashville's good players and a 3rd rd pick for 2 months of Forsberg....ha!
Hilarity would ensue if they also got Forsberg back, but I hope they let someone else pay for his 25 healthy games a year.
Great Deal, as Ed said, it was a given that Timonen would fetch 7mil on the open market. His contract is supposedly front loaded at 8 per then goes down to 3 and 2 mill the final 2 years making him manageable. The Hartnell trade was a Banner like contract. Going at projections, they paid him. He's a fiesty Knuble.
the yearly price isnt what concerns me....six years is...and i dont believe for a second that anyone was giving him six years at 7 million per...that just wasnt gonna happen...im happy they got him but be prepared to eat possibly the last half of that contract
4 of Nashville's good players and a 3rd rd pick for 2 months of Forsberg....ha!
thats sounds good but it really didnt work that way...this deal is completely independant of the forsberg deal and the fact that nashville was going to lose both these guys in my mind doesnt even make this a trade....more like the fleysr are giving a first round pick as comepnsation for siging these two guys...they basically were restricted free agents
another black eye for the nhl as far as im concerned and more proof that they ahve about ten too many teams
True, or that the Cap doesnt work in the NHL. The problem is the crazy bidding that would have occured if these guys hit the market.
The NHL has no less than 14 too many teams.
Article from a guy i trust
QuoteBill Meltzer Crashes the Timonen & Hartnell Party
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Judging by the early response to the Flyers-Predators trade, I may be the only person with some reservations from a Philadelphia standpoint.
On the surface, it's a great deal for Philadelphia, but:
1) Timonen-- a rock solid defenseman who will add a lot to the Philadelphia blueline-- is 32 years old and the team will be taking a $6.3 million cap hit on him until he's 38. He's worth that right now. Will he be worth that five and six years out?
2) Hartnell is a heart-and-soul type forward who will help Philadelphia-- one of the poorest puck possession teams in the NHL--on the forecheck and add something to the second powerplay unit. The real question with him is whether he's a $4 million player.
I'd say yes if he solidifies the second line. If he's a third liner, no.
3) Lastly, from a draft/ player development standpoint, the Flyers have said they really want to start rounding out the depth in the organization. Well, while that can be done in later rounds, the odds are better when you are picking a little higher. After making the second overall pick, the Flyers will now not be picking again until the third round.
One way of looking at it is the Flyers beat the free agency spending rush and may have paid somewhat (but not a whole heap) less for Timonen and possibly Hartnell than they would on the open market.
Clearly, the players' agents and the Flyers were in contact (with Nashville's blessing) throughout this process. From the agents' perspective, they merely get to cash in early at figures that aren't all THAT far away from what they'd have gotten on the open market.
Another interpretation is that Philadelphia has complicated life for their scouting department to acquire two players they may well have been able sign anyway as unrestricted free agents on July 1.
His contract is supposedly front loaded at 8 per then goes down to 3 and 2 mill the final 2 years making him manageable
if this is true then it makes a lot more sense
In the NHL, they can make the deals whatever they want, but in terms of the salary cap, it's spread evenly like an NFL signing bonus...
If Timonen hit the market he likely would have gotten a max deal from someone. He was one of the top two defensive free agents and it's not as if elite defensemen like him grow on trees.
I called it in April. They made Timonen their #1 priority and rather than get into a bidding war with other teams, they got him on their own terms and didn't have to give up much to get him. Plus they get a very good player in Hartnell to boot.
Not seeing the downside here even if Bill Meltzer is.
Bill Meltzer would like the downside of your sack.
Al Meltzer's ur daddy.
Keith Jones is on WIP with Eskin floating an idea of #2 overall and Pitkanen to Tampa Bay for Brad Richards. He also thinks the Flyers are going after Gomez...
Quote from: BigEd76 on June 18, 2007, 04:59:21 PM
Keith Jones is on WIP with Eskin floating an idea of #2 overall and Pitkanen to Tampa Bay for Brad Richards. He also thinks the Flyers are going after Gomez...
Gomez and Gagne..... :drool
If the Flyers are giving up both the #2 and Pitkanen to the Lightning, the player coming back better have the initials V.L.
Quote from: BigEd76 on June 18, 2007, 10:35:08 AM
It also looks like they've zeroed in on Kyle Turris with the #2 pick on Friday...
Chicago might take him #1 overall (http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/nhl)
Outstanding trade, the 23rd pick is a wash. Only downside is Timonen's age. Oh well.
Quote from: BigEd76 on June 18, 2007, 04:59:21 PM
Keith Jones is on WIP with Eskin floating an idea of #2 overall and Pitkanen to Tampa Bay for Brad Richards. He also thinks the Flyers are going after Gomez...
or maybe its for Lecavalier. ha.
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 18, 2007, 03:48:48 PM
how do you get beat up by jiri fischer?
Isn't he the dude who had to have CPR done on him on the Detroit bench?
Same one, crazy thing is that was just a great hit right on the nose.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on June 18, 2007, 06:54:10 PM
Same one, crazy thing is that was just a great hit right on the nose.
I hate to break it to you, but if you really want to hurt someone with a punch to the face, that's where you aim.
Quote from: FastFreddie on June 18, 2007, 07:22:03 PM
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on June 18, 2007, 06:54:10 PM
Same one, crazy thing is that was just a great hit right on the nose.
I hate to break it to you, but if you really want to hurt someone with a punch to the face, that's where you aim.
Thats where i hit mrs ff all night long
Don't lie and claim you've ever done anything in bed longer than 17 seconds or so.
zinged
As much as I want the Flyers to get Briere, I think Gomez might be a better option if for no other reason his acquisition makes the Flyers stronger and the Devils weaker at the same time.
Get Gomez and Drury.
Drury to San Jose is all but a done deal, plus there's not enough cap space to sign both. I'd be thrilled with Gomez.
gomez is three years younger too
Buffalo won't lose both Briere & Drury. If Drury goes to San Jose then Briere should be a lock to stay in Buffalo because Buffalo could offer him a max contract.
Like I said, I prefer Briere but getting Gomez away from the Devils would be excellent.
I prefer Gomez only because I have more friends that are Devils fans than Sabres fans.
you have friends?
yeah
but he moved
Quote from: SD_Eagle on June 19, 2007, 08:20:29 AM
you have friends?
Ha. I actually realized I left myself open for that. Good work.
I'm pretty sure that Briere either stays in Buffalo or goes to Montreal. I dont want him here at all, i think he's a product of the buffalo system. I'd rather get Gomez. If he's outpriced, i'd rather get Forsberg again on a 1 year rental, then get someone like Iginla next year
yeah i dont want the flyers going all out this offseason just becaus they sucked last eyar and wanna create a big buzz...they arent gonna do anything this season...id rather have the team improve and mesh and then add a piece like iginal or two next year and hopefully make a two year run at the cup before birons contract is up
what they desperately need more than anything tho is a defensemen or two....even with geting timmonen...unless somehow all these young defensemen develop at one time...but thats highly unlikely
Quote from: FastFreddie on June 19, 2007, 08:18:37 AM
I prefer Gomez only because I have more friends that are Devils fans than Sabres fans.
If the Flyers stole Gomez I'd flood D@TL's in-box on the EMB with the happy news.
:-D
I hate the stillupfronty ass Devils and their fans almost as much as I hate the Cowboys.
Devils fans will be busy not showing up at the new arena this fall
TSN's top 60 (http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature/?fid=11063&hubname=)
http://flyers.nhl.com/team/app/?service=page&page=NewsPage&articleid=319792
Quote from: SunMo on June 19, 2007, 04:03:07 PM
http://flyers.nhl.com/team/app/?service=page&page=NewsPage&articleid=319792
When did Spadaro start writing for the Flyers?
ha...seriously
we are so happy and we are gonna room together and give lots of reach arounds and salad tosses...philly is gonna be so awesome!!
Quotesaid Hartnell. "Looking on paper at the guys in Philadelphia right now, we have a lot of heart,
what an douche.
Quote from: phattymatty on June 19, 2007, 09:16:16 PM
Quotesaid Hartnell. "Looking on paper at the guys in Philadelphia right now, we have a lot of heart,
what an douche.
They actually do when you look at the younger guys like Upshall, Eager, Richards, Knuble, Sami. Then when you look at D you have Kuku as a give all type of player.
number one heart doesnt win you shtein
number two every team in the league has four or five guys that have a lot of heart (whatever that even means)
gayness abounds
Quote from: ice grillin you on June 19, 2007, 09:50:38 PM
number one heart doesnt win you shtein
number two every team in the league has four or five guys that have a lot of heart (whatever that even means)
gayness abounds
Did you see Anaheim play?
yeah they had the most talented team in the nhl by far
talent and/or great goaltending wins in hockey
meanwhile heart gets you the 2nd overall pick
Quote from: rjs246 on June 19, 2007, 08:00:54 AM
Get Gomez and Drury.
I initially wanted Briere as 1st choice, but then realizing we have no official Captain on the team, I gravitated to Drury. If we can Gomez for low ball $, ok...but I think he's good due to the system the Devils play...maybe not for O&B.
gomez is arguably the number on FA on the market....no low ball there...hes getting a monster deal
Quote from: dis12 on June 20, 2007, 06:22:44 AM
Quote from: rjs246 on June 19, 2007, 08:00:54 AM
Get Gomez and Drury.
I initially wanted Briere as 1st choice, but then realizing we have no official Captain on the team, I gravitated to Drury. If we can Gomez for low ball $, ok...but I think he's good due to the system the Devils play...maybe not for O&B.
Timonen was Nashville's Captain last season, so they could always go that route. Most teams won't give the C to a new free agent...I'm expecting Kapanen to get it. Regardless, team Captain is a useless title that serves no purpose aside from arguing with the refs on ice when there is a penalty.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on June 20, 2007, 09:25:33 AM
Regardless, team Captain is a useless title that serves no purpose aside from arguing with the refs on ice when there is a penalty.
Keith Primeau says arhgkjfakjfdkldjlla!
Quote from: SD_Eagle on June 20, 2007, 09:25:33 AM
Quote from: dis12 on June 20, 2007, 06:22:44 AM
Quote from: rjs246 on June 19, 2007, 08:00:54 AM
Get Gomez and Drury.
I initially wanted Briere as 1st choice, but then realizing we have no official Captain on the team, I gravitated to Drury. If we can Gomez for low ball $, ok...but I think he's good due to the system the Devils play...maybe not for O&B.
Timonen was Nashville's Captain last season, so they could always go that route. Most teams won't give the C to a new free agent...I'm expecting Kapanen to get it. Regardless, team Captain is a useless title that serves no purpose aside from arguing with the refs on ice when there is a penalty.
Sami should get it, when his contract is up, Richards gets the "C"
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on June 20, 2007, 09:41:30 AM
Quote from: SD_Eagle on June 20, 2007, 09:25:33 AM
Regardless, team Captain is a useless title that serves no purpose aside from arguing with the refs on ice when there is a penalty.
Keith Primeau says arhgkjfakjfdkldjlla!
there have been other useful captains in history:Captain Kangaroo
Captain (& Tenille)
Captain Jack (he will get you high tonight)
Captain Hawkeye Pierce
Captain Morgan
captain underpants
Captain Insano (http://www.gotwavs.com/php/sounds/?id=gog&media=WAVS&type=Movies&movie=Waterboy"e=iam31yearsold.txt&file=iam31yearsold.wav)
Quote from: BigEd76 on June 20, 2007, 01:32:50 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on June 20, 2007, 09:41:30 AMKeith Primeau says 'whoa, I'm dizzy again'
I still would have loved to see Primeau play with the crazy tinted visor
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on June 20, 2007, 11:59:53 AM
Captain Insano (http://www.gotwavs.com/php/sounds/?id=gog&media=WAVS&type=Movies&movie=Waterboy"e=iam31yearsold.txt&file=iam31yearsold.wav)
aka the Big Show
Make "the gawd" Richards captain.
draft time
Sounds like the Flyers might take the New Jersey kid instead of whoever is left from Kane/Turris...
Sounds like they're working the phones to make a deal. TV coverage mentioned talks with the Kings and Maple Leafs.
Leafs turned down Steen and 13 for 2
damn
flyers should trade now
classic flyer mistake
Should have taken Turris
yep
of course they cant pass up the plodding american power forward
Great pick.
Newest future Flyer:
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/48/fullj.getty-74860263rb006_2007_nhl_entr_8_49_12_pm.jpg)
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/c8/fullj.getty-74860263rb001_2007_nhl_entr_8_29_13_pm.jpg)
(http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070622/capt.b9b1b8f0349f43bfacfd3cb44433d657.nhl_draft_hockey_ohks103.jpg)
QuoteProspect Profile: James Van Riemsdyk
Birthdate: May 4, 1989
Position: Left Wing
Height/Weight: 6'3" / 200lb
Shoots: Left
Current Team: US National Team Developmental Program
ISS Ranking: #2 overall
CSB Ranking: #3 North America
[NHL Connect Profile] [Hockey's Future Profile]
Nickname: Reemer
Favorite TV Show: The OC
Favorite Movie: Happy Gilmore
Favorite Music: John Mayer, Jack Johnson, Bruce Spingsteen, OAR
Quote: "Success is never final, and failure is never fatal." - Nick Saban
Post Draft Plans: University of New Hampshire
Favorite NHL Memory: Game seven of the 1994 Stanley Cup Finals (Rangers defeat the Canucks)
i dont think ive ever felt older than when i was watching the draft tonight
Nickname: Reemer
Favorite TV Show: The OC
Gavin Floyd is that you?
I hate this kid already.
I have socks older than this kid.
Should have taken Turris, this is going to haunt them 5 years from now. JVR isnt going to suck but he isnt going to have half the career of Turis or Cherepanov. The worst part is the Penguins got Esposito, and the Rags got Cherepanov both at great value
latest word is the Flyers will trade Pitkanen to Edmonton for rights to Gomez.
1989...jesus farg that makes me feel old.
hockey nicknames anger me
I noticed when watching CSN this morning that Jeremy Roenick's teams (CHI, PHI, PHX, LA) were the top 4 teams to draft. What this means? Nothing other than interesting me.
Quote from: dis12 on June 23, 2007, 09:41:25 AM
latest word is the Flyers will trade Pitkanen to Edmonton for rights to Gomez.
That rumor has been floating around for the past day or two, Gomez is still a Devil even though the Oilers have been granted permission to talk to him. Regardless, trading Pitkanen for him would be retarded. I'd hope Holmgren would call their bluff considering they have no intention of signing him. Even if we lose him its not like we were only a Gomez away from the Cup.
Flyers traded one of their 3rd rounders today and a 2nd next season to Carolina for their 2nd - they chose defenseman Kevin Marshall
The NHL set the cap for next season at $50.3M.
QuoteNHL salary cap rises to $50.3 million next season
Associated Press
Updated: June 29, 2007, 3:17 PM ET
NEW YORK -- The NHL salary cap will rise to $50.3 million per team next season, an increase of $6.3 million from last season, the league and players' union announced Friday.
It's the second increase under the collective bargaining agreement that ended the yearlong lockout in 2005.
The key issue in the lockout that forced the cancellation of the 2004-05 season was the owners' insistence to include a salary cap and the players' association's unwillingness to accept it. The union finally gave in, and has had a financial windfall.
Teams don't have to spend up to the ceiling, but each club's payroll must be at least $34.3 million. The range from top to bottom is always $16 million.
The first season following the lost year featured a cap of $39 million, and that figure rose to $44 million for the 2005-06 season.
Cool. That gives them $9.6M left to sign Gomez and/or a combination of others.
Rumor is that Gomez is the #1 target :yay
how much under the cap are the Isles and Rangers? Rumor is that's where he's going. I'll be happy with any of the top 3 centers.
i dont want any of the centers i dont think...id rather get a another defenseman or two for less money..their defense is still mad suspect
Hmmm...
QuoteSabres' Briere to test waters; free agency starts tomorrow
Daily News Wire Services
Co-captain Daniel Briere has broken off negotiations with the Buffalo Sabres, deciding to test the free-agent market when it opens tomorrow.
"We've made the decision to go to July 1 and sit down and seek all options at that point," agent Pat Brisson told the Associated Press yesterday.
The Flyers, Los Angeles Kings, New York Rangers and Montreal Canadiens are among numerous teams with salary-cap space expected to make offers to Briere, especially with the announcement yesterday that the cap is expected to rise about $6.3 million to $50.3 million.
Briere particularly has been linked with the Flyers, where he could rejoin his friend and former teammate, goalie Martin Biron. The Canadiens are also high in mix; Briere is a French Canadian, who grew up 2 hours from Montreal.
Briere's decision, which came a day after he traveled to Los Angeles to meet with Brisson, will make the player one of the most sought-after free agents. He's expected to attract offers above $6 million, coming off a career-high season in which he finished 10th in the NHL with 95 points (32 goals, 63 assists).
The Sabres waited more than a month after their season ended before finally making Briere an offer Wednesday, reportedly a 5-year, $25 million deal.
