get over the sweep you losers, lets guess which mediocre pitcher will get 10 million a year from old man gillick
Free agents
Starting pitchers
Tony Armas (30) - $5MM mutual option for '08
Kris Benson (33) - $7.5MM club option for '08
Paul Byrd (37) - $8MM club option for '08
Shawn Chacon (30)
Roger Clemens (46)
Matt Clement (33)
Bartolo Colon (35)
Josh Fogg (31)
Casey Fossum (30)
Freddy Garcia (32)
Tom Glavine (42)
Livan Hernandez (33)*
Jason Jennings (29)
Joe Kennedy (29)
Byung-Hyun Kim (29)
Brian Lawrence (32)
Jon Lieber (38)
Kyle Lohse (29)
Rodrigo Lopez (32)
Greg Maddux (42) - $8.75MM player option or $11MM club option for '08
Eric Milton (32)
Tomo Ohka (32)
Russ Ortiz (34)
Odalis Perez (31) - $9MM club option for '08
Andy Pettitte (36) - $16MM player option for '08
Joel Pineiro (29)
Kenny Rogers (43)
Curt Schilling (41)
Carlos Silva (29)
Julian Tavarez (35) - $3.85MM club option for '08
John Thomson (34)
Brett Tomko (35) - $4.5MM mutual option for '08
Steve Trachsel (37) - $4.75MM club option for '08
Koji Uehara (33)
Jeff Weaver (31)
David Wells (45)
Kip Wells (31)
Randy Wolf (31) - $9MM club option for '08
Jamey Wright (34)
Jaret Wright (32)
Closers
Armando Benitez (35)
Joe Borowski (37) - $4MM club option for '08
Francisco Cordero (33)
Octavio Dotel (32) - $5.5MM mutual option for '08
Eric Gagne (32)
Todd Jones (40)
Al Reyes (37) - $1MM club option for '08
Mariano Rivera (38)
Bob Wickman (39)
Middle relievers
Jeremy Affeldt (29)
Antonio Alfonseca (36)
LaTroy Hawkins (35)
Jorge Julio (29)
Joe Kennedy (29)
Scott Linebrink (31)
Troy Percival (39)
David Riske (31) - $2.85MM club option for '08
Russ Springer (39)
Julian Tavarez (35) - $3.85MM club option for '08
Mike Timlin (42)
Luis Vizcaino (31)
Kerry Wood (31)
Center fielders
Milton Bradley (30)
Mike Cameron (35)
Darin Erstad (34) - $3.5MM club option for '08
Torii Hunter (32)
Andruw Jones (31)
Kenny Lofton (41)
Corey Patterson (28)
Aaron Rowand (30)
Right fielders
Bobby Abreu (34) - $16MM club option for '08
Milton Bradley (30)
Kosuke fargudome (31)
Shawn Green (35) - $10MM club option for '08
Jose Guillen (32) - $9MM club option for '08
Geoff Jenkins (33) - $9MM club option for '08
Trot Nixon (34)
Reggie Sanders (40)
Third basemen
Pedro Feliz (33)
Mike Lamb (32)
Mike Lowell (34)
Alex Rodriguez (32) - Has ability to opt out of contract after season
1. ARod is too expensive, a Hoyda, a choke artists and a vagina. No. No. No. Don't even think about it.
2. I would farging love for that lunatic Milton Bradley to be here. He's out of his mind but really good. Might not be healthy, but whatever. Do it.
3. Ain't much to pick from a 3B. Either overpay for Lowell or hope for Dobbs to be good again. Yuck.
4. No, Phreak. No Torri Hunter.
5. Schilling. Yes.
6. Trade for Willis, none of the pitchers are worth it.
oh shtein! we are farged.
I saw the future and we get A Rod.
and I'm not kidding.
you also said the phillies would win 2 in colorado...
1. Is Moyer going to be back next year? He's older than dirt but still reliable and as he showed last night, not scurred of the postseason. I don't recall when his contract is up and I didn't see his name on the FA list so I'm guessing that he's locked up for next year. But he could decide to retire.
2. Does Myers get thrown back into the starting rotation or do they keep him at closer? The closers available are either old or unimpressive, perhaps with the exception of Cordero.
3. I know 3rd base is supposed to be a production position offensively but I really wouldn't mind if Nunez were this team's starting 3rd baseman. He's sound defensively and I think that with the Phils having so much offense generated from the rest of the infield that they shouldn't be really need constant production from Nunez like many teams rely on from their 3rd bagger.
4. The pen actually came on pretty strong down the stretch. Obviously Romero is a keeper even though he had a tough night last night and gave up the gw run. Geary and Condry are a little too "hit or miss" for my liking. If Kerry Wood is content to remain in the pen in order to extend his career then I wouldn't mind seeing the Phils take a run at him. Jeremy Affedlt is a guy who was getting beat up in KC for a while but has pretty good stuff. He'd be another decent lefty to come in and face left handed batters.
5. Rowand choked big time in the playoffs this year but they should still bring him back. Unless they have plans of going after Torri Hunter or Andruw Jones.
6. I'm not overly impressed by any of the right fielders available. And I like Victorino. He's fast as hell and has a cannon for an arm.
7. Trish really pissed me off in the playoffs. I thought he put together a pretty solid year overall but he went back to doing all the little things I hate against Colorado. Especially swinging at the first pitch last night when the 2 batters before him drew walks.
8. I thought that if the Phils made the postseason I could overlook Howard's strikeouts. I can't. Dude really needs to cut down on them. He also needs to know that when you've got 2 strikes against you in the 9th inning and your team is down that you need to swing at anything even remotely close to the plate rather than relying on the ump to make a favorable call for you. If you don't like the pitch, just foul it off and make the pitcher throw another one. Keep doing it until he walks you or makes a mistake.
Quote from: SunMo on October 07, 2007, 09:13:55 AM
you also said the phillies would win 2 in colorado...
He meant next season, obviously.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 07, 2007, 01:00:31 PM
Quote from: SunMo on October 07, 2007, 09:13:55 AM
you also said the phillies would win 2 in colorado...
He meant next season, obviously.
Yep. He predicts the future about as well as you draft quarterbacks.
3B is definitely a concern. Dobbs is nothing special, Helms is trash, Nunez is not even a little league player. I know he's a solid defensive player, but having a black hole at the end of your lineup of Ruiz, Nunez and Pitcher will be detrimental to the team. He hit under .200 in every month except May. He is farging brutal.
Lowell has had a OPS over .800 every year except his oddly horrible 2005. He is hitting a healthy .355 with a 1.0552 OPS at Citty Bank though. So this could work, despite the fact that he's 34 and would get paid a ridiculous amount of money.
You could find a number of people to play RF. Hell, if Lowell is signed, a Bourn/Werth platoon could work. Bourn will show everyone that he's trash and Werth will perform fairly well exclusively against LHP. But if he's healthy, I'd want Bradley. This town will love him.
Pitching wise, I'd keep Myers as a closer. Set up with Gordon and Romero. And let's not forget, Madson comes back and so does Matheison. That's a solid top 5 right there. Round out the pen with a lefty (not Zagurski) and a long man (Condrey? Durbin?).
Rotation is already 3/5's set. Hamels, Kendrick, Eaton. Yes Eaton is farging horrible but he has two guaranteed years left and no one wants him. So there's nothing the Phillies can do but put him at 5th starter and hope he's better. His career numbers indicate he's not this bad, so chances are, he'll be better next year. But who knows. The last two spots go to one big name and one average guy. Think Willis and Lohse, something like that. Schilling would be fun because he's be on a short contract and could bail after 2008 so Carrasco or someone could take over. Lohse would need a multi year deal. Also Gramps could come back, though I'd say no. On the whole, he's was mediocre this year.
so nunez is a black hole but bourn in a platoon will work
i get it
if they get lowell to offset his lack of talent, yes. bourn will get .260ish against rhp. nunez might not him over the mendoza line if he plays every day. plus bourn can at least create something if he gets on base, he stays out of double plays, etc.
nunez will never ever be a fulltime player...so to talk about what he will or wont do is retarded
the little guy's hatred of Bourn is quite hilarious. he has shown he can play at every level, so to say he suddenly can't do it on this level is farging retarded.
eric valent and reggie taylor also showed they could play on every level. great.
look, i just dont think bourn is gonna be anything special. i could be wrong, and will eat crow if so. but depending on what else is done, the phils can survive with him and werth platooning in rf.
the free agent pitching available sucks...i would pay Rowand to play center and use Victorino or Bourn in a trade for a pitcher and put the other you don't trade in right field
and i would pay Lowell to play 3rd
to an extent. you need 1 more bat to complement what you have now. i dont see how you cant go get it, this the prime for rollins, utley and howard. not signing someone now is pointless. you have a 4-5 year window now to win the series with these guys. dont be the eagles.
Pipe dream galore: Find a way to trade for Julio Santana. :drool
they need no more bats...they need they bats they have to step up in big spots like say in the playoffs...but more than that they need to not have kyle kendrick starting the second game of a playoff series
normally i agree they don't need another bat, but 3rd base is such an abyss for them for offensively and defensively and Lowell fills both needs. he's a right handed bat, which they need, he plays defense, so you won't have replace him late in the game. he really seems like a perfect fit.
Quote from: SunMo on October 07, 2007, 08:13:24 PM
normally i agree they don't need another bat, but 3rd base is such an abyss for them for offensively and defensively and Lowell fills both needs. he's a right handed bat, which they need, he plays defense, so you won't have replace him late in the game. he really seems like a perfect fit.
Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And yes.
A-Rod is the better player, but is beyond the Phils' budget (he'll be the Red Sox' replacement for Lowell if he does leave the Yanks). Lowell will fill the Phils' need offensively and defensively.
The only caveat is that he'll be 34 next season. Don't want more than a 2-3 year contract. He'll probably get four, and the Phils will have to take it if they really want him.
im not saying dont get mike lowell but he wont make one bit of difference in this team....yeah they might score a few more runs but it wouldnt be a tangible difference in wins and losses
they need two quality starters and a real manager and then we can talk postseason wins
I thought Mike Lowell should have been on this team two years ago (LOL - Check This Thread Out) (http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?topic=17888.280) and still think he'd be an ideal addition to the team.
He's a veteran that would provide a stabilizing force at a position that has been chaotic since Rolen left. He's a right-handed bat that would further protect Utley or Howard depending on where he would be placed in the lineup, and he's going to be there for the taking if the farging Phillies will simply spend the money to get him.
I could go either way with Lowell, but I wouldn't be upset if they signed him. Would love to see Schilling back for a season. Think a guy like Linebrink in middle relief would be good insurance in case Gordon's arm falls off or Romero was just a fluke.
Any guesses on how much they spend this offseason? My guess is $30 million
Quote from: SD_Eagle on October 08, 2007, 08:09:55 AM
I could go either way with Lowell, but I wouldn't be upset if they signed him. Would love to see Schilling back for a season. Think a guy like Linebrink in middle relief would be good insurance in case Gordon's arm falls off or Romero was just a fluke.
Any guesses on how much they spend this offseason? My guess is $30 million
$15. Not million. Fifteen bucks.
Radano was on WIP this morning and hinted that Dubee's job is in jeopardy
Right. Blame the pitching COACH.
With the manager not under contract, all of their coaches jobs are in jeopardy.
just let Charlie shuffle off into the sunset
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 08, 2007, 09:59:12 AM
Radano was on WIP this morning and hinted that Dubee's job is in jeopardy
Yeah, pitching was the issue. This team has an ERA of around 5. They gave up 6, 10 and 2. 18 runs in 3 games. By my math, that's an ERA of 6.00 in the playoffs. Not much dropoff from the regular season. Game one was pretty much par for the course, game 2 was bad but let's not forget that was a rookie mid season call up on the hill and game 3 was phenominal.
Offensivley this team averaged about 6 runs scored per game in the reg season. They scored 3, 5 and 1. 9 runs in 3 games which comes out to 3 runs per game. And their team batting average dropped .100. Plus, they averaged about 8 k's a game.
Yes. Clearly pitching was the problem.
It's Dubee's fault Mesa, Alfonseca, Eaton and all sucked. And it's his fault 75 year old Moyer was mediocre. Go team.
Mesa, Alfonseca and Eaton all sucked before Dubee coached them.
Mesa and Alfonseca had their time but their time has past. Eaton's another story, he hovered around a 4.00 ERA his entire career then came here and hovered around 6.00.
Definately wasn't implying that Mesa or Alfonseca have been horrible throughout thier careers. But both of them were full of suck by the time Dubee got to them.
Yes you were, liar.
You know me so well.
charlie just got a two year extension.
http://philadelphia.phillies.mlb.com/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20071009&content_id=2259067&vkey=pr_phi&fext=.jsp&c_id=phi
heinekens on me
2 years with a team option for the 3rd. Essentially assures that Amaro or Arbuckle will get the GM job when Gillick steps down. Joy.
Good signing.
Did anyone really think Cholly would leave?
nope and its a good move. he is incompetent in game, but that wasn't the reason they were swept by colorado. if gillick goes out and gives him a bullpen to work with, perhaps things will be easier on ol' chuckles.
AWESOME1
3 MORE YEARS OF 85-88 WINS AND NO CHAMPIONSHIPS YEAH11111111
Good move.
He deserved to be brought back because of what he did with this team. He's a laughing stock to many, but that team played for him. How about Gillick and Monty go out and get the guy some pitching and see what happens.
c'mon Phreak, it's not a good move...you give him pitching and he'll run it into the ground...just like he did with the pitching he had this year
Dubee and Steve Smith might be gone because of it. Manuel said he'd only accept a 1-yr deal if he could bring back all of his coaches. Radano thinks all of them will be back though...
jesus christ i cant believe how many of you people settle....they were one of the worst teams to ever make the MLB playoffs and their manager single handedly lost them one game in the series....a manager that is one of the worst tatically ive ever seen...on top of that you have an offseason that is setting up to be great for available managers....and you people are happy...wtf?...you have to wonder if the city even deserves a title after all these years with moves like this and fan support for them
Its amazing that y'all can't see that he did a good job. He ran pitching into the ground? Well shtein! He only had three relievers to use at the end who were worth a shtein. And when Myers and Gordon were out he had nothing - so when they get back healthy you use them over and over and over because the other guys who the GM signed were garbage.
alright angelo, because kyle lohse gives up a gs hr to kaz matsui, manuel lost them a playoff game. the farging top of the lineup choked. what the farg else is there to say about that series.
manuel is horrible tactical manager. he ran his pitching into the ground because he only had 3 good relievers out of the pen. no one blamed him for using them so much. its better to pitch them until their arms fall off than take your chances with mesa or alf. gillick needs to give him better pitching.
what yous dont undertsand is that the team can have bad pitching and a horrid manager...the two are not mutually exclusive...btw the bullpen was lights out the last month plus of the season...and even in the post season it was the manager/hitting coach and the offense that failed them...im not sure what was more inexcusable putting in lohse in a bases loaded situation or bringing in jose mesa in a playoff game...two back to back moves that a AAA manager shouldnt be making much less a guy in the mlb playoffs...i guess you all missed the numerous games in the regular seaosn he blew as well
im sorry but if you think charlie manager is a good manager i have to question your knowledge of the game...maybe like the ownership youre happy with an embarrassing showing in the playoffs (if they even make the playoffs next year) but im not....we deserve more and more starts with getting a competant mlb manager for the team
First manager in 14 years to make the playoffs is why he got the extension. There were some decent ones who couldn't muster what he did from this bunch. Gillick needs to do a better job moreso than grandpa does. Not to mention, who besides Girardi would be a better option at this point?
i dont think manuel is a good manager. really no one does. rather, the guys on the team really like him and play hard for him. its a good group of guys and it works. managers blow games all the time, good and bad. if this team had a good bullpen april-august, the phils probably have a few more wins and still win the nl east and stay play colorado in the first round.
blaming him for losing the rockies series, or even one game, is silly. mesa is farging awful. but his other options were alf and condrey. great selection. yes, he overused the "experience" factor by using 1000 year old fossil and pulling kendrick that early, but the phils had 10000 reasons to quit this year and manuel didnt let it happen. for that, he deserves credit.
I would have been estatic to get a new manager (I heard Joe Torre may be available in a few days). But I also knew that Cholly would be back.
1. Gillick has pretty much said that 2008 is going to be his last year. No Joe Torre-type manager is coming to Philly with a lame-duck GM.
2. Cholly took a team that seemed dead in the water and guided them to the NL East title. Now, one may question how much credit he deserves for that, but remember how long the Phils kept Danny Ozark (no Einstein himself) with three straight NLCS losses - it took the 1979 disaster to get him canned. If they had canned him in 1977, that team could have been World Champs in 1978 with a real manager. But they kept him on for loyalty - and that was the Phils' best owner and GM in their sordid history. The Phils just were not going to can Cholly after winning the division.
3. He's extremely popular with the players. Especially if the Phils let Rowand walk, they need something to keep the players happy.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on October 09, 2007, 10:40:52 PM
There were some decent ones who couldn't muster what he did from this bunch.
link?
Quote from: MDS on October 09, 2007, 10:43:09 PM
blaming him for losing the rockies series, or even one game, is silly. mesa is farging awful. but his other options were alf and condrey. great selection. yes, he overused the "experience" factor by using 1000 year old fossil and pulling kendrick that early, but the phils had 10000 reasons to quit this year and manuel didnt let it happen. for that, he deserves credit.
deserving credit for something and being a good manager are not the same thing...again youre settling...
and lol @ keeping a horrible manager because he doesnt upset pat burrell and "the guys like him"...be still my heart that is so sweet....detroit likes jim leyland and the rockies like clint hurdle and lost of players like their manager...this is the most sheep excuse ive ever heard for keeping a hack around...way to fall into the trap
again its not an either or scenario...there is such a thing as having a manager the players like who is also a good manager...stop being sucked in by the organizational rhetoric
I would have been estatic to get a new manager (I heard Joe Torre may be available in a few days). But I also knew that Cholly would be back.
larussa too...like i said its a great offseason for managers...but youre right they took this hack over jim leyland i dont know why i ever thought there was a chance of getting someone like those two guys this year
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 09, 2007, 10:49:18 PM
Quote from: SD_Eagle on October 09, 2007, 10:40:52 PM
There were some decent ones who couldn't muster what he did from this bunch.
link?
I was more or less referring to Bowa and to a lesser extent Francona. They didn't have this bunch but they certainly had enough talent to make the playoffs.
Quote from: MDS on October 09, 2007, 10:43:09 PM
blaming him for losing the rockies series, or even one game, is silly. mesa is farging awful. but his other options were alf and condrey. great selection. yes, he overused the "experience" factor by using 1000 year old fossil and pulling kendrick that early, but the phils had 10000 reasons to quit this year and manuel didnt let it happen. for that, he deserves credit.
Its also not his fault Utley, Rollins, and Howard couldn't hit for shtein. Not only that but they struck out at an alarming rate (except for Howard who's 7 k's over 3 games was par by his standards).
Francona didn't have nearly the talent on the Phils that Cholly did this year:
Here was his "everday" players (the ones with the most games listed first):
C - Mike Lieberthal (108 games) or Tom Prince
1B - Pat Burrell (111 games, 58 at 1B) or Travis Lee or Rico Brogna
2B - Mickey Morandini (98 games) or Kevin Jordan or Marlon Anderson
SS - Desi Relaford (83 games) or Alex Arias or Tomas Perez
3B - Scott Rolen (128 games) or Kevin Jordan
LF - Ron Gant (89 games) or Pat Burrell
CF - Doug Glanville
RF - Bobby Abreu
And their starting pitching:
SP - Curt Schilling (6-6, 3.91 before he was traded)
SP - Randy Wolf (11-9, 4.36)
SP - Andy Ashby (4-7, 5.68)
SP - Robert Person (9-7, 3.63)
SP - Paul Byrd (2-9, 6.31)
SP - Bruce Chen (3-4, 3.63)
SP - Omar Daal (2-9, 4.69)
And their "relief":
CL - Jeff Brantley (2-7, 5.86, 23 saves)
This whole thing of players "wanting" to play for Manuel and he brings out the best in them is horseshtein. If you believe that, your kidding yourself. You think hes a motivator in any way?
They play for themselves, and the fact they know they have a shot every game because of their offense. It keeps them competitive and has them believing they can make the playoffs with what they have.
Its sure has hell not "because" of Manuel. He might be the worst baseball strategist ever when it comes to in-game decisions. Its embarrassing, and it was unfortunate the Mets shtein the bed or he would be c-ya bye.
Quote from: MDS on October 09, 2007, 10:43:09 PM
i dont think manuel is a good manager. really no one does. rather, the guys on the team really like him and play hard for him. its a good group of guys and it works
except in the playoffs, when you need someone to manage a game
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 08:52:43 AM
Quote from: MDS on October 09, 2007, 10:43:09 PM
i dont think manuel is a good manager. really no one does. rather, the guys on the team really like him and play hard for him. its a good group of guys and it works
except in the playoffs, when you need someone to manage a game
or in close games...hes a super manager when the offense puts up 14 runs...however in one run games he was 14-23
Manuel really shouldnt have instructed Howard and Utley to strike out so much, that was a mistake in hindsight.
of course the players love him...he runs a daycare, nobody is accountable for their mistakes.
