2009 Philadelphia Phillies - Season's Over, Time to Move On

[MDS]

i remember a game last year in chicago that he pitched well then madson and durbin gave up 30 runs in the 8th inning and that was it. cole stormed out of the clubhouse like a farging twatface baby.

but when he blows a 2 or 3 run lead to the friggin giants its no big deal. hes a farging baby.

[ice grillin you]

FIne, a #2 guy doesn't whine, bitch and moan after every hit he gives up.

i mean i know what youre saying and i have never been that warm towards him but i give him a pass because of that parade thing he gave us last year

[The BIGSTUD]

If you win a WS MVP, then you earn the right to be the game one starter the following postseason.

If he goes out and continues to pitch like he is now, then so be it.

[BigEd76]

Unless Lee starts one of the games against the Marlins in that final weekend, I don't see how he isn't starting game 1 of the NLDS.  As for Cole, his problem is that his curve isn't good enough to be a 3rd dominating pitch and people are teeing off on him when he leaves his two pitches up...

[mpmcgraw]

Hamels threw a tremendous amount of innings last year. He is doing historically what most pitchers in his situation do the next year. It happens.

He is 25 and you'd be hard pressed to find another 25 year old in the majors with less time to develop than he had. He will only get better. Calling him a 2 is just stupid. Next year he will be himself again, probably even better than he was last year. 

He's not even in his prime yet you space monkeys. Get a grip.

[ice grillin you]

so hes a one cause you says hes gonna be a one next year...lol...doesnt work like that....

dook has never won more than 15 games in his life....he was amazing in the playoffs last year for a month and you cant take that away from him but he has never been a true one and still isnt...hopefully youre right about him down the line....but for right now....no good dunny

[Rome]

hamels is pitching like a bitch this year. who gives a holy farg what he did last year? 

[The BIGSTUD]

Because you get special privileges when you are the MVP of a team that ends the 25 year drought.

If he goes out and buckles down in the playoffs, then everyone will forget about the regular season.

[MDS]

youre an idiot

if lee pitches like you expect him to, hell be the game 1 starter and cole will have no problem with it. in fact hell welcome it. he doesnt want to be an ace and hes admitted as such.

[The BIGSTUD]

How come you're always wrong?

The Phils have stated before that Cole will be their game 1 starter no matter what.

[MDS]

yea im sure thatll hold up if lee runs the table

[The BIGSTUD]

The postseason is still a different animal. Just because you are a great regular season pitcher/player, doesn't make you a great playoff pitcher/player and vice versa(see A Rod and CC Sabathia). I'm not going to excuse Cole's regular season, but he could very well be that big game pitcher who takes his game to the next level in the playoffs. You want that guy who has been there, done that at the top spot in the rotation.

Cole pitched a million times better in the playoffs than he ever did in his big league career in 2008. Maybe that is just what he does. IMO he's earned his shot again this year to prove it.

Now if he goes into the playoffs and pitches the same way? Well then he obviously will have lost his that privilege. Otherwise, I don't see how you don't want a player who has proven he can handle big moments and dominate in the playoffs as your ace. He didn't just have a great postseason last year, he had one of the single best in playoff history. Not to mention he battled the weather conditions in a championship-decider.

I don't think one inconsistent season negates all of that. You obviously do.

[MDS]

thanks for breaking it down, skip.

you go with the hotter hand. if things are equal its hamels. if lee is lights out its him. why is this a pointless reese/cole/munson debate?

[The BIGSTUD]

That is the question. Do you go with the hot hand or do you go with the proven winner?

I go with the proven winner. I don't think hot pitching necessarily always carries over to the playoffs. I'd love to think Lee can be a great postseason pitcher, but he hasn't proven it yet. Cole has.

For all we know Lee could be Sabathia and be red hot going into the playoffs. Sabathia carried the Brewers into the playoffs last season. Then he comes into Philly and gets hit around. He let Brett farging Myers own him.

I'm not going to say starting Lee in game one is the dumbest move ever. He's a great pitcher obviously. But in the playoffs I'd rather go with the guy who we've seen get it done before.

[SD_Eagle5]

Trying to put Hamels struggles in focus

On Aug. 4, 2004, a young righthander named Josh Beckett allowed eight runs - five earned - on nine hits in four innings of an 11-6 loss to the Arizona Diamondbacks, who would go on to win just 51 games and hit just .253 as a team. The previous season, at the age of 23, Beckett led the Marlins to a dramatic seven-game win over the Yankees in the 2003 World Series, claiming MVP honors in the process. Less than a year later, he was 4-7 with a 4.54 ERA after that loss to Arizona and had two stints on the disabled list.

Beckett finished that 2004 season strong, going 5-2 with a 2.95 ERA in his final 11 starts of the season.

Now, 5 years later, the Phillies are hoping Cole Hamels - who won World Series MVP honors at the age of 24 last year, but is 7-6 with a 4.68 ERA this season - can experience a similar renaissance.