"We haven't closed the door on Buffalo at all," Brisson said. "There's no animosity; there's a lot of respect there."
Buffalo stands to lose both co-captains this offseason, with Chris Drury also eligible to become a free agent.
Briere appeared in his first career All-Star Game this season and earned the game's MVP honors. He also produced in the clutch, scoring 10 game-winners over the past two seasons.
ESPN conducted a poll and one of the questions was where a certain someone might end up. Here's the results:
Quote4) Where will Daniel Briere land?
35.8% Philadelphia Flyers
29.4% Other
18.2% Buffalo Sabres
16.6% New York Rangers
:deion
there are some reports that Brierre has signed with the Habs and that the Flyers and Rangers are fighting it out over Gomez
Quote from: SunMo on July 01, 2007, 02:16:08 PM
there are some reports that Brierre has signed with the Habs and that the Flyers and Rangers are fighting it out over Gomez
I guess thats to be expected, I read awhile back he wanted to go back to Canada.
Gomez is the one I wanted the whole time. Throw a max deal at him or whatever it takes. Either way, Devils fans are getting screwed hard by one of their stars which will be some solace if the Flyers don't land Gomez.
The Flyers signed Briere.
http://www.sportsnet.ca/
this says he's coming to Philly
TSN is saying EIGHT years, between 6 and 7 million
http://www.tsn.ca/
Years are big, $ is lower than I thought though. I imagine the contract is frontloaded so they'll be able to get out of it if he doesn't pan out.
Either way, I think he's unquestionably the most talented of the C's that were available. He's a very good player and I think he'll fit in well.
Damn thats as long as DiPietro's contract.
I know I should be happy but I just didn't want the Flyers to throw this kind of money at this guy.
Quote from: NGM on July 01, 2007, 03:55:49 PM
Damn thats as long as DiPietro's contract.
I know I should be happy but I just didn't want the Flyers to throw this kind of money at this guy.
DiPietro got 15 years, i think.
I know what you're saying, but I don't think you could go into next season with Carter as your top center. Briere might not be the ideal #1 center, but he's an established guy who can score.
I would have preferred Gomez, someone who could make his wings better.
Briere has a monster career year, one that is a large amount over his normal production. I fear that he won't just fall short of those numbers, but won't even approach them.
Tim P. is saying 8 years, 52 million
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 03:59:52 PM
I would have preferred Gomez, someone who could make his wings better.
Briere has a monster career year, one that is a large amount over his normal production. I fear that he won't just fall short of those numbers, but won't even approach them.
He averaged over a point a game two years ago as well, though he missed 25 games. The fact of the matter is the new NHL is geared towards players like Briere. He's small, agile, has good vision but can score as well. He had over 30 goals last year, but still dished out 60 assists. My guess is he'll have between 25-30 goals next year with 50 or so assists. He should fit in well with Gagne and he instantly improves the PP unit and is also decent in a shootout.
even though the contract is long, the cap hit is only 6.5 a year, which is under what everybody thought he'd average per year.
one scary thing is that the contract has a full no movement clause, which could be trouble towards the end of the contract.
Nothing official yet. I'll wait until I see him put the jersey on at the Wach Center.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 03:59:52 PM
I would have preferred Gomez, someone who could make his wings better.
Briere has a monster career year, one that is a large amount over his normal production. I fear that he won't just fall short of those numbers, but won't even approach them.
Exactly, I really don't see him being a set-up man for Gagne who needs one.
Either way, the hockey season can't get here soon enough.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 04:06:54 PM
Nothing official yet. I'll wait until I see him put the jersey on at the Wach Center.
TSN and ESPNews have both reported it with TSN giving contract numbers
Let's just say I have my meatcicle out but I haven't started stroking it yet.
:-*
Quote from: NGM on July 01, 2007, 04:08:52 PM
Exactly, I really don't see him being a set-up man for Gagne who needs one.
Either way, the hockey season can't get here soon enough.
and exactly who has been Gagne's set-up man recently (ex-Forsberg)? Briere's play should work wonders in turing around this entire team, not just as gags setup man.
of course I pick this year to give up season tix.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 04:11:34 PM
Let's just say I have my meatcicle out but I haven't started stroking it yet.
:-*
Because he hasn't been spotted at the NovaCare Complex?
LeCharles Briere?
Sounds remarkably french, and is also my father.
Responding to dis, when is the only time Gagne reached 50 goals?
Sounds like Gomez to the Rangers and Rafalski to the Red Wings too, so the Devils took a major hit...
Supposedly this Briere contract has a no-trade clause and is $10M in the first year, but it's still only $6.5 against the cap
According to an interview with TSN, Briere said he was offered $7M/yr in other places but wanted to come here. He did say Biron being here played a factor...
Why is it that the hockey team is the only team in this town that realizes they're in the 4th largest media market?
Flyers just made another trade:
Pitkanen and Sanderson to Edmonton for Oiler captain Jason Smith and forward Joffrey Lupul (was part of the Pronger trade)
NICE
Flyers also give up a 3rd round pick
Best Flyers day in ages. Incredible trade and great signing.
I guess Timonen's going to have to find someone else to mentor.
What is the deal with this Lupul guy, is he any good?
the flyers love defensive defensmen sooooo much
The Smith/Lupul deal is absolute highway robbery. Holmgren should be reported immediately to the FBI. :-D
Lupul was excellent in Anaheim before being traded to Edmonton before last season.
Smith is a good defenseman who actually plays solid defense. In other words, unlike Joni he does precisely what he's supposed to do behind the blue line.
Lupul is good, but Joni has the potential to be great. Sure he's a tard but his level is scary.
The Rangers supposedly signed Drury along with Gomez.
Man they are pathetic. It is going to be so funny when they don't even make the playoffs, let alone contend.
Lupul is good, but Joni has the potential to be great. Sure he's a tard but his level is scary.
what he said
If Pitkanen realizes his potential, the Flyers will regret this trade for years.
Quote from: King Cole on July 01, 2007, 07:46:03 PM
The Rangers supposedly signed Drury along with Gomez.
Man they are pathetic. It is going to be so funny when they don't even make the playoffs, let alone contend.
How many cups do Drury and Gomez have between them? These were easily the best signings the Rags have ever had. 2 leaders who produce in the playoffs.
The Rangers posted both of them on their official roster page:
http://www.newyorkrangers.com/team/roster.asp (http://www.newyorkrangers.com/team/roster.asp)
Wow. I don't see how they can afford both of them plus Jagr & Shanahan.
Whatever, though. The more the merrier. Should make for some epic battles.
i cant believe they got drury from the west coast...and gomez....the advantage ny teams have is ridiculous...and that goes for any sport
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:05:33 PM
If Pitkanen realizes his potential, the Flyers will regret this trade for years.
He hasn't thus far. What makes you think he'll discover greatness in Edmonton?
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 08:14:43 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:05:33 PM
If Pitkanen realizes his potential, the Flyers will regret this trade for years.
He hasn't thus far. What makes you think he'll discover greatness in Edmonton?
I'm a Philadelphia sports fan. Do I need anything more?
Also, the Flyers do not have a good track record of developing defensemen. Who was the last big-time defenseman that developed on the Flyers?
It's not a lock (hence the "IF"), but if he does develop, the Oilers will have a bona fide #1 defenseman, something the Flyers have been lacking since Eric Desjardins' prime.
Who cares what he does in Edmonton? He had ample opportunity in Philly and proved he couldn't cut it.
C'est la vie. Time to move on.
A question for the actual Flyers/hockey fans (in other words, shut up MDS):
The Flyers have collected a bunch of talent this offseason. They've sacrificed a young, talented and struggling defenseman and several draft picks for established players (some still young, some older). They've spent a lot of their cap space, current and future, on help that will cost them big money in the future, perhaps long after they're actually benefitting the team.
To me, it almost seems as if Holmgren is loading up for a Cup run in the next year or two, going for broke with a team that had the WORST record in the NHL this year.
Where do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
On the surface, these moves bring the Flyers forward quite a bit from last season. I'm not convinced they are a bona-fide contender next year, and may have actually mortgaged the future quite a bit for these short term gains.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 08:12:54 PM
The Rangers posted both of them on their official roster page:
http://www.newyorkrangers.com/team/roster.asp (http://www.newyorkrangers.com/team/roster.asp)
Wow. I don't see how they can afford both of them plus Jagr & Shanahan.
Whatever, though. The more the merrier. Should make for some epic battles.
Shanahan is a UFA and the Rangers may not be able to sign their RFAs...
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:25:42 PMWhere do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
Snider teams don't sit around for 3 years and rebuild. I think the Flyers needed to shake things up from the disaster of last season and did. I think they're better than the Islanders, and you can never count the Devils out of anything but they got hit hard today and will be playing in a half-empty new arena. The Penguins and Rangers are still better as of now...
Quote from: BigEd76 on July 01, 2007, 08:26:02 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 08:12:54 PM
The Rangers posted both of them on their official roster page:
http://www.newyorkrangers.com/team/roster.asp (http://www.newyorkrangers.com/team/roster.asp)
Wow. I don't see how they can afford both of them plus Jagr & Shanahan.
Whatever, though. The more the merrier. Should make for some epic battles.
Shanahan is a UFA and the Rangers may not be able to sign their RFAs...
[igy] There is no salary cap for the Rangers. [/igy]
to be fair geo edm did go for janne niinima and he was the same bust that youre saying pitkanen could be....but i saw both and imo and of course i could be wrong but janne is not pitkanen....i honestly thought and i still kinda do that joni will win a vezina....basically what im saying is that i think this trade is at best a huge risk and at worst a mistake
FWIW, Keith Jones thinks Pitkanen doesn't have the brains and will never live up to his promise.....said there's only so many ways and times that you can teach something to a guy before giving up...
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:25:42 PM
A question for the actual Flyers/hockey fans (in other words, shut up MDS):
The Flyers have collected a bunch of talent this offseason. They've sacrificed a young, talented and struggling defenseman and several draft picks for established players (some still young, some older). They've spent a lot of their cap space, current and future, on help that will cost them big money in the future, perhaps long after they're actually benefitting the team.
To me, it almost seems as if Holmgren is loading up for a Cup run in the next year or two, going for broke with a team that had the WORST record in the NHL this year.
Where do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
On the surface, these moves bring the Flyers forward quite a bit from last season. I'm not convinced they are a bona-fide contender next year, and may have actually mortgaged the future quite a bit for these short term gains.
Not better than the Penguins, Sens, maybe Thrashers. The Flyers usually are good against the Thrashers straight up though, but they really choked in the playoffs. I just have a hard time seeing an Atlanta team as a contender.
Flyers are better than the Rangers, Devils now though. It is all slipping away for the Devils, but at least they got their Cups.
igy] There is no salary cap for the Rangers. [/igy]
haha...well done
but thats the skins and lil danni
still tho if theres anyone that doesnt believe that ny teams have a distinct advantage in every major pro sports league (no that doesnt count arena league easy) then youre being naive...theres a reason the head offices of all four major pro johnsons are in mahatten
FWIW, Keith Jones thinks Pitkanen doesn't have the brains and will never live up to his promise.....said there's only so many ways and times that you can teach something to a guy before giving up...
thats a fair assesment but hes going on one year where the team was the worst in the league and ignoring all the promise that joni showed in his other two years...so for how long and for how "many times" did they really try and teach him where he didnt listen...to me it sounds as tho keith is pushing the company line here
I'm not disagreeing with you, but what do you think the advantage for New York is in salary capped leagues? The cap was invented to prevent big market teams to pull Yankees bullshtein. New York isn't even the most popular city for pro sports according to ESPN radio, San Diego is.
Despite all that, I still agree with you for some reason.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 08:22:46 PM
Who cares what he does in Edmonton? He had ample opportunity in Philly and proved he couldn't cut it.
C'est la vie. Time to move on.
"Ample opportunity?" The kid doesn't turn 24 until the beginning of next season, and two years ago he was considered a future NORRIS winner by many experts.
Now he's traded for yet another 30+ year old defensemen and another 2nd/3rd winger, both of which the Flyers seem fond of collecting.
The Flyers' defensive corps now includes:
Kimmo Timonen - 32 years old
Derian Hatcher - 35 years old
Mike Rathje - 33 years old
Denis Gauthier - 31 yeas old in Oct.
Jason Smith - 33 years old
Forgive me for saying that this reminds me of the "rebuilding" practices of the Washington taterskins that we enjoy laughing at so much.
This TEAM was in LAST PLACE in the whole freaking NHL last year, and the Flyers sacrifice youth to gain more help. In the short term, the Flyers will probably be better this year (could they be any worse?). However, do the moves make it more likely that the Flyers will win a Cup in the next 5-10 years. Not in my opinion.
For some reason I thought Shanahan had re-signed. I guess not.
He still wants to come back to the Rangers although now I don't see any way they can re-sign him even with the cap exception they'll get.
PS: Goalies win the Vezina Trophy, Geo, not defensemen. ;)
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 08:41:17 PM
For some reason I thought Shanahan had re-signed. I guess not.
He still wants to come back to the Rangers although now I don't see any way they can re-sign him even with the cap exception they'll get.
PS: Goalies win the Vezina Trophy, Geo, not defensemen. ;)
DOH! Norris - that trophy.
Damn this trying to type with a screaming (in play) 3 year old and a screaming (in hunger) 7-week old.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:40:21 PM
"Ample opportunity?" The kid doesn't turn 24 until the beginning of next season, and two years ago he was considered a future NORRIS winner by many experts.
Now he's traded for yet another 30+ year old defensemen and another 2nd/3rd winger, both of which the Flyers seem fond of collecting.
The Flyers' defensive corps now includes:
Kimmo Timonen - 32 years old
Derian Hatcher - 35 years old
Mike Rathje - 33 years old
Denis Gauthier - 31 yeas old in Oct.
Jason Smith - 33 years old
Forgive me for saying that this reminds me of the "rebuilding" practices of the Washington taterskins that we enjoy laughing at so much.
This TEAM was in LAST PLACE in the whole freaking NHL last year, and the Flyers sacrifice youth to gain more help. In the short term, the Flyers will probably be better this year (could they be any worse?). However, do the moves make it more likely that the Flyers will win a Cup in the next 5-10 years. Not in my opinion.
on point
this is what i was saying yesterday when i wished they would layed off one of the centers and go for a couple defenseman...it seems like the flyers are trying to make an attendance statement not a make the team better statement...they needed some more defenseman way more than they needed a soft batch center...look at buffalo and why they lost the last few years and they had briere AND drury
The Flyers also have Picard & Coburn plus a host of talented defensemen in the pipeline not the least of whom is Ryan Parent.
Yes, they do have a lot of veteran defensemen but what they gave up in Joni isn't exactly franchise-shattering. They got a very good defenseman in return plus a guy I really like in Lupul.
I'm happy with the deal. I wish Joni well, of course because like you I think he's got potential but he never lived up to that potential in Philly and things only appeared to be going further south with him there.
They have a nice mix of young and old now. If you try to have 15 young guys learning at the same time, you get garbage like this past season...
BTW, they've now acquired 3 captains this offseason to go along with their 3 alternates...
ha...those alternate capitans are uber important
easy just when i thought we had you on the phils side youre homertastic for the flyers now
farg
TEH SOUL ARE GOING TO WIN TEH ARENA BOWL
In case anyone's interested, here's some clips from the press conference:
Holmgren on Briere (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/flyers/070107-HolmgrenonBriere.wmv)
Stevens is excited (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/flyers/070107-Stevens.wmv)
Snider likes the job Holmgren has done (http://philadelphia.comcastsportsnet.com/media/video/flyers/070107-Snider.wmv)
igs, listen to Stevens' comments about the captains. I was just saying that if they didn't want to give it to Gagne or Kapanen, they don't have to...
they shouldn't give it to Gagne, he doesn't want it, never has
If you think back to where this team stood before they traded Forsberg and compare it to where they stand now, it's absolutely incredible.
They've literally made wholesale changes and in most instances they've upgraded the team tremendously.
And I agree about Gagne. No need to slap the 'C' on someone who doesn't want it.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 01, 2007, 09:49:08 PM
If you think back to where this team stood before they traded Forsberg and compare it to where they stand now, it's absolutely incredible.
They've literally made wholesale changes and in most instances they've upgraded the team tremendously.
And I agree about Gagne. No need to slap the 'C' on someone who doesn't want it.
At the end of the year he was quoted as saying that he is okay with being the Captain now. He said before he wasn't ready for it, but this year matured him a lot and he thinks he could handle it now. So I think Gagne is the guy next year.
(http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l10/baorao/phillies.png)
double threat!
How's his curveball? Hell, he can't be worse than Geary, Mesa or one of the other Arsonists.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:25:42 PM
A question for the actual Flyers/hockey fans (in other words, shut up MDS):
The Flyers have collected a bunch of talent this offseason. They've sacrificed a young, talented and struggling defenseman and several draft picks for established players (some still young, some older). They've spent a lot of their cap space, current and future, on help that will cost them big money in the future, perhaps long after they're actually benefitting the team.