Tony LaRussa pulls kids after swinging at 3-0 pitches, and wins World Series, Cholly pats them on the back, and gets knocked out in the first round
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 10, 2007, 08:55:52 AM
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 08:52:43 AM
Quote from: MDS on October 09, 2007, 10:43:09 PM
i dont think manuel is a good manager. really no one does. rather, the guys on the team really like him and play hard for him. its a good group of guys and it works
except in the playoffs, when you need someone to manage a game
or in close games...hes a super manager when the offense puts up 14 runs...however in one run games he was 14-23
That stat is irrelevant in that...the Phils played in less 1 run games than anyone else in the NL.
Paul Owens had a decision to make in the late 1970's.
Does he keep the status quo and retain Danny Ozark as manager or does he bring in someone to put foot to ass and get a remarkably talented but underachieving bunch to finally win a World Series?
The Pope chose to put foot to ass and the rest was history.
This team decides to stick with Danny Ozark II despite the fact that a host of more qualified managerial prospects will be there for the taking.
Yay team.
Charlie Manuel is one of the least of the team's problems. They won't win a World Series with him, but it has more to do with the dearth of decent pitching than the manager.
Still, I wish they'd gone and made a change, but I knew they wouldn't.
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 09:06:30 AM
of course the players love him...he runs a daycare, nobody is accountable for their mistakes.
Tony LaRussa pulls kids after swinging at 3-0 pitches, and wins World Series, Cholly pats them on the back, and gets knocked out in the first round
and he knocked his own team out in game two
and yes the players are not accountable...its why they are one of the dumber teams around.....with a real manager they still would score in bunches but they wouldnt do things like swing at first pitches after four ball walks and try to steal bases down by four
you gotta improve the pitching on this team yes...but that means closer games which means more strategizing and manuevering....something charlie is incapable of doing
so maybe charlie is the perfect manager for a team full of babies who just wanna win 15-5 games and do whatever they want when they want...but if you wanna play the game the right way and win close games and win playoff games then charlie is a pathetic excuse as a manager
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 10, 2007, 09:15:39 AM
Paul Owens had a decision to make in the late 1970's.
Does he keep the status quo and retain Danny Ozark as manager or does he bring in someone to put foot to ass and get a remarkably talented but underachieving bunch to finally win a World Series?
The Pope chose to put foot to ass and the rest was history.
This team decides to stick with Danny Ozark II despite the fact that a host of more qualified managerial prospects will be there for the taking.
Yay team.
excellent post romey....shows the stark contrast btwn that ownership group and this one
The Phillies retention of Uncle Cholly proves unequivocally that this ownership group doesn't care one bit about doing whatever it takes to win it all.
They got three million-plus suckers (me included) to buy tickets and fill their house to the rafters and as long as we're dumb enough to keep accepting mediocrity, they'll be more than happy to accommodate us.
I hope they all burn in farging hell.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 10, 2007, 09:24:15 AM
The Phillies retention of Uncle Cholly proves unequivocally that this ownership group doesn't care one bit about doing whatever it takes to win it all.
The fact you didn't know that already means that you're a dumbass anyway.
i'm not buying tickets next year...go me!
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 10, 2007, 09:18:55 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 10, 2007, 09:15:39 AM
Paul Owens had a decision to make in the late 1970's.
Does he keep the status quo and retain Danny Ozark as manager or does he bring in someone to put foot to ass and get a remarkably talented but underachieving bunch to finally win a World Series?
The Pope chose to put foot to ass and the rest was history.
This team decides to stick with Danny Ozark II despite the fact that a host of more qualified managerial prospects will be there for the taking.
Yay team.
excellent post romey....shows the stark contrast btwn that ownership group and this one
lolololol
No, it doesn't, in fact it shows that this ownership group is pretty much the same as that. The phils won the division 3 straight years in 1976, 77 and 78 before dumping Ozark in the middle of 79 (they missed the playoffs that year).
does it pain you to be so completely offbase all the time?
Ha. JeromeRIP99 thinks he's Gordon Lightfoot, while your point of agreement is the exact opposite of what happened...and I am off base?
Whatever makes you feel good, dookie.
The Phillies had winning records for five consecutive (1975-1979) before making a managerial change that resulted in a World Series title. That ownership group made a decisive change while this ownership group stuck with the status quo.
But sure, they're both exactly the same.
:-D
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 10, 2007, 10:14:22 AM
The Phillies had winning records for five consecutive (1975-1979) before making a managerial change that resulted in a World Series title. That ownership group made a decisive change while this ownership group stuck with the status quo.
But sure, they're both exactly the same.
:-D
It's fairly obvious that you are saying this looking at the records alone.
No one gives a shtein about being 84-80 (for example) if there isnt a playoff appearance. Bowa was + .500 3 out of 4 years. It's completely irrelevant.
Ozark was hired before 73...and made 3 straight years of improvement before winning the division in 1976, then they got swept by the reds. Then he won the division in 77 and 78, losing to the dodgers 1-3 twice in the NLCS.
Ownership reluctantly replaced Ozark with Dallas Green (at the insitance of Dallas Green actually) in the middle of 1979, when the Phils were below .500 in august of that year, overall they wound up missing the playoffs and losing the division to the pirates. It wasn't until the next season when that worked out for them.
Quote from: Wingspan on October 10, 2007, 10:24:51 AM
It's fairly obvious that you are saying this looking at the records alone.
How else should I look at it?
Cholly's been the manager for three years and had winning records just like Ozark. They've yet to win a postseason game in his tenure whereas Ozark's teams routinely butchered away entire series in the playoffs. He's a horrible tactical manager like Ozark. He's a "players" manager like Ozark was. His teams underachieved like Ozark's.
On and on it goes...
But the bottom line is there are going to be better managerial candidates available and despite that the Phillies settled for Manuel. In other words, they settled for the status quo. Again.
Yay team.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 10, 2007, 10:35:32 AM
Quote from: Wingspan on October 10, 2007, 10:24:51 AM
It's fairly obvious that you are saying this looking at the records alone.
How else should I look at it?
Cholly's been the manager for three years and had winning records just like Ozark. They've yet to win a postseason game in his tenure whereas Ozark's teams routinely butchered away entire series in the playoffs. He's a horrible tactical manager like Ozark. He's a "players" manager like Ozark was. His teams underachieved like Ozark's.
On and on it goes...
Ok, and how exactly is that "stark contrast" in ownership groups? As icee stated?
Quote from: Wingspan on October 10, 2007, 10:24:51 AM
Ownership reluctantly replaced Ozark with Dallas Green
thats the whole point...they made a difficult concious decision to make a change that in the end would be better for the team....something that the current leadership is incapable of doing
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 10, 2007, 10:40:14 AM
Quote from: Wingspan on October 10, 2007, 10:24:51 AM
Ownership reluctantly replaced Ozark with Dallas Green
thats the whole point...they made a difficult concious decision to make a change that in the end would be better for the team....something that the current leadership is incapable of doing
Yeah...6.5 seasons after they hired the guy.
Stark contrast indeed.
ozark was coming off three straight division titles had won playoff games and had multiple 100+ win teams and they still canned him...manuel has only made the playoffs once in a fluke year has never won even 90 games and got swept by a wild card team and they kept him...that to me is a stark contrast
Danny Ozark likes to blow trannies
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 10, 2007, 10:50:52 AM
ozark was coming off three straight division titles had won playoff games and had multiple 100+ win teams and they still canned him...manuel has only made the playoffs once in a fluke year has never won even 90 games and got swept by a wild card team and they kept him...that to me is a stark contrast
He was canned in the middle of the season when it was pretty clear they weren't winning the division. This after getting Pete Rose in the 78/79 offseason.
He was not canned the year after his first playoff appearance and then subsequent 3-0 sweep in the playoffs. (Which was the case for both managers)
well if manuel is fired during next season then you can say its not a stark contrast and id agree...right now it mos def is
Sure thing, icee.
actually thinking about it even more....because charlie hasnt been even close to successful as ozark was...even if they did fire him next year it would be case of should have done that six months ago when people like larussa and torre were around vs being any kind of similarity to what happened to ozark
The fact that Tony LaRussa or Joe Torre might be available and the Phillies automatically jumped the gun and signed a queef like Charlie Manuel tells you all you need to know about this ownership and management group.
Charlie did a great job motivating a team that was injured all year. He sucks at managing a game but does seem to do well as a motivator. What they need is a bench coach who can make all of the decisions that this team needs in a game, honestly Charlie would be best at being a bench coach but thats not going to happen
charlie maxes out his potential as a hitter instructor, not even a bench coach
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on October 10, 2007, 11:53:41 AM
Charlie did a great job motivating a team that was injured all year. He sucks at managing a game but does seem to do well as a motivator. What they need is a bench coach who can make all of the decisions that this team needs in a game, honestly Charlie would be best at being a bench coach but thats not going to happen
If the Phillies wanted a motivator they should have hired Tony Robbins. What they need is a baseball manager and Cholly's about as qualified in that capacity as Rosie O'Donnell is as a swimsuit model.
*broken record alert*
there are managers out there that can properly manage AND motivate a baseball team
*broken record alert*
Rosie O'Donnell has huge cans.
Stan Hochman just said on DNL that the Phillies have an offer on the table to sell and one owner is holding it up. He believes they will sell within 2 years. He said that the potential buyer is a Philadelphian.
I got all of this from PhilaPhans.
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 05:26:29 PM
Stan Hochman just said on DNL that the Phillies have an offer on the table to sell and one owner is holding it up. He believes they will sell within 2 years. He said that the potential buyer is a Philadelphian.
I got all of this from PhilaPhans.
kill him, then all will be well.
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 05:26:29 PM
Stan Hochman just said on DNL that the Phillies have an offer on the table to sell and one owner is holding it up. He believes they will sell within 2 years. He said that the potential buyer is a Philadelphian.
I got all of this from PhilaPhans.
Please let it be Pat Croce and Mark Cuban
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on October 10, 2007, 06:05:57 PM
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 05:26:29 PM
Stan Hochman just said on DNL that the Phillies have an offer on the table to sell and one owner is holding it up. He believes they will sell within 2 years. He said that the potential buyer is a Philadelphian.
I got all of this from PhilaPhans.
Please let it be Pat Croce and Mark Cuban
Cuban is actually from Pittsburgh area, but Croce is Philly. Both are fargen hyper dudes. Would make it real exciting.
I'll believe it when it actually happens
Heck, aren't all the silent owners around 112 years old? They'll hopefully all kick off in a few years.
The Cardinals are supposedly considering Amaro, Jr. as their new general manager. (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Cards-looking-at-Amaro-Jr-for-GM-job?urn=mlb,48594)
If Pat Croce bought the team, I'd want to be a season ticket holder again.
Quote from: SunMo on October 10, 2007, 05:26:29 PM
Stan Hochman just said on DNL that the Phillies have an offer on the table to sell and one owner is holding it up. He believes they will sell within 2 years. He said that the potential buyer is a Philadelphian.
I got all of this from PhilaPhans.
I wont get my hopes up, but how awesome would that be?
And pray to allah that Amaro gets that Cards GM job.
get
(http://www.mcfarlane.com/toys/baseball/mlb20/cutley/images/mlb20_cutley_photo_01_dp.jpg)
(http://www.mcfarlane.com/toys/baseball/mlb20/cutley/images/mlb20_cutley_photo_01_dp.jpg)
Shouldn't the ball be on the ground or over his head in that shot?
Duh, the ball is already in center field.
:-D
I want the Ryan Howard one where he's butchering a grounder at first.
or the one where he overthrows the second baseman....big money
Gillick today "we need to upgrade third base."
Also figure the salary to be in the $105 mil area, that was the final tally this year.
The selling the team thing is too good to be true.
So who are the available 3B out there?
Is Mike Lowell a viable option? Did he really say he would come here? Is he worth the $30M he'll likely demand?
But we know who they'll sign, whichever low-cost schmuck is out there. Someone like Wes Helms or Babe Nunez.
Is Tomas Perez available?
Pedro Feliz and Aaron Boone woooo
Supposedly Manuel told Gillick that he wants to keep Myers as the closer and trade for a #1/#2 starter to go with Hamels
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 10, 2007, 11:33:41 PM
Pedro Feliz and Aaron Boone woooo
Supposedly Manuel told Gillick that he wants to keep Myers as the closer and trade for a #1/#2 starter to go with Hamels
Yes and Yes. On Myers and getting a 1/2. Not on more schmuch third sackers.
shtein, if they get the #2 to go with Hamels, then keep Myers there. But you gotta get the guy. Also only one of Eaton/Moyer please.
So...
Hamels/????/Kendrick/Moyer/Eaton is looking likely.
or...
Hamels/Myers/Kendrick/Moyer/Eaton...
I'd prefer...
Hamels/????/Kendrick/Lohse/Moyer
Just not Eaton please.
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 10, 2007, 11:33:41 PM
Supposedly Manuel told Gillick that he wants to keep Myers as the closer and trade for a #1/#2 starter to go with Hamels
Right - because it's much easier to trade for a legitimate #1 or even a #2 starter than it is to sign a closer.
farging shtein-kicking hick.
they thought they got their #2 last year, but then they didn't bother to look at his dictionary sized medical folder and the rest is history
<------Mo, what does that say over there under your lord and savior?
(http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h264/xxx_Raven_xxx/JesusIsWatchingYouMasturbate.jpg)
Quote from: SunMo on October 11, 2007, 08:19:35 AM
they thought they got their #2 last year, but then they didn't bother to look at his dictionary sized medical folder and the rest is history
I wish Ugueth Urbina and Freddy Garcia would hang out on Ugie's farm.
I wish you would hang out with aids.
Gillick concurred that the Phillies have a #1, 2 #4's and a #5.
Umm...Kendrick is a #3 and Eaton is off the radar, douchey.
Quote from: SunMo on October 07, 2007, 07:16:14 PM
the free agent pitching available sucks...i would pay Rowand to play center and use Victorino or Bourn in a trade for a pitcher and put the other you don't trade in right field
and i would pay Lowell to play 3rd
I would not mind Abe at 3B if they signed Rowand and spent some $$ on the pitching staff. I'd take a veteran like Schill, Maddux, Glavine, etc for 2 years if the options aren't picked up + 1 or 2 arms for the pen.
If they would sign Lowell and let Rowand leave, I'd platoon Dobbs/Werth in RF
Yeah...glavine was exceptionally good the last week of the season.
Quote from: MDS on October 11, 2007, 10:00:16 AM
Umm...Kendrick is a #3 and Eaton is off the radar, douchey.
kendrick is not a three...ill bet anyone here 20 bucks he isnt over 500 next year
and ill take odds on him losing his spot in the rotation at some point
Sophomore slump is a given for Kendrick, but he's a 3 at worst on the Phillies' staff.
Let's put it this way... if Eaton is even in the majors, Kendrick's a 3.
who cares what he is on the phillies staff
Well, unless they can actually find a way to acquire more than one quality starter, Kendrick's your 3.
I'll take a guy that knows how to pitch like Kendrick, over a guy with better stuff like Rosario any day of the week. And I'll take that bet.
And as for Glavine, he's not a dominant, strikeout pitcher. He's a better version of Moyer. The Mets defense was atrocious later in the season. I'd like a veteran with playoff experience who is still a quality pitcher, just look what Moyer did in his playoff start.
Quote from: troyhstewart on October 11, 2007, 10:50:03 AM
I'll take a guy that knows how to pitch like Kendrick, over a guy with better stuff like Rosario any day of the week. And I'll take that bet.
And as for Glavine, he's not a dominant, strikeout pitcher. He's a better version of Moyer. The Mets defense was atrocious later in the season. I'd like a veteran with playoff experience who is still a quality pitcher, just look what Moyer did in his playoff start.
1 run in 6 innings? That's not good enough?
wing is slooooooooooow
he so paranoid about anyone saying anything remotely nagative about philly sports that he flys off the handle when he thinks he sees something....its kinda cute actually
Reading back, i see how that was taken. But troyhstewart was talking up Glavine, and how he's better than moyer...then switched it up.
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 11, 2007, 11:09:45 AM
he so paranoid about anyone saying anything remotely nagative about philly sports that he flys off the handle when he thinks he sees something....its kinda cute actually
Man, you have me pegged, icee. I totally flew off the handle.
Whoa...someone stop me.
The Phils announced today that Nunez, Barajas and Kane Davis won't return in 2008. Happy day.
Who in the farg is Kane Davis?
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 11, 2007, 10:23:19 AM
Quote from: MDS on October 11, 2007, 10:00:16 AM
Umm...Kendrick is a #3 and Eaton is off the radar, douchey.
kendrick is not a three...ill bet anyone here 20 bucks he isnt over 500 next year
and ill take odds on him losing his spot in the rotation at some point
All Kendrick did was keep the team in every start he made. He looked like he was going to implode about 50,000 different times but never did. Somewhere along the way you just have to figure is he fairly above average. But, you're right, I wouldn't be surprised at all if he imploded. In fact, since his stock should be kind of high, maybe he can be packaged in a deal for Willis or Santana (last year of his contract, Minny not gonna resign him...) or someone.
If the pipe dream of getting Johan Santana came true, I'd cream myself right then and there.
Even though its the last year of his deal I don't think Carrasco/Kendrick/Bourne get the Bums Santana. Not to mention they'd probably let him play the season then give the old 'we'll deal with his contract when the seasons over' line.
I would have hung onto Nunez
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 11, 2007, 07:21:28 PM
If the pipe dream of getting Johan Santana came true, I'd cream myself right then and there.
And he would respond by being dominant for 4-5 games, then blowing out his elbow.
Quote from: FastFreddie on October 11, 2007, 07:44:49 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 11, 2007, 07:21:28 PM
If the pipe dream of getting Johan Santana came true, I'd cream myself right then and there.
And he would respond by being dominant for 4-5 games, then blowing out his elbow.
Yeah, but I'd be really REALLY happy for those 4-5 games.
JRoll was named the NL winner of the 2007 Legacy Award (Negro Leagues MVP). Howard won the same award last year...
Anyone who wanted to hang on to Abe Nunez is a moron.
Outside of his miraculous May where he hit .338, the next highest batting average for a month was a stifling .224 in June. He finished the year with 0 home runs, despite playing in a little league park. He knocked in a grand total of 16 runs. He is an absolutely putrid player. Putrid. His above average defense is completely useless seeing as the Phillies will get a full time 3B who doesn't need to come out of the game.
But let's keep him around as a pinch hitter, you might say. Well, how about his amazing performance of 1-23 with 2 walks as a pinch hitter this year. And that's not an anomaly, he hit .140 as a PH between 04-06.
He is useless. He is awful. He is terrible. Good. Bye.
But a nice little fun stat: Juan Pierre's OPS is only .84 points higher than Abe's.
Should have whacked Helms too. Bum.
Unless they get a top notch 3B, I'd have kept Abe and cut Helms. Abe can ball defensively.
I'm guessing they will. Both Helms and Dobbs are under contract for next year, with Dobbs being a great fit off the bench (the 3B they get will be RH, so Dobbs can split in there and for Burrell, and also be a solid bat off the bench). Helms, on the other hand, is terrible. He sucked as both a pinch hitter and a starter, so who gives a shtein what they do with him.
The point is, Abe is farging terrible. His defense was vastly overrated because Helms and Dobbs are so mediocre. They will get a starting 3B and Nunez will not get another job because he is again, farging terrible.
Quote from: MDS on October 11, 2007, 10:58:35 PM
The point is, Abe is farging terrible. His defense was vastly overrated because Helms and Dobbs are so mediocre. They will get a starting 3B and Nunez will not get another job because he is again, farging terrible.
I disagree with his defense being overrated, he's one hell of a defensive 3rd baseman. He made some plays only a few other 3rd baseman in this league could make and often at crucial times. Offensively he's horrible.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on October 11, 2007, 10:48:49 PM
Unless they get a top notch 3B, I'd have kept Abe and cut Helms. Abe can ball defensively.
MDS got his yamaka in a bunch when I mentioned it earlier in this thread, but I'd be ok with Abe as the team's 3b next year. Yes, he's horrible offensively and this team would have 7-9 hitters that wouldn't intimidate a little league pitcher but they can generate enough offense from the 1-6 hitters. And his defense would easily save a few runs over the year as well. So even though he might not be knocking runs in, he'd be keeping them off the board for the other team.
Obviously, that doesn't mean that I wouldn't like to see the Phils land a Lowell or A-Rod type player who can produce at the plate and in the field. But I think it was stupid for the Phils to announce that they have no intentions of bringing him back before they sign anyone.
You want someone two people hitting under .200 in the lineup (Abe and Pitcher) because Abe saves a few runs here and there in an important offensive position. That would be the first time in baseball history someone has an everyday job at third because of his defense. Normally you see that at catcher, with someone like Henry Blanco getting a nice career (for the most part in the AL), or a shortstop (Rey Ordonez comes to mind). Never at third. It's behind center, short, catcher and second in terms of defensive importance and wasting a spot on a pathetic hitter like Abe because of his above average glove is ridiculous and stupid.
I was hoping that the Phils would get to DH Dobbs for Nunez in the lineup. :D
Seriously, if letting Nunez go is a prelude of getting a real starting 3B over the winter, I'm fine with it.
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 11, 2007, 10:11:56 PM
JRoll was named the NL winner of the 2007 Legacy Award (Negro Leagues MVP). Howard won the same award last year...
Holliday deserved it.
