Let's all talk about our experiences smoking weed. That'll be farging great.

Started by Diomedes, May 09, 2008, 08:14:16 AM

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Diomedes

easily as misguided as the war in Iraq, the so-called War on Drugs is one of the biggest problems going in this country; it is a problem larger even than the actual drugs themselves.  It boils down to a war on the poor, and on basic liberties that would otherwise be protected by the constitution if we hadn't let the government strip them away in the name of the good fight.  Kinda like the War on Terrorism...America is willing to let the government do anything in the fight against these two bogey men.

Now we have a thread to discuss this particular American Horror.

I'll start with this example of jack booted government drug warfare...

http://reason.com/blog/show/126284.html?redux
There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists." - Yosemite Park Ranger

rjs246

#1
Opposing this racist and hideously ineffective 'war' is a hopeless cause because there is no justifiable logic to it in the first place. Nearly every drug law that has ever been passed has been rooted in racism, not any sort of real threat to the common good, which is remarkable given just how many ridiculous laws there are around drugs. And yet, these laws have become so ingrained in our society that the idea of changing them or dropping them altogether sends people into a tizzy of righteous indignation.

As long as people anywhere consider it immoral to alter your consciousness this type of pointless, expensive, idiotic crusade will continue.
Is rjs gonna have to choke a bitch?

Let them eat bootstraps.

Diomedes

So what you're saying is....delete thread?
There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists." - Yosemite Park Ranger

ice grillin you

it aint a war on the poor its a war on minorities


http://www.hrw.org/reports/2000/usa/Rcedrg00-05.htm

VII. RACIALLY DISPROPORTIONATE DRUG ARRESTS
The disproportionate rates at which black drug offenders are sent to prison originate in racially disproportionate rates of arrest.72 Contrary to public belief, the higher arrest rates of black drug offenders do not reflect higher rates of drug law violations. Whites, in fact, commit more drug crimes than blacks. But the war on drugs has been waged in ways that have had the foreseeable consequence of disproportionately targeting black drug offenders.
i can take a phrase thats rarely heard...flip it....now its a daily word

igy gettin it done like warrick

im the board pharmacist....always one step above yous

Diomedes

Of course it's a war on minorities, but that puts it a little too simply.  Poor people are targeted, middle class and wealthy people are not.

I know it's impossible for you to wrap your monomaniacal mind around, vigy, but it is nevertheless true that racism is not the reason for every bad thing ever.
There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists." - Yosemite Park Ranger

rjs246

Actually, a war on the poor is far more accurate if you look at the history of drug laws. It manifests itself in being a war on minorities these days because South American and Black folks make up much of the lower class right now. But in the past laws have been passed to fight substance use of the Chinese and Irish, both of which made up much of the lower class at the times of the laws passing.

Racism, by and large, has very little to do with race. It is almost always a rich man/poor man thing. Not that I expect you to believe that.
Is rjs gonna have to choke a bitch?

Let them eat bootstraps.

ice grillin you

the poor by far are more likely to go to jail for drugs but there isnt a war on the poor its just where the most arrests can be made and of course minorities are disproportionatly lower income dwellers


if youre a middle/upper class minority your drug sentance is going to be much more severe than if youre a poor white

i can take a phrase thats rarely heard...flip it....now its a daily word

igy gettin it done like warrick

im the board pharmacist....always one step above yous

shorebird

That burns my ass reading stories like that. There are too many cops out there, SWAT and DEA, who are on nothing but a power trip, and they aren't made to suffer the consequences of thier mistakes. They are given' free rein to fight drug abuse. It's the whole "police brotherhood" thing.

Having said that, it's not drug use thats hurting this country, it's drug abuse, and the way the gov. goes about having to fight it. The government is so hypocritcal on the issue of drugs, it makes me sick. Alcohol and cigarettes are the perfect example. Cigarettes kill more people and are more addictive than any drug out there, but as long as the government is making money off of them they don't care.

Alcohol is probably the second or third most addictive drug out there. It's legal. Every liquor store or bar you go into, they have a license issued by the state making it legal to sell booze. But the state puts no limit on how much you can buy at a liquor store or how much a bar tender can serve you. Drink over what is the legal limit, and walk out of a bar, and you stand a good chance of getting arrested, wether your walking, riding a bike, or whatever.

The same people who provided the license for the vendor to sell you the alcohol and collect the taxes off it, are the same people who will prosecute you for drinking too much.

I'm not saying that drinking and driving is not wrong, but c'mon. If the state is so damn worried about you drinking and driving, why do they allow bars to operate, or drive in liquor stores? Farging hypocrites.

And then, the guy or gal who wants to relax after work or before a big game with a few tokes off a joint has the possibility of going to jail with thieves, rapist, murderers, and all types of thugs in general. For the life of me I don't know what screams hypocrites any more than the government that allows it's people to kill themselves smoking cigarettes and driving drunk while they get rich, but yet wants to prosecute and lock up a person for smoking a joint. Goddamn farging hypocrites.