To me, it almost seems as if Holmgren is loading up for a Cup run in the next year or two, going for broke with a team that had the WORST record in the NHL this year.
Where do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
On the surface, these moves bring the Flyers forward quite a bit from last season. I'm not convinced they are a bona-fide contender next year, and may have actually mortgaged the future quite a bit for these short term gains.
I think you are drastically overrating what the Flyers have let go. The core of this team is extraordinarily young. The defense isn't as young, but Rathje is gone and Gauthier will probably be moved. This team is also loaded with prospects and is in very good shape for the future. Also, the cap is consistently going up, to the point where most teams in the NHL won't be able to afford spending the max amount, meaning teams like the Flyers/Rangers/Red Wings/etc will be positioned better in the future again to buy whoever they want. I think you are seeing Holmgren going after younger players with a lot of promise, while mixing them in with proven vets. This isn't Clarke going after Adam Oates.
Furthermore, what people are missing about the EDM deal is that they aren't just dumping an uberprospect in Pitkanen and getting no promise in return. Lupul scored 28 goals when he was TWENTY TWO. He is only 24 now. He had a down year in EDM last year obviously, but he should be a 30 goal scorer in Philly.
I think this team is probably 5th or 6th in the East now, with the chance to compete for a cup within 2-3 years.
Lupul scored 28 goals when he was TWENTY TWO. He is only 24 now. He had a down year in EDM last year obviously, but he should be a 30 goal scorer in Philly.
lupul scored 28 when he was 22 and when he was 24 hes scored 16 and was a minus 29 as a friggin forward...but pitkanen is expendable because he had the same down season lupul had last year...i dont follow...and pitkanen is a defenseman which are much more valuable than forwards plus hes way higher rated as a player in general
the spin zone is in full effect
i guess pitkanen "should" be a top line defenseman in edm
I hate the word (or prefix) uber. Fingernails on the chalkboard (of course, my school no longer has any chalkboards) annoying.
Carry on.
Quote from: Eagles_Legendz on July 01, 2007, 10:46:51 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:25:42 PM
A question for the actual Flyers/hockey fans (in other words, shut up MDS):
The Flyers have collected a bunch of talent this offseason. They've sacrificed a young, talented and struggling defenseman and several draft picks for established players (some still young, some older). They've spent a lot of their cap space, current and future, on help that will cost them big money in the future, perhaps long after they're actually benefitting the team.
To me, it almost seems as if Holmgren is loading up for a Cup run in the next year or two, going for broke with a team that had the WORST record in the NHL this year.
Where do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
On the surface, these moves bring the Flyers forward quite a bit from last season. I'm not convinced they are a bona-fide contender next year, and may have actually mortgaged the future quite a bit for these short term gains.
I think you are drastically overrating what the Flyers have let go. The core of this team is extraordinarily young. The defense isn't as young, but Rathje is gone and Gauthier will probably be moved. This team is also loaded with prospects and is in very good shape for the future. Also, the cap is consistently going up, to the point where most teams in the NHL won't be able to afford spending the max amount, meaning teams like the Flyers/Rangers/Red Wings/etc will be positioned better in the future again to buy whoever they want. I think you are seeing Holmgren going after younger players with a lot of promise, while mixing them in with proven vets. This isn't Clarke going after Adam Oates.
Furthermore, what people are missing about the EDM deal is that they aren't just dumping an uberprospect in Pitkanen and getting no promise in return. Lupul scored 28 goals when he was TWENTY TWO. He is only 24 now. He had a down year in EDM last year obviously, but he should be a 30 goal scorer in Philly.
I think this team is probably 5th or 6th in the East now, with the chance to compete for a cup within 2-3 years.
And Kyle Calder had 26 goals as a 24-year-old with the freaking Chicago Blackhawks. Where did that get him with the Flyers last year?
Before you notch any player (other than Gagne and Briere, and perhaps Knuble) for 30 goals, you'd better make them prove it.
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 01, 2007, 11:00:52 PM
Lupul scored 28 goals when he was TWENTY TWO. He is only 24 now. He had a down year in EDM last year obviously, but he should be a 30 goal scorer in Philly.
lupul scored 28 when he was 22 and when he was 24 hes scored 16 and was a minus 29 as a friggin forward...but pitkanen is expendable because he had the same down season lupul had last year...i dont follow...and pitkanen is a defenseman which are much more valuable than forwards plus hes way higher rated as a player in general
the spin zone is in full effect
i guess pitkanen "should" be a top line defenseman in edm
Lupul and Pitkanen were both equally disappointing for their respective teams last year. There is no doubting eithers talent, as both were top ten picks in the last five years. I happen to think Lupul will do very well on a line with Briere and Gagne. You certainly don't need to share that sentiment.
Regardless, Pitkanen was never a good defensive defenseman and he probably never will be. He is a poor man's Sheldon Souray right now. I think Lupul will help the team more than Pitkanen would have the next few years, but again, that's just my opinion. I think the team is set pretty well for next season.
Here is the age breakdown of their projected lines:
1: Gagne (27) Briere (29) Lupul (24)
2: Hartnell (25) Carter (24) Knuble (34)
3: Upshall (24) Richards (24) Kapanen (35)
They also have Giroux/Downie/Nodl etc as forwards who should be ready in the next few years and Parent as a great D prospect.
Timonen and Smith is finally a legit #1 pairing. Hatcher and Coburn played well together last year, and Kukkonen and Picard should be fine.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 11:14:30 PM
Quote from: Eagles_Legendz on July 01, 2007, 10:46:51 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:25:42 PM
A question for the actual Flyers/hockey fans (in other words, shut up MDS):
The Flyers have collected a bunch of talent this offseason. They've sacrificed a young, talented and struggling defenseman and several draft picks for established players (some still young, some older). They've spent a lot of their cap space, current and future, on help that will cost them big money in the future, perhaps long after they're actually benefitting the team.
To me, it almost seems as if Holmgren is loading up for a Cup run in the next year or two, going for broke with a team that had the WORST record in the NHL this year.
Where do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
On the surface, these moves bring the Flyers forward quite a bit from last season. I'm not convinced they are a bona-fide contender next year, and may have actually mortgaged the future quite a bit for these short term gains.
I think you are drastically overrating what the Flyers have let go. The core of this team is extraordinarily young. The defense isn't as young, but Rathje is gone and Gauthier will probably be moved. This team is also loaded with prospects and is in very good shape for the future. Also, the cap is consistently going up, to the point where most teams in the NHL won't be able to afford spending the max amount, meaning teams like the Flyers/Rangers/Red Wings/etc will be positioned better in the future again to buy whoever they want. I think you are seeing Holmgren going after younger players with a lot of promise, while mixing them in with proven vets. This isn't Clarke going after Adam Oates.
Furthermore, what people are missing about the EDM deal is that they aren't just dumping an uberprospect in Pitkanen and getting no promise in return. Lupul scored 28 goals when he was TWENTY TWO. He is only 24 now. He had a down year in EDM last year obviously, but he should be a 30 goal scorer in Philly.
I think this team is probably 5th or 6th in the East now, with the chance to compete for a cup within 2-3 years.
And Kyle Calder had 26 goals as a 24-year-old with the freaking Chicago Blackhawks. Where did that get him with the Flyers last year?
Before you notch any player (other than Gagne and Briere, and perhaps Knuble) for 30 goals, you'd better make them prove it.
Actually, Calder was 27 and he was a 5th round pick. Not quite the same as a 22 year old who was the 7th overall pick in '02, but I do agree that it is safer to take a wait and see approach. I'm simply saying its not like they are getting washed up players in return for Pitkanen. Lupul is highly regarded as well.
Quote from: Eagles_Legendz on July 01, 2007, 11:19:18 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 11:14:30 PM
Quote from: Eagles_Legendz on July 01, 2007, 10:46:51 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on July 01, 2007, 08:25:42 PM
A question for the actual Flyers/hockey fans (in other words, shut up MDS):
The Flyers have collected a bunch of talent this offseason. They've sacrificed a young, talented and struggling defenseman and several draft picks for established players (some still young, some older). They've spent a lot of their cap space, current and future, on help that will cost them big money in the future, perhaps long after they're actually benefitting the team.
To me, it almost seems as if Holmgren is loading up for a Cup run in the next year or two, going for broke with a team that had the WORST record in the NHL this year.
Where do you think this team stacks up in the Eastern Confrerence as is? Are they a playoff team? A possible division champion? Where do you think they finish (1-8 or out)? Do they have a realistic chance of actually challenging for the Cup? Or are these moves of a team frantically trying to keep waning interest of a fan base that began to stay home in large numbers as the team limped through the schedule?
On the surface, these moves bring the Flyers forward quite a bit from last season. I'm not convinced they are a bona-fide contender next year, and may have actually mortgaged the future quite a bit for these short term gains.
I think you are drastically overrating what the Flyers have let go. The core of this team is extraordinarily young. The defense isn't as young, but Rathje is gone and Gauthier will probably be moved. This team is also loaded with prospects and is in very good shape for the future. Also, the cap is consistently going up, to the point where most teams in the NHL won't be able to afford spending the max amount, meaning teams like the Flyers/Rangers/Red Wings/etc will be positioned better in the future again to buy whoever they want. I think you are seeing Holmgren going after younger players with a lot of promise, while mixing them in with proven vets. This isn't Clarke going after Adam Oates.
Furthermore, what people are missing about the EDM deal is that they aren't just dumping an uberprospect in Pitkanen and getting no promise in return. Lupul scored 28 goals when he was TWENTY TWO. He is only 24 now. He had a down year in EDM last year obviously, but he should be a 30 goal scorer in Philly.
I think this team is probably 5th or 6th in the East now, with the chance to compete for a cup within 2-3 years.
And Kyle Calder had 26 goals as a 24-year-old with the freaking Chicago Blackhawks. Where did that get him with the Flyers last year?
Before you notch any player (other than Gagne and Briere, and perhaps Knuble) for 30 goals, you'd better make them prove it.
Actually, Calder was 27 and he was a 5th round pick. Not quite the same as a 22 year old who was the 7th overall pick in '02, but I do agree that it is safer to take a wait and see approach. I'm simply saying its not like they are getting washed up players in return for Pitkanen. Lupul is highly regarded as well.
Double-checked the age, and you were right on that one. Buggy-eyed tonight for some reason. He scored 21 as a 24/25-year-old, separated by the lockout year.
Defensive prospects are harder to get than fowards, and especially so for the Flyers. I just think that the Flyers will come to regret this move.
Believe me, I hope you're right.
Even if Pitkanen turns into a stud as an Oiler, it doesn't mean he would've become a stud here. Some people just have to change scenery to blossom.
Yesterday gets a big fat meh from me. The team is better, but the Rangers getting both Gomez and Drury makes my stomach churn.
The Rangers made some good moves, no doubt, they are pretty close to the cap and they still have RFA's to resign, not to mention that Shanahan, Lundqvist, Avery, Hossa, and Prucha are not signed.
They spent a ton of money on centers and it's going to force the rest of their lines to be a little thin.
Quote from: rjs246 on July 02, 2007, 07:17:51 AM
Yesterday gets a big fat meh from me. The team is better, but the Rangers getting both Gomez and Drury makes my stomach churn.
Too bad neither of them play defense.
The Rangers will be like the Phillies. Tons of scoring power, no defense. Lots of 7-6 games in their future.
I was on the beach in Sea Isle when F/A opened and didn't have a signal, got back in time to see the bums win and got a text from my buddy telling me we signed Briere. Initially I was excited because he was the most talented offensive player in free agency and it was a relief to know we got one of the top 3 Centers, after I heard how much we gave him I was a little shocked. I know you overpay in free agency but I didn't think the market for him would be so high. After reading some stuff in the paper today it seems there were a lot of teams willing to pay a similar amount.
As for the Pitkanen trade, I was happy they got decent value after hearing the crap that was being talked about. If Joni's gonna turn it around its not gonna be next year or the year after, its gonna be when he gets closer to 30, and there was no way the Flyers were going to wait for it to click.
As for where we rank after all the offseason moves, I'll say top 4-5 teams in the EC. Its gonna take a while for these guys to mesh.
n/m
d/p
The Flyers gave him $6.5M per year while Buffalo offered him $5M per year.
I keep seeing comments as to how much the Flyers overpaid him but I'm really not seeing it. Giving him $9M/year is overpaying. Giving him $6.5M seems pretty much like fair market value in the current climate to me.
The only worry about Briere's contract is the NTC and the length of the deal. Again he easily makes this team much better, but my worries about him are the NTC and Injuries.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 02, 2007, 11:48:29 AM
The Flyers gave him $6.5M per year while Buffalo offered him $5M per year.
I keep seeing comments as to how much the Flyers overpaid him but I'm really not seeing it. Giving him $9M/year is overpaying. Giving him $6.5M seems pretty much like fair market value in the current climate to me.
I'm trying to understand how this works, he makes $10 million this season but only $6.5 counts against the cap?
the cap # is the average amount per year of the deal.
i actually don't know of any benefit for the team front loading the contract
Quote from: SunMo on July 02, 2007, 12:04:02 PM
the cap # is the average amount per year of the deal.
i actually don't know of any benefit for the team front loading the contract
i dont think there is at this time. I think they are preparing the contracts now like this in hopes that the NHL adopts a NFL like way of adding up salaries.
I think the benefit is to the player and it may have been a deciding factor for Briere. Money up front is always preferable.
it doesn't really matter though, the contracts are all guarenteed
Giving a 30 year old an 8 year, no trade contract is always a good idea.
Right, but just everyday-schmo economics says that money in hand is better and more valuable than future money. He could invest that upfront money and turn it into more money... blah blah blah.
i hate you
lies
Poor Buffa-woe. (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=sukiennik/070702)
:-D
the best part of the last 48 hrs is the realization that the nhl cap doesnt hurt big market teams like the flyers
the worst part is how many people are shteinting on pitkanen for having a down year on an equally awful team and completely forgetting his two previous years which were very very good for his age and after coming over from europe
it amazing to me how people will overrate every single unknown player on the flyers from coburn to upshall to picard...but the one young player whos actually done something in the league and hgolds the biggest upside everyone is glad that hes traded
Let it go, IGY.
Joni's gone and he's not coming back. EVER.
;)
i will not
i will hold on to my prediction that he will one day win a norris and i will never let go of it.....EVER
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 08:35:34 PM
the worst part is how many people are shteinting on pitkanen for having a down year on an equally awful team and completely forgetting his two previous years which were very very good for his age and after coming over from europe
I wanted to keep Pitkanen, sure he had a zesty year but few defenseman can move the puck like he can. Not to mention, we now have Timonen who can bring it up the ice and ? Kukkonen and Coburn are average but the rest are drones. What we received in return is better than what was initially being reported but a young winger with potential and a solid defensive defenseman who's a good character guy aren't equal to the talent that Joni has. It just wasn't happening for him here.
i dont agree but at least i can see your point of view in defendiung what they got in return but how can you possibly say that its not happening here for him...he had two really good years and one bad year...is it not happening here for richards or carter...or how about the 15 other players on the team last year that it wasnt happening for...i just dont get how you completely cast off a potential stud defenseman after a sub par year on what was the worst team in the nhl
I thought Mike Richards was "the gawd"...?
he is
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 02, 2007, 08:39:15 PM
Let it go, IGY.
Joni's gone and he's not coming back. EVER.
;)
Sure he will. For big $$$ when he hits free agency. :deion
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 08:53:35 PM
i dont agree but at least i can see your point of view in defendiung what they got in return but how can you possibly say that its not happening here for him...he had two really good years and one bad year...is it not happening here for richards or carter...or how about the 15 other players on the team last year that it wasnt happening for...i just dont get how you completely cast off a potential stud defenseman after a sub par year on what was the worst team in the nhl
igy speaks the truth.
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 08:53:35 PM
i dont agree but at least i can see your point of view in defendiung what they got in return but how can you possibly say that its not happening here for him...he had two really good years and one bad year...is it not happening here for richards or carter...or how about the 15 other players on the team last year that it wasnt happening for...i just dont get how you completely cast off a potential stud defenseman after a sub par year on what was the worst team in the nhl
I'm just going by what I read and hear from people in the organization. Supposedly he didn't 'get it' and they had lost their patience with him. What I'm gathering is he's mentally soft and the Flyers thought it best to part ways with him. I'll reiterate, I wanted to keep him, even if he's a Hoyda his skill was worth the risk of suffering through some more growing pains...I just think it went deeper than the usual.
my thing is id like to see him skate with a much improved team that they hopefully will have over the next few years...i undertand the thought that you find out whats in a guy when times are at their worst but at the same time i think good players are brought down by really bad teams and i would have liked to have seen him given another few years
that said he could be niinamaa or he could be wade redden...well find out in the next several years
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 09:49:17 PM
my thing is id like to see him skate with a much improved team that they hopefully will have over the next few years...i undertand the thought that you find out whats in a guy when times are at their worst but at the same time i think good players are brought down by really bad teams and i would have liked to have seen him given another few years
that said he could be niinamaa or he could be wade redden...well find out in the next several years
He needs to learn to play defense to become Wade Redden.