Rowand requesting 6 years $84 milion.
See ya. Take care of yourself
Quote from: Sgt PSN on October 11, 2007, 11:59:56 PM
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on October 11, 2007, 10:48:49 PM
Unless they get a top notch 3B, I'd have kept Abe and cut Helms. Abe can ball defensively.
MDS got his yamaka in a bunch when I mentioned it earlier in this thread, but I'd be ok with Abe as the team's 3b next year. Yes, he's horrible offensively and this team would have 7-9 hitters that wouldn't intimidate a little league pitcher but they can generate enough offense from the 1-6 hitters. And his defense would easily save a few runs over the year as well. So even though he might not be knocking runs in, he'd be keeping them off the board for the other team.
mds is an idiot...helmes sucks on offense and defense and he says "who cares what they do with him"...abe is a great defensively and sucks hitting and hes the worst player ever
i want a real full time 3rd basemen no doubt...anyone who would want helms or abe starting is crazy...but i also agree with you sarge that having abe start next year would not kill the team.....provided they significantly improve the SP...if they dont do that then you gotta get bashers at every concievable spot in the lineup and try to hit your way to the playoffs
perfect example is the mets...they had a lineup that went 8 deep but had horrible fielding and they lost the division
Quoteperfect example is the mets...they had a lineup that went 8 deep but had horrible fielding and they lost the division
money
Quote from: reese125 on October 12, 2007, 08:07:50 AM
Rowand requesting 6 years $84 milion.
See ya. Take care of yourself
That's from Randarino. He also says the Phils want to sign Schilling and Rivera...
actually those numbers are from rowands agent...numbers hes throwing out there to try and inflate his market
Quote from: MDS on October 12, 2007, 02:15:45 AM
You want someone two people hitting under .200 in the lineup (Abe and Pitcher) because Abe saves a few runs here and there in an important offensive position. That would be the first time in baseball history someone has an everyday job at third because of his defense. Normally you see that at catcher, with someone like Henry Blanco getting a nice career (for the most part in the AL), or a shortstop (Rey Ordonez comes to mind). Never at third. It's behind center, short, catcher and second in terms of defensive importance and wasting a spot on a pathetic hitter like Abe because of his above average glove is ridiculous and stupid.
The Phils generate so much offense from non traditional positions like SS and 2B that they don't really "need" the offensive production normally associated with a 3B. What they need is someone who can field the position and
any offensive production that he brings to the plate is gravy imo.
Am I campaigning for Nunez to be the Phillies starting 3b next year? No. I'm simply campaigning for them to not ax the best one they've got until they actually bring in someone better.
I have an idea, lets argue for 3 more pages about a 3B that was cut already.
Hi Wingspan. Welcome to Concrete Field. Nice to meet you.
That's what I meant to say.
ha^^^^
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 12, 2007, 10:27:17 AM
Quote from: reese125 on October 12, 2007, 08:07:50 AM
Rowand requesting 6 years $84 milion.
See ya. Take care of yourself
That's from Randarino. He also says the Phils want to sign Schilling and Rivera...
In
And if Rowand wants close to those #s then no thanks. I'd rather that money went towards pitching.
i would bet anything that in the phillies warped minds that they are intending to take a run at rivera to be a set up man for myers
Quote from: Sgt PSN on October 12, 2007, 10:37:39 AM
Quote from: MDS on October 12, 2007, 02:15:45 AM
You want someone two people hitting under .200 in the lineup (Abe and Pitcher) because Abe saves a few runs here and there in an important offensive position. That would be the first time in baseball history someone has an everyday job at third because of his defense. Normally you see that at catcher, with someone like Henry Blanco getting a nice career (for the most part in the AL), or a shortstop (Rey Ordonez comes to mind). Never at third. It's behind center, short, catcher and second in terms of defensive importance and wasting a spot on a pathetic hitter like Abe because of his above average glove is ridiculous and stupid.
The Phils generate so much offense from non traditional positions like SS and 2B that they don't really "need" the offensive production normally associated with a 3B. What they need is someone who can field the position and any offensive production that he brings to the plate is gravy imo.
Am I campaigning for Nunez to be the Phillies starting 3b next year? No. I'm simply campaigning for them to not ax the best one they've got until they actually bring in someone better.
they didnt cut him. they declined to pick up his option. it either pay him 250k to walk away, or pay him 2 mil to be on the roster. it was the right move.
You guys realize that Wes Helms is still on the squad, right? If they don't find someone to take him off their hands he'll be the starting third baseman next April.
That's the way this farged up team rolls.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 12, 2007, 01:07:21 PM
You guys realize that Wes Helms is still on the squad, right? If they don't find someone to take him off their hands he'll be the starting third baseman next April.
That's the way this farged up team rolls.
I'd disagree with you except they went into last season thinking he was the answer at 3rd so I don't see why this season is any different. I'm unusually optimistic that with making the playoffs, the fan support, and having some dead money come off the books they'll make some big moves. They almost signed Soriano last season, I think there was legit interest and that it wasn't just a smoke screen, so that tells me they're at least willing to put big money out on decent players. I'm probably wrong but we'll see.
Baltimore fired Leo Mazzone...Pat Gillick should be sending a limo right now
Quote from: SunMo on October 12, 2007, 04:30:25 PM
Baltimore fired Leo Mazzone...Pat Gillick should be sending a limo right now
Ha, I thought the same thing when I heard that.
Schilling:
Quote"You have to put that my first choice is to stay here," he said during batting practice last night. "But if it doesn't work out, the Phillies are absolutely on the short list of places we'd want to go.
"There are probably still some people in Philadelphia who would rather not have me back. So we'll just have to see how it goes."
Quote from: MDS on October 13, 2007, 12:31:22 PM
Schilling:
Quote"You have to put that my first choice is to stay here," he said during batting practice last night. "But if it doesn't work out, the Phillies are absolutely on the short list of places we'd want to go.
"There are probably still some people in Philadelphia who would rather not have me back. So we'll just have to see how it goes."
I'd love to get Schill back. I'm guessing he's talking about Montgomery
Ownership is the only thing I could come up with too because other than maybe Burrell, I don't think any players were around when Schill was here. Same goes for the coaching staff and key players in the front office.
CSN said that according to the Bucks County Courier Times (is that Miller?), the Phillies want Schilling back too. So....
This might be posted somewhere earlier in the thread, but Phil Conlin was speculating (probably only that) that the Phils are going to make a run at oft-injured, former all-star 3B Hank Blalock.
another lefty in the lineup? pass
Quote from: SunMo on October 14, 2007, 12:43:17 PM
another lefty in the lineup? pass
Blalock on the DL is better than Wes Helms evar.
Just a rumor from Yahoo with zero substance, but:
Rolen to return to Philly? (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Would-Rolen-Schilling-return-to-Phillies-?urn=mlb,49021)
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 14, 2007, 01:22:51 PM
Just a rumor from Yahoo with zero substance, but:
Rolen to return to Philly? (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/rumors/post/Would-Rolen-Schilling-return-to-Phillies-?urn=mlb,49021)
Garen to Filly
It's not a rumor. It was a "would they return?" dream article that said there's zero chance of Rolen ever returning to the Phillies.
Like I said, zero substantiation.
Nor do I want Rolen back. Between his departure, shots at the team and the fans, injuries and declining production, I'd rather go with a Lowell.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on October 14, 2007, 02:03:26 PM
Nor do I want Rolen back. Between his departure, shots at the team and the fans, injuries and declining production, I'd rather go with a Lowell.
Word, son. Even when he's been healthy, he hasn't produced much at the plate. His defense is still solid but offensively he's been on the decline the last couple years. Plus it seems like he's had McNabb-like injury problems and failed to finish like 2 or 3 out of the last 4 years or so. And even if his days in St Louis are numbered, I seriously doubt he would ever want to come back to Philly.
Some loser writer for the Courier Times wrote an article for today's paper on how the Phillies could build a WS team within their budget. Signing Schilling was part of it, but it was all speculation and not based on any inside knowledge or anything.
QuoteHow to turn the Phillies into champions
By RANDY MILLER
phillyBurbs.com
We know who's on first and what's on second, Ryan Howard and Chase Utley. And in keeping Abbott and Costello's spirit alive, starting at third base for your 2008 Phillies is ... I don't know.
At this point, neither does general manager Pat Gillick.
The Phillies have plenty of offseason work ahead because their 2007 club, while winning 89 games and the National League East, was flawed.
What should the Phillies do this winter to improve?
Gillick won't ask for our help, but here's how we'd try spending the $23 million we believe the Phillies have freed up this winter in a 2008 payroll that they say will be at least $95 million.
Transaction No. 1: Sign Curt Schilling to a one-year, $13 million deal with a $15 million club option or $2 million buyout for 2009.
The Phils need a No. 2 starter to pair with young ace Cole Hamels, and Schilling is perfect. He'll be 41 next year and doesn't throw 95 mph anymore, but he'd still be an ace on many teams and his postseason pedigree is among the best of all-time.
Schilling made $13 million in Boston this year, and our deal adds $2 million when factoring in the buyout. This probably would be enough because Schilling has talked for years of his desire to end his career in Philly.
2007 dollars spent: $13 million; Free dollars: $10 million.
Transaction No. 2: Re-sign lefty reliever J.C. Romero to a 3-year, $9 million deal that includes a $2.5 million 2008 salary.
You never know what you're getting one year to the next from a reliever, but it's not cheap nowadays to build a bullpen and this deal would be similar to nice deals that a few non-closer relievers received last season.
2007 dollars spent: $15.5 million; Free dollars: $7.5 million.
Transaction No. 3: Sign reliever David Riske to a three-year, $10 million deal that includes a $3 million 2008 salary.
Milwaukee's Scott Linebrink, another right-handed reliever, is a bigger name and has been pursued by the Phils for two years, but Riske might be a better option. He has a 3.40 ERA over eight big-league seasons and this year posted a terrific 2.45 ERA in 65 games for Kansas City.
2007 dollars spent: $18.5 million; Free dollars: $4.5 million.
Transaction No. 4: Sign infielder Mark Loretta to a 2-year, $6.5 million deal that includes a $3 million base salary for 2008.
Loretta is a natural second baseman, but also plays third and is a pretty good contact hitter with a .298 career average.
Using free agency to sign Mike Lowell is a better option, but he figures to be too expensive.
2007 dollars spent: $21.5 million; Free dollars: $1.5 million.
Transaction No. 5: Sign center fielder Mike Cameron to a 3-year, $27 million deal that includes an $8 million salary for 2008.
Cameron will turn 35 in January, but should be able to play his usual great center field for another three seasons. He also has power. His 43 homers over the last two seasons playing for San Diego, which has a huge home field, probably translates to 30 for the Phillies, who play in a home run haven.
2007 dollars spent: $29.5 million; Free dollars: $6.5 million over budget.
Transaction No. 6: Trade left fielder Pat Burrell and reliever Geoff Geary to Anaheim for two decent minor leaguers.
We must stay on budget, so Burrell and Geary must go in a salary dump.
Burrell has $14 million coming in 2008, the final year of his contract, and we're going to pay half and kick in another $500,000 so he waives his no-trade clause. Dealing Geary, who is arbitration eligible, would save another $1 million. Just like that, we're in the black.
The Angels badly need a DH. They used 13 of them in 2007 with Shea Hillenbrand getting the most starts, 44.
As for the Phils, righty-swinging slugger Jayson Werth and lefty-swinging speedster Michael Bourn can share left field in 2008.
2007 dollars spent: $23 million; Free dollars: $0.
There you have it, a championship team in place.
Not paying Rowand $11M/yr then paying Cameron $9M/yr is super smart
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 14, 2007, 06:24:28 PM
Not paying Rowand $11M/yr then paying Cameron $9M/yr is super smart
Exactly.
I'd rather have Ed Wade than Randy Miller.
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 14, 2007, 01:59:33 PM
It's not a rumor. It was a "would they return?" dream article that said there's zero chance of Rolen ever returning to the Phillies.
your life is a rumor easy
Cameron's absolute garbage. No fargin' way do I want him in Philly and especially not for Burrell. Burrell's not irreplaceable and if the right combination of players or cap room allowed for a superior player to be brought in, then I'd be all for his being shipped out. But Mike Cameron certainly isn't the answer.
As for the other moves, I'd agree with Schilling especially if he's healthy. J.C. Romero is an absolute no-brainer. Riske would be a good upgrade. Mark Loretta at 3B? Huh??? NOT ON YOUR LIFE. Enough of this plug and pray bullcrap. SIGN A REAL THIRD BASEMAN. If trading Burrell got them Mike Lowell, I'd be fine with an outfield platoon of Werth/Bourn.
Here's what I want (assuming Burrell stays and the Phillies sign Lowell):
1. Rollins - SS
2. Victorino - CF
3. Utley - 2B
4. Howard - 1B
5. Burrell - LF
6. Lowell - 3B
7. Werth/Bourn - RF
8. Ruiz
Rotation: Hamels, Schilling, Myers, Kendrick, Moyer
I'd be fine with a combination or Romero, Madson, Flash & Mathieson although if the Phillies could somehow shoehorn another legitimate major league relief pitcher into the budget, I'd be happier.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 14, 2007, 08:09:11 PM
Rotation: Hamels, Schilling, Myers, Kendrick, Moyer
What part of "Myers loves being the closer" and "The phils management want him in the pen for good" do you people not understand?
Myers is the closer for the forseeable future.
I posted "here's what I want."
What part of that didn't you understand, you farging illiterate douchebag?
ha
If the Phillies didn't make the postseason this year, this thread is still on page 1 as nobody would give a crap about them for the better part of the next 2 months. Instead, Romey and Wingspan are trying to out do each other in terms of douche baggery.
Quote from: MDS on October 14, 2007, 06:36:46 PM
I'd rather have Ed Wade than Randy Miller.
Agreed.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 14, 2007, 08:21:13 PM
I posted "here's what I want."
What part of that didn't you understand, you farging illiterate douchebag?
Does cursing on the internet make your penis bigger?
Plus, you made the (wrong) assumption that I would read your whole post.
Whoa, captain positivity, take it easy.
Quote from: Wingspan on October 15, 2007, 10:11:36 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 14, 2007, 08:21:13 PM
I posted "here's what I want."
What part of that didn't you understand, you farging illiterate douchebag?
Does cursing on the internet make your penis bigger?
Plus, you made the (wrong) assumption that I would read your whole post.
Since you make a habit of talking out of your ass on this forum it doesn't surprise me a bit that you wouldn't read an entire post before replying to it.
Bottom line is you're an ignorant blowhard, and your opinions on just about everything are a notch above a talking chimp's. In the future feel free to either ignore my posts or kill yourself - whichever you prefer.
I could sure go for some flapjacks right about now.
(http://www.stereogum.com/img/magazines/rolling_stone_5-22-86/rs_cover.jpg)
Get that animated as a gif with his hands and head shaking uncontrollably, and you're the winner.
Seriously, though, Wingspan is giving this thread Parkinson's.
Ha, nice mullet. I like his haircut better here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMliHkTDHaE). Gotta give his barber some credit too.
Hell.
You fargers are going to H-E-L-L.
:-D
Jews don't believe in hell.
Jews aren't real people either, so who cares what they believe in.
Quote from: FastFreddie on October 15, 2007, 11:33:18 AM
Seriously, though, Wingspan is giving this thread Parkinson's.
You get that off of a t-shirt?
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on October 15, 2007, 11:23:07 AM
In the future feel free to either ignore my posts or kill yourself - whichever you prefer.
Neither. Thanks for your concern though.
Your completed unrelated insult aside, it can't be possible that you actually follow professional sports and still form some of the opinions you represent on this board. It's getting nearly as unbelievable as "King Cole".
Quote from: FastFreddie on October 15, 2007, 04:21:40 PM
Your completed unrelated insult aside, it can't be possible that you actually follow professional sports and still form some of the opinions you represent on this board. It's getting nearly as unbelievable as "King Cole".
Tell me, what opinions do I represent on this board?
Stupid ones.
I applaud stupid opinions (especially my own).
What annoys me is when someone comes off acting like they're an expert when they've never demonstrated even a passing familiarity with the subject in question.
Whatever, though. . . back to whining about Cholly from Mayberry and Black Dunn's strikeouts.
So, when you give your dumb opinion to someone, you get so excited and happy for doing so that you actually applaud yourself
huh...pretty interesting
the last page and a half of this thread has been ben stellar
Ben Stiller what?
ben stiller is a jew
Days until pitchers & catchers report?
it's still over 100 :(
Thank god. Seriously.
A couple of minor updates:
-- Yoel Hernandez refused minor league assignment and will be a free agent. Goodbye.
-- Former Devil Rays GM Chuck LaMar is the new Phillies Director of Pro Scouting
Quote from: BigEd76 on October 25, 2007, 05:05:30 PM
A couple of minor updates:
-- Yoel Hernandez refused minor league assignment and will be a free agent. Goodbye.
-- Former Devil Rays GM Chuck LaMar is the new Phillies Director of Pro Scouting :yay
He was pretty good at picking young talent
I'd hope the bums weren't this stupid, but the Amaro quote says all I need to know:
QuoteLefthander Romero likely to test free agency
By Todd Zolecki
Inquirer Staff Writer
It looks as if lefthander J.C. Romero could be pitching elsewhere next season.
Romero, who played a major role this season in helping the Phillies win their first National League East championship since 1993, appears far apart from the Phillies in early contract negotiations.
"We have had some discussions," said Dan Lozano, Romero's agent from the Beverly Hills Sports Council. "But I'm not too optimistic at this point. I'm waiting to hear back from the Phillies."
The Phillies remain hopeful they can get something done.
"We would consider it a priority to bring J.C. back," said Ruben Amaro Jr., the Phillies' assistant general manager. "He played a very, very important role for us down the stretch. We also gave him that opportunity to play that role after being released [by Boston]. I think it was mutually beneficial for both of us.
"If we had our druthers, we'd bring him back and we wouldn't let him get on the market. But as a free agent, he has every right to test the marketplace. That does not mean if he tests the free-agent market that we have severed ties. We certainly will continue to try to bring him back."
Romero would be a considerable loss from the Phils' bullpen. The 31-year-old went 1-2 with a 1.24 ERA in 51 appearances for the Phillies. He pitched extensively with closer Brett Myers and Tom Gordon in the final month of the season as the Phillies overcame a seven-game deficit to the New York Mets with 17 games to play.
The Phillies have few in-house candidates to replace him if he leaves. Lefthander Mike Zagurski (1-0, 5.91 ERA in 25 appearances) finished the season on the disabled list with a strained hamstring. Lefthander Fabio Castro (0-0, 6.00 ERA in 10 appearances) has not proven he can be a situational lefthander. And lefthander Matt Smith (0-0, 11.25 ERA in nine appearances) had Tommy John surgery in July.
These certainly are things the Phillies will discuss early next week, when they hold their organizational meetings.
Romero signed a one-year, $1.6 million contract with the Boston Red Sox before the 2007 season, but he seems in line for a considerable raise with more guaranteed years.
Other potential free-agent lefthanded relievers include Colorado's Jeremy Affeldt (4-3, 3.51 ERA in 75 appearances) and Washington's Ray King (1-1, 4.76 in 67 appearances). Last season, relief pitchers such as righthander Justin Speier (four years, $18 million) and lefthander Jamie Walker (three years, $12 million) received considerable contracts. Those could be good indicators when thinking about what Romero could be seeking.
The Phillies will continue to have exclusive negotiating rights with Romero until two weeks after the final game of the World Series. If a deal is not struck by then, Romero hits the open market.
LaMar joins Phils. The Phillies named former Tampa Bay Devil Rays general manager Chuck LaMar to be their director of professional scouting.
LaMar, 51, worked this season with the Washington Nationals as special assistant to the general manager and national cross-checker. He served as Tampa Bay's GM from 1995 to 2005.
The fall league. Lefthander Joe Savery, the team's first-round pick in June, is 0-1 with a 0.00 ERA in two starts for the Peoria Saguaros in the Arizona Fall League.
Third baseman Mike Costanzo, the Archbishop Carroll graduate and the team's top pick in 2005, is hitting .175 (7 for 40) with two home runs and five RBIs. He has struck out 16 times. Outfielder Greg Golson, the team's first-round pick in 2004, is hitting .214 (9 for 42) with no homers and five RBIs.
He doesn't owe the Phils a discount cause they gave him a chance last season, dipshtein
yeah what an absolutely assinine comment...the phils were pompous clueless idiots before they made the playoffs...i cant imagine what they are gonna be like this offseason...i can def see the front office believing they are gonna win the division again next year if they do absolutely nothing this offseason
exhibit #22243/a why every phillies fan has nightmares over thoughts of Ruben Amaro being the next gm.
QuoteThe fall league. Lefthander Joe Savery, the team's first-round pick in June, is 0-1 with a 0.00 ERA in two starts for the Peoria Saguaros in the Arizona Fall League.
Only a Phillies pitching prospect could lose with an ERA of 0.00.
you know who hasnt lost in the arizona fall league?
kyle drabek
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 26, 2007, 01:51:26 PM
you know who hasnt lost in the arizona fall league?
kyle drabek
but he did lose his arm in the minors
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 26, 2007, 01:51:26 PM
you know who hasnt lost in the arizona fall league?
kyle drabek
No baseball player named Kyle will ever be good.