Still, the drug abuse is a terrible thing and something needs to be done. Meth, Heroin, and Crack Cocaine is some serious shtein, and ruins the lives of the people addicted to it as well as their families. I don't think kicking doors in and shooting people is the answer, and I don't have the answer. All I know is the way the government is going about it is not helping anyone, and thats what the addict needs is help.

The war on drugs is a war the U.S. will never win. Mainly because they are going about it the wrong way. They allow their officers to abuse authority in the name of the law. And judges, prosecuters, and most of the media are all on thier side. It's the casual user who being no different than the cigarette smoker or happy hour drinker, is the one who loses out.


fansince61


mussa

our jail systems are overloaded with inmates because of the war on drugs. doesn't the US have more inmates than any other country? oh yea, and our tax dollars pay for them to rot in jail. this war on drugs is totally awesome
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fansince61

Quote from: mussa on May 09, 2008, 10:17:46 AM
our jail systems are overloaded with inmates because of the war on drugs. doesn't the US have more inmates than any other country? oh yea, and our tax dollars pay for them to rot in jail. this war on drugs is totally awesome

"The War on Taxpayers"  By the way...they love to bust the rich here and confinscate all the property they can.  The "rich" are like free money to the police depts.

Phanatic

There was a guy from the NY Times on NPR the other day who did a study comparing our prison system to the rest of the world. Shocking thing was that the US has more prisoners then any other country in the world. By a lot! This includes China and India with larger populations. The biggest difference that he could tell all comes from the war on drugs.

Not only does the US arrest dealers but users as well. Most other countries rehab and rehabilitate. Another part is that the US prison system is now only interested in punishment and does not actually reform or get anyone in the system ready to rejoin society so it becomes a vicious circle.

In the early 1900's the US prison system was a model to the rest of the world and many countries came to learn and copy our system. Now everyone agrees we're farged.
This post is brought to you by Alcohol!

fansince61

Quote from: Phanatic on May 09, 2008, 11:39:22 AM
There was a guy from the NY Times on NPR the other day who did a study comparing our prison system to the rest of the world. Shocking thing was that the US has more prisoners then any other country in the world. By a lot! This includes China and India with larger populations. The biggest difference that he could tell all comes from the war on drugs.

Not only does the US arrest dealers but users as well. Most other countries rehab and rehabilitate. Another part is that the US prison system is now only interested in punishment and does not actually reform or get anyone in the system ready to rejoin society so it becomes a vicious circle.

In the early 1900's the US prison system was a model to the rest of the world and many countries came to learn and copy our system. Now everyone agrees we're farged.

The prison system/drug laws are a big source of civil service jobs so those groups lobby for $ and expand.

ice grillin you

just like agriculture or construction or car making....prisons are an industry and a huge one
i can take a phrase thats rarely heard...flip it....now its a daily word

igy gettin it done like warrick

im the board pharmacist....always one step above yous

Father Demon



More than 1 in 100 American adults were incarcerated at the start of 2008.

As the consequence of "three strikes laws," the increase in the duration of incarceration in the last decade was most pronounced in the case of life prison sentences, which increased by 83% between 1992 and 2003.

According to the U.S. Department of Justice, as of December 31, 2006, American prisons held 2,258,983 inmates. In recent decades the U.S. has experienced a surge in its prison population, quadrupling since 1980, partially as a result of mandated sentences that came about during the "war on drugs." Violent crime and property crime have declined since the early 1990s.

As of 2004, the three states with the lowest ratio of imprisoned to civilian population are Maine (148 per 100,000), Minnesota (171 per 100,000), and Rhode Island (175 per 100,000). The three states with the highest ratio are Louisiana (816 per 100,000), Texas (694 per 100,000), and Mississippi (669 per 100,000).

Currently, considering local jails as well, almost one million of those incarcerated are in prison for non-violent crime.

In 2002, 93.2% of prisoners were male. About 10.4% of all black males in the United States between the ages of 25 and 29 were sentenced and in prison, compared to 2.4% of Hispanic males and 1.3% of white males.

In 2005, about 1 out of every 136 U.S. residents was incarcerated either in prison or jail. The total amount being 2,320,359, with 1,446,269 in state and federal prisons and 747,529 in local jails.

The percentage of prisoners in federal and state prisons 55 and older increased by 33% from 2000 to 2005 while the prison population grew by only 8%.

Under U.S. law convicted felons lose their eligibility to apply for Medicare and Medicaid. Housing one prisoner costs a state between $18,000 and $31,000 annually, $33 per day for the average prisoner and $100 per day for an elderly prisoner.

Half of all persons incarcerated under state jurisdiction are for non-violent offenses, and 20% are incarcerated for drug offenses.
The drawback to marital longevity is your wife always knows when you're really interested in her and when you're just trying to bury it.