He has great offensive ability, but his defense is severely lacking. Even when he was 'good' it was for his offensive production.
He has a lot of talent, but let's not pretend he's gawd and lupul is nothing, considering they were picked three selections apart.
And Coburn will be very good as well. He's very fluid for a big guy and actually uses his size, unlike Pitkanen.
He needs to learn to play defense to become Wade Redden
redden wasnt always with ottawa...he was traded before he blossomed..thats what i was speaking of...
And Coburn will be very good as well. He's very fluid for a big guy and actually uses his size, unlike Pitkanen.
you didnt know who braydon coburn was before the flyers traded for him and in the few games youve ever seen him play youre somehow sure hes gonna be good...but pitkanen who youve seen have entire good years youre glad is gone...can you say homerism
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 10:04:07 PM
He needs to learn to play defense to become Wade Redden
redden wasnt always with ottawa...he was traded before he blossomed..thats what i was speaking of...
And Coburn will be very good as well. He's very fluid for a big guy and actually uses his size, unlike Pitkanen.
you didnt know who braydon coburn was before the flyers traded for him and in the few games youve ever seen him play youre somehow sure hes gonna be good...but pitkanen who youve seen have entire good years youre glad is gone...can you say homerism
Please. Coburn and Pitkanen are completely opposite players. The fact that I'm from Philadelphia doesn't automatically disqualify what I say. Pitkanen is a gifted offensive defenseman who has a strong shot, plays with no physicality, and is NOT good defensively. You are comparing him to Wade Redden? It's a joke. At least sound knowledgable when ranting by comparing him to someone more of his ilk like Schneider or Souray. Coburn will probably not ever possess Pitkanen's potential offensively, but he was picked 9th overall by ATL because he has TALENT as well--it's just more suited for a defensive game. However, he does have an OK shot and can skate. He uses his body and has great potential. Can you say uninformed?
You are comparing him to Wade Redden? It's a joke.
can you effin read...i posted once and you didnt undertand what i was saying in calling out two defensemen that were traded young...one in niinamaa that didnt pan out and one in redden that did...you didnt undertand the analogy the first time then i spelled it out for you that i brought up reddens name not cause pitkanen plays like him but because they were both guys that were traded befofre they blossomed and you still ignored what i said
god dammit ignornace annoys me
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 10:22:27 PM
You are comparing him to Wade Redden? It's a joke.
can you effin read...i posted once and you didnt undertand what i was saying in calling out two defensemen that were traded young...one in niinamaa that didnt pan out and one in redden that did...you didnt undertand the analogy the first time then i spelled it out for you that i brought up reddens name not cause pitkanen plays like him but because they were both guys that were traded befofre they blossomed and you still ignored what i said
god dammit ignornace annoys me
I don't care about Wade Redden or how he relates to Pitkanen. That deviates so far from the main point that it is irrelevant. You are correct that Redden became a much better player when he arrived in Ottawa. Maybe Pitkanen will be better in EDM, but he has never showed the defensive ability to become a Norris Candidate or a #1 defenseman. Maybe they should have given him more time to develop, but I can see Pitkanen becoming a great offensive Dman with a great point shot to man PPs than I can a top DMan (ala Redden, regardless if you were comparing their skillset you were certainly compairing Pitkanen to Redden in that his level of play is something Pitkanen can reach--which I disagree with).
I see Pitkanen's ceiling as something more along the lines of Sheldon Souray. I would have said that two weeks ago and I would have said it six months ago. Maybe he'll prove me wrong, but I doubt it.
Also IGY, and as I said, the point is not that important, Redden has played his entire NHL career with the Sens, despite being drafted by NYI. So your "point" is void.
http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app?service=page&page=PlayerDetail&playerId=8462033&tab=crst
Redden...Niinamaa...Norris trophy candidate aside...if Pitkanen ever plays close to his potential it'll be when he's closer to 30.
Quote from: FastFreddie on July 02, 2007, 08:58:02 PM
I thought Mike Richards was "the gawd"...?
He's Not?
(http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m267/jeepwrang1994/Richards_hits_Petrovicky.gif)
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 02, 2007, 08:41:20 PM
i will not
i will hold on to my prediction that he will one day win a norris and i will never let go of it.....EVER
I would predict that he turns into a power play specialist but Norris? Never would have nailed him for that. Still he's a nice player and it would have been nice to see the Flyers keep him, but don't listen to me. I fealt the same way about Niinimaa. :paranoid
im half joking about him winning a norris but it wouldnt suprise me and i did predict it...i think he can be that good and he showed that direction his first two years...i just think its risky to cast a young defensemen off after one down year...i was never as high on niinamaa as pitkanen but i admittedly was concerned when they traded him as well...time will tell
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 03, 2007, 09:23:19 AM
im half joking about him winning a norris but it wouldnt suprise me and i did predict it...i think he can be that good and he showed that direction his first two years...i just think its risky to cast a young defensemen off after one down year...i was never as high on niinamaa as pitkanen but i admittedly was concerned when they traded him as well...time will tell
I'm with IGY on the Joni trade, I understand that the guy is a moron, and may never get it. But if he does, it will go down as one of the worst trades in team history. He was a leading canidate for the first quarter of the season last year before the groin/hernia injury.
I just don't get why they'd trade him away right after they trade for Timonen.
Quote from: FastFreddie on July 03, 2007, 09:54:43 AM
I just don't get why they'd trade him away right after they trade for Timonen.
Supposedly he requested/demanded a trade for how he was treated by the team last year(fridge punching him in the face in practice and no one identifying with Joni) and by the fans (he got booed towards the end of the year) if thats true, he's a bitch, this town took it so easy on him.
WORST TRADE EVAR!
NORRIS TROPHY FOR JONI!!
YAAHAHAHA!
Die. All of you just die.
I can't believe that this trade has generated this much conversation. They got a proven defensive veteran and leader for a young unproven offensive-minded defender. Trades like this happen dozens of times every season. You sacrifice youth and promise for experience, grit and leadership. The end.
That post was reasonable and well thought-out.
Are you feeling alright?
Quote from: rjs246 on July 03, 2007, 11:32:54 AM
I can't believe that this trade has generated this much conversation. They got a proven defensive veteran and leader for a young unproven offensive-minded defender. Trades like this happen dozens of times every season. You sacrifice youth and promise for experience, grit and leadership. The end.
That's a good mo for a team that's close to winning the Cup, and trying to put the final pieces together. The Flyers are nowhere near a cup - how much further away can a team be than the worst record in the league?
To me, the Flyers are trying to return to respectability - outside fringes of the playoff race, rather than an embarrassing flop like last season - solely to keep butts in the seats. The Flyers are not a Cup team this year, nor next year, without a drastic change in the landscape of the league.
The Flyers aren't sacrificing youth for experience to win the Cup. They're doing it to sell tickets. In my opinion, the Flyers actually decreased their chances for the actual Cup in the next five years with this move.
Their chances of winning the Stanley Cup in the next five years were reduced by trading Joni Pitkanen?
Come on. :-D
Not even IGY would be audacious enough to make that sort of statement.
In other news, does anyone doubt that Briere's going to be a massive underachiever and/or have consistent injury problems? I'd put money on it if there were a good way to do so.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 03, 2007, 11:40:12 AM
Their chances of winning the Stanley Cup in the next five years were reduced by trading Joni Pitkanen?
Come on. :-D
Not even IGY would be audacious enough to make that sort of statement.
It goes with my point - short term gain, long term loss.
Are the Flyers, as-is, going to win the Cup next season? No.
In the next five years, Timmonen, Smith (if he's still on the team), and Hatcher will be in their mid-30s or older. Pitkanen will still be in his 20s.
Technically, does the trade improve the Flyers chances of winning a Cup THIS season. Yes - from about 0.5 % to maybe 3-5%. They aren't winning the Cup anyway. Basically, it gets the Flyers back to (maybe) respectability, but does not increase the long-term chances of getting the Cup.
Was Pitkanen a sure thing? No, especially with the Flyers' history of developing top defensemen. But he was the Flyers' best defensive prospect in a long time, and was just traded for an aging defenseman and a winger that doesn't really add anything that the team needed (hence the debate about where he's going to play, and who will get bumped).
Smith would be a GREAT pickup for a team that was going for broke to win the Cup. The Flyers aren't - or at least shouldn't be - that team. They are a team that should be currently building for the future, but just sent one of their best young prospects in order to achieve respectability/mediocrity. And to sell more tickets.
One good thing about the Pitkanen trade: It makes one less Finnish name for me to confuse.
Kapanen
Kukkonen
Timonen
Pitkanen
No wonder Holmgren wanted so badly to get rid of one.
If Pitkanen had the sort of potential that you people are attributing to him then why would the Flyers trade him away?
If he was that sort of rare prospect who had the special skills to become a top-flight defenseman, there's no way in the world any sane organization would simply kick him to the curb. It's reasonable to assume that they would do whatever it took to help him realize that potential, right?
It seems pretty obvious to me that the Flyers analyzed Joni and made the determination that he wasn't going to reach that sort of level and that he had, in fact, plateaued in terms of production. It's too bad he didn't work out but asserting that he's going to be the sort of player that becomes a Norris Trophy-level player is a stretch of epic proportions especially considering what he'd accomplished thus far playing for the Flyers.
defenceman take a long time to develop...you could've said the same thing about Chris Pronger after the same amount of time Pitkanen has had in Philly
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 03, 2007, 12:13:21 PM
If Pitkanen had the sort of potential that you people are attributing to him then why would the Flyers trade him away?
If he was that sort of rare prospect who had the special skills to become a top-flight defenseman, there's no way in the world any sane organization would simply kick him to the curb. It's reasonable to assume that they would do whatever it took to help him realize that potential, right?
It seems pretty obvious to me that the Flyers analyzed Joni and made the determination that he wasn't going to reach that sort of level and that he had, in fact, plateaued in terms of production. It's too bad he didn't work out but asserting that he's going to be the sort of player that becomes a Norris Trophy-level player is a stretch of epic proportions especially considering what he'd accomplished thus far playing for the Flyers.
I don't think anyone was comparing Pitkanen to Ratatouille. That wouldnt be fair.
Again, why would they give him the boot if they thought he could develop into that sort of player?
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 03, 2007, 12:19:58 PM
Again, why would they give him the boot if they thought he could develop into that sort of player?
Remember, you're talking about the team that traded Petr Forsberg away....twice.
Nothing should be put past them.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 03, 2007, 12:19:58 PM
Again, why would they give him the boot if they thought he could develop into that sort of player?
just became a flyers fan huh?
New Flyers commercial:
http://mfile.akamai.com/33446/wmv/nhl.download.akamai.com/33446/downloads/video/Brierewelcome.asx
Quote from: phattymatty on July 03, 2007, 12:24:57 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 03, 2007, 12:19:58 PM
Again, why would they give him the boot if they thought he could develop into that sort of player?
just became a flyers fan huh?
Post of the week nominee^
Post of all time. Ever.
You're right, though. The Flyers have never traded away young talent for older, proven guys.
Where did I say they NEVER trade away young players? I asked why the Flyers would give up on someone they thought had the potential to become a star.
And don't give me Forsberg either. They got Lindros in that deal and anyone in their right mind would have done the same thing at the time.
By the way, Briere is guaranteed to be a bust.
Quote from: rjs246 on July 03, 2007, 01:07:56 PM
By the way, Briere is guaranteed to be a bust.
I'm pretty sure he blows his groin out again by mid november
Quote from: FastFreddie on July 03, 2007, 11:45:00 AM
In other news, does anyone doubt that Briere's going to be a massive underachiever and/or have consistent injury problems? I'd put money on it if there were a good way to do so.
Quote from: rjs246 on July 03, 2007, 01:07:56 PM
By the way, Briere is guaranteed to be a bust.
Wowee wow! You'd think we had a lively online discussion about this recently!
Indeed.
Yeah Briere's undersized and a product of the system he played in possibly.
But hey! He's got 8 more years on his contract!
On the "why would the Flyers trade Pitkanen" nonsense...
Because they might actually be wrong?
You know. Not the Whalers trading Pronger after his 2nd year wrong but you get the drift. Teams are wrong all the time. Especially those teams that drink the water in Philly.
I think all Blues fans should jump off the top of the Gateway Arch.
That's fine with me...
Just because I live here doesn't mean I switched loyalties...
FWIW,
Morganti and Moran were on DNL yesterday and they pretty much said Joni needed a change of scenery because he just wasn't putting it all together here. Moran said he'll be one of those guys in a few years, if he gets it right, where people will say "why the hell did they trade him?" but was in agreement that it was time to move him.
Quote from: Phanatic on July 03, 2007, 04:05:59 PM
That's fine with me...
Just because I live here doesn't mean I switched loyalties...
Your buddy Demon would be dead, though.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on July 03, 2007, 04:24:04 PM
FWIW,
Morganti and Moran were on DNL yesterday and they pretty much said Joni needed a change of scenery because he just wasn't putting it all together here. Moran said he'll be one of those guys in a few years, if he gets it right, where people will say "why the hell did they trade him?" but was in agreement that it was time to move him.
That's a decent amount of blurb containing zero revealing information whatsoever.
Morganti said that Joni was basically an idiot on the ice. That he played fetch with the puck, passing back and forth(this drove me crazy about Joni) and that a Golden Retriever would have as much hockey sense as Joni.
In 5 years when he's the MVP of the league, Norris Trophy winner and banging Jessica Alba, the Flyers are totally going to be sorry they traded the Jon-ser.
George Bush liked the trade.
Pitkaneney?
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 03, 2007, 04:31:24 PM
In 5 years when he's the MVP of the league, Norris Trophy winner and banging Jessica Alba, the Flyers are totally going to be sorry they traded the Jon-ser.
If he was truly top notch he'd be banging Jessica Biel...
Kevin Marshall > Joni Pitkanen.
Rumor of Flyers interest in Derek Boogaard.
People, Smith wasn't the person they were trading for. He was a bonus throw-in for the deal and is someone who will probably look nice paired next to Timonen. They aren't sacrificing youth. The person they wanted was Lupul who is 23 and was selected the same year as Pitkanen. How is that sacrificing youth?
That's retarded. Smith was captain and actually plays defense. They needed him on the team way more than Lupol.
So, now the two guys the Flyers got in the trade are so awesome that we're arguing which one is more awesome?
They traded for Lupul, he was picked 3 after Joni in that draft. He has a ton of potential, Smith wasnt exactly a throw in, he's just the very steady D Man. Smith has to be re-signed, which they'll probably wait to see how he fits into their system before re-signing him.
smith is rathje when he was healthy...lupol was the guy they wanted...they have been trying to trade for him for almost a year now...and thats what is wrong with the deal imo...they traded a promising young defenseman for a potential 30 goal scorer...both are coming off bad years...i just dont know why youd do that
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 04, 2007, 08:52:01 AM
smith is rathje when he was healthy...
Same style of play but Smith is much better
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 04, 2007, 08:52:01 AM
they traded a promising young defenseman for a potential 30 goal scorer...both are coming off bad years...i just dont know why youd do that
Both teams are trying to get more potential value out of the deal than they were getting before the trade was made.
Isn't that the point of trades in sports in general?
The point of any trade is to have dorks like us argue about their merits endlessly on the intarwebs.
Same style of play but Smith is much better
why becasue he is a flyer now?
rathje when in his prime was every bit the player smith was...you had to have seen rathje before he got to the flyers
they both were solid 25 pt defensive defensivmen...smith a better hitter rathje a better puck mover...to say smith is much better than anyone is a stretch...and he def wasnt any better than rathje...essentially the same player
Smith is faster, not much faster. Rathje wasnt a bad player, i really think his body breaknig down destroyed any chance he had in the new NHL. He was alright for the first 2 months of the new NHL, but thereafter his back/shoulder/groin gave way
def agree with that...im talking rathje at the time of him coming over from sj is the same defensive defensemen as smith is now...id almost rather have rathje because in the new nhl he had a slight advantage over smith because he was such a good puck mover from defensive to neutral zone...but its six of one half dozen of the other as to who youd rather have...honestly i could do without either as i think there are better options in the "new" nhl
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 04, 2007, 02:19:46 PM
Same style of play but Smith is much better
why becasue he is a flyer now?
rathje when in his prime was every bit the player smith was...you had to have seen rathje before he got to the flyers
they both were solid 25 pt defensive defensivmen...smith a better hitter rathje a better puck mover...to say smith is much better than anyone is a stretch...and he def wasnt any better than rathje...essentially the same player
Rathje is a Flyer till 2010 so your first point is null.