He should stick to NASCAR, surfing or BASS fishing.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on October 26, 2007, 01:56:52 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 26, 2007, 01:51:26 PM
you know who hasnt lost in the arizona fall league?
kyle drabek
but he did lose his arm in the minors
better than losing it in the majors (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Dravecky)
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 26, 2007, 10:06:44 AM
yeah what an absolutely assinine comment...the phils were pompous clueless idiots before they made the playoffs...i cant imagine what they are gonna be like this offseason...i can def see the front office believing they are gonna win the division again next year if they do absolutely nothing this offseason
I hate Amaro with about the same amount of passion that you hate Banner, Lurie & Reid.
That guy is a prick. A pompous smarmy little dipshtein.
i like reid i just think hes a bad coach
i dont mind lurie
i hate banner with all the force in my body
Schilling listed the Phillies among the teams he's interested in for his last season, but Boston is still his first choice. The Mets and Braves are also on there.
Quote from: ice grillin you on October 27, 2007, 11:05:03 AM
i like reid i just think hes a bad coach, evaluator of talent and father.
MLB4U.com predicts Andruw to the Phillies for 7/$161M and was serious when saying that :-D
He has Jones going to the Phillies for 7/$161M yet he has Rowand going to the Cardinals for 4/$44M??
What a tool.
http://www.mlb4u.com/topfa07.php
gillick says that 3rd base is most likely not gonna be addressed...meanwhile the mets have an mvp type third basemen and are meeting with arod this week
the Mets are going to trade Reyes for Santana and sign Arod for SS...book it
I was just about to post that, IGY.
Nauseating. (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20071106_Phils_Gillick__Third_base_isnt_an_off-season_priority.html)
I don't even know what to say anymore. I guess the best we can hope for is that Gillick is blowing smoke but I doubt it.
Actually getting a third baseman would involve him admitting that Helms was a catastrophe last season and like most of the other GM's in Philly we can't have them owning up to colossal fargups.
Put Pat Burrell back at Third! High comedy!
Phillies third basemen were dead last in the NL in OBP last year.
But sure, it's not a priority position. Not at all. Helms is going to have a career year next year and so is Eaton.
Holla.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 06, 2007, 08:38:54 AM
I was just about to post that, IGY.
Nauseating. (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20071106_Phils_Gillick__Third_base_isnt_an_off-season_priority.html)
I don't even know what to say anymore. I guess the best we can hope for is that Gillick is blowing smoke but I doubt it.
Actually getting a third baseman would involve him admitting that Helms was a catastrophe last season and like most of the other GM's in Philly we can't have them owning up to colossal fargups.
Right or wrong...they are probably looking at Dobbs/Helms combo as "good enough" for 2008 while Mike Costanzo gets at least half a season at Lehigh.
Gillick said somewhere that Costanzo is a few years away and that third base might not even be his position
Phillies offseason >>>>>>>> Eagles regular season.
Quote from: SunMo on November 06, 2007, 09:46:31 AM
Gillick said somewhere that Costanzo is a few years away and that third base might not even be his position
Gillick is also a senile old man who brought us Helms, Fasano, Barajas, Aflonseca and Jose Mesa.
Costanzo is also 24 years old right now...if he's still "A few years away" then he's pretty much worthless.
and i'm sure he's just repeating the information given to him from people who watch the prospects...Costanzo hasn't played well at all. tons of errors and strikeouts
Quote from: SunMo on November 06, 2007, 09:53:20 AM
and i'm sure he's just repeating the information given to him from people who watch the prospects...Costanzo hasn't played well at all. tons of errors and strikeouts
Call him up.
Seems to fit in well with the team's overall concept to me.
The Boston Herald says the Phils are one of the teams interested in trading for Coco Crisp. umm
Schilling officially back with Saaaaawx (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3096549)
Nice.
Costanzo is hitting .177 in the Arizona Fall League
not exactly what you want to see from your supposed future at 3rd base
what ridiculous is entertaining the notion that the phillies after just having won their division would sit on their asses and wait for mike farging costanzo to arrive and maybe be a player in three years rather than try to improve a position of need right now is sickening
thats what the royals and pirates do
Not even the Royals anymore. KC wants Torii Hunter
I hate this farging town.
JRoll and Rowand win Gold Gloves
Its about time Jimmy got him one. Good to see Rowand get one too; his departing gift from this city as we watch them not re-sign him.
Coco Crisp? farging kidding me?
I dont care about 3B because not every position will be stacked. They aren't getting anyone of significance there anyways because there's no one out there. ARod? Nice dream, but no way they pay that cash. Who else is there? Aaron bleeping Boone? I thought they'd actually sign him and then pimp him to us because his Dad was a Phillie and tell us those wonderful stories about little Aaron on the Vet turf during BP as a young lad.
Get pitching. And re-sign Rowand.
Rowand's not coming back so you can forget him. And Mike Lowell won't be a Phillie either. Schilling's already a Sox so say bye-bye. Of the other top free agents you can forget about A-Rod, Jones, Hunter, Gagne, or even Carlos Silva. All of them are out of the Phillies price range because the Phillies are a small market team. Well, they are despite the fact that Philly is the fourth largest television market in America and the Phillies had over 3,000,000 in attendance last year.
The lineup is going to look similar to last year's and the pitching staff will be slightly better but only if everyone who pitched well this year is brought back and pitches well again.
Get used to it because as long as the ownership is what it is the Phillies will never do what needs to be done to win it all.
Period, end of story.
Phreak, I'd agree about them not going after a 3b if they hadn't shown Nunez the door already. But now they don't have any reliable glove on the corner and they need one there. I could really care less about offensive production from that position because they should have plenty as it is from everywhere else. Of course, if they landed someone who could field the position and hit then it's a bonus, imo. Helms almost as bad at 3rd and Howard is at 1st. That's not good.
I'm not even starting on the Nunez discussion anymore.
The guy I want to trade for is Miguel Tejada. Sure, he costs $13 million. But Bodymore wants to unload so you can get on the cheap, rather, than trading away studs to get Fatty Cabrera. He will move to 3rd and secure the offense, letting the Phils go out and get some journeyman to play RF. Since pitching still remains the top priority, this of course will mean the Phillies must not give a shtein about payroll. Which of course will never happen. Why do I even bother.
Bums ask fans opinion on broadcasters (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/phillies/20071107_Phillies_Notebook___Phillies_ask_fans_opinion_on_broadcasters.html)
(http://media.philly.com/images/20071107_dn_g2phln07s.JPG)
I voted.
ANd made some comments too. :evil
It would be nice if someone could post a link to the questionnaire so we could all play along.
It was for season ticket holders.
I got it too. I did not vote well in any category.
Oh, I see... so it was available only to season ticket holders?
Weird. Especially considering people who don't attend games in person are more likely to listen to and/or watch the various broadcasters they employ.
Whatever, though. Wheeler's not going anywhere and neither are any of the other hacks. As long as Harry's still the #1 PBP guy I can tune out the other fools.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 07, 2007, 09:37:23 AM
Oh, I see... so it was available only to season ticket holders?
Weird. Especially considering people who don't attend games in person are more likely to listen to and/or watch the various broadcasters they employ.
Yeah, that makes absolutely no sense. I know some people still show up with walkmans and what not and tune to the radio broadcast of the game but that's a pretty small percentage. If they're going to ask about their radio/tv commentators then they should open it up to the people who most likely use those 2 mediums.....non-season ticket holders.
Wouldn't season ticket holders be the most likely group to watch/listen when the team's on the road, though?
Quote from: Sgt PSN on November 07, 2007, 10:34:54 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 07, 2007, 09:37:23 AM
Oh, I see... so it was available only to season ticket holders?
Weird. Especially considering people who don't attend games in person are more likely to listen to and/or watch the various broadcasters they employ.
Yeah, that makes absolutely no sense. I know some people still show up with walkmans and what not and tune to the radio broadcast of the game but that's a pretty small percentage. If they're going to ask about their radio/tv commentators then they should open it up to the people who most likely use those 2 mediums.....non-season ticket holders.
Most season ticket holders do not have a full season.
I have the 17 game plan.
So it's more likely the phils don't give a crap about the opinions of the people who are not paying to see them.
the main problem with the season tickets holders is a large number of them are seamhead homers...the kind of fans that love "wheels"...of course the ancient shibe park fans love wheels as well
wheels wins
whats there to get worked up over. harry hates wheels, whitey hated wheels, the fans complained about him in droves a few years ago, yet....he still has a job. one of these days hes going to die, and that'll be it.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 07, 2007, 10:59:27 AM
the main problem with the season tickets holders is a large number of them are seamhead homers...the kind of fans that love "wheels"...of course the ancient shibe park fans love wheels as well
wheels wins
I know you enjoy trying to poke hornets nests...but I have never met anyone who liked Wheeler.
far more people hate wheels than like him in general
but the season ticket holders and the lunatic phillie fans
the kind of fans as you pointed out that the phillies care about
the phillie fans who hate the eagles
and hate sports in the city in general
but love the phillies
all worship wheels
5-7-5 dookie
Is that a telegram?
Keep this link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shift_key) here for future reference, Icee.
Quote from: Wingspan on November 07, 2007, 11:07:23 AM
I know you enjoy trying to poke hornets nests...but I have never met anyone who liked Wheeler.
I've never met a single Phillies fan who even tolerate Wheeler much less "love" him. Hell, even his wife wears ear muffs when they make love.
And before you ask, no, I don't have pix. Freaks.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 07, 2007, 12:44:34 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on November 07, 2007, 11:07:23 AM
I know you enjoy trying to poke hornets nests...but I have never met anyone who liked Wheeler.
I've never met a single Phillies fan who even tolerate Wheeler much less "love" him. Hell, even his wife wears ear muffs when they make love.
And before you ask, no, I don't have pix. Freaks.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on November 07, 2007, 10:34:54 AM
some people still show up with walkmans and what not and tune to the radio broadcast of the game but that's a pretty small percentage.
people i want to party with.
I'm not a season ticket holder and I got htat email.
I would guess that you are a former season ticket holder, and they were just too lazy to take you off the list. Or that you bought enough seats under your account that you count for something.
Quote from: Don Ho on November 07, 2007, 02:06:14 PM
Quote from: Sgt PSN on November 07, 2007, 10:34:54 AM
some people still show up with walkmans and what not and tune to the radio broadcast of the game but that's a pretty small percentage.
people i want to party with.
Like this guy:
(http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39463000/jpg/_39463228_bartman-ap-203body.jpg)
HOLY ISH
BRAD LIDGE and Eric Bruntlett for Geary, Bourn and Costanzo :o
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 07, 2007, 10:32:14 PM
HOLY ISH
BRAD LIDGE and Eric Bruntlett for Geary, Bourn and Costanzo :o
Is that real, or rumor? Didn't find anything on the Phils' website.
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 07, 2007, 10:32:14 PM
HOLY ISH
BRAD LIDGE and Eric Bruntlett for Geary, Bourn and Costanzo :o
I thought you were joking at first. Link (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20071107_Phils_get_Lidge_in_multiplayer_deal.html)
Guess Lidge becomes the closer, now re-sign Romero and move Myers back into the rotation.
It's on FOXSports.com and ESPN.com too
Lidge is the new closer, but he's a free agent after the 2008 season
Bruntlett takes Nunez's spot as backup IF/OF
Myers returns to the rotation
Gordon is the setup guy
In Houston, Bourn will start in CF and lead off, moving Pence to RF. Wade gets his reliever, and Costanzo is Costanzo (see the last few pages)
GREAT trade.
Bourn sucks, yea its just me, but getting anything of value for him is gold.
Gas Can? Who cares.
Costanzo probably won't pan out, but who cares.
Lidge, Gordon, Madson, Mathieson and hopefully Romero is a good veteran bullpen.
Hamels, Myers, Kendrick, Moyer, Eaton is an average rotation. Still room for improvement there.
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 07, 2007, 10:46:46 PM
It's on FOXSports.com and ESPN.com too
Lidge is the new closer, but he's a free agent after the 2008 season
Bruntlett takes Nunez's spot as backup IF/OF
Myers returns to the rotation
Gordon is the setup guy
In Houston, Bourn will start in CF and lead off, moving Pence to RF. Wade gets his reliever, and Costanzo is Costanzo (see the last few pages)
Then I agree: Holy crap!
Thing with Lidge is that he seems to be prone to prolonged slumps. Is he perhaps too mentally soft to play in Philly - and especially in the little league field known as Citizens Bank Park?
If the Phils get good Lidge = :drool
If the Phils get 5.00+ and lots of homers = :puke
Lastly, so much for Costanzo being the 3B of the future. They had better damn well get one now.
Jayson Stark loves the trade and thinks the Phils got a good closer for basically a speed guy. He also says the Phils may go after Geoff Jenkins to platoon in RF if they don't re-sign Rowand...
I was iffy on this trade then I remembered Ed Wade was the Astros new GM and now I'm all for it.
Costanzo was never going to pan out into anything, anyway. He is still years away from producing at 3B, so it's back to the drawing board on that one.
Bruntlett is a versatile player. He can essentially play every position except first and catcher. So that's good news considering how often Uncle Cholly gets a brain cramp. His defense at third probably isn't as good as Nunez's, but we'll wait and see what the Phillies do there.
A big plus is that he is close to a .300 hitter as a PH over the last few years (11 for 37 with 6 k's). Really doesn't have any power, not all that patient, but he's pretty good against RHP.
All in all, not a bad guy to get spell Rollins and Utley every now and then.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on November 07, 2007, 11:26:22 PM
Thing with Lidge is that he seems to be prone to prolonged slumps. Is he perhaps too mentally soft to play in Philly - and especially in the little league field known as Citizens Bank Park?
If the Phils get good Lidge = :drool
If the Phils get 5.00+ and lots of homers = :puke
That's my concern also. Dude had some serious consistancy issues last year and had the closer job taken away from him for a little while. But when he's on, he's almost unhittable.
lidge is gonna be a total bust here....he wont be a gas can in that park hell be a refinery...plus hes not exactly the most stable guy mentally...a couple pop ups into the flower bed and he will implode
but at least this gets myers back in the rotatgion where he belongs
^^^^^^
lolololol
Figures.
Does anyone else think this means they make a push to re-sign Rowand now?
what would this move have to do with rowand...unless the rumored numbers are way off rowand is long gone
victorino in center
werth platoon in right
ig, other than the almost impossible moves of getting A-Rod, Santana or Cabrera, what the hell is going to make you happy with this team?
myers going back to the rotation
MORE BLACK PLAYERS
Black people are better at baseball because they're naturally built to withstand the heat.
they be the tropical peoples
Quote from: Sgt PSN on November 08, 2007, 10:50:51 AM
Black people are better at baseball because they're naturally built to withstand the heat.
you forgot the extra calves
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 08, 2007, 10:15:05 AM
myers going back to the rotation
and that happened with this move, so why is this a bad trade? He said he's happy to get out of Houston and thinks he can return to being the dominant closer he was before Pujols destroyed one off the back wall of Minute Maid Park. He won't cost 5/$55M like Cordero and the Phils couldn't trade for Francisco Rodriguez, so it's about as good as it's going to get for improving the back of the bullpen. Now they just need some decent relievers, do something about CF/RF, figure out what they're going to do about 3B and get ready for 2008...
I don't like this move. For a number of reasons:
Down the stretch the back end of the bullpen with Romero/Geary/Gordon/Myers was a strength. Now it's a "Maybe" with potentially the only one coming back in 08 is 41 year old Gordon? Ha.
Myers the Closer >>> Lidge
Myers as a starter is just not that good. When he goes 13-14 (maybe 14-13) next season with s 4.90 era don't forget all the cries to make him a starter again from this offseason.
This move, like most of Gillick's other moves...will backfire.
Quoteso it's about as good as it's going to get for improving the back of the bullpen.
Wrong...Myers was a better closer than Lidge.
QuoteNow they just need some decent relievers,
They effectively just got rid of 2 in Myers and Geary
Quotedo something about CF/RF,
Like trade away their one promising OF prospect while your every day CF is unsigned?
Quotefigure out what they're going to do about 3B and get ready for 2008...
"We're not looking at 3B" - Pat Gillick
Goosebumps
Ed's right. It's not like this is exciting, but the team got some possible value from 3 players that no longer had any value to the Phillies. Myers is capable of being a good starter, which is more than can be said for the gettable FA possibilities. Etc etc.
They're not going to win the World Series with this move, but it's better than if they still had Geary, Costanzo, and Bourn.
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 08, 2007, 11:45:32 AM
He said he's happy to get out of Houston and thinks he can return to being the dominant closer he was
i didn't realize this part. it's a great trade then.
i mean seriously, what's he supposed to say? i definitely am not the pitcher i once was, and i'm just happy to be getting a paycheck somewhere.
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 08, 2007, 11:45:32 AM
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 08, 2007, 10:15:05 AM
myers going back to the rotation
and that happened with this move, so why is this a bad trade? He said he's happy to get out of Houston and thinks he can return to being the dominant closer he was before Pujols destroyed one off the back wall of Minute Maid Park. He won't cost 5/$55M like Cordero and the Phils couldn't trade for Francisco Rodriguez, so it's about as good as it's going to get for improving the back of the bullpen. Now they just need some decent relievers, do something about CF/RF, figure out what they're going to do about 3B and get ready for 2008...
i never said it was a bad trade....im just warning the section of philadelphia sports fans that go bonkers and make every decent/good player aquisition into a blockbuster steal....i think all the makings of a lidge implosion in philly are ripe
if they moved myers to the starting rotation and didnt get lidge i would be happy...so i def dont hate the trade...but like wing said myers is not a great starter to begin with but my main concern with him is does he have it inside of him to be a starter again....it certainly doesnt sound like it....so combine that with a potential lidge implosion and what do you have then?
the positives are that they didnt give up a ton unless constanzo becomes a player and the upside is great if lidge goes back to lights out plus even if myers is 14-12 its still 1 million times better than what they would have in his place
they now need to resign lohse to get eaton out of the rotation or at least have some depth in case of injury or continued incompetance...moyer and eaton blow and kendrick is still a huge ?....they need to have a sixth starter...lohse isnt a terrible guy to get
It's not like this is exciting, but the team got some possible value from 3 players that no longer had any value to the Phillies. their possible 3rd basemen of the future has no value?
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 06, 2007, 10:58:20 AMwhat ridiculous is entertaining the notion that the phillies after just having won their division would sit on their asses and wait for mike farging costanzo to arrive and maybe be a player in three years rather than try to improve a position of need right now is sickening
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 08, 2007, 12:17:39 PM
It's not like this is exciting, but the team got some possible value from 3 players that no longer had any value to the Phillies.
their possible 3rd basemen of the future has no value?
What's his batting average in the fall league?
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 08, 2007, 12:25:27 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 06, 2007, 10:58:20 AMwhat ridiculous is entertaining the notion that the phillies after just having won their division would sit on their asses and wait for mike farging costanzo to arrive and maybe be a player in three years rather than try to improve a position of need right now is sickening
please tell me what getting a third basemen this year rather than waiting to see if constanzo develops has to do with anything
Quote from: FastFreddie on November 08, 2007, 12:25:38 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 08, 2007, 12:17:39 PM
It's not like this is exciting, but the team got some possible value from 3 players that no longer had any value to the Phillies.
their possible 3rd basemen of the future has no value?
What's his batting average in the fall league?
so 34 at bats in the arizona fall league determines his career future?
or should his .270 27 hr and 86 rbi in a full AA season determine it?
Less than 2 days ago, he was garbage that might be here in 2010. Now he's the 3B of the future and has value?
Costanza = Russell Branyan, IGY. He might make a nice bench player in the big leagues but as far as him being an everyday starting 3rd baseman it just wasn't gonna happen. He strikes out a ton at the plate and is a walking clusterfarg in the field.
As far as Geary & Bourn go, I can't see how anyone can be upset about those two leaving. Geary was garbage and Bourn was extremely limited in terms of his upside. He's a carbon copy of Endy Chavez and if Endy Chavez is what anyone envisions as the starting CF for the Phillies for the next 10 years, please blind yourselves.
PS: LOL at Myers >>> Lidge as a closer.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 12:40:32 PM
PS: LOL at Myers >>> Lidge as a closer.
Why? It's true.
Lidge hasnt been all that great since he was completely shellshocked in the 2005 Playoffs.
And the 2007 numbers clearly show that Myers was the better closer.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 06, 2007, 10:58:20 AM
what ridiculous is entertaining the notion that the phillies after just having won their division would sit on their asses and wait for mike farging costanzo to arrive and maybe be a player in three years rather than try to improve a position of need right now is sickening
thats what the royals and pirates do
To be fair to our friend IGY, he never said Costanzo didn't have potential.
Although, he was obviously wrong about them expecting Costanzo would be ready in 3 years to take over.
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 08, 2007, 12:39:53 PM
Less than 2 days ago, he was garbage that might be here in 2010. Now he's the 3B of the future and has value?
please find where i ever said he was anythig much less garbage...and he was the 3b of the future...whether he became that or not only time will tell
i have no clue as to what he will develop into...my post was addressing the fact that the phillies just made the playoffs...and they arent in a position where they should be waiting around for a kid to develop in a few years to fill a big need position...they should go out and imporve it now...if constanzo had become a player in 2010 so be it...they are position to win right farging now
lidge vs myers as a closer is a toss up....both have issues upstairs both have great stuff...both might or might not be a full time closer
but i dont think thats the point here...the point is more along the lines of myers > any starter they could have gotten
Quote from: Wingspan on November 08, 2007, 12:42:08 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 12:40:32 PM
PS: LOL at Myers >>> Lidge as a closer.