Smith has better mobility, Rathje was a drone. He's just an all around better player (defensive, puck handling, leadership). If Rathje had stayed healthy and we had traded him straight up for Smith you wouldn't have called that a good deal? I think a majority of hockey fans would.
i would have no feeling on that deal...it wouldnt even register...one old defensive dman for another....bleh
im glad they got smith now because their defense is so bad he improves it but like geo said hes gonna be out of the league by the time the flyers are ready to challenge for anything...the one advantage id give to getting smith is that he was included with lupol and if not for that he wouldnt even be here where as the flyers paid a lot of money for rathje as a fa
i tell one thing id rather have than smith and thats pitkanen...either pitkanen is better than you all think or smith is a lot worse..otherwise why wouldnt the trade have been pitkanen for lupol straight up
nm
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 04, 2007, 02:58:19 PM
i tell one thing id rather have than smith and thats pitkanen...either pitkanen is better than you all think or smith is a lot worse..otherwise why wouldnt the trade have been pitkanen for lupol straight up
I'm not 100% sure on this but I think they save cap space by dealing Sanderson/Pitkanen for Smith/Lupol...and they had to get a defenseman back in the deal.
Pitkanen skill wise is much better than anyone gives him credit for.
They did save, plus Smith is in the last year of his deal. Joni would have costed them at least 2 mill, Sanderson was at least 1.5 i think he was closer to 2 mill.
smith and sanderson cancel each other out 1.9 v 1.5 and both have a year left on their deals...flyers save a couple bucks but hardly enough to influcence the trade
therefore those two didnt need to be included in the deal at all except for like sd said the flyers needed a defenseman...so in essence edm was like take smith we dont care and throw in sanderson...to me that says smith is a nothing in the deal
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 04, 2007, 03:41:13 PM
smith and sanderson cancel each other out 1.9 v 1.5 and both have a year left on their deals...flyers save a couple bucks but hardly enough to influcence the trade
therefore those two didnt need to be included in the deal at all except for like sd said the flyers needed a defenseman...so in essence edm was like take smith we dont care and throw in sanderson...to me that says smith is a nothing in the deal
I agree that Smith was a neglible part of the deal. The Flyers were looking to dump Sanderson's salary and figured they could get a decent Dman in return to help the deal, but the primary part was Lupul for Pitkanen.
However, here is an interesting article I read from EDM:
http://www.edmontonsun.com/Sports/Oilers/2007/07/02/4306422-sun.html
By ROBERT TYCHKOWSKI
Ethan Moreau called it a bad trade.
He didn't even ask, or care, who the Edmonton Oilers got in return for captain Jason Smith yesterday. If Smith is going the other way, he considers it a bad deal.
"When you're losing a guy like that it really doesn't matter what's coming the other way, it's a huge blow to our locker-room," said Moreau, Smith's teammate for eight seasons.
"I didn't even ask who we got. I don't really care right now if we're better or worse, it's more the human side of it. You lose a great friend and a great leader, the longest standing Oilers captain of all time. It's a tough one. It's probably the worst thing that can happen as far as emotions go."
All of the Oilers, still one of the closest clubs in the NHL, were mourning the loss of their friend and leader in a deal with Philadelphia.
"It's definitely shocking, I'm very surprised," said Jarret Stoll. "The way I feel right now is the way I felt after the other trade we made earlier this year (Ryan Smyth). It's shocking.
"The guys we got in return are good players, they're going to help our team. It's just tough losing guys who are good character people, who've been here a long time. Good teammates, it's disappointing losing guys like that."
The Oilers also gave up winger Joffrey Lupul in the deal for defenceman Joni Pitkanen and journeyman winger Geoff Sanderson in the exchange. Whether it pays off or not remains to be seen, but the players aren't in the mood for evaluating trades.
"It's a tough one to swallow," said Moreau. "We're like an extended family. There will be a day and time when as a player you look at your own situation, but that's definitely not in my mind right now."
Smith and Moreau and their families had just moved into a house they rented in Los Angeles. They, along with Raffi Torres, Jarret Stoll, Matt Greene, Lupul, Zack Stortini and Shawn Horcoff are all in the process of moving into the same complex to begin training. Even in the off-season, the team sticks together. So when the captain got traded, it hit them like a punch in the stomach.
"I hear some people saying he's gone downhill the last couple of years, I don't see that," said Stoll. "I wouldn't say he's Chris Pronger, but he plays all the tough minutes, he's out there in every tough situation. I'm shocked."
Losing Lupul, meanwhile, could come back to bite the Oilers big time. He'll probably score 30 on the rebuilt Flyers.
"I guarantee it," said Stoll, adding the Edmonton native, who wasn't returning calls yesterday, feels terrible about the way his brief homecoming turned out. "I talked to him, he's happy about Philly. He's good friends with (Scottie) Upshall and (Scott) Hartnell ... he's happy about them being together, he's just disappointed how it all went here."
I read that article yesterday, that had more to do with his character than it did his on ice play.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on July 04, 2007, 04:48:07 PM
I read that article yesterday, that had more to do with his character than it did his on ice play.
Don't disagree with that. He's still a pretty good defenseman, but I think his leadership was more of a benefit in the deal.
According to the Courier Post, the Flyers have about $1.3M left in cap room and they're looking to spend about $700K on another enforcer. If they can't re-sign Fedoruk, they could look at Chris Simon or go after a lesser name like Andrew Peters (BUF), Derek Boogaard (MIN), Eric Godard (CGY), Cam Jansen (NJ) or ex-Phantom Josh Gratton (PHX)...
Fedoruk shouldn't be an option at this point.
Simon would be my #1 choice because he's also a half decent player, plus after his stick incident last year players will be looking over their shoulders when he's on the ice.
Boogaard would be my 2nd option.
Boogaard would be my first choice for two reasons.
First, anyone with that many vowels in his name has to be a bad ass.
Second, the sound of BOOOOOOOOO after he kicks someone's ass in the Wach Center would be deafening.
I like his name because it reminds me of Peter SAAAAAARRRRRRRSGAAAAAAAAAARD.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on July 05, 2007, 11:34:54 AM
I like his name because it reminds me of Peter SAAAAAARRRRRRRSGAAAAAAAAAARD.
:-D
Boogard would be my #1 choice without flinching. He crushed Fridges face in. Is like 6'7" and has an awsome name, how could you want Simon over him.
Simon though can actually play hockey, not just enforce. Simon should be cheap since the incident last season, and Boogard is a RFA for the Wild. The Flyers can only offer up to 745k for Boogard before they would have to compensate the Wild.
Also since no one said anything yet, Forsberg was in Montreal yesterday for Gagne's Golf Tourney. He was asked if he was there to speak with Bob Gainey the GM of the Habs. Forsberg stated no, but he would like to return to the Flyers
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on July 05, 2007, 12:29:35 PM
Boogard would be my #1 choice without flinching. He crushed Fridges face in. Is like 6'7" and has an awsome name, how could you want Simon over him.
Simon though can actually play hockey, not just enforce.
You answered your own question.
I'd take Forsberg back at an extremely low salary.
I'd be happy if they got Simon, i actually liked the hit to Hollowfag in the face. I'm just curious what Simon would want or look for monetarily?
http://nhlnumbers.com/phi.html
Page above shows exactly where the Flyers sit in terms of the salary cap. They have a little wiggle room left but not much ($2.076M).
if you want an enforcer theres no better person than boogard...hes the best fighter in the league bar none...second would be godard who is the only guy ive seen beat boogard and hes beat him twice..godard just doesnt have the intimidation factor of boogard who straight knocks people out in like half his fights...
simon is over the hill as a fighter...he doesnt have his heart in it anymore
fedoruk and enforcer should not be mentioned in the same sentence...unless you are talking about the plates that re-enforce his face
there's a rumor going around that the Flyers are interested in Teemu Selanne. it's been corroborated by a couple people on different boards that seem to know what they are talking about.
Panaccio says 'NO' to the Selanne rumor. (http://www.hockeybuzz.com/boards/thread.php?thread_id=22814&forum_id=1&page=last)
nobody on any message boards know what they are talking about
The blogger (Eklund) and Panaccio have a $500 dinner bet on this now.
That thread's a trip.
:-D
i'll trust just about anybody over Pannachio...he once again sites the salary cap, when the cap is a non factor until the season starts, he is clueless #1
anyone in the world>>> any message board poster
negative chief
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 06, 2007, 10:19:04 PM
The blogger (Eklund) and Panaccio have a $500 dinner bet on this now.
That thread's a trip.
:-D
HB is to hockey sites what PFT is to football. Eklund hits every once in a while. I'd rather see the Flyers get another puck moving defensman but you wouldn't see me bitch if this turns out to be true.
i'm not only going on Eklund's report, because he's pretty bad, except for Flyers stuff.
but there is a guy on a Ducks board that has some credibility that says this has legs
wildcat48
He's decent but he's no Gaylord_Focker
I'll file this under "I'll believe it when I see it."
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 06, 2007, 10:19:04 PM
The blogger (Eklund) and Panaccio have a $500 dinner bet on this now.
That thread's a trip.
:-D
Eklund is a douche. I'll believe my grandmother over him.
anyone on any message board that "gets it right" is just reporting (often as fact) some rumor he read online heard on his local sports or read in his local paper...the rumor may or may not be true but the poster himself is clueless...any one of us could do the same thing
I heard a rumor that the Flyers are employing a mad scientist that is working to resurrect Maurice "The Rocket" Richard and put him on the third line.
Isn't Selanne like 80 years old anyway?
Quote from: FastFreddie on July 07, 2007, 04:43:49 AM
Isn't Selanne like 80 years old anyway?
he is 37, but sill managed to score 48 goals and 94 points in '07 (40 goals and 90 points in '06) for Anaheim.
Here's the bottom line:
If he plays for the Flyers, he proves to be over the hill.
If he plays anywhere else, he'll put up big numbers.
He's from Finland. Of course they'll sign him...
Pitkanen's from Finland holla
Today was the first day of conditioning camp at the Skate Zone. After all the LeClair comparisons, the Flyers went ahead and gave vanRiemsdyk #10
Quote from: ice grillin you on July 06, 2007, 10:31:09 PM
anyone in the world>>> any message board poster
This is the truest thing that any of you nerds has ever said.
Dallas did us a favor and signed Fedoruk:
QuoteFRISCO, Tex. -- Dallas Stars General Manager Doug Armstrong announced today that the club has signed left wing Todd Fedoruk to a one-year deal ($875,000) for the 2007-08 season.
"Todd adds the elements of size and toughness to our hockey club," said Armstrong. "We expect our fans to enjoy his style of play and we look forward to his contributions to the Dallas Stars in 2007-08."
Fedoruk, 28, appeared in 58 total games last season with the Anaheim Ducks and the Philadelphia Flyers, registering three goals and 11 assists for 14 points with 120 penalty minutes. The Redwater, Alberta, native ranked second on the Flyers in penalty minutes after being acquired by Philadelphia in exchange for a fourth round pick on Nov. 13, 2006.
The 6-2, 241-pound left wing was originally drafted by the Flyers in the seventh round (164th overall) in the 1997 NHL Entry Draft. Over parts of six NHL seasons, Fedoruk has appeared in 354 career games and collected 17 goals and 48 assists for 65 points with 785 penalty minutes. In 19 career playoff games, he is scoreless with 38 penalty minutes.
Acquired by Anaheim from Philadelphia on July 29, 2005 in exchange for a second round draft pick in 2005, Fedoruk produced career-highs in goals (4), assists (19), points (23), penalty minutes (174) and plus/minus (+6) in 2005-06 with the Ducks. A member of the Philadelphia Phantoms' AHL Calder Cup Championship team in 2005, he played in 16 playoff games, earning four points (2-2-4) with 33 penalty minutes.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on July 09, 2007, 05:12:48 PM
Dallas did us a favor and signed Fedoruk:
QuoteFRISCO, Tex. -- Dallas Stars General Manager Doug Armstrong announced today that the club has signed left wing Todd Fedoruk to a one-year deal ($875,000) for the 2007-08 season.
"Todd adds the elements of size and toughness to our hockey club," said Armstrong. "We expect our fans to enjoy his style of play and we look forward to his contributions to the Dallas Stars in 2007-08."
Fedoruk, 28, appeared in 58 total games last season with the Anaheim Ducks and the Philadelphia Flyers, registering three goals and 11 assists for 14 points with 120 penalty minutes. The Redwater, Alberta, native ranked second on the Flyers in penalty minutes after being acquired by Philadelphia in exchange for a fourth round pick on Nov. 13, 2006.
The 6-2, 241-pound left wing was originally drafted by the Flyers in the seventh round (164th overall) in the 1997 NHL Entry Draft. Over parts of six NHL seasons, Fedoruk has appeared in 354 career games and collected 17 goals and 48 assists for 65 points with 785 penalty minutes. In 19 career playoff games, he is scoreless with 38 penalty minutes.
Acquired by Anaheim from Philadelphia on July 29, 2005 in exchange for a second round draft pick in 2005, Fedoruk produced career-highs in goals (4), assists (19), points (23), penalty minutes (174) and plus/minus (+6) in 2005-06 with the Ducks. A member of the Philadelphia Phantoms' AHL Calder Cup Championship team in 2005, he played in 16 playoff games, earning four points (2-2-4) with 33 penalty minutes.
as much as I liked Fridge, there's no chance he will ever be intimidating...after the punishment he took last season.
http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app?service=page&page=TeamSchedule&team=PHI&season=20072008
Thu Oct 25, 2007 Flyers At Lightning 7:30 PM
I smell a long weekend in Tampa.
At least they get the 3 western Canada games out of the way to start the season
Buffalo home-and-home on back-to-back nights right before Christmas
Last 8 games: NYR, NYI, @NYR, @NJ, @NYI, @PIT, NJ, PIT....wtf
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 11, 2007, 02:34:35 PM
Thu Oct 25, 2007 Flyers At Lightning 7:30 PM
I smell a long weekend in Tampa.
You can smell Tampa from Galveston.
Quote from: BigEd76 on July 11, 2007, 04:28:59 PM
Last 8 games: NYR, NYI, @NYR, @NJ, @NYI, @PIT, NJ, PIT....wtf
I second that. What. the. farg.
rangers last TEN games
pitt
at nj
at phi
phi
nj
at pitt
pitt
at nyi
nyi
at nj
Briere is making the rounds today. WIP this morning, press conference at noon, then DNL at 5...
i heard him on wip
zzzzzzzzz
typical cliche ridden interview
He's Canadian. You shouldn't expect much of a personality...
true....and even worse hes french canadian
ha...he's as tall as the teens getting his autograph
(http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070712/capt.1a9a4756e9c84fe08de8b91aa7b133f1.flyers_briere_hockey_njgw102.jpg)
I met that guy rocking the mohawk and Flyers Tats on his head at the draft party, dude must not work. He's nice, but reminds me of Shoulderpad Shawn
Here he is again. Note the look on Briere's face:
(http://media.philly.com/images/20070713_dn_0jl2xqcl.jpg)
:-D
"new" Flyers jersey
(http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2563/flyersbackxa7.jpg)
FF can proudly wear his Boucher jersey again:
QuoteBrian Boucher Agrees to Contract With Phantoms
Philadelphia Flyers
July 23, 2007
The Philadelphia Flyers announced that 6'2", 198-pound goaltender Brian Boucher has signed a contract with the Flyers' American Hockey League affiliate, the Philadelphia Phantoms, according to club General Manager Paul Holmgren. Per club policy, financial terms were not disclosed.
"Brian is a good goalie who will add depth to the organization and solidify our goaltending situation," said Holmgren in making the announcement.
Boucher, 30, appeared in 18 regular season games for the Chicago Blackhawks and Columbus Blue Jackets during the 2006-07 season, posting a 2-11-3 record and 3.34 goals-against average. He had a 1-1-0 record and 3.80 GAA in three games for Columbus after being claimed on waivers from Chicago on February 27, 2007. He registered a 1-10-3 record, 3.26 GAA and one shutout in 15 games for the Blackhawks. He was signed as a free agent by Chicago on September 23, 2006.
In seven NHL seasons with the Flyers, Phoenix Coyotes, Calgary Flames, Chicago and Columbus from 1999-2000 through 2006-07, Boucher has compiled a 77-96-33 record, 2.79 GAA and 13 shutouts in 220 regular season games.
In three seasons with the Flyers from 1999-2000 through 2001-02, Boucher posted a 46-38-12 record, 2.45 GAA and seven shutouts in 103 regular season games. He was named to the 2000 NHL All-Rookie Team after winning a career-high 20 games and posting a league-best 1.91 GAA. He was traded by the Flyers, along with Nashville's third round pick in the 2002 NHL Entry Draft, to the Coyotes in exchange for Michal Handzus and Robert Esche on June 12, 2002. He was originally drafted by the Flyers in the first round (22nd overall) of the 1995 NHL Entry Draft.
Over parts of four seasons (1997-98 through 1999-2000 and 2005-06), Boucher appeared in 77 career AHL regular season games, compiling a 38-23-9 record, 2.76 GAA and two shutouts. In three seasons with the Phantoms (1997-98 through 1999-2000), Boucher registered a 36-20-9 record, 2.88 GAA and two shutouts. He was a member of the Phantoms' 1998 Calder Cup Championship Team.
That farging rocks.
With the Trenton Devils now exclusive to NJ, the Flyers will share the Wheeling Nailers with the Penguins for an ECHL affiliate
scintillating news
There's been some talk lately about a possible Forsberg return to Philly. Sportsrise said Holmgren talked to him about a possible return.
Gotta love that he has legitimate interest to come back, and not for the money, but to possibly get a cup.
I wouldn't mind having him back at a 1 year deal. where do you put him? Briere was signed for big money so I can't see them throwing him on the second line. On the flipside, Forsberg worked really well and already has familiarity with Gagne and Knuble.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on August 28, 2007, 10:06:57 AM
I wouldn't mind having him back at a 1 year deal. where do you put him? Briere was signed for big money so I can't see them throwing him on the second line. On the flipside, Forsberg worked really well and already has familiarity with Gagne and Knuble.
Its a tough call, i'm not sure if Knuble fits with the speedy 2 of Gagne and Briere. The good thing is Forsberg can play wing or center, and could play on any of the top 3 lines no question. Really i would almost let him and the players decide where he fits best. Carter should be the 2nd line winger, Forsberg could really get some space for Carter to do his magic.
If you moved Carter to LW on the second line where do you put Hartnell?
Quote from: SD_Eagle on August 28, 2007, 10:34:16 AM
If you moved Carter to LW on the second line where do you put Hartnell?
I'd have Carter playing center, i think he's a better fit there than winger based off his past play. Hartnell can play either wing side, he used to be a center. Knuble is a natural RW. Its a tough call, the other thing you have to keep in mind, Forsberg if he comes back wont be playing till january, maybe later depending if he's ready. I want to see what Knuble looks like with two speedsters, then go from there
Is that official that Forsberg won't play till January? This morning they made it sound like he was weighing his options of playing here or in Sweden but there was no mention of him coming back midseason.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on August 28, 2007, 10:50:13 AM
Is that official that Forsberg won't play till January? This morning they made it sound like he was weighing his options of playing here or in Sweden but there was no mention of him coming back midseason.
I havent heard that officially, but thats what has been mentioned over and over since the end of the season, and Forsberg having surgery again a month or so ago. All i know is this team would be a contender with a healthy Forsberg.
i always felt like forsberg would return here...he always seemed to be genuinely upset that he wasnt able to deliver a cup to philly...and with the injuries at times he actually sounded guilty about what happened
I'm glad he won't be looked as at a Captain/Leader if he does return, on the ice he fits that mold but his personality really isn't Captain material.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on August 28, 2007, 11:39:52 AM
I'm glad he won't be looked as at a Captain/Leader if he does return, on the ice he fits that mold but his personality really isn't Captain material.
He definitely isn't, I thought the same thing that IGY said, he was really apologetic to the fans and org about his injuries and didnt want to leave with that hanging over him.
Quote from: ice grillin you on August 28, 2007, 11:34:29 AM
i always felt like forsberg would return here...he always seemed to be genuinely upset that he wasnt able to deliver a cup to philly...and with the injuries at times he actually sounded guilty about what happened
When I met up with him, Gagne, and Knuble last December out front of Ruth's Chris in Cary, NC, Forsberg said that he wanted to bring a Cup to Philly so bad that it made it burn when he peed.
what was the It burns when i pee filter for...that is incredibly accurate
lock_thread
It burns when I pee
http://broadband.2007superseries.ca/2007super/?vid=12419 (http://broadband.2007superseries.ca/2007super/?vid=12419)
The Game 2 2007 Super Series between Canada and Russia is live right now. Claude Giroux from the flyers is playing. Canada is up 2-0 in both the game and if they win the series
Demon, David Perron is one of the Blues guys, he looks really good
is that guy Giroux any good?
Quote from: SunMo on August 29, 2007, 10:40:08 AM
is that guy Giroux any good?
Fast, decent in the physical department. He's put on 10-15 pounds since the drafted him 2 years ago.
so what is he? banger? scorer?
Quote from: SunMo on August 29, 2007, 10:42:14 AM
so what is he? banger? scorer?
A Boinker?
He's a scorer, his physical game has been a suprise but he put up 112pts last year in juniors 103 the year before. Both year 64 assists, 48 goals last year
He's another Briere.
Giruox just got in there and mixed it up
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on July 11, 2007, 02:34:35 PM
Thu Oct 25, 2007 Flyers At Lightning 7:30 PM
I smell a long weekend in Tampa.
In.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on August 28, 2007, 10:50:13 AM
Is that official that Forsberg won't play till January? This morning they made it sound like he was weighing his options of playing here or in Sweden but there was no mention of him coming back midseason.
QuotePeter Forsberg had hernia surgery in Montreal on Tuesday, and that's another reason why he won't be ready to skate for quite a while - if at all.
Read that this morning - if he comes back great if not oh well.
i really like the team Homer put together this year, and if Forsberg is ready to play come mid year, i'd sign him in a heart beat.
(http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l281/theflyfan/newflyersjerseycr0.jpg)
I'm gonna say beautiful jersey before everyone comes in and says ugly.
They should have returned to the orange jerseys. The black are ugly no matter how much they spiff them up.
And what's with the gay pride triangle on the collar? farging retarded.
they should be ashamed of that...
is it a third jersey or is that their every home game johnson
Holy shtein. I just read the text in that ad.
QuoteThis performance based jersey is made with a dri-fit material with a more slimming fit!
WHAT.
THE.
farg?
:puke
The fabric is one that's being adopted league wide. Another of Gary Bettman's brilliant schemes to widen the popularity of the NHL.
When he's done, the NHL will be about as popular as Professional Ultimate Frisbee.
All 30 teams are being redesigned for the less bulky, new material, logo-on-the-neck-to-rip-off-the-NFL look. No alternates this year, either...
QuoteSPECTOR'S MAILBAG.
Here's some more speculation on Peter Forsberg signing with the Philadelphia Flyers:
Wip's Anthony Guardano great spelling spector just reported the Forsberg had dinner with Flyers President, Peter Lukko. His girlfriend is from Philly, so he has every reason to be here that had NOTHING to do with hockey, but the golf and the dinner is starting to look a little suspect. Anyway, WIP is now sure Forsberg will be a Flyer, though where the Flyers get the cap money to sign him even for half a season is beyond me.
holmgren played golf with forsberg last week and is coming on wip at 4 to talk about whats going on if anyone wants to listen
Saw a commercial on Comcast for "Meet the Flyers 2007-08". They're going to film it on Sunday 9/16 1PM at the Skate Zone...
Briere explaining why he took less money to play in Philly
Quote"People might think I'm crazy but I like the direction the Flyers are headed," Briere said. "They made great moves at the trade deadline, signed (Kimmo Timonen and Scott Hartnell) in the summer, and already had a good young core with guys like Mike Richards and Jeff Carter. When you sign a contract like mine, you look at the long-term prospects, not just those for one year."
"I'm excited to play with Mike Knuble and Simon Gagne. Marty Biron and I were roommates in Buffalo. And I played junior with Denis Gauthier. Our first goal is to make the playoffs. And I truly believe it can happen."
People thought Reggie White was crazy to sign in Green Bay too!!!1111111111!!
briere obviously knows nothing about philly sports...like all those players are gonna pan out and lead the flyers to a cup
i don't care about that...i just hope he can survive on the money he took here
Chickies and Petes does have an opening since Reno left
New Flyers Jerseys (http://flyers.nhl.com/team/app/?service=page&page=MediaGalleryPlayer&galleryId=2403)
Ew.
Go back to the old regular orange. PLEASE.
i know, gotta love this move by Betteman. Everyteam must have new jerseys, that will get fans into hockey :-D
im not sure if i can express in words how much that disgusts me
try really, really hard
I like the guy with the crosseyes.
Is there new news on Forsberg? I just heard it mentioned in the preview for SportsNite.
Flyers won their first preseason game 3-2. Tonight's game vs Ottawa will be on CN8.
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/9e/fullj.getty-76097042bb014_philadelphia_.jpg)
Hockey is back
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ8a1dyZRUs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJ8a1dyZRUs) Boulerice vs Janssen 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rv73Tk3gXNM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rv73Tk3gXNM) Smith vs Clarkson
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_trRROBEStg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_trRROBEStg) Cote vs Clarkson
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XNCCPnbBFU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XNCCPnbBFU) Eager vs Rupp (not the best, people in the way)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9nVXaH1wFM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9nVXaH1wFM) Boulerice vs Janssen 2
Quality sucks, but its nice to see fights
I'm a fairly large hockey fan, but I have never given even a glance to the pre-season. With the Flyers sucking so bad last year, and then going out and making some big moves, I am jonesin to see them play.
How serious (compared to say weeks 1-4 of the NFL pre-season) is the NHL pre-season.
Quote from: NGM on September 18, 2007, 03:13:54 PM
How serious (compared to say weeks 1-4 of the NFL pre-season) is the NHL pre-season.
I went to see the Flyers play the Caps last preseason (Flyers were blown out 6-1) and just knew they were going to have a bad season.
Quote from: NGM on September 18, 2007, 03:13:54 PM
I'm a fairly large hockey fan, but I have never given even a glance to the pre-season. With the Flyers sucking so bad last year, and then going out and making some big moves, I am jonesin to see them play.
How serious (compared to say weeks 1-4 of the NFL pre-season) is the NHL pre-season.
I never thought the preseason was serious until last year. You can watch them tonight on NHL TV, go to
http://flyers.nhl.tv/team/ (http://flyers.nhl.tv/team/)and do a preview of center ice online for free, hopefully it works, it was crapping out last night
It's basically like the Phillies preseason but there's only 2-3 weeks and 8 games. Lots of Phantoms and Nailers players, with a couple of rehabbing vets mixed in...
Thanks fellas, I'm definitely going to check it out. :yay
Flyers vs Senators preseason on CN8?
IN
Quote from: SunMo on September 18, 2007, 07:09:08 PM
Flyers vs Senators preseason on CN8?
IN
Down 3-0, when does spring training start :-D
Richards-Hartnell-Giroux line looks great, tons of energy between Richards and Hartnell
For the out of towners you can try this too http://www.cn8.tv/default.asp go under PA and you can watch a live stream
Those road jerseys are atrocious. They look nothing like a Flyers uniform.
i know...it's embarrassing, i really thought Ed Snider would be one owner that wouldn't allow that to happen
(http://www.jrbooksonline.com/jew-bwa-ha-ha.gif)
Gagne possibly the new Captain? (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20070924_Gagne_ready_to_take_on_C.html)
Downie vs Jessiman 9-22 (http://youtube.com/watch?v=lhuTVbWD5Nw)Jessiman is like 6'4", Downie is maybe 5'10". ;D
LOL at the Rangers hacks making excuses. Downie jacked him, plain & simple.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on September 24, 2007, 09:33:20 AM
LOL at the Rangers hacks making excuses. Downie jacked him, plain & simple.
My favorite part is them explaining in fight that Jessiman took boxing lessons over the summer and then BAM, Downie caught him with the right hook.
Tonight's game at home vs the Devils is on CSN
WTF? Fighting in the pre-season?!? These guys need to get over themselves.
The flyers have had at my count 11 fights in the preseason, and have won all but 3.
Quote from: Cerevant on September 24, 2007, 11:49:04 AM
WTF? Fighting in the pre-season?!? These guys need to get over themselves.
You need to throw yourself off a cliff.
Quote from: rjs246 on September 24, 2007, 12:26:32 PM
Quote from: Cerevant on September 24, 2007, 11:49:04 AM
WTF? Fighting in the pre-season?!? These guys need to get over themselves.
You need to throw yourself off a cliff.
:-D :-D
thanks for letting the old rich white people win by caring about the nhl 2 years after they stuck it in your ass and canceled the season.
NHL.com Flyers preview (http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app/?service=page&page=NewsPage&articleid=338178)
Anyone want two tickets to the Flyers game tonight? I know its really short notice but I can't use them. They're good seats, section 107 row 2.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on September 24, 2007, 05:19:45 PM
Anyone want two tickets to the Flyers game tonight? I know its really short notice but I can't use them. They're good seats, section 107 row 2.
damn SD, those are sick seats. I'm lucky enough to have to eat dinner at the inlaws tonight :'(
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on September 24, 2007, 05:21:07 PM
Quote from: SD_Eagle on September 24, 2007, 05:19:45 PM
Anyone want two tickets to the Flyers game tonight? I know its really short notice but I can't use them. They're good seats, section 107 row 2.
damn SD, those are sick seats. I'm lucky enough to have to eat dinner at the inlaws tonight :'(
ha, I just PM'd you.
Anyone? I'd hate to see them go to waste.
Flyers lose 3-1. Briere scored
Can't be too concerned. They have an entirely new lineup...will take some time to work out kinks and learn how to play with one another.
The speed and skill level is night and day from last season, some jelling is needed but you can definitely see the potential. Brodeur is still lights out, if he's not the greatest goalie of all time he's certainly top 3.
man, i really wanted to go to this game tonight, i wish i could've found tickets somewhere
Ticketmaster (http://www.ticketmaster.com/browse?category=9&tm_link=tm_sports_b_9&root=10004)
or parking lot for 5 bucks
i was tellin sun this at tailgate sunday...imo flyers are gonna stryggle to score this year...unless someone like carter (or others) take a huge leap forward and become a pure goal scorer...outside of gagne they just dont have any real finishers...not including simon i think on the entire roster they have two 30 goal seasons
maybe the score by committe approach will work and they will have like ten 20 goal scorers..well see...but with the defense being suspect they are gonna need to score more than i think they have in them...biron is gonna have to be huge
Along those same lines, I keep reading opinions on how vastly improved the Flyers will be and how they should be a playoff team, blah blah blah and I WANT to believe it, but it just seems like way too much has to fall in line for it to happen this season.
They have a lot of unrealized potential in their lineup that people seem to be in love with. Guys who have shown flashes of goal-scoring ability or highly touted prospects who 'just need a different environment'... It just all sounds like too much wishful thinking.
They'll certainly be better than last year, but I can't seem to convince myself that they'll be a playoff team.
What would you guys say if Forsberg did come back like its being talked about? Not as the superstar, but just coming back to "help".
if forsberg is forsberg and they get him it would make a huge difference...because he would single handedly turn a guy or two from 20 to 30 goal scorers...he wouldnt make them cup contenders or anything but hed be good for a bunch more wins and maybe even a playoff series win...
from what ive read is that forsberg is not gonna play until sometime after the new year....im not sure id even want him at that point...its not like hes gonna lead the team to the stanley cup and why take him on for three months in the middle of the season...doesnt make much sense to me...unless the team plays way above my expectations and is a real player in the east to the point that forsberg could put them over the top
relative to what rjs is saying this is what i posted a while back in regards to this years team in response to romey saying they would challenge for the easter conf championship this year...its still how i feel going into the season...
Quote from: ice grillin you on March 26, 2007, 08:30:18 PM
if EVERY young player they have accuired and EVERY young player already on their team develops into a bonafied nhl player then maybe they can challenge for a division...but even if they all turn out they still would be too young to challenge for the eastern conference championship
outside of gagne where are their top notch nhl players that you think can bring them to the stanley cup NEXT year...even a player like briere is on a great team...how do you know what he will do on a team like the flyers with limited talent
i think youre way overrating players they have and/or counting the young players as givens as far as developing
i like the direction they are taking but lets not go overboard here...them making the stanley cup next year is laughable
Quote from: PhillyGirl on September 25, 2007, 08:48:14 AM
What would you guys say if Forsberg did come back like its being talked about? Not as the superstar, but just coming back to "help".
Of course that would make me feel better about the team's ability to win some games and maybe make the playoffs in the short term. But truthfully I already feel good about this team's future, just not convinced about this season. They have youth up front and a deep veteran blue line. Which definitely bodes well for the next 2-3 years, I just don't think there's any way to tell how all of the young guys are going to pan out this year so all of the hype about them being a playoff team seems premature.
they should def be a playoff team...if they arent then things went dreadfully wrong
i think the question this year should be whether than can win a playoff series or not...if they do then it was a very successful season...making the playoffs would be just a good year
i completely missed this thread today. I really think this team is going to do well. I've watched the 2 preseason losses and come away impressed with everyone except Nitty and Ratcheese.
The D Men are very impressive, whats even better is the fact that the flyers have Bartulis, Parent, Picard, Ratchuck all in the system.
-Timonnen add the offense the blueline needed.
-Gauthier adds the physical aspect
-Smith is a beast, just mauls people and blocks shots
-Hatch really reinvented himself last season
-Kukkonen is a great defensive d man, and has a chance now to possibly show his offensive prowess
-Coburn is a guy to watch out for, he's looked very good again in the preseason. He's 6'5 and skates like the wind. I'm most impressed with his outlet passes to forwards.
-Randy Jones should be the reserve and is very capable if healthy. He sucks really bad if he has any injuries.