Why? It's true.
Lidge hasnt been all that great since he was completely shellshocked in the 2005 Playoffs.
And the 2007 numbers clearly show that Myers was the better closer.
And what do the 2003, 2004, 2005, & 2006 numbers show? Oh, that's right - they don't - because Myers was being used in his natural position as a starter.
Lidge has a PROVEN track record as a closer in the Major Leagues whereas Myers does not. Myers saved 21 games last year, that's true, but he also had 3 blown saves, a major injury that was caused by him over-throwing in a critical situation in relief, as well as four other appearances where he lost games in relief that weren't outright save opportunities.
Myers does not have the mentality to be a closer. He does, however, have the stuff to be a good starting pitcher because if he gets hammered during one start he has five days to get over it and come back strong the next time out.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 08, 2007, 12:52:25 PMi have no clue as to what he will develop into...my post was addressing the fact that the phillies just made the playoffs...and they arent in a position where they should be waiting around for a kid to develop in a few years to fill a big need position...they should go out and imporve it now...if constanzo had become a player in 2010 so be it...they are position to win right farging now
and I'll agree with you on that. Costanzo is nowhere near the potential that a Wright, Zimmerman, Braun, Stewart or Fields had, where you only needed 1 year until they were ready to take over long term, so I'm still holding out hope (yeah, I'm dumb) that they'll get a veteran with a long-term deal until they're ready to groom someone else. Glaus, Tejada, Mora, Crede, whatever....anything is an upgrade from Helms...
More good news: Romero close to re-signing (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20071108_Phils_close_to_re-signing_Romero.html)
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 01:03:16 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on November 08, 2007, 12:42:08 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 12:40:32 PM
PS: LOL at Myers >>> Lidge as a closer.
Why? It's true.
Lidge hasnt been all that great since he was completely shellshocked in the 2005 Playoffs.
And the 2007 numbers clearly show that Myers was the better closer.
And what do the 2003, 2004, 2005, & 2006 numbers show? Oh, that's right - they don't - because Myers was being used in his natural position as a starter.
Lidge has a PROVEN track record as a closer in the Major Leagues whereas Myers does not. Myers saved 21 games last year, that's true, but he also had 3 blown saves, a major injury that was caused by him over-throwing in a critical situation in relief, as well as four other appearances where he lost games in relief that weren't outright save opportunities.
Myers does not have the mentality to be a closer. He does, however, have the stuff to be a good starting pitcher because if he gets hammered during one start he has five days to get over it and come back strong the next time out.
Lidge's 2006's numbers don't show anything that will win you this agrument. His 2004 and 05 seasons he was top knoch.
Lidge at 19 saves last season, with 8 blown saves and a higher ERA than myers.
I hope Lidge goes back to his form from 3 seasons ago...but I dont see it especially since his problem has been giving up HRs the last two seasons.
And you do realize that on 10/1/07 he had knee surgery for torn cartilidge?
This was a dumb move.
The Phillies gave up garbage in Geary, an unknown in Costanza and at best a fourth outfielder in Bourn.
In return they got a solid utility infielder and a proven closer who had a tough year last year. As a result of the trade they also got a #2 starting pitcher in Myers.
But sure, it's a dumb move. Definitely dumb.
so bourn as a fourth outfielder is nothing but bruntlett is "solid"?
without bourn you dont get lidge
i think both sides are spinning this thing...i would say its a good move with the potential for disaster
right now you cant say its a great move and you cant say its a dumb move
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 01:32:26 PM
The Phillies gave up garbage in Geary, an unknown in Costanza and at best a fourth outfielder in Bourn.
In return they got a solid utility infielder and a proven closer who had a tough year last year. As a result of the trade they also got a #2 starting pitcher in Myers.
But sure, it's a dumb move. Definitely dumb.
Are you that dense?
"a proven closer who had a tough year last year"
He's been bad for 2 seasons now...and got rocked out of the park in the playoffs in 2005. Coming off of major knee surgery, to boot.
This is no different than the Freddy Garcia trade...sure it
could work...but everyone, including the phils are ingnoring the fact that this guy is damaged goods, and you're expecting him to replace a closer that just played a major part in getthing them to the playoffs.
Go get the reaction of Astro's fans...they are THRILLED that this guy is gone.
Who gives a shtein about Bourne, Costanzo, and Geary other than you just traded them for damaged goods to move your already solid closer to the rotation where he will be no better than a .500 4.5-5.00 era pitcher??? Like he was before moving to the pen. (Myers already said he was pissed at the move back to the rotation...that should work out great).
(Myers already said he was pissed at the move back to the rotation...that should work out great).
this is easily my biggest concern with the trade
QuotePhils get creative to land closer, starter
Ken Rosenthal
FOXSports.com, Updated 11 hours ago
ORLANDO, Fla. - This is the kind of trade you might see frequently this off-season — a burst of creativity inspired by the lack of quality starting pitching on the free-agent market.
The Phillies not only acquired closer Brad Lidge and infielder Eric Bruntlett from the Astros on Wednesday night, but also regained right-hander Brett Myers as a starting pitcher.
Myers was arguably better as a closer than he was as a starter, but that's not the point. No, the point is that Myers is a better starter than Carlos Silva and Kyle Lohse, both of whom might command free-agent contracts of at least four years and $10 million per season.
Yes, Lidge is a risk, particularly in hitter-friendly Citizens Bank Park. The Phillies will pay him at least $6 million and control him for only one season. But as one scout said, "You can count on two fingers guys who have better stuff."
That might be an exaggeration, but Tom Gordon will set up for Lidge, and if the Phillies re-sign free-agent left-hander J.C. Romero, the back of their bullpen should be formidable. With no further improvements, their rotation — Myers plus lefties Cole Hamels and Jamie Moyer and righties Kyle Kendrick and Adam Eaton — could be above-average. And Bruntlett should prove a useful part, playing infield and outfield and offering more versatility than the departed Abraham Nunez.
Put it all together, and the trade at first glance appears lopsided in the Phillies' favor. All they gave up was Michael Bourn, a speedy center fielder who has yet to prove he can hit; right-hander Geoff Geary, a middle-inning reliever who will earn more than $1 million next season; and Class AA third baseman Mike Costanzo, whose stat line features plentiful amounts of home runs, strikeouts and errors.
Of course, Phillies GM Pat Gillick appeared to get an even bigger steal a year ago when he acquired right-hander Freddy Garcia from the White Sox for right-hander Gavin Floyd and lefty Gio Gonzalez — and Garcia made only 11 starts before suffering a shoulder injury that required season-ending surgery.
For the Phillies, the trade will be a success if Lidge re-establishes himself as an elite closer. The Astros, at the very least, created payroll flexibility for the acquisition of more pitching and a second baseman who can hit No. 2 behind Bourn — Luis Castillo, Kaz Matsui or Tadahito Iguchi come to mind. If Bourn can post a .350 on-base percentage, the Astros will be set in center for the next five years.
The question is whether Bourn can develop into that type of player. The Phillies, bracing for the loss of free-agent center fielder Aaron Rowand, didn't view Bourn as a regular — at least not one who could crack their projected outfield of Pat Burrell, Shane Victorino and Jayson Werth. But Astros GM Ed Wade, who drafted all three players in the trade during his tenure with the Phillies, views Bourn as a top-of-the-order catalyst with base-stealing ability.
The Astros had numerous options in center, from free agents such as Torii Hunter and Andruw Jones to trade possibilities such as Coco Crisp and Rocco Baldelli.
The Phillies had far fewer options in their quest to add pitching. They couldn't count on trading for a quality starter. They couldn't sign one at a reasonable price. Considering the shortage of pitching throughout the industry, acquiring Lidge and moving Myers back to the rotation qualifies as a coup.
Rosenthal likes the trade. He's dumb too, I guess?
You're all dumb.
Just click any link anywhere on this site.
Like here for instance? (http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=956)
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 08, 2007, 01:44:22 PM
(Myers already said he was pissed at the move back to the rotation...that should work out great).
this is easily my biggest concern with the trade
It's his wife's biggest concern as well.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 02:04:16 PM
Like here for instance? (http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=956)
Everyone's a comedian.
Quote
Rosenthal likes the trade. He's dumb too, I guess?
(http://www.austinchronicle.com/binary/c3922e57/i_see_what_you_did_there.jpg)
Quote from: rjs246 on November 08, 2007, 01:59:21 PM
Just click any link anywhere on this site.
:-D :-D :-D
this thread was good reading.
i'm pissed they gave up bourn, i think it's going to come back and haunt them, like a ghost...a sexy ghost
Lets hold the rah-rahs until Gillick does something worth "serious" substantial noting. His blunders far outweigh his positives.
Still, hoping that Lidge now rebounds just because the Phillies got him is a bit of a reach regardless if hes proven or not. Trends in diminished production usually don't lie. Shows you how desperate we as Phillies fans really are
dont forget they still have gordon, madson, romero and matheison in the bullpen. its not like its lidge and mesa waiting in the wings.
they need 1 more bat, hopefully at 3B because they can find any LH corner outfielder to make an effective platoon with Werth.
QuoteESPN - New GM Strikes Out
Ed Wade didn't hit a home run in his first big move as Astros GM, getting bad value for one of his best assets.
Quote from: rjs246 on November 08, 2007, 02:07:33 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 02:04:16 PM
Like here for instance? (http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=956)
Everyone's a comedian.
Speaking of comedy...
Snow White received a camera as a gift. She happily took pictures of the Dwarfs and their surroundings. When she finished her first batch she took the film to be developed. After a week or so she went to get the finished photos. The clerk said the photos were not back from the processor.
Needless to say, she was disappointed and started to cry. The clerk, trying to console her, said,
"Don't worry, sweetheart. Someday your prints will come in".
:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 04:01:37 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on November 08, 2007, 02:07:33 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 08, 2007, 02:04:16 PM
Like here for instance? (http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=956)
Everyone's a comedian.
Speaking of comedy...
Snow White received a camera as a gift. She happily took pictures of the Dwarfs and their surroundings. When she finished her first batch she took the film to be developed. After a week or so she went to get the finished photos. The clerk said the photos were not back from the processor.
Needless to say, she was disappointed and started to cry. The clerk, trying to console her, said,
"Don't worry, sweetheart. Someday your prints will come in".
:-D :-D :-D :-D :-D
Wow.
ban
:-D
If it were possible for me to be speechless, I would be speechless right now.
Puns > Phillies baseball > Eagles football ?
Comcast SportsNight reporting that JC Romero is close to signing with the PHils.
Great news on Romero.
Even better news on Lidge and Bruntlett.
Getting Lidge and hoping he's better than the slop they had out there last year while watching Myers and Gordon on the DL is a positive. Give me the hope he'll regain his AS form over Joe Table, Sixto and whoever else saved games.
I'd like to have seen Myers stay as the closer but this helps the rotation. Even though I was originally against Myers going to the pen, I liked it. He's better than the FA SP's. So yeah.
Houston radio is kissing Lidge goodbye. I so wanted to call in just to laugh at them for having Ed Wade here.
Costanzo is a bum. Geary is trash. I HATE HATE HATE losing Bourn.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on November 08, 2007, 06:40:54 PM
Comcast SportsNight reporting that JC Romero is close to signing with the PHils.
So, is that any earlier today than when Ed posted the article saying that JC Romero is close to signing with the Phils?
I'm going to call the repost police on you. Sorry, PG. Tsk tsk.
MLB.com's article on Miguel Cabrera being more popular than A-Rod at the GM meetings says the Phillies are one of the teams interested in Cabrera. .0000000000000000000001% on that one....
Yeah, and all the men here are interested in a date with Jessica Alba, too...
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 08, 2007, 09:51:05 PM
MLB.com's article on Miguel Cabrera being more popular than A-Rod at the GM meetings says the Phillies are one of the teams interested in Cabrera. .0000000000000000000001% on that one....
It'd be great. No shot though.
They dont have enough to give up unless Cole goes. And no way I want him leaving
Lidge is toast. The last type of player that should come to Philly is one who couldnt even hold up mentally in HOUSTON.
Romero's deal is done (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20071110_Romero_agrees_to_multi-year_deal_with_Phillies.html)
No numbers yet
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 10, 2007, 06:59:43 PM
Romero's deal is done (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20071110_Romero_agrees_to_multi-year_deal_with_Phillies.html)
No numbers yet
At least the Phils are doing something - even if it backfires, at least they've done more than the Eagles.
yikes....3/$12M with a 2011 team option for $4.75M
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 10, 2007, 08:01:28 PM
yikes....3/$12M with a 2011 team option for $4.75M
I guess this means A-Rod is out of the question. :D
Good.
I dont care about the amount - he needed to be signed.
Yep. Romero very well could just be a one year wonder for the Phils (half year really) but he pitched well enough to earn a new contract so the Phils are making the right move be resigning him. I'm still not sure what to think of the Lidge trade. I'm not really all that upset about the players they gave up except for maybe Bourn. I thought he was a decent young player that would be nice to watch develope. But that the same time, if you can get a quality closer for him then it's well worth the price. The question is, which Brad Lidge are the Phillies getting? The one thing they've got going for them is that he's in the last year of his contract so he should be motivated enough to play for a big payday next year. the bad news is that if he goes out and performs well and gets 35-40+ saves, then he'll likely be playing somewhere else in 2009 since the Phils will probably be too cheap to resign him.
But like Geo said, at least they're doing something. They've already addressed 3 needs. SP, BP relief and closer.
Now go get a farging 3rd baseman!!
No 3B to get...unless somehow they get Blalock. And he's been bad/injured.
Maybe the Rangers, who like Phillies castoff SPs, would take Eaton back. But he's LH if I recall correctly, so that'd be another LH bat in that lineup. Not good.
Losing Rowand is going to sting. Not only because he's good, but because losing his RH bat throws off the balance somewhat. Because does anyone think Burrell will be good next year?
Aaron Boone at 3B? No way. Joe Crede? Hurt. Who else is there?
Not really sure who they can get for 3rd but they can't go into the season with what they've got, that's for sure. I actually liked MDS' idea of trying to trade for Tejada but the Phils don't really have anything to offer....at least not without weakening the team in another area.
As for Rowand, I don't see any reason why they don't bring him back. They didn't have to spend money on a starter or a closer so there's no excuse to at least not bring him back.
Well, I would love Tejada. The only hope would be that BAL wants Burrell again and he actually waives his NTC. Which won't happen. And the O's would probably ask for Kendrick and/or Carrasco. No thanks on giving them up.
As for bringing Rowand back, yeah it makes sense to all of us. But we know how this FO operates. Once he asks for 50+ they'll tell him to go farg himself and then sell us on Vic in CF and a Dobbs/Werth platoon in RF.
I spoke to an Astros fan at Chili's today. He laughed at me because the Phils got Brad Lidge. So I laughed at him because Ed Wade is the Astros GM, and because tey have Gas Can Geary as a centerpoint for giving up Lidge.
I bought the guy a beer, had it sent to his table and he asks why I bought him one. I told him its a sympathy brew for having to deal with Ed Wade for however long the schmuck has a job here.
I was happy when I saw they re-signed Romero and figured he'd get something in the ballpark of 3 years 8-9 million. The 3/$12 mill deal is high but whatever, its not like there's a cap in baseball. He was practically lights out last season so I'm not expecting that to repeat, but if he can keep his pitches down and do close to what he did last season the money they gave him is a non-issue. He always had good stuff he's just struggled with his location.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on November 10, 2007, 11:38:03 PM
The 3/$12 mill deal is high but whatever, its not like there's a cap in baseball.
There is if you work for the Phillies. They're a small-market team, remember?
wow @ that contract....gotta do things like that tho...im impressed
Quote from: FastFreddie on November 11, 2007, 06:34:48 AM
Quote from: SD_Eagle on November 10, 2007, 11:38:03 PM
The 3/$12 mill deal is high but whatever, its not like there's a cap in baseball.
There is if you work for the Phillies. They're a small-market team, remember?
Speaking of which:
QuotePhils hike some ticket prices
Some Phillies tickets will cost more in 2008, which season ticketholders will see when they receive their invoices over the next couple of days.
Lower-bowl seats (Sections 108 to 114 and 133 to 139) will rise from $35 to $37, the first time the price of those seats has gone up since Citizens Bank Park opened in 2004. Seats in Sections 201 to 205, the pavilion area, and the scoreboard porch area will increase to $22, from $20. The $15 seats in the club and terrace levels will be $16.
Scoreboard porch seats tied to a $10 concession add-on last season that cost individuals or groups $30 will cost $32 next year.
An average Phillies ticket in 2007 cost $27.25, according to Team Marketing Report, seventh among major league teams. That was slightly below the Yankees ($29.01) and much below the Red Sox ($47.71), who sold baseball's most expensive ticket to see its best team.
Team Marketing's signature list, the Fan Cost Index, ranked the Phillies ninth. That index adds up the average cost for a family of four to attend a baseball game; in Philly it was $196, a slight increase over '06. *
keep raising them, who cares, get more players.
i keep reading little tidbits of info from different sources about the phillies talking to ARod...you read it once and you can dismiss it, but a couple of times makes you wonder where it's coming from
It's coming from Boras or one of the gargoyles who works for him.
As for the Romero signing I think it's a fantastic move.
Alot of things have to happen to get ARod, so they'll never get him. His price must come down and other guys have to sign or be traded to the teams with the cash to pay him now.
Angels would have to get Cabrera from FLA...because they want ARod...and the Dodgers would have to get someone too.
No shot he comes here.
If the team got A-Rod and absolutely no one else, would that be good?
Nope.
I would prefer more pitching and suffer through a Dobbs/Helms/Bruntlett/who cares platoon at 3B.
Romero signing is great. Sure relievers are a dime a dozen and you have no clue how theyll do year to year, but this had to be done.
Sounds like the Phillies are going for a platoon in RF (Jenkins was mentioned), are content with 3B and want to improve the pitching some more. Damn.
I'd sell the farm and try to get Johan Santana. Your top 3 would be Santana, Hamels, Myers.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on November 11, 2007, 02:33:40 PM
I'd sell the farm and try to get Johan Santana. Your top 3 would be Santana, Hamels, Myers.
:drool
Depends on whether they can sign him long term. A one-year rental would be too expensive (in terms of talent).
That said, the Phils probably don't have the talent to pry him out of Minnesota, anyway.
If there's even any truth to the rumor they're interested in A-Rod or Cabrerra then you'd have to assume they'd give them a long term deal, Santana is more valuable then either of those players.
Besides the package of prospects that the Phils don't have, it'll also cost 6/$132M for an extension
They were 'reportedly' willing to give Soriano $100 million + so I don't see why they wouldn't do the same with a pitcher the caliber of Santana. You're right that they don't have enough to get him, though.
Give Minnesota Eaton and Helms. Done deal.
I'd give up Corrasco for him. But there'd need to more than just that.
Rowand is rumored to be going to Giants for 5 years at 80 million
edit: never mind, this was said on Mike and the Mad Dog and it was based on a prediction column written in Newsday yesterday.
(http://forums.thehuddle.com/style_emoticons/default/g-bash.gif)
If a team is dumb enough to fork over $80M for Rowand, then sayonara, babycakes.
Good player but $80M for him would be galactically stupid.
The Phillies have roughly $10 million to spend. They are not signing Rowand.
Rosenthal thinks the Phils have interest in Tom Glavine if he doesn't return to Atlanta
Can Moyer even last an entire season? He was wearing down last year after 6 innings or 70 pitches. He had a great last two games, but I'm not sure that thank ain't on empty.
Quote from: BigEd76 on November 13, 2007, 11:58:13 PM
Rosenthal thinks the Phils have interest in Tom Glavine if he doesn't return to Atlanta
so do the Braves.
Moyer turns 45 on Sunday.
Tom Glavine will be 42 before the season begins.
I'm just saying.
Youth movement.
get rolen (http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/stories.nsf/cardinals/story/00B301FCAA429C6A8625739300169280?OpenDocument)
Apparently Heaven sucks if LaRussa is running it
What a bitch.
i can't imagine having a 3rd baseman on the phillies as good as rolen.
not only is rolen one of he biggest Hoydas to ever play professional sports but he isnt all that good either
basically id rather have wes helms wife play third for the phillies than rolen
Um, he's a .280+ hitter with 1000+ RBIs and a .500+ slugging %. Not to mention 7 gold gloves.
The dude is a sopping snatch, but let's not pretend that he isn't a good player.
When he's healthy, he's still the best defensive 3B in the national league...and the guy can still hit.
I'll never understand what drives phillie fans to hate this guy.
All he did was say that he wanted out because he didnt think the team ownership showed the desire to win. He was right.
And then he went and took less money to play with a team he thought would do just that.
He's one of the only guys that has said "It's not always about the money" and then backed it up. But because it shunned the Phillies (the glowing beacon of winning baseball and dedication that this organization has always been) he gets booed.
Quote from: Wingspan on November 14, 2007, 02:24:22 PM
I'll never understand what drives phillie fans to hate this guy.