-The forwards is what IGY said, i think they have 2-3 30 goal scorers and that might just be the first line. I really like what Briere brings to the table, gagne will get his 40 easy, and Knuble should be back in the 25-30 range.
-Upshall is good for around 20-25 imo based off the player he's been since the trade.
Hartnell is a PP beast and will get at least 12 goals on the PP alone and might end up with 30 total(philly is gonna love his game).
-Richards is Gawd, but he needs to step it up offensively this year, i'm hoping for 20-25 from him.
-Carter should push that 30 goal mark, but he has to stay healthy and agressive. He plays too passive too often, but when he turns it on he's a scary player.
-Sami is Sami, he's a huge energy guy who might net 15 goals if he's healthy
-Lupul is a huge question mark? He had 35 goals for anaheim 2 years ago but last year really regressed in a system that was similar to the flyers style. The good thing is he likes it here, has good friends in Hartnell, Carter, Upshall, and Richards and i really think he has so much less pressure than last time that he will produce 25 goals.
-Eager will annoy everyone in the league and may net between 5-10. He is really underrated in his offensive play, but he's got skill
-Umberger has netted 20 goals in the past 2 seasons and if he doesnt get traded or stuck with 4th line minutes i expect him to reproduce those #'s.
overall scoring is going to be much improved. My main concern is that our goaltending and D are exceptional as is the case with all stanley cup winners. Biron looked very good last year with a bad D in front of him.
you to the flyers = shorebird to mcnabbs scrotum
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 25, 2007, 09:11:52 PM
you to the flyers = shorebird to mcnabbs scrotum
dont ever say that whitebread
If it comes together they have a good chance to make a run
Steve Downie is GAWD Pt II (http://youtube.com/watch?v=322zqTkL0-c)
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on September 25, 2007, 09:55:32 PM
Steve Downie is GAWD Pt II (http://youtube.com/watch?v=322zqTkL0-c)
How long will that suspension be?
idiot doesnt learn does he
What the farg was that!?!?
Dumbass hockey players.
QuoteDownie received a match penalty - which means an automatic and indefinite suspension pending a review
Bob Mckenzie right on point again
QuoteHere we go again9/26/2007
Here we go again.
The NHL regular season hasn't even commenced yet and we are already forced to re-open the debate on heads shots, thanks to Steve Downie's devastating hit on Dean McAmmond.
Anyone who regularly follows this space knows where I stand on it. The NHL, it says here, is not doing nearly enough to discourage hits to the head, but in the broad context of that debate, I'll put the soap box away (for now anyway) and instead focus strictly on this particular hit.
First thing, I was in the building at ScotiaBank Place so my take on it is clearly influenced by seeing the hit live and not being able to see as many angles of the replays as I normally would. Whether that makes me more qualified or less qualified, I don't know.
All I know is that people will debate the issues they usually debate on these types of hits.
Was it late? The Senators says yes, that McAmmond had dished the puck well before Downie hammered him. My sense, both in terms of live action and a quick look at a slow-motion replay, is that it wasn't a ridiculously late hit.It was nowhere close to the Chris Neil hit on Drury or any of Colby Armstrongs hits last year
Did Downie leave his feet before making impact? The Senators says yes, big time. My limited viewing of replays is inconclusive, but our boys back at the shop at TSN looked at it frame by frame and said Downie's feet may have come up slightly before impact but it was not a huge leap by any standards, although Downie's airborne body AFTER the hit certainly created the impression Downie left his feet.
Did Downie use his forearm or elbow or shoulder to hit McAmmond in the head? Again, it's apparently open to debate if you look at it frame by frame. The Senators and many others say it was an elbow. Others suggest the elbow was nicely tucked in and he used his shoulder to deliver a devastating blow to the head, which in the eyes of the NHL is just fine and dandy so long as it wasn't late, it wasn't interference, etc. It's often a tough argument because where does the forearm end and the elbow begin, where does the elbow end and the shoulder begin.
But in this case, this time around, none of it matters a bit. And that's because there is one aspect of it that is so overwhelmingly obvious the rest of it is inconsequential. And that is, quite simply, Steven Downie was looking to take off McAmmond's head and inflict damage, his protestations to the contrary notwithstanding.
It was obvious in the building and if you look beyond the isolated clip of Downie hitting McAmmond, it's obvious there on tape, too.
Moments before Downie's hit, he was pounded down to the ice and face-first into the boards by Sens' defenceman Christoph Schubert. When Downie, a blue-chip prospect who plays the game on the edge and often beyond it, got up, it was evident to one and all who knows hockey, who knows Downie, who knows anything, that he was going to seek payback. Immediately.
The minute he stood up and raced back into the play, I turned to TSN colleague Brent Wallace in the press box and said, "Watch Downie, he's going to try to kill someone."
I didn't mean kill in the literal sense, I was using hockey vernacular. The play returned to the Flyers' end, Downie was prowling and looking for someone. When the play went back up the ice into the Ottawa end, he was skating through the neutral zone. My eyes never left Downie from the moment he was hit by Schubert and what I'm describing here is my view of it, my recollection of it, my interpretation of it. This is not trial by video.
Just as he got over the centre red line, heading towards the offensive blueline, he clearly identified McAmmond in the far corner, beginning to move behind the net, and Downie sprinted at top speed. It was clear from way before the moment of contact what he was doing and what was going to happen if McAmmond didn't alter his course. It was like watching a high-speed auto accident unfold right in front of you.
To Downie's credit, I suppose, he did stop churning his legs and began to glide, mitigating the issue of a charge to some degree. But there was never any doubt in my mind what was in Downie's mind, he was going avenge the hit he took and McAmmond was going to pay the price .
And he did. If this was a court of law, the defense attorney would object to me presuming to know Downie's state of mind. Fair enough, but this isn't a court of law. It was so overwhelmingly obvious that Downie meant to do McAmmond harm. And the referee obviously agreed.
The on-ice call was appropriate. A match penalty. Match penalties are assessed for intent to injure and this one could not have been more obvious.
Should McAmmond have had his head up? Sure. Any player coming out from behind the net in that circumstance should do that, just ask Patrick Eaves or Saku Koivu, who were victims of Pittsburgh's Colby Armstrong in an area of ice that is becoming known as Death Valley.
The debate will rage on in hockey whether these are acceptable hits or not. I will get e-mails telling me if I don't like tough hockey, take up curling. And that's fine. I'm not going to get into the broader context of the argument tonight. Let's keep the focus narrow – Downie on McAmmond.
But the NHL has to decide what it wants to do with this particular hit. Technically, Downie is already suspended indefinitely, pending a review by the league.
I would be surprised if he doesn't get suspended, but whether it's for a couple of games or more than that, well, it's anyone's guess. Only Colin Campbell knows for sure whether Downie will be suspended and, if so, how many games.
To be honest, my greater concern is for McAmmond. Having had concussion problems in the past, most recently in Game 3 of the Cup final in June when Chris Pronger elbowed him in the head, you got the sickening feeling in the building that this hit had the potential to be career ending for a player like McAmmond.
Hopefully, he'll be fine, both in terms of resuming his career to say nothing of qualify of life for now and forever.
As for Downie, this isn't about persecuting him personally. I've known the kid since he played peewee hockey against a team I coached. I admire a lot about the young man who has had great hardship in his life. He's talented but he's also capable of being malicious and has clearly had issues in terms of discipline and behavior. And while we can all criticize him for that, the truth is those qualities, even the dark ones, are held in high regard in our sport. Hockey is, at times, a violent blood sport.
All things being equal, Downie was expected to start this season with the AHL Phantoms, but I couldn't help but wonder if after a hit like that, he actually did himself some good in terms of getting a roster spot with the NHL Flyers.
That will all play itself out in the days to come, as will the league's decision on whether to suspend him and, if so, for how many games. And then the debate will resume on what's a good hockey hit and what's not. And some people will say, Right on, Bob, and others will ask if my column comes in men's.
But on this night, in this instance, on this hit, there's no question about what happened and why it happened and to tell you the truth, it sort of sickens me.
watch your pass...lose your head, it's simple
it def wasnt a head shot...but you cant be objective watch that hit and say it wasnt late and/or he didnt leave his feet...it was a cheap hit period
but more than that how much of a blockhead is downie someone who has a long history of cheapshots to do something when big brother is forever watching him
hell probably get a few extra games just because of the stupidity and the in your face nature of the hit...hes basically screaming out loud to the league i dont give a shtein how much youre watching me or what my history says im gonna do what i want when i want to do it
Give Downie the "C"
he's known more for being a hot head and fighting than cheapshotter. I love everything Downie brings to the table. He got crushed on a borderline dirty hit by Schubert and returnd the favor.
Quote from: SunMo on September 26, 2007, 08:47:29 AM
watch your pass...lose your head, it's simple
Exactly. Hockey is a game played by men and written about by flags who couldn't hack it.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on September 26, 2007, 09:26:45 AM
Quote from: SunMo on September 26, 2007, 08:47:29 AM
watch your pass...lose your head, it's simple
Exactly. Hockey is a game played by men and written about by flags who couldn't hack it.
and the commish is from the NBA :boom
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on September 26, 2007, 09:19:27 AM
Give Downie the "C"
he's known more for being a hot head and fighting than cheapshotter. I love everything Downie brings to the table. He got crushed on a borderline dirty hit by Schubert and returnd the favor.
lol...you need to research downies history....hes a cheap shot extroadanaire
the one good thing about this is that if he makes the team the next game against ottawa should be off the hook
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 26, 2007, 10:01:45 AM
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on September 26, 2007, 09:19:27 AM
Give Downie the "C"
he's known more for being a hot head and fighting than cheapshotter. I love everything Downie brings to the table. He got crushed on a borderline dirty hit by Schubert and returnd the favor.
lol...you need to research downies history....hes a cheap shot extroadanaire
the one good thing about this is that if he makes the team the next game against ottawa should be off the hook
So your telling me you know more about Junior hockey than me right?
lol...holy crap where did that come from....dont worry im not gonna steal your junior hockey crown from you
bottom line is i can cite multiple incidents where downie has cheapshotted people...last night was the latest one
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 26, 2007, 11:34:41 AM
lol...holy crap where did that come from....dont worry im not gonna steal your junior hockey crown from you
bottom line is i can cite multiple incidents where downie has cheapshotted people...last night was the latest one
i was ready to drop the gloves man
All i know is this kid brings championships where ever he plays. In the regular season, he gets out of hand, but Homer has been close to him from the day he was drafted. In the Memorial Cups/World Championships he never pulls that kind of stuff.
I cant wait to see the next meeting between Ott and the Flyers, its gonna be great. I'm thinking Stevens dresses 2 goons.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on September 26, 2007, 12:00:15 PM
I cant wait to see the next meeting between Ott and the Flyers, its gonna be great. I'm thinking Stevens dresses 2 goons.
if downie plays it should be interesting
but because its really a downie vs ottawa thing rather than a flyer vs ottawa thing stevens isnt gonna dress multiple goons to protect a 4th line rookie who is fairly tough in his own right
first game against the Sens is
Sat. Nov 24th @ Ottawa 7:00 p.m. CW-57
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 26, 2007, 12:11:56 PMits really a downie vs ottawa thing rather than a flyer vs ottawa thing
since there's no history or bad blood between these teams or anything
makes sense since the flyers have exactly two players left from that team
Lupul out at least 2 weeks
Upshall out 6-8 weeks
Broken wrist last night for each
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LItMqF6_G0I
Quote from: SunMo on September 26, 2007, 01:51:26 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LItMqF6_G0I
i'm jeepwrang :-D Ceez is killing me with the werewolf stuff
ha...classic OnA references are always funny
Jason Blake with an all time overreaction:
QuoteI've got one thought... the kid should not be [allowed] to ever play in the league again. There's no place in hockey for that. Our game is supposed to be fun, exciting, fast... and safe in the same breath. To watch that last night, it's just unacceptable. Guys like [Downie] should either be suspended or kicked out of the league. To leave your point-man and run a guy all the way from the blueline... I mean, one day, a player is not going to get up. So, something needs to be done about hits of that nature."
When asked about Downie's claim that he has to play like that in order to crack the Flyers' roster, Blake replied: "Has to play like what? That's just a dumb comment from a kid that's not going to make the Philadelphia Flyers. I mean, I watched the play over and over, and to see him hit Dean McAmmond with his head down, going full bore, and leaving his feet... [McAmmond] could have died last night. There's absolutely no place in hockey for that and, if you ask me, [Downie] shouldn't even be allowed to play hockey in the NHL again.
Quote from: SunMo on September 26, 2007, 03:52:48 PM
Jason Blake with an all time overreaction:
QuoteI've got one thought... the kid should not be [allowed] to ever play in the league again. There's no place in hockey for that. Our game is supposed to be fun, exciting, fast... and safe in the same breath. To watch that last night, it's just unacceptable. Guys like [Downie] should either be suspended or kicked out of the league. To leave your point-man and run a guy all the way from the blueline... I mean, one day, a player is not going to get up. So, something needs to be done about hits of that nature."
When asked about Downie's claim that he has to play like that in order to crack the Flyers' roster, Blake replied: "Has to play like what? That's just a dumb comment from a kid that's not going to make the Philadelphia Flyers. I mean, I watched the play over and over, and to see him hit Dean McAmmond with his head down, going full bore, and leaving his feet... [McAmmond] could have died last night. There's absolutely no place in hockey for that and, if you ask me, [Downie] shouldn't even be allowed to play hockey in the NHL again.
someone needs to perform an abortion on that albino fetus
not much different than you homers under reacting
it was a super cheap vicious hit...should he suspended for life of course farging not...but hes gotta sit for 8-15 games
8-15...stop
christ, you're turning into a woman
it was premeditated...dirty...cheap and dangerous and the guy has a history
id be shocked if he didnt get around 10 games
i dont care that much cause hes a flyer but if the situation was reversed id be fuming right now and probably talking like blake
you're still a woman
I can smell IGY's tampon all the way up 95
Its a 2 game max, he didnt charge the stills show he was still on the ice with the inital contact. He caught someone with their head down after Schubert cross checked Downie from behind into the boards. He got up and wrecked the first thing he saw. I love steve downie, and if the jerseys werent so ghey i'd have one by friday
im actually stunned at how much of a flyer homer youre...never knew you had it in you...you easily equal and one day may surpass any eagle homer...should be a fun year
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 26, 2007, 04:50:57 PM
im actually stunned at how much of a flyer homer youre...never knew you had it in you...you easily equal and one day may surpass any eagle homer...should be a fun year
i lurve you
i think it was the new uniforms. obviously Downie's is wrapped waaay too tight.
Flyers beat the old-school Caps 2-1
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/6c/fullj.getty-76972589jm011_washington_ca.jpg)
just the symbol easy...the hockey stick capitals is awesome but those uni's blow...they should have went back to the entire uniform...oh yeah bettman wouldnt allow that
That symbol reminds me of my hatred for Dale Hunter
Sens forward McAmmond released from hospital after suffering concussion
Canadian Press
OTTAWA - The good news for Senators forward Dean McAmmond is nothing was broken in the bone-rattling hit he absorbed from Flyers prospect Steve Downie on Tuesday night.
But there was little other word on the condition of McAmmond, who has had head injuries before.
The Sens issed a short statement Wednesday saying there were no fractures and that he was to see the club's training staff for treatment. McAmmond was released from a local hospital after undergoing an examination following Tuesday's exhibition.
McAmmond suffered a concussion after a hit by Chris Pronger in Game 3 of the Stanley Cup final last June.
The Sens forward had to be wheeled off on a stretcher in the second period Tuesday. Downie received a match penalty - which means an automatic and indefinite suspension pending a review.
In Edmonton, Oilers veteran Shawn Horcoff said hockey is a physical game but that there has to be limits.
"There isn't any room in the game for that," Horcoff said Wednesday. "He showed him no respect. It very well could have ended his career. Mac has some concussion problems as it is, and that one looked pretty severe."
Oilers head coach Craig MacTavish said the hit was a textbook case of what the league is trying to crack down on.
"It's hard to defend the player in that respect," said MacTavish. "Dean I know well, so maybe I'm a little more emotionally attached to what happened, but clearly to me this is something the league was very clear that they were going to try to eliminate.
"I guess the only argument you would have for Steve Downie is that he's trying to make a name for himself and get a (roster) spot, but that's not the way to do it."
The Flyers were leading 2-1 when, at the 2:39 mark of the second, Downie skated the length of the ice and took a run at McAmmond, who had just released the puck while circling behind the Flyers' net and was met by Downie coming around the other side. Downie also appeared to leave his feet as he flattened the veteran.
Downie gained a reputation at the junior level for some nasty play, but the Newmarket, Ont., native said Tuesday's hit wasn't pre-meditated, nor did he intend to go for McAmmond's head.
Oilers forward Andrew Cogliano said he's a good friend and former roommate of Downie.
"It's pretty unfortunate," he said. "It's a hit where he could have used his head a little bit better, but he's trying to find a job in the league and make his name, but I think a lot of guys would agree that was kind of a little bit of a cheap hit, and I think he kind of knows it was, too."