Least shocking post ever.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 14, 2007, 02:29:47 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on November 14, 2007, 02:24:22 PM
I'll never understand what drives phillie fans to hate this guy.
Least shocking post ever.
No, what would be the least shocking post ever would be to have some know it all philly fan hate on the guy because he insulted the team he grew up insulting himself.
It's one thing for me to pick on my little brother but it's another thing entirely to have a bully picking on him.
he insulted the city...not just the phillies...hes a midwestern puppies and flowers bitchmade punk...he doesnt like tony larussa because hes too demanding of his players...same reason he hated larry bowa...
Um, he's a .280+ hitter with 1000+ RBIs and a .500+ slugging %. Not to mention 7 gold gloves.
youre talking about the distant past...im talking about the possibility that the phillies could get him now...i really dont give a shtein what he did four years ago
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 14, 2007, 02:38:33 PM
It's one thing for me to pick on my little brother but it's another thing entirely to have a bully picking on him.
Please... using that analogy, your "little brother" was doing nothing but punching himself in the face.
No one ever seems to address the fact that Rolen was right. And frankly, not much has changed since, other than his back problems are enough to make me not want anything to do with the guy.
You like him, I don't.
End of story.
Quote from: rjs246 on November 14, 2007, 02:45:47 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 14, 2007, 02:42:12 PM
youre talking about the distant past...
Or 2006. Same thing.
2006 he had like 20 hr and 90 rbi...hardly great numbers...better than the phillies 3rd basemen but not nearly good enough to pay him 36 million for the next three years and put up with his faggyness and minneapolis bridge back....if im gonna pay out big money for a bitch it will be a rod...
rolen would slit his throat before he ever came to philly so its a moot point anyway
Quote from: Wingspan on November 14, 2007, 02:42:36 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 14, 2007, 02:38:33 PM
It's one thing for me to pick on my little brother but it's another thing entirely to have a bully picking on him.
If he's healthy i'd still take him back, he's better than Helmsy or Dobbsy
Please... using that analogy, your "little brother" was doing nothing but punching himself in the face.
No one ever seems to address the fact that Rolen was right. And frankly, not much has changed since, other than his back problems are enough to make me not want anything to do with the guy.
I think IGY and Winger are right, i thought i remembered him using the team is not committed to winning excuse but then followed it up with saying he didnt like the city.
He used the 'team is not committed' (which he was partly right but he used that excuse after they offered him a reported $100 million contract), then said he didn't like the city, then it was his back was hurtin on the hard vet turf even though he left a year (or was it two) before they moved into CBP. He's one of the best defensive 3rd baseman ever but overall he's a Hoyda who doesn't fit in this town.
He's had one good and two terrible years in the last three:
2005: 5 HR, 28 RBI, .235/.323/.383 (56 games)
2006: 22 HR, 95RBI, .296/.369/.518 (142 games)
2007: 8 HR, 58 RBI. ..265/.331/.398 (112 games)
So, to me:
1. He's mostly on the decline, at least offensively (will be 33 next year, one year younger than Lowell).
2. He's missed no less than 20 games in the last four years (also played 142 in 2004).
3. He's going to cost $12M per for three years.
4. The Cardinals have said that they're not going to take scraps for him.
That said, he's better than any third baseman currently wearing red pinstripes.
Moot
Rolen? No. Anyone who wants him to put on a Phillies uniform again should get violated with a battle axe.
Not only did he rip the city, but WHILE the city was behind him and supporting his stance against the FO, he dissed ALL of us when he was cheered on for a curtain call (after a big play or game, can't remember) and blew us all off by ignoring it.
And in his first game in Heaven, he obliged a curtain call.
He's a piece of shtein.
So, a recap... everyone here who is a Phillies fan except Wingspan hates Rolen and thinks it would be a colossally stupid idea to bring him back to Philly?
2 pitchers on the rumor mill are Randy Wolf and Bartolo Colon. :-\
1. Rolen is a Hoyda; farg him and farg Heaven
2. Colon would be Garcia and Millwood part two. No thanks.
3. Wolf? Mildly interested, but he cannot stay healthy. And he's a junkballer
4. Did I hear Gammons seemingly suggest that Lowell could come here? I would like that. Its obvious Rowand is gone, so they need a RH bat to helpout. Plus he's a good fielding 3B.
they have to replace Rowand's production from last year one way or another...Lowell would be perfect, it fills an offensive and defensive need, Gammons apparently said on ESPN that the Phils are "coming on strong"
I can deal with a Burrell/Victorino/Werth outfield if they signed Lowell.
A small part of me wants to take a chance on Prior. I know his shoulder is shot but he's still only 27. I wish they could get him cheap and make him prove he's still decent but that's totally unrealistic.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 14, 2007, 09:00:00 PM
So, a recap... everyone here who is a Phillies fan except Wingspan hates Rolen and thinks it would be a colossally stupid idea to bring him back to Philly?
Who said anything about bringing him back to philly? :-D
Hate him or no...when healthy, he's the best 3B in the NL.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on November 14, 2007, 10:11:00 PM
I can deal with a Burrell/Victorino/Werth outfield if they signed Lowell.
Definately. Although it would make the loss of Bourn sting a little more though.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on November 14, 2007, 10:11:00 PM
I can deal with a Burrell/Victorino/Werth outfield if they signed Lowell.
A small part of me wants to take a chance on Prior. I know his shoulder is shot but he's still only 27. I wish they could get him cheap and make him prove he's still decent but that's totally unrealistic.
I'd take a shot on Prior...a minor league or non-guaranteed ML deal, sure.
I don't like that OF. I still would like to deal Burrell...the time is now. He played well. But he has to approve the NTC and I dont see him doing that, but hopefully they try
Lowell wanted to stay in Boston, so if the Phillies are "coming on strong," they are obviously going to grossly overpay for him. This will be a contract that will undoubtedly kill the payroll in it's last 3 years, ala Pat Burrell, but I like the idea that they are going for it for these next few years. Rollins and Utley are 28, Howard is 27; they are all in their prime. Why the farg not try to win it now, and by win it, I mean find a way to choke.
Quote from: Wingspan on November 14, 2007, 10:27:16 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 14, 2007, 09:00:00 PM
So, a recap... everyone here who is a Phillies fan except Wingspan hates Rolen and thinks it would be a colossally stupid idea to bring him back to Philly?
Who said anything about bringing him back to philly? :-D
Hate him or no...when healthy, he's the best 3B in the NL.
So you're saying he's the best 3B in the NL and have defended and justified his actions against the team, the fans, and the city of Philadelphia but there's no way you want him back in Philly?
I see.
I noticed this quote by Phreak's favorite GM-In-Waiting and got a chuckle out of it:
Quote"I know it's become mode to talk about other teams' players, but we are not in that mode," said Phils assistant GM Ruben Amaro Jr.
Buster Olney was just on 950am (reported on PhilaPhans) and said the Phillies have offered Lowell 4 years for 48-50 million
...which means he can and will take 3 years for 40 million from Boston.
Quote from: SunMo on November 15, 2007, 01:10:18 PM
Buster Olney was just on 950am (reported on PhilaPhans) and said the Phillies have offered Lowell 4 years for 48-50 million
haha...this is funny cause in the last 10 minutes on wip cuz and steve are like rumors are "floating around" that the phils have made an offer to lowell
Quote from: SunMo on November 15, 2007, 01:10:18 PM
Buster Olney was just on 950am (reported on PhilaPhans) and said the Phillies have offered Lowell 4 years for 48-50 million
That's a reasonable deal and if they get him for that much I'd consider it a very good signing.
Four teams top Boston offer for Lowell
Thursday, Nov 15, 2007 2:09 EST
A Boston television station and the Boston Globe are reporting that four teams, the Atlanta Braves, Anaheim Angels, St. Louis Cardinals, and New York Yankees, have each offered Boston Red Sox free agent third baseman Mike Lowell a four-year contract worth between $55 million and $60 million, exceeding the Sox' three-year proposal.
St. Louis?!?
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 15, 2007, 02:39:30 PM
St. Louis?!?
Why would they do that when Scott Rolen is the best third baseman ever?!? WINGSPAN?!?!!
Reading comprehension is a lost art, eh?
I said originally "when healthy, Rolen is the best 3B in the NL."
Two things:
1) He's never healthy.
2) Lowell is a better all around 3B than Rolen, without question.
Either was, Lowell is not winding up in STL...no way they sign Lowell without knowing that Rolen has an out. He;s not going to be on the yankee's radar either (realistically), unless he wants to play 1B. (If A-rod goes back to the yanks as reported.
The phils signing Lowell would make up for the Lidge trade.
No.
Atlanta?
FYI, Lidge has a press conference in about 45 mins on CSN
Also the Reading Phillies changed their logo to the cool new "R-Phils" ::) and one of their alternate uniforms is the powder blue from the 70s and 80s
R-Phils? Jesus, even minor league athletes need to be shot in the head.
yea that's really lame, but it's Reading, so what do you expect
watch yo mouth fool. reading represent.
Quote from: MDS on November 15, 2007, 03:31:55 PM
yea that's really lame, but it's Reading, so what do you expect
Puerto Ricans?
three headed babies
Cocaine.
poor people
more Yocco's Hot Dog Stands than there should be in a town that big
Don't hate on Reading. It used to not be a dump.
Quote
Posted on Thu, Nov. 15, 2007
Who's On Third? Gillick to stand pat
By Todd Zolecki
INQUIRER STAFF WRITER
Pat Gillick said today the Phillies are not in the market for a third baseman.
His word comes after an espn.com report said the Phillies plan to make a lucrative multiyear offer to free-agent third baseman Mike Lowell.
"We're concentrating on pitching right now," Gillick said at Citizens Bank Park, where the Phillies introduced closer Brad Lidge.
Phillies assistant general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said earlier this week that the money the Phillies have left to spend has been earmarked almost entirely for pitching.
Has that changed?
"No," Gillick said. "Why would it change?"
Perhaps because the Phillies received an increase in payroll?
"No," he said. "That hasn't changed. We're still concentrating on pitching. We prefer a starter and a bullpen piece. We'd prefer the starter."
Oh, goodie.
So, let's recap:
1. The Phillies lose Aaron Rowand, Michael Bourn and don't upgrade at third base.
2. The Phillies move Victorino to center and then have a platoon in right of Werth/X Man.
3. They possibly upgrade the pitching staff by acquiring Lidge and moving Myers back to the rotation.
4. They further look to get "more" pitching despite the fact that there is an almost complete lack of pitching that forced them to deal for Lidge and move Myers back to the rotation. Meanwhile there are scads of position players both in the outfield (CF in particular including Rowand) plus Lowell & other third basemen who could be had via trade.
Got it. NO PITCHING available so they go after pitching in a thin market. Lots of position players available especially at positions of need - but no dice.
Phillies Baseball - catch it!
PS: The Yankees have spent more to sign a catcher, a closer and a third baseman in terms of payroll than several other teams spend on their entire 2008 payrolls. Whoopie.
don't pay too much attention to that Romey...he said Myers would stay in the bullpen a few days before he traded for Lidge.
if true, it's a terrible mistake, but i don't think it's true. the rumor they made an offer for Lowell came from too many sources.
I had a few beers at the bar watching the Flyers tonight but not enough to get truly shtein-faced.
In other words, I didn't go the distance.
Me = Philadelphia Phillies
forget the phillies...
you = philadelphia sports
Living off past glories and just coming up short?
Yeah - that about covers it.
the only thing im mad about is 3rd base. getting rid of rowand and replacing him with a werth/probably jenkins platoon will suffice. they need an upgrade at 3rd, or, they need another top of the line starter. they get that, who cares about getting more offense.
theres like six teams bidding for lowell and two of them are the red sox and the yankees....there is absolutely no chance they sign lowell
The more I hear about Lowell signing elsewhere the more I hope the bums pay Rowand. And I hope Gillick doesn't really think this is an upgrade:
QuoteLieber could re-sign with Phillies, agent says
After injury-curtailed '07, pitcher believes he's not finished
By SCOTT LAUBER, The News Journal
Posted Friday, November 16, 2007
The Phillies tried to trade Jon Lieber before the 2007 season but couldn't. He made just 12 starts before incurring a season-ending foot injury June 23.
News Journal file/GINGER WALL
PHILADELPHIA -- When Jon Lieber underwent season-ending surgery on his right foot July 6, it was widely presumed his Phillies career had ended.
Maybe not.
With the Phillies shopping for another starter to add depth to their rotation, Lieber's agent said Thursday the 37-year-old right-hander wants to pitch in 2008 and hasn't ruled out re-signing with the Phillies.
"I know he's not happy, at this point in his career, with how things ended last year," said Rex Gary, who represents Lieber and new Phillies closer Brad Lidge. "He wants to show somebody, wherever it is, that he's the pitcher he was when the Phillies signed him."
Assistant general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said the Phillies would be open to discussing a deal with Lieber, although Gary declined to say if Lieber would be willing to sign a one-year contract with a low base salary and significant performance bonuses.
Lieber signed a three-year, $21 million contract with the Phillies before the 2005 season and went 17-13 with a 4.20 ERA that year. But he went 12-17 with a 4.87 ERA over the past two seasons, and the Phillies tried to trade him last winter. Lieber made just 12 starts last season before rupturing a tendon in his right foot June 23 at Cleveland.
Freeing Iguchi
The Phillies released second baseman Tadahito Iguchi, making him a free agent. Iguchi's initial contract with the Chicago White Sox allowed him to elect free agency after his third season in the majors. The Phillies almost certainly will lose Iguchi but won't receive draft-pick compensation.
"He thinks he can get a second base job someplace," general manager Pat Gillick said, "and he and his agent are probably correct in that assumption."
Unwounded knee
Nearly seven weeks after having surgery to fix torn cartilage in his right knee, Lidge walked with one crutch Thursday. He said he'll be cleared to shed crutches next week and will begin his annual offseason throwing program on schedule in the first week in January.
Lidge, acquired last week from Houston in a five-player trade, will wear No. 54.
Inside pitches
If the Phils don't re-sign free-agent center fielder Aaron Rowand, Gillick said they'll look for a lefty-hitting outfielder to split time in right field with Jayson Werth. Greg Dobbs and newly acquired Eric Bruntlett also can play the outfield. ... Ace lefty Cole Hamels received two third-place votes in the NL Cy Young Award balloting.
Contact Scott Lauber at slauber@delawareonline.com.
Good God. They'd better not re-sign Leiber. :puke
I was this close. THIS CLOSE!
(http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/1992/1010234fw2.jpg)
I should have capped him when I had the chance.
Lieber > Eaton? Close call.
Quote from: FastFreddie on November 16, 2007, 09:16:30 AM
Lieber > Eaton? Close call.
Put them both out of their misery.
There is no point in signing Lieber. He is Eaton. But fatter.
lieber? please god, NO!
farg Lieber.
MDS' boy Hayes is off the Phils beat (Deitch too from Delco)...whats the scoop on that MDS? Did your boy piss someone off again?
I could snoop around and find out. From what I've heard everyone pretty much likes Marcus, so this wasn't about him being a fleshpopface and getting booted off. But I will inquire.
howard eskin reporting jimmy has won the mvp
Rob Neyer (ESPN) had a chat about it around noon and thought it would be David Wright.
I replied that I thought he should stop blowing little boys. Surprisingly my reply was never posted in the live chat.
It's official. (http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071120&content_id=2304717&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb)
Rollins wins MVP.
Rollins = 353 (16 1st place, 7 2nd, 4 3rd)
Holliday = 336 (11 1st place, 18 2nd, 1 3rd)
Fielder = 284 (5 1st place, 6 2nd, 17 3rd)
Howard finished 5th, Utley 8th
he actually got 4 fourth place votes and 1 fifth...gay
good stuff, definitely deserved it since he's a skill postion guy who put up sick #'s while being a gold glove at SS.
ha...Carlos Marmol got at 10th place vote
All that's left is for Eaton to be awarded his much deserved Cy Young.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on November 20, 2007, 02:08:59 PM
All that's left is for Eaton to be awarded his much deserved Cy Young coffin.
Quote from: SunMo on November 20, 2007, 02:05:51 PM
he actually got 4 fourth place votes and 1 fifth...gay
Like I said, a fag like David Wright got consideration from three of those queers and he had no business being anywhere near the top.
It's a meaningless award but it's still nice for Jimmy to have received it.
Two straight MVP's. Any chance they could actually win a ring next time instead?
No.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 20, 2007, 02:11:56 PMAny chance they could actually win a ring next time instead?
No.
Here's a link to the official tabulation by the BBWAA:
http://www.baseballwriters.org/awards/2007/2007_NL_mvp.html (http://www.baseballwriters.org/awards/2007/2007_NL_mvp.html)
david wright? farg him.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 20, 2007, 02:17:49 PM
Here's a link to the official tabulation by the BBWAA:
http://www.baseballwriters.org/awards/2007/2007_NL_mvp.html (http://www.baseballwriters.org/awards/2007/2007_NL_mvp.html)
that background is really easy on the eyes if you wanna sit back, relax, and read some baseball stats.
Aaron Rowand with an 8th place vote!
is this considered a title in philly?
Quote from: MDS on November 20, 2007, 06:06:34 PM
is this considered a title in philly?
That would make us back to back champs
Don't forget the home run derbies!
What, noone reporting about the Phils acquiring Chris Snelling from the Devil Rays??? :o
We still got 3 months until spring training so let's try and pace ourselves, mkay?
Who?
their fourth outfielder...don't worry, they only gave up cash, their most prized prospect
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on November 20, 2007, 09:10:31 PM
Who?
(http://media.scout.com/Media/Minor_League_Baseball/371383_snelling.JPG)
World Series!
I see the Chuck LaMar hiring is finally paying off.
QuoteChris has always had a great bat, but he has battled some injuries in the past," Phillies assistant general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said. "We feel he will be healthy this coming year and adds a lefthanded hitter and some depth to our outfield."
"some injuries"
Broken left hand; and ligament damage in his left wrist (2000); a stress fracture in his right ankle (2001), a broken right thumb and blown-out left knee (2002), more problems with his left knee (2003) and deep bone bruise in his right wrist (2004). Then problems to his right knee, which knocked him out last season. That's almost one big injury a season this decade
He looks retarded. Seriously.
Snelling was signed out of Australia in 1999 by the Mariners. Gillick luvs him sum ex-Mariners
Dayn Perry's latest "gem" about the NL MVP (part of this article (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7470516?CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=49) about the award winners):
QuoteThis is certainly the award with the most crowded field, and that means a compelling debate.
With that being said, Rollins was not the guy. Not even close. Rollins is a smart, hard-working ballplayer and a good leader, and he's got baseball skills for days. However, he's not the MVP. He didn't deserve to win the Gold Glove at short (is it too much to ask that we make this award about, you know, actual defensive ability?), and his power numbers were aided greatly by his home park, which has been the best power environment in all of baseball throughout its brief existence. Rollins' OBP of .344 is also nothing special considering the context.
As for Holliday, the runner-up, he had without question a great season. However, his numbers were inflated by Coors Field, and he played a non-premium defensive position.
Prince Fielder? The best power hitter in the NL, but his defense at first base (also a non-premium position) left much to be desired. That's overshadowed by his production with the bat, but it still matters.
If the award were about offense and offense only, then Hanley Ramirez would be the runaway winner. However, his defense is so brutal at short that it knocks him down a peg or three.
So all things considered, here's who should have wo it: David Wright of the Mets.
On the year, Wright authored a batting line of .325 AVG/.416 OBP/.546 SLG with 74 extra-base hits, all while playing his home games in a park that's quite tough on right-handed batters. Throw in his Gold Glove defense and his 34 steals in 39 attempts, and you've got an MVP season. It's also worth noting that Wright hit like a house afire down the stretch (.394 AVG/.516 OBP/.657 SLG in August and .352 AVG/.432 OBP/.602 SLG in September/October), even as the rest of the team fell apart. He also delivered in clutch situations: Wright batted .310 with runners in scoring position, .332 with runners on, .346 in "close and late" situations, .375 when the score was tied, .353 when the margin was one run, and .366 when the margin was two runs. Heck, Wright even slugged a robust .614 in games against the rival Phillies this season. When it came to producing in the clutch, Wright this year was better than Rollins, Holliday and Fielder. Overall, once you correct for home park and positional scarcity, Wright has better offensive numbers than anyone in the NL except for Ramirez. Once defense is taken into account, Wright easily moves past Ramirez in terms of overall value.
In other words, no matter how you slice the numbers, Wright was a better player in 2007 than Rollins or Holliday or Fielder or anyone else in the National League. As indicated in the brief discussion above, if you choose not to give the award to the best player in the league — Wright, who put up the best numbers and delivered in the clutch — in favor of an inferior player who happened to have better teammates, then you're penalizing said best player for things beyond his control. That doesn't make any sense.
That's also why David Wright, without question, should have been the NL MVP.
:-D
dayn perry is a classic seamhead from the billy beane school of baseball...he used to write for baseball prospectus.....in short hes a farging moron
i can't believe how many people even have wright in the conversation, everything i'm seeing is pro-wright over rollins instead of holliday.
wright finished exactly where he should have.
Who farging cares what those stat geeks have to say? None of them ever picked up a bat or put a glove on past little league anyway. Let them analyze statistical minutia until their blue in their pasty, pimply, four-eyed faces. Bottom line is Rollins produced historic numbers on offense while leading off most games and at the same time performed at a gold glove-level at arguably the most difficult position in the field. He was also the unquestioned leader of a team that didn't collapse like a salvation army suit down the stretch. In fact, he carried his team for vast stretches of a season where the other two legitimate MVP candidates on the team were hurt or mired in long slumps.
I've said in the past that postseason awards are nothing more than self-congratulatory popularity contests and I still believe that. That said, if anyone deserves a "most valuable" award, it's Rollins, because without him the Phillies were a sub-.500 baseball team.
did these dingbats forget that the farging mets choked their coke snorting eyes out? farg new york.
Dingbats? Ok, gramps.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 21, 2007, 09:45:16 AM
He was also the unquestioned leader of a team that didn't collapse like a salvation army suit down the stretch.
I don't know what that means.
Quote from: rjs246 on November 21, 2007, 01:37:44 PM
Dingbats? Ok, gramps.
(http://gallery.allinthefamilysit.com/albums/userpics/10001/carroll%20as%20archie%20bunker.jpg)
Stop.
The Phils signed Brandon Watson (http://sports.espn.go.com/minorlbb/news/story?id=2906668) for Lehigh Valley
The Angels signed Torii Hunter to a five year/90 million dollar deal.
Insane.
bye bye Aaron
it sounds like the Phillies are going to sign Randy Wolf, probably friday
Hunter's contract is a joke. Wow.
Wolf? How much are they going to pay for a guy to hang out on the DL?
Probably at least $8 mill a year
wake me up when someone finds a free agent deal that isnt a joke
http://philadelphia.phillies.mlb.com/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20071127&content_id=2312400&vkey=pr_phi&fext=.jsp&c_id=phi
If the phils brought him back, that probably means he is recovering from a tracheotomy.
Does this mean less of Hairpiece?
never
the press release does refer to him as a color commentator...that should cut his word totals down a little bit...and hopefully he does more radio this year
Hopefully he ingests rat poison this year. Lots of it.
QuotePhils claim pitcher off waivers
By SCOTT LAUBER, The News Journal
Posted Wednesday, November 28, 2007 at 3:33 pm
PHILADELPHIA -- In their continued search for pitching, the Phillies turned to the waiver wire today and claimed left-hander Shane Youman from the Pittsburgh Pirates.
Youman, 28, went 3-5 with a 5.97 ERA in 16 games (eight starts) last season for the Pirates and was roughed up for 10 earned runs in six innings (15.00 ERA) over two appearances against the Phillies.
But he was more effective out of the bullpen for Pittsburgh, going 1-0 with a 3.54 ERA in 10 career relief appearances, and he's had success in the minors (26-17, 3.37 ERA) since being selected in the 43rd round of the 2001 draft.
Youman was designated for assignment last week by the Pirates
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on November 28, 2007, 04:15:54 PM
QuotePhils claim pitcher off waivers
By SCOTT LAUBER, The News Journal
Posted Wednesday, November 28, 2007 at 3:33 pm
PHILADELPHIA -- In their continued search for pitching, the Phillies turned to the waiver wire today and claimed left-hander Shane Youman from the Pittsburgh Pirates.
Youman, 28, went 3-5 with a 5.97 ERA in 16 games (eight starts) last season for the Pirates and was roughed up for 10 earned runs in six innings (15.00 ERA) over two appearances against the Phillies.
But he was more effective out of the bullpen for Pittsburgh, going 1-0 with a 3.54 ERA in 10 career relief appearances, and he's had success in the minors (26-17, 3.37 ERA) since being selected in the 43rd round of the 2001 draft.
Youman was designated for assignment last week by the Pirates
If you can't beat them, join 'em.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on November 28, 2007, 04:15:54 PM
Quote
he was more effective out of the bullpen....10 career relief appearances,
He'll be an innings eater for the Lehigh Valley Iron Pigs.
FINALLY a philadelphia team does something right with uniforms...phillies third uniforms for next year are from what they wore in the 40's...i already ahve this hat and always wanted a jersey but could never bring myself to pay 400 bucks for the m&n and could never find it cheaper....count me in on one of these...
butta joints
(http://philadelphia.phillies.mlb.com/images/2007/11/29/S2UTaOJG.jpg)
The hats are pure excrement.
The uniforms aren't bad.
$$$$$
(http://ak.buy.com/db_assets/prod_lrg_images/159/201184159.jpg)
horrendous. Thats a closet ornament at best
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 29, 2007, 01:05:06 PM
$$$$$
They look like something Lucy would steal from Charlie Brown after she beat the piss out of him.
Horrible, IGY. Just aw-ful.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 29, 2007, 12:47:35 PM
FINALLY a philadelphia team does something right with uniforms...phillies third uniforms for next year are from what they wore in the 40's...i already ahve this hat and always wanted a jersey but could never bring myself to pay 400 bucks for the m&n and could never find it cheaper....count me in on one of these...
butta joints
(http://philadelphia.phillies.mlb.com/images/2007/11/29/S2UTaOJG.jpg)
Excellent
here's what i'm talking about:
(http://www.onthefield.com/prodimg/b1279.jpg)
^^^
top 10 all time jersey....i have two of them
give me one
The baby blues are definitely top notch. It angers me when sports geeks lump them in with the Astros jerseys of the 1970's as examples of horrible sports apparel.
Those things were classic just as the Sixers solid red uni's were excellent. Hell, all of the Philly teams had great uniforms in the '70s.
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 29, 2007, 02:10:02 PM
^^^
top 10 all time jersey....i have two of them
Same, a Schmidt I wear on occasion and an autographed Carlton one I have framed.
Quote from: SD_Eagle on November 29, 2007, 03:17:19 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on November 29, 2007, 02:10:02 PM
^^^
top 10 all time jersey....i have two of them
Same, a Schmidt I wear on occasion and an autographed Carlton one I have framed.
yikes you got me beat....i got a schmidt that i rock and a size XXS no nameplate that has a combination of mustard and snot stains on it
Quote from: SunMo on November 29, 2007, 02:29:25 PM
give me one
guess which one you get
You're not truly rocking the 1970s threads until you answer this question:
Zipper or buttons?
Quote from: Geowhizzer on November 29, 2007, 03:41:53 PM
You're not truly rocking the 1970s threads until you answer this question:
Zipper or buttons?
zipper front was rocked off an on all the way till 86 i believe...im not a big fan of the zipper
white people look stupid in baseball jerseys.
Quote from: MDS on November 29, 2007, 05:46:36 PM
white people look stupid in baseball jerseys.
60% of MLB players are caucasian, Enos.
so long as you have the hat, glove and matching pants, it fits. it the goofy white guy with the jersey with jeans or khaki shorts that looks stupid.
still, there is nothing worse than white people wearing basketball jerseys. white people really suck.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 29, 2007, 06:00:20 PM
Quote from: MDS on November 29, 2007, 05:46:36 PM
white people look stupid in baseball jerseys.
60% of MLB players are caucasian, Enos.
You realize that you're helping to prove his point, right?
Quote from: rjs246 on November 30, 2007, 07:20:22 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on November 29, 2007, 06:00:20 PM
Quote from: MDS on November 29, 2007, 05:46:36 PM
white people look stupid in baseball jerseys.
60% of MLB players are caucasian, Enos.
You realize that you're helping to prove his point, right?
Shylock pays me to help him.
Looks like Randy Wolf is going to sign with the Padres instead
QuoteThe very first person to arrive at Livan Hernandez's agent's door -- literally at Greg Genske's office door in Newport Beach, Calif. -- at the onset of the free-agent period was Philadelphia Phillies general manager Pat Gillick.
Conceivably, Hernandez would fit into the Phillies' rotation after Cole Hamels and Brett Myers and ahead of Jamie Moyer and Kyle Kendrick, which still leaves the issue of what to do with Adam Eaton. Gillick's acquisition of Brad Lidge, which moved Myers back into the rotation, certainly lessened the Phillies' urgency for a starter.
Got it from the Phils MB...
I'd like it.
QuoteConceivably, Hernandez would fit into the Phillies' rotation after Cole Hamels and Brett Myers and ahead of Jamie Moyer and Kyle Kendrick, which still leaves the issue of what to do with Adam Eaton. Gillick's acquisition of Brad Lidge, which moved Myers back into the rotation, certainly lessened the Phillies' urgency for a starter.
(http://www.arrowgiftshop.com/media/800-4601-Old-Tex-Rifle.jpg)
Need something a little more up to date Geo
(http://www.soldf.com/images/s_psg90_2.jpg)
I'm a history teacher, remember. 8)
(http://www.snowshoemen.com/Musket_75_English_flint_B34_full.jpg)
(http://www.accessexcellence.org/WN/NM/images/Ebola.jpg)
(It's ebola, you idiots.)
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 03, 2007, 08:51:35 PM
(http://www.accessexcellence.org/WN/NM/images/Ebola.jpg)
(It's ebola, you idiots.)
i thought it was a mickey mouse balloon
Minnie Mouse's balloon knot?
Iguchi willing to play 3rd, Gillick wants to get it done. If it's for 1-2 years, it's smart. Otherwise, committing long term to a pretty average guy who wasn't spectacular at 2nd and probably can't play 3rd is stoopid.
I'm surprised he hasn't gotten more interest from teams at 2nd base. Regardless, he gives you another versatile infielder and hit well when he was traded here.
Iguchi>>>>>>Dobbs/Helms/Bruntlett
I would like to see him back. I like his plate approach. He's a pretty solid glove guy too
From Ken Rosenthal (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7524642?CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=49):
QuoteThe Phillies are one of the teams interested in free-agent right-hander Kris Benson, who is expected to throw for teams in Phoenix around Dec. 17. Benson, 33, underwent surgery last March to repair a partially torn rotator cuff. The Orioles declined the $7.5 million option on his contract, preferring to pay him a $500,000 buyout instead.
His wife and the Philly media? Especially if (once) the fans turn on him?
Gold.
Todd Zolecki (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/phillies/20071204_Phillies_still_hoping_for_help_on_the_mound.html) also says Benson is a good bet, once the Phils watch him throw.
Here's his possibilities in a rundown:
QuoteThe Phillies have interest in free-agent righthander Kris Benson, according to a team source, but they want to see him throw first. They are expected to watch him later this month to make sure he has fully recovered from shoulder surgery, which forced him to miss the entire 2007 season.
QuoteGillick said the Phillies had no interest in Garcia or Lieber, but would not rule out Colon, Jennings or Benson. The Phillies clearly have some interest in Benson. They also have contacted Colon's agent.
QuoteSo word that the Texas Rangers might be looking to deal third baseman Hank Blalock can't totally be dismissed, although the Phillies are reluctant to trade top prospects like Carlos Carrasco and Josh Outman and Gillick said finding position-player help has been pushed to the side to accommodate their need for pitching.
QuoteKyle Lohse and Carlos Silva remain on the market, but Gillick said "we'd go more than two years on some guys, but you get into four and five we've got a little bit of a problem with that."
QuoteThe Phillies had targeted lefthander Randy Wolf, who just agreed to a one-year contract with the San Diego Padres. Gillick seemed perturbed with the way things evolved with Wolf.
QuoteThe Phillies aren't expected to make a play for any of the stud pitchers who could be available via trade - Johan Santana, Dontrelle Willis, Erik Bedard, Dan Haren or Joe Blanton - because it would require too much top talent in return, and the Phillies don't have much to give. Livan Hernandez does not seem to be high on their list. Pitchers like Anthony Reyes or Julian Tavarez could be had in a trade.
Paul Hagen (http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/phillies/20071204_Phillies_-_Rowand_not_out_of_picture.html) says Phils aren't out of the Rowand picture yet.
QuoteThe Phillies, meanwhile, are believed to be willing to overpay for a 3-year deal. And there is some thought that, all things being equal, he'd like to return.
Also mentioned in that article:
QuoteWhile the word on the baseball grapevine is that the Seattle Mariners are the front-runners for righthander Hiroki Kuroda, of Japan's Hiroshima Carp, reportedly increasing their offer to $44 million for 4 years, the Phillies haven't completely given up on signing the star Japanese free agent. The Dodgers, Diamondbacks, Cubs and Royals are also thought to have serious interest.
hagen is a farging idiot
if the money is right i think taking a chance on benson is a good move
Benson isn't much of an upgrade over Eaton. And I don't care what his wife looks like she's the most annoying bitch on the planet.
Ann Coulter says "hi".
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 05, 2007, 08:43:37 AM
Ann Coulter says "hi".
There aren't enough >'s to describe Anna Benson vs. Ann Coulter.
Same goes for Kris Benson and Adam Eaton.
Quote from: FastFreddie on December 05, 2007, 09:30:03 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 05, 2007, 08:43:37 AM
Ann Coulter says "hi".
There aren't enough >'s to describe Anna Benson vs. Ann Coulter.
Same goes for Kris Benson and Adam Eaton.
:-D :-D :-D
Serious rumors all over the place about Bedard/Tejada for Victorino/Kendrick + prospects. It's been on WIP apparently as well.
I would ejaculate all over myself if that went down.
That leaves a giant hole in the OF, but Bedard > Kendrick and the offense wouldn't need much else. Probably would have to sign Rowand and then go with a Jenkins/Werth platoon in RF.
Rollins
Tejada
Utley
Howard
Burrell
Rowand
RF
Ruiz
P
Hamels
Myers
Bedard
Geezer
Eaton?
Jizz.
i havent heard anything about that on wip...probably because its completely made up...the phillies dont have the prospects to get that deal done...
for example the mets have offered heilman....gomez and humber for just bedard
victorino kendrick and lets say carrasco for berard AND tejada
not happening
it would be ridiculous....the phillies would have to really screw up to not make the world series if that happened...when something is to good to be true it usually is
Or, Tejada and Bedard aren't as good as you think and would bust as Phillies anyway.
The WIP thing was second-hand knowledge reported on different boards, IGY. Since I wouldn't listen to it unless someone had a gun pointed at my meatcicle, I wouldn't know if it was talked about there.
As far as what package of players the Phillies are offering, Victorino & Kendrick are both the centerpieces but the minor league talent wasn't disclosed. I would guess at least two or three of their top ten prospects would be included considering Victorino is mediocre and Kendrick is as well.
That's why they call it the hot stove, though. More bullshtein spills over than not.
Oh, and the thinking behind Tejada is strictly a salary move. No one wants to pay that. The understanding I have is that any team who wants Bedard HAS to take Tejada and his lotto contract.
Gillick says the Phils are out of the Kuroda bidding but they might bring Glendon Rusch in as a non-roster invitee. WORLD SERIES!
Glendon Rusch > Adam Eaton
Travis Blackley - Philadelphia Phillie (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travis_Blackley)
QuoteSelected MLB statistics
(through September 29, 2007)
Win-Loss 1-3
Earned Run Average 7.27
Strikeouts 21
World..Series
They also took Lincoln Holdzkom from Boston. He was a former Marlins draft pick that had Tommy John surgery 3 yrs ago. Both guys will be in the mix for bullpen spots. If they don't stay in the majors all year, they go back to their former teams.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 06, 2007, 11:13:45 AM
Travis Blackley - Philadelphia Phillie (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travis_Blackley)
NSFW wifey pics (http://www.sinfulcurves.com/Link/SP1/PL2ArynneTiller.html)
their wedding on YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BaFN1DAIpcg)
another YouTube clip of the wedding (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ck8z8xhAjI)
i googled lincoln holdzkom to see what he looks like and the second pic to come up was this beaut
(http://www.cantstopthebleeding.com/img/lastings0807.jpg)
Arynne Tiller: A review:
Weird first name: Check!
Stamp tramp: Check!
Pierced bellybutton: Check!
Nice fake titties: Check!
Bleach blonde hairdo: Check!
Shaved Hoyda: Check!!!
Looks like she's the ideal major league slut. Welcome aboard, Travis!
her + Anna Benson (if they sign Kris, which id doubtful, but still) + Wheels = greatest moment in sports broadcasting history
Quote from: BigEd76 on December 06, 2007, 12:38:23 PM
NSFW wifey pics (http://www.sinfulcurves.com/Link/SP1/PL2ArynneTiller.html)
You know, I hate to nitpick, but if you're going to wax your chach and get some implants and pose nude the least you can do is ice down those nipples for the photo shoot.
Looks like free agent Aaron Rowand's pretty serious about leaving town. The Phillies slugger and wife Marianne listed their six-bedroom colonial in Garnet
Valley, Delaware County, for $985,000 12 days ago.
The couple bought the 6,750-square-foot house in February 2006 for $799,000 and according to the listing with Long & Foster, in Media, have added $200,000 in "additional features." That means they're listing it for a loss, and seemingly in a hurry to sell.
The house on a cul-de-sac features a 42-inch wood-burning fireplace with marble surround speaker system for the plasma TV. Among rooms is a conservatory, though Prof. Plum and the lead pipe are not included. Phillies GM Pat Gillick said last week it was "a long shot" the team would come to an agreement with the centerfielder, who is looking for a deal of at least five years.
Wow - imagine that... listing a house in December 2007 for a "loss" in comparison to what they paid for it in February 2006.
Considering the residential real estate market is in near free-fall right now, I'd say that certainly qualifies as a shocker.
what a loser. playing in the bigs and doesn't even have a house worth a mil. bye loser. you big stupid loser.
Iguchi signed a 1-yr deal with the Padres
Giants sign Rowand to a 5 year deal...
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/12/12/SP4ETSURO.DTL
unless Gillick pulls a trade out of his ass, this might be a 3rd place team next year
QuoteTerms of the deal were not disclosed, although the value of Rowand's contract was believed to have approached the five-year, $90 million package that Torii Hunter, another free-agent center fielder, recently received from the Los Angeles Angels.
funny how the phils would only go three years and rowand gets a five year deal
wonder what the money is
between 80 and 90 million
So, is the phils big acquisition still on crutches?
sigh...
thats a killer contract for rowand. phillies would have been stupid to match it.
Losing Rowand hurts bad enough. Losing him to a divisional is a kick to the nuts.
And to add insult to injury, Ed Wade pulled of a deal to bring Miguel Tejada to Houston. WTF?
Quote from: MDS on December 12, 2007, 04:27:42 PM
thats a killer contract for rowand. phillies would have been stupid to match it.
i don't disagree with that...but they still need to get someone to replace those numbers.
they still only won 89 games last year and needed a huge collapse from the Mets to win the division...
Sarge...the Giants aren't in the Phillies division you moron
Quote from: Sgt PSN on December 12, 2007, 04:31:19 PM
Losing Rowand hurts bad enough. Losing him to a divisional is a kick to the nuts.
Rowand is gonna look great catching passes from Eli Manning.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on December 12, 2007, 04:31:19 PM
And to add insult to injury, Ed Wade pulled of a deal to bring Miguel Tejada to Houston. WTF?
Stand Pat (actually tejada is not as good as he once was and i would stick with rollins over tejada anyway...that said...the phils are run by idiots.)
Quote from: MDS on December 12, 2007, 04:27:42 PM
thats a killer contract for rowand. phillies would have been stupid to match it.
if you care about money its smart...if you care about winning its stupid
you cant always say how every philly team would be stupid to over pay for players then complain that they dont win championships
im not saying they would win the world series with aaron rowand but they 100% for sure are not going to win it without him (or a suitable replacement)
Rowand's contract is probably ridiculous and I wouldn't mind losing him so much if the money the bums didn't pay him was used to sign someone else. The whole 'there was no one else out there' excuse should be making the rounds shortly
As it stands right now, the phils lineup is this:
Rollins
Victorino
Utley
Howard
Burrell
Dobbs/Helms
Werth/Roberson
Ruiz/Coste
and defensively you have
C- Ruiz
1B Howard
2B Utley
SS Rollins
3B Platoon Helms/Dobbs
RF Platoon Werth/Roberson
CF Victorino
LF Burrell (w/ Werth/Roberson coming in 8th and 9th innings)
God help this team if ANYONE goes on the DL
God help this team anyway with that lineup....Chris Roberson getting regular at bats? awful
The Giants will be ruing that contract for years to come.
I like Rowand as much as anyone but five years and ninety million goddamn dollars for him is retarded. And yeah, I know it's not MY MONEY they're using, but for God's sake, when second-tier players like Rowand start getting contracts like that, it's bad for the entire sport and it makes signing anyone of merit that much more difficult.
you do know romey that next year there are going to be five more rowands getting even bigger contracts...and that its been like this since free agency started...if youre a team like the phillies you can pay for rowand and go for a title in the next five years or you can pay for werth and roberson or some other scrub that costs a lot less and hope the mets collapse again
Burrell
Dobbs/Helms
Werth/Roberson
Ruiz/Coste
yikes
then when he gets that kind of loot and shteins the bed the following year--like most Philly athletes, everyone bitches.
people are going to bitch if someone shteins the bed no matter what...id rather bitch about aaron rowand sucking than chris roberson or jayson werth
actually, the money from the inital report is wrong...it's only 60 mil over 5 years, 12 per year
so that means the Phils must not have come off their insistence for 3 years, because i can't believe he wouldn't have stayed for 4 years.
assuming that's true, they offered Lowell a longer contract than Rowand...stupid.
they receive 2 compensatory draft picks in exchange
Quote from: SunMo on December 12, 2007, 04:33:02 PM
Sarge...the Giants aren't in the Phillies division you moron
ha! football, baseball........same difference
Quote from: Sgt PSN on December 12, 2007, 04:31:19 PM
And to add insult to injury, Ed Wade pulled of a deal to bring Miguel Tejada to Houston. WTF?