"I didn't mean to hurt him and I hope he's OK," Downie said after the game. "My game's to hit and to finish the check. I'm just trying to earn a spot on the roster. It's part of my game and I apologize for him getting hurt.
"I thought I got him clean. Once we hit the boards after, I asked if he was OK."
The hit had the Sens fuming after the game.
"It was a cheap shot. There's no part in the game for hits like that," said Senators right-winger Brian McGrattan, who was ejected after he sought justice on the offending Downie. "A guy can't defend himself and you take a 40-foot run and jump and hit him. Hopefully the league takes a look at it. Those are the hits we don't want in our game.
"You don't want to see stuff like that. We're not out there to kill each other."
McGrattan later went on to issue a warning.
"He'll get what's coming to him," said McGrattan. "He'll do it to the wrong guy and somebody will put him out of hockey. You do that at his level a couple of times, guys in junior won't do it, but guys at this level will.
"He'll get what's coming to him next time we play him, that's for sure."
Lupol may be ready for the opener (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20070927_Among_injuries__Upshalls_hurts_most.html)
So, let me get this straight - there's no place in hockey for "dirty" hits but there is a place for threats of ending another player's career?
I see.
:-D
New NHL = GHEY
Cam Janssen hit on Thomas Kaberle
More atrocious than the hit is the announcer trying to justify it (http://youtube.com/watch?v=WgDUNn8q4qo)
Quote from: SunMo on September 27, 2007, 02:50:49 PM
Cam Janssen hit on Thomas Kaberle
More atrocious than the hit is the announcer trying to justify it (http://youtube.com/watch?v=WgDUNn8q4qo)
Thats the exact case i was making. There is no way that Downie's was worse than that. What annoys me is the league is having a special hearing for Downie tomorrow about his hit, meanwhile Cam Janssen had a 2 game suspension without a hearing.
If Mike Richards had delivered that hit, this would not have been as big an issue. What a kid does in Juniors should hold no bearing on the league he's in now. The NFL has set that precedent, I really want to see what the NHLPA does?
(http://a730.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/124/l_0e9923133a31091dea2bbd5f634765a9.gif)
farging absurd...
http://flyers.nhl.com/
little higher than i thought but i told you his history plus the downright brazeness of the play would bang him hard
the 20 comes from the nhl trying to pay more attention to head injuries...something that needs to be done...concussions are becoming an epidemic in the league
Bertuzzi served 20 games for trying to kill Steve Moore
:-D
The Longest NHL Suspensions:
The Rest Of The Season (minimum 25 games)
Chris Simon of the New York Islanders, for a slash to the face of the Rangers' Ryan Hollweg in March 2007. Simon misses 15 regular season games plus all of the Islanders' playoff games. The suspension carries over to 2007-08 if necessary to meet the 25-game minimum.
The Rest Of The Season (23 games)
Marty McSorley of the Boston Bruins, for knocking out Vancouver's Donald Brashear by swinging a stick at his head in March, 2000. McSorley misses 23 regular season games.
The Rest Of The Season (20 games)
Todd Bertuzzi of the Vancouver Canucks, for serious injuries sustained by Colorado's Steve Moore when Bertuzzi jumped him from behind in March, 2004. Bertuzzi misses 13 regular season games, plus seven playoff games. His suspension is listed as indefinite, but the following season is cancelled due to a labor dispute and he is allowed to return when the NHL resumes in the fall of 2005.
23 Games
Gordie Dwyer of the Tampa Bay Lightning, for abusing officials and leaving the penalty box to fight in a pre-season game against the Washington Capitals in September, 2000.
21 games
Dale Hunter of the Washington Capitals, for a hit on Pierre Turgeon of the New York Islanders while Turgeon celebrates a goal in the 1993 playoffs.
20 games
Tom Lysiak of the Chicago Blackhawks, for intentionally tripping a linesman in October, 1983.
20 games
Brad May of the Phoenix Coyotes, for a slash to the head of Columbus' Steve Heinze in November, 2000.
16 games
Eddie Shore of the Boston Bruins, for hitting Toronto's Ace Bailey over the head with his stick in 1933.
yup, a body check fits right in there...
What a mickey mouse league
breaking someone's neck and ending their career is totally the same as a charge
its worthless and irrelevant to refer to past suspensions...times change and like i said the league is really trying to make a statement regarding head injuries...something mccammond had a history of
plus downie has long been known as a punk vs bertuzzi having an impeccable record prior to his punch
also re: bertuzzi if moore doesnt break his neck he probably gets five games...the 20 games was because of the severe injury....truth be told bertuzzi got off light and if mcammond never plays again or is out for months and months then so will have downie
from what i've read, mcammond will be ready to go when the season starts or soon after
20 games is severe but it sends a message to these douches to stop head hunting and play the game right. i like it.
also, i read through espns nhl preview and was able to name 1 player or 14 teams and 4 coaches (including the flyers). hooray.
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 28, 2007, 02:19:00 PM
its worthless and irrelevant to refer to past suspensions...times change and like i said the league is really trying to make a statement regarding head injuries...something mccammond had a history of
plus downie has long been known as a punk vs bertuzzi having an impeccable record prior to his punch
also re: bertuzzi if moore doesnt break his neck he probably gets five games...the 20 games was because of the severe injury....truth be told bertuzzi got off light and if mcammond never plays again or is out for months and months then so will have downie
There is nothing in the bylaws about headshots. They have been talking about it for years but never address it, now they go overboard. I agree that headshots have no place in the game unless your hitting Darcy Tucker.
well you thought the hit was legal from the get go and dont believe any suspension is warranted so i can see why youd go crazy over 20 games
Quote23 Games
Gordie Dwyer of the Tampa Bay Lightning, for abusing officials and leaving the penalty box to fight in a pre-season game against the Washington Capitals in September, 2000.
How can anyone with a penis not love hockey?
Quote from: ice grillin you on September 28, 2007, 02:32:31 PM
well you thought the hit was legal from the get go and dont believe any suspension is warranted so i can see why youd go crazy over 20 games
I thought 2-3 would be more than enough to set a standard.
I'm buying you this havas (http://www.cafepress.com/cp/customize/product.aspx?clear=true&number=%20174238183)
lol
Tim P talked with Colin Campbell after the decision was made:
QuoteHe told me, "This boy left his feet, targeted the head and stalked the player. [McAmmond] had no expectation of this hit and [Downie] drilled him. We felt we saw retribution in the cards once [Downie] was hit himself.
"We're not saying shoulder hits to the head are illegal. Only if all the other criteria come into play. We don't want to take shoulder hits to the head out of the game."
I argued a point with Colin. As long as shots to the head are not outlawed, there is always going to be a "gray" area in hockey as to what is a legal hit and illegal hit. And there is going to be concussions.
"Tim, if we take out hits to the head, do we ban fighting then?" Campbell asked me. "I don't want to eliminate hitting from hockey. Shoulder hits to the head are still a legal body check. What we don't want to do is having players skating around with their heads down and looking for the league or referees to protect them."
Before Campbell made his ruling, he canvassed opinion from the NHL's competition committee. He said the consensus from the committee was that the Downie hit represented the "exact" hit the NHL wants to eliminate from the game.
Flyers took the high road here. Here's general manager Paul Holmgren's reaction:
"My reaction is that it seems like a lot of games, but Colin Campbell is in a very difficult position and we respect his position and his judgment in this case. We will live with it. I was with Steve during the hearing and was with him after the verdict. He is very upset and understandably so. He understands the ramifications and he is prepared to live with this decision.
what a farging joke of a league
Quote from: SunMo on September 28, 2007, 04:41:45 PM
Tim P talked with Colin Campbell after the decision was made:
QuoteHe told me, "This boy left his feet, targeted the head and stalked the player. [McAmmond] had no expectation of this hit and [Downie] drilled him. We felt we saw retribution in the cards once [Downie] was hit himself.
"We're not saying shoulder hits to the head are illegal. Only if all the other criteria come into play. We don't want to take shoulder hits to the head out of the game."
I argued a point with Colin. As long as shots to the head are not outlawed, there is always going to be a "gray" area in hockey as to what is a legal hit and illegal hit. And there is going to be concussions.
"Tim, if we take out hits to the head, do we ban fighting then?" Campbell asked me. "I don't want to eliminate hitting from hockey. Shoulder hits to the head are still a legal body check. What we don't want to do is having players skating around with their heads down and looking for the league or referees to protect them."
Before Campbell made his ruling, he canvassed opinion from the NHL's competition committee. He said the consensus from the committee was that the Downie hit represented the "exact" hit the NHL wants to eliminate from the game.
Flyers took the high road here. Here's general manager Paul Holmgren's reaction:
"My reaction is that it seems like a lot of games, but Colin Campbell is in a very difficult position and we respect his position and his judgment in this case. We will live with it. I was with Steve during the hearing and was with him after the verdict. He is very upset and understandably so. He understands the ramifications and he is prepared to live with this decision.
what a farging joke of a league
Seriously, wtf did they suspend him for. He didnt use his elbow, he used his shoulder. They have no case other than the bitches in Ottawa and dirty tampons like Jason Blake cried about it. The NHLPA should rip this thing to shreds if they just use those quotes alone.
I figured Downie would be suspended, but I had guessed it would be five games, maybe as many as ten to make an example. Twenty is just crazy.
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l178/flyerland/DOWNIE.jpg)
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l178/flyerland/kitty.jpg)
(http://a899.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/92/l_2cb51f15827a27131632ec99522b9612.jpg)
and for Murp
(http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/7119/vulgar2um6.jpg)
They suspended him for that hit? That is the first I've seen it due to the travel and shtein, but a lengthy suspension? Gary Bettman and Colin Campbell are a couple of ninny's.
Flyers/Rangers games should be good this season, there were 4 fights tonight:
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/1e/fullj.getty-76097054lr003_new_york_rang.jpg)
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/sp/getty/9b/fullj.getty-76097054lr004_new_york_rang.jpg)
So, the Flyers are going on the "lose the games, but win the fights" mentality?
I guess that's a step up from last year.
I'll be surprised - not shocked, but surprised - if they actually make the playoffs.
Jason Smith was named Captian today with Gagne and Gawd getting the 'A'
Quote from: SunMo on October 01, 2007, 12:24:21 PM
Jason Smith was named Captian today with Gagne and Gawd getting the 'A'
Who the farg is Jason Smith? What the farg?
Why not Brieiereireirre?
unless gagne didnt want it then thats a huge slap in his face...jason smith is not a philadelphia flyer....
Gagne is a cheese-eater
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 01, 2007, 01:55:34 PM
unless gagne didnt want it then thats a huge slap in his face...jason smith is not a philadelphia flyer....
Gagne NEVER wanted to be captain. Ever.
ANd get your Hoyda ass into the Phillies thread and admit you were wrong.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on October 01, 2007, 02:56:38 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 01, 2007, 01:55:34 PM
unless gagne didnt want it then thats a huge slap in his face...jason smith is not a philadelphia flyer....
Gagne NEVER wanted to be captain. Ever.
ANd get your Hoyda ass into the Phillies thread and admit you were wrong.
Guess you missed this: Gagne ready to take on Captain (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20070924_Gagne_ready_to_take_on_C.html).
Quote from: FastFreddie on October 01, 2007, 02:25:26 PM
Gagne is a cheese-eater
Jason Smith was a hell of a captain to Edmonton. I'm fine with the pick.
What type of cheese is that.....AMERICAN... (http://youtube.com/watch?v=APOtRvO6moA)
Quote from: PhillyGirl on October 01, 2007, 02:56:38 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 01, 2007, 01:55:34 PM
unless gagne didnt want it then thats a huge slap in his face...jason smith is not a philadelphia flyer....
Gagne NEVER wanted to be captain. Ever.
ANd get your Hoyda ass into the Phillies thread and admit you were wrong.
define ever?
Gauthier placed on waivers (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20071002_Veteran_defenseman_Gauthier_a_victim_of_salary_cap.html)
Quote from: SD_Eagle on October 01, 2007, 03:30:51 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on October 01, 2007, 02:56:38 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 01, 2007, 01:55:34 PM
unless gagne didnt want it then thats a huge slap in his face...jason smith is not a philadelphia flyer....
Gagne NEVER wanted to be captain. Ever.
ANd get your Hoyda ass into the Phillies thread and admit you were wrong.
Guess you missed this: Gagne ready to take on Captain (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20070924_Gagne_ready_to_take_on_C.html).
Guess I did. He's not the "leader" type though. I have no problem with them offering Smith the C.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on October 02, 2007, 07:49:02 AM
Gauthier placed on waivers (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/flyers/20071002_Veteran_defenseman_Gauthier_a_victim_of_salary_cap.html)
Sucks for Goat, but its really the best thing for the team. Rathje is done, Long Term Injured list, so i'm hoping thats the end of him. Putting ratcheese on the injured list and Gauthier on waivers means that they keep Dowd and Jesse, plus have enough money to get Forsberg if he wants to come back
If Gagne's upset he's not expressing it publicly:
Quote"Jason has been one of the best leaders in the game," Gagne said. "He was the right choice and is the full package. He has everything in him to be a good captain."
smith is a fine captain...he just shouldnt be the flyers captain....should be richards or gagne....hell id give it to hatcher before smith...really the captaincy in hockey is mad overrated...but it should always go to someone who represents the franchise perfectly and some 34 year old rent a player doesnt do that imo
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 02, 2007, 10:26:09 AM
smith is a fine captain...he just shouldnt be the flyers captain....should be richards or gagne....hell id give it to hatcher before smith...really the captaincy in hockey is mad overrated...but it should always go to someone who represents the franchise perfectly and some 34 year old rent a player doesnt do that imo
Hatcher didnt do too well the last time around IGY. Smith is the 2 year captain. If you notice the made teh GAWD an "A", thats more or less setting him up as the next "C"
QuotePaper: Desjardins no fan of Pitkanen
E-MAIL Print Comment 0
Posted: October 2, 2007
Canadian Press
MONTREAL (CP) -- Retired defenseman Eric Desjardins likes every offseason move made by Philadelphia Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren, especially dealing Joni Pitkanen to Edmonton.
Desjardins, a former Flyers captain, lauded Holmgren in his weekly column in Montreal La Presse on Tuesday.
"He made courageous decisions, but he came out looking good because he was prepared and he knew his team inside out," said Desjardins.
Those decisions included the complex trade of Peter Forsberg to Nashville, which ended up with defenseman Timmo Kimmonen and forwards Scott Hartnell and Scottie Upshall moving to the Flyers.
"The other courageous move was trading young defenseman Joni Pitkanen to the Oilers," he said. "He has all the talent in the world, he's strong as a horse and he's as powerful a skater as Al Iafrate was, but he is also very immature.
"As I said, Holmgren knows his people and he knew the guys couldn't put up with Pitkanen any more. They tried to give him support, but the youngster can't accept criticism and is very hard-headed. Even his (Finnish) compatriot Sami Kapanen had trouble with him and asked me to deal with it because he couldn't do it any more."
Desjardins called the Flyers "the most improved club in the NHL by far" and said he may have reconsidered his decision to retire before last season if Holmgren had been GM at the time instead of Bob Clarke.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on October 03, 2007, 08:36:46 AM
QuotePaper: Desjardins no fan of Pitkanen
E-MAIL Print Comment 0
Posted: October 2, 2007
Canadian Press
MONTREAL (CP) -- Retired defenseman Eric Desjardins likes every offseason move made by Philadelphia Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren, especially dealing Joni Pitkanen to Edmonton.
Desjardins, a former Flyers captain, lauded Holmgren in his weekly column in Montreal La Presse on Tuesday.
"He made courageous decisions, but he came out looking good because he was prepared and he knew his team inside out," said Desjardins.
Those decisions included the complex trade of Peter Forsberg to Nashville, which ended up with defenseman Timmo Kimmonen and forwards Scott Hartnell and Scottie Upshall moving to the Flyers.
"The other courageous move was trading young defenseman Joni Pitkanen to the Oilers," he said. "He has all the talent in the world, he's strong as a horse and he's as powerful a skater as Al Iafrate was, but he is also very immature.
"As I said, Holmgren knows his people and he knew the guys couldn't put up with Pitkanen any more. They tried to give him support, but the youngster can't accept criticism and is very hard-headed. Even his (Finnish) compatriot Sami Kapanen had trouble with him and asked me to deal with it because he couldn't do it any more."
Desjardins called the Flyers "the most improved club in the NHL by far" and said he may have reconsidered his decision to retire before last season if Holmgren had been GM at the time instead of Bob Clarke.
I had no idea he was such a headcase. I just though he had no balls.
Randy Jones just crushed Patrice Bergeron and now they're taking him off on a stretcher
Wrong thread smart guy.
on the nhl package the boston tv announcers are killing the flyer guys saying word got back to us that the flyer announcers tried to defend the hit
jack edwards from espn is the bruins pbp guy