I'm an Astros fan and it's not even that good of a deal. Obviously bringing in someone who is capable of hitting at SS after years of Adam Everett is a huge upgrade, but Wade dealt their best prospect Troy Patton and a guy who appeared to be a stud Dennis Sarfate. The Astros had a bunch of young pitching coming in (Fernando Nieve, Troy Patton, Matt Albers, Taylor Buchholz, Jason Hirsh, Dennis Sarfate) and now it's
all gone. Awesome trade for Jason Jennings last year too.
Quote from: Wingspan on December 12, 2007, 04:33:25 PM
Stand Pat (actually tejada is not as good as he once was and i would stick with rollins over tejada anyway...that said...the phils are run by idiots.)
I wouldn't want Tejada at SS, I would put him at 3rd. But I didn't make the statement because the Phils didn't get him but more so because Wade has been the GM of Houston for a couple months and addressed a need for the Astros. Where was all that when he was here? Maybe he was handcuffed by ownership not wanting to spend money....I dunno.
Quote from: SunMo on December 12, 2007, 05:06:55 PM
actually, the money from the inital report is wrong...it's only 60 mil over 5 years, 12 per year
so that means the Phils must not have come off their insistence for 3 years, because i can't believe he wouldn't have stayed for 4 years.
assuming that's true, they offered Lowell a longer contract than Rowand...stupid.
They're a buncha idiots. But we already know that...
They were willing to overpay for a 3yr deal, but they won't go 5yrs at all. I would love to know what these fools are thinking. I like that Gillick is insistent upon not giving out FNTC's and is cautious when it comes to signing some players.
Romey; the Phillies will rue losing Rowand more than the Giants will rue paying him that money. Book that, bro.
Because the Phils have lose a RH bat and a player with intangibles. In a LH heavy line-up, losing Rowand was dumb because that means those fargwads are thinking about good ol' Trish the LF being that RH pop guy. Yeah he was great in the 2nd half last year.
And we pray that Pat comes out and plays like his icehole is on fire to get a new contract...(not from the Phils either)
Quote from: SunMo on December 12, 2007, 05:06:55 PM
actually, the money from the inital report is wrong...it's only 60 mil over 5 years, 12 per year
so that means the Phils must not have come off their insistence for 3 years, because i can't believe he wouldn't have stayed for 4 years.
assuming that's true, they offered Lowell a longer contract than Rowand...stupid.
Five years and sixty million dollars would have been completely acceptable to me. 12 million a year for a guy like that is entirely different than 18 million, obviously.
Too bad.
Not that upset about it.
Get Mark Prior
the phillies need pitching, plain and simple. even when rowand was ineffective and in and out and of the lineup in 2006, they still scored a ton of runs. and that was with abreu for half the year, but nunez for the other half. so there.
the problem is pitching, kiddies. id overpay for santana or something, no problem. but the phillies can still score runs without gritty mcgritter and play in a little league park. they cant go into this season with 46 year old moyer and adam eaton. prior would be alright but he'll just wind up getting hurt.
Everyone needs pitching. And that's the reason the Phillies will get none of it.
You have the list of the non-tendered guys? Any help on there?
exactly phreak...you can say get pitching instead but thats not going to happen...people act like losing runs is no big deal to the phils and on paper it isnt...but if youre not going to reduce the number of runs you give up then it is a big deal to subtract an aaron rowand and add a jayson werth...and we havent even brought up the fact that they are losing a gold glove
Two questions:
1. Does anyone want the Phils to make a run at Mark Prior, to see if the scotch tape and rubber bands can hold his arm together for an entire season.
2. Does anyone really expect them to?
My answers:
1. Heck yes, if the price is right, or even close to right.
2. Heck no. This is the Phillies, after all.
the Phillies were reportedly interested in him before he was a FA, so i would expect they kick the tires on him.
if he's willing to accept a 1 year deal for low salary with performance based incentives then that's right up the Phils alley
"They saw him as a long term player and we didn't."
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. That's why you offered him 3 years plus an option for a fourth while the Giants gave him a five year deal. Basically it boiled down to a single year's difference.
I hate this farging team right now. They can puke up all the platitudes they want but they're still acting like a bargain-basement outfit and that pisses me off.
you guys probably don't remember this but he had a catch last year where he smashed his face right into the wall!
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on December 12, 2007, 11:15:41 PMYou have the list of the non-tendered guys? Any help on there?
list (http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071212&content_id=2324311&vkey=hotstove2007&fext=.jsp)
Notable names besides Prior:
Johnny Estrada
Morgan Ensberg
Miguel Olivo
Akinori Otsuka
Kevin Mench
Anyone even slightly surprised or annoyed about Rowand inking elsewhere should kill themselves.
Quote from: BigEd76 on December 12, 2007, 10:03:53 PM
Not that upset about it.
Get Mark Prior
General manager Ed Wade said Thursday that the Astros have contacted Mark Prior.
Prior was non-tendered by the Cubs earlier this week and likely won't be ready to pitch until several months into the season following shoulder surgery. "We talked to his [agent] to see what the lay of the land was," Wade said. "I don't know where it's going to lead. There's a lot of teams that have contacted them, and there was some discussions on the medical stats and that type of thing. I don't know where it's headed."
The Phillies may be interested in Akinori Otsuka, according to the Philadelphia Daily News.
Non-tendered by the Rangers earlier this week, Otsuka figures to be a popular target if teams are confident that he's healthy after missing the second half with arm problems.
Ill get you something more definitive next time when Les Bowen calls
Geoff Jenkins' agent is deciding between the Phillies and Padres
I wonder what Geoff thinks.
That he looks live Brett Favre?
Quote from: MDS on December 14, 2007, 06:56:43 PM
I wonder what Geoff thinks.
that surf and sand > warehouses
QuotePhillies eye outfielder Jenkins
By Todd Zolecki
Inquirer Staff Writer
There's no question the Phillies need help in the outfield.
They lost Aaron Rowand this week. He signed a five-year, $60 million contract with the San Francisco Giants. They also sent Michael Bourn to the Houston Astros last month in the Brad Lidge trade.
Could help be near? The Phillies confirmed yesterday they have interest in free-agent outfielder Geoff Jenkins, who is believed to be mulling offers from them and the San Diego Padres.
The Phillies like Jenkins because he hits lefthanded, which means he could platoon in right field with righthanded-hitting Jayson Werth. He also can play left field, which means he could find himself in the lineup on days when Pat Burrell needs a rest or is struggling.
"Things are definitely heating up with Philly and San Diego," Jenkins' agent, Damon Lapa, told FoxSports.com.
Jenkins, 33, spent the first 10 years of his career with the Milwaukee Brewers. He is a career .277 hitter with 212 home runs and 704 RBIs. Jenkins batted.255 with 21 home runs and 64 RBIs in 132 games last season.
Other than Burrell, Werth and centerfielder Shane Victorino, the Phillies have outfielders Chris Snelling, Chris Roberson and T.J. Bohn on their 40-man roster.
The Phils continue to look for pitching help as well. Only a handful of players who were not offered contracts by their teams earlier this week have interested the Phillies, with relief pitcher Akinori Otsuka one of them.
The Texas Rangers declined to offer a contract to Otsuka on Wednesday, making him a free agent.
The Phillies do not have interest in righthander Mark Prior, let go by the Chicago Cubs earlier this week.
I don't understand how they can't have * any * interest in Mark Prior. I mean, this is a team that acquired Adam Eaton & Freddy Garcia last year, right? If Prior had his hand amputated he'd still be a more palatable option than Eaton.
I just don't get this team. At all.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 15, 2007, 11:31:34 AM
I just don't get this team. At all.
I can't wait for them to feed the fans the 'there was no one available' crap when teams are making moves left and right. Haren would have been a great pick up but of course they sat on their hands while he went elsewhere. With Rowands departure offensively (and defensively) they're worse off. How they do shtein after taking their biggest step forward in 14 years is a joke.
I like how Ed Wade managed to trade for Jose Valverde. Granted, I think Lidge is good. But Valverde > Lidge.
yeah valverde is nasty
im ready for fantasy baseball
I'll ask the question one more time regarding Ed Wade. He's been very active so far down in Houston and has pulled off a few nice trades. He got some young players from the Phils for Lidge and then not only replaced Lidge but got a major upgrade with Valverde. And he also added Tejada to the mix. So was Ed Wade really the moron we all said he was or was it Phillies management handcuffing him by being extremely frugal and not really letting him do his job?
I know it's probably too early to tell but from where we're standing right now, it looks like Wade may have been shouldering a little too much blame for the Phils lack of success during his tenure.
If I'm an Astros fan, I'm pretty excited about what I'm seeing so far.
He's trying to win now on a team that isn't good enough to. He should be rebuilding and stockpiling prospects, not trading for washed up steroid users and above average closers.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on December 15, 2007, 03:18:03 PM
I'll ask the question one more time regarding Ed Wade. He's been very active so far down in Houston and has pulled off a few nice trades. He got some young players from the Phils for Lidge and then not only replaced Lidge but got a major upgrade with Valverde. And he also added Tejada to the mix. So was Ed Wade really the moron we all said he was or was it Phillies management handcuffing him by being extremely frugal and not really letting him do his job?
I know it's probably too early to tell but from where we're standing right now, it looks like Wade may have been shouldering a little too much blame for the Phils lack of success during his tenure.
If I'm an Astros fan, I'm pretty excited about what I'm seeing so far.
Wade drafted or aquired Utley, Howard, Hamels, Kendrick, Ruiz.
Wade is making the moves Gillick should be making. Other than resigning JC Romero....the phils have done nothing right.
I don't think anyone ever really knocked Wade for the players he drafted. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a GM who drafted that many players of that caliber who are actually making bonafide contributions to that same team that drafted them.
It's the free agency moves, or lack there of, that Wade never made that got him a bad rep among the fans.
Quote from: Wingspan on December 15, 2007, 03:30:05 PM
Wade is making the moves Gillick should be making. Other than resigning JC Romero....the phils have done nothing right.
And this is the point I'm getting at. Is Gillick the one sitting on his hands or has ownership tied them up? Because if that's the case, then it's likely the same scenerio when Wade was here which means that he never got a fair shake in Philly. Not that that's a surprise. Very few people do get a fair shake in this town when it comes to sports. Players, coaches, GM's, towel boys, etc.
wade didn't draft those prospects, Arbuckle did...stop suckling Wade all of the sudden, he was always active here (Andy Ashby, Kevin Millwood, Turk Wendell, Dennis Cook, etc...) and they were moves that were bad or looked good at the time and didn't work out. he tried to trade Ryan Howard for Kip Wells and then Ted Lilly, luckily those teams were dumb enough to say no. he gives up entirely too much in these trades, just like he did in the Tejada trade.
in fact, he's the one that kept Howard in the minors for too long, he's the one that kept Utley in the minors for probably a half of a year too long, he never would've brought up Kendrick last year either.
Quote from: SunMo on December 15, 2007, 04:13:43 PM
wade didn't draft those prospects, Arbuckle did...stop suckling Wade all of the sudden, he was always active here (Andy Ashby, Kevin Millwood, Turk Wendell, Dennis Cook, etc...) and they were moves that were bad or looked good at the time and didn't work out. he tried to trade Ryan Howard for Kip Wells and then Ted Lilly, luckily those teams were dumb enough to say no. he gives up entirely too much in these trades, just like he did in the Tejada trade.
in fact, he's the one that kept Howard in the minors for too long, he's the one that kept Utley in the minors for probably a half of a year too long, he never would've brought up Kendrick last year either.
Correct. 100% correct.
Wade is who we thought he is; an idiot.
I'm going to love hearing Houston sports radio blast him at the trade deadline and beyond this year.
Not suckling at all. It just looks like Wade wasn't quite as bad as we all thought he was and that even more blame should be pushed towards Monty and Co than what we've already been shoveling their way to begin with.
you're suckling, and it's making me sick....SICK!
Suckling!
Quote from: SunMo on December 15, 2007, 04:13:43 PM
wade didn't draft those prospects, Arbuckle did...stop suckling Wade all of the sudden, he was always active here (Andy Ashby, Kevin Millwood, Turk Wendell, Dennis Cook, etc...) and they were moves that were bad or looked good at the time and didn't work out. he tried to trade Ryan Howard for Kip Wells and then Ted Lilly, luckily those teams were dumb enough to say no. he gives up entirely too much in these trades, just like he did in the Tejada trade.
in fact, he's the one that kept Howard in the minors for too long, he's the one that kept Utley in the minors for probably a half of a year too long, he never would've brought up Kendrick last year either.
money post of the day
Quote from: Sgt PSN on December 15, 2007, 03:18:03 PM
I'll ask the question one more time regarding Ed Wade. He's been very active so far down in Houston and has pulled off a few nice trades. He got some young players from the Phils for Lidge and then not only replaced Lidge but got a major upgrade with Valverde. And he also added Tejada to the mix. So was Ed Wade really the moron we all said he was or was it Phillies management handcuffing him by being extremely frugal and not really letting him do his job?
I know it's probably too early to tell but from where we're standing right now, it looks like Wade may have been shouldering a little too much blame for the Phils lack of success during his tenure.
If I'm an Astros fan, I'm pretty excited about what I'm seeing so far.
very good points sarge...i put ed wade in philly kinda of on the same level as billy king...both not very good gm's but not as bad as everyone would like to believe...for different reasons they couldnt show what they could do and thus looked horrible but really werent that bad...but not that good either
Quote from: SunMo on December 15, 2007, 04:51:52 PM
you're suckling, and it's making me sick....SICK!
Would it make you feel better if I shared the teet with you?
Mets season ticket package:
(http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/4760/24931678hy3.png)
Trashiest fan base in America.
Let's. Go. Mets. Dum dum dum dum.
Phillies vs IronPigs in Allentown on March 30 (2PM)
Ed-you seriously must never leave your computer. In general, I dont know where you find half the shtein you find man
You are a friggin well of info, some useless, but way more useful. Good stuff
thanks? :-\
Did these iceholes sign Chad Durbin today?
Pittsburgh Post Gazette thinks so
supposedly Jenkins is on the way too, that's actually not a terrible signing...except it probably moves Victorino to center and doesn't utilize his arm which is better for RF
http://www.todaystmj4.com/sports/12652476.html
jenkins stats have really gone downhill over the past several years and im not sure they need lots more strikeouts but even with that i think its a good signing...
the best they could have done seeing that they only deal with B level free agents
Quote from: SunMo on December 20, 2007, 08:41:15 AM
supposedly Jenkins is on the way too, that's actually not a terrible signing...except it probably moves Victorino to center and doesn't utilize his arm which is better for RF
http://www.todaystmj4.com/sports/12652476.html
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3162819
you can never have too many durbins on the team.
It's not that Jenkins is a bad signing but as a whole the outfield is defensively and offensively worse than it was last season. The only upgrade this offseason has been adding Myers back to the starting rotation. Unless they add another quality starter, and I'm not talking Lohse, this offseason has been another huge Gillick failure.
Gillick is doing a fantastic job staying under the cap....oh wait...
a Werth/Jenkins platoon will probably put up close to the same numbers that Rowand did last year. Victorino will be a better CF defensively than rowand, but RF defense will suffer, but i don't think a hole lot. Werth actually showed some decent athleticism out there last year.
if anything, the bench is worse than last year, they don't have a late inning speed/defensive guy to replace burrell with (don't say roberson) and i'm not sure Bruntlett is the answer as the late inning defensive replacement.
the bullpen is still a problem, gordon may be ok for the first few weeks but once he goes down they are in trouble once again.
Quote from: reese125 on December 20, 2007, 10:54:21 AM
Gillick is doing a fantastic job staying under the cheap ownership's self-imposed "small market team" cap
CHAD DURBIN = WORLD SERIES
Victorino better do a lot of extra pre-game stretching because he'll be covering a shteinload of ground this season with Burrell & Jenkins/Werth on either side of him.
I think Werth has good speed to cover ground out there. Its his arm Im worried about
As long as he can hit a cutoff man and catch the farging ball when it's hit his way, I'm fine with him out there. Same for Jenkins & Burrell. Having guys with cannons for arms is nice but having fundamentally sound fielders playing out there is more important.
the outfield is passable nothing less nothing more...the problem is like sun said depth..and im not talking late inning depth im talking about when someone gets hurt...when that happens it becomes the titantic
Quote from: SunMo on December 20, 2007, 10:55:34 AM
a Werth/Jenkins platoon will probably put up close to the same numbers that Rowand did last year. Victorino will be a better CF defensively than rowand, but RF defense will suffer, but i don't think a hole lot. Werth actually showed some decent athleticism out there last year.
if anything, the bench is worse than last year, they don't have a late inning speed/defensive guy to replace burrell with (don't say roberson) and i'm not sure Bruntlett is the answer as the late inning defensive replacement.
the bullpen is still a problem, gordon may be ok for the first few weeks but once he goes down they are in trouble once again.
You don't need great defense in the outfield corners at CBP. So you can get away with that to an extent.
I agree with all of this. Except I dont have nearly as positive an outlook on the bullpen as you.
They can always make a trade for depth if it comes down to it. They got Iguchi last year for peanuts and that worked out well.
Iguchi wasn't acquired for depth. He was acquired because the phils already had no depth and they needed a 2B for an undeterminable amount of time.
Iguchi was the luck move of the decade.
Right - he wasn't acquired for depth. Not at all. He was acquired to be a full-time starter until Utley returned at which time he added depth to the bench.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 20, 2007, 11:26:41 AM
They can always make a trade for depth if it comes down to it. They got Iguchi last year for peanuts and that worked out well.
theres no such thing as trading for depth during the season...if they trade for another outfielder during the year then its because they are in dire straits
You acquire someone during the season to fill in until your starter returns at which point they become a bench player, correct?
normally you dont aquire anyone....you go to your own bench or AAA club to replace the guy....the phillies dont have that option or horrible options...which is the point here
like wing said iguchi is an extremely rare case...in fact had the whole team not been a mash unit last year iguchi would have gone down to AAA once utley came back
Had the whole team been healthy they wouldn't have acquired him, so that point is moot. And he was their best option off the bench despite the fact that Cholly the clown preferred playing Butcher Dobbs & Helms at third.
And he wouldn't have gone anywhere remotely close to the minor leagues. He was an established major league starter in Chicago and then Philly, not some journeyman scrub vacillating between the majors & minors, IGY. If the Phillies didn't have the best second baseman in the National League he would have been re-signed here, guaranteed.
iguchi blows.....theres a reason the phillies in a desperate situation got him for someone who probably wont ever see even AAA baseball
and my point with the injuries is that if utley got hurt and they didnt have a million other injuires then when utley came back iguchi would have been sent down...he stinks
He blows?
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=6217
Well, his stats tell a different story but whatever.
he doesn't stink, its a dumb thing to say
in a matter of six months he got traded for michael dubee and couldnt get anything more than a small one year contract as a free agent....ill be suprised if hes in the league in three years and he definitely wont be starting
Is there any question J.C. Romero goes back to his waiver-wire AAA/Majors tweener form this year?
Quote from: ice grillin you on December 20, 2007, 12:54:31 PM
and couldnt get anything more than a small one year contract as a free agent....
he had multi-year offers from other teams, phillies included, but chose the 1 year deal with the padres in hopes to get a bigger deal next year.
sure he did
Our newest outfielder:
(http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/9809/52532795e15f193cedowu2.jpg)
:-D
Iguchi's 33 years old so his not being in the league after three more seasons at the age of 36 wouldn't be a shock or a surprise.
He'd probably play the three seasons the Phillies offered him and then go back to Japan.
Quote from: ice grillin you on December 20, 2007, 01:01:54 PM
sure he did
http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/weblog/2007/12/iguchi_and_more.html
QuoteThe guy loves San Diego, according to his agent, who said the Rockies offered him a two-year guarantee plus an option (though, presumably, for less annual salary). The Phillies, wanting him to play third base, offered him a three-year guarantee, the agent said. Of courese, signing a one-year deal could pay off for Iguchi as well. The Dodgers and Giants might be looking for a second baseman next offseason.
Quote from: SunMo on December 20, 2007, 01:12:10 PM
according to his agent. the agent said.
yeah his agent took less money cause the great tadihito iguchi who was given away this past season in a trade is going to command the big bucks next year
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 20, 2007, 01:04:38 PM
(http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/9809/52532795e15f193cedowu2.jpg)
thats awesome
(http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/Brett-Favre_1.jpg)
Quote from: ice grillin you on December 20, 2007, 01:16:00 PM
yeah his agent took less money cause the great tadihito iguchi who was given away this past season in a trade is going to command the big bucks next year
why are you so hung up on who he got traded for?
Jeff Bagwell got traded for Larry Anderson...i guess he sucks too?
because that shows value
same as the fact
that he couldnt get anything more
than a one year ghetto contract
he got traded for a pitching coaches son
whos only in baseball cause of his father
he did a nice job for the phils this year but lets not start sucking his dick
hes a borderline mlb starter
sometimes you're so wrong it makes me cry
chad durbin comes from the ryan franklin school of pitching. this guy is going to be abortion-worthy.
jenkins/werth should be just fine in rf. werth should come defensively which should make things fairly close to what they were last year.
they still probably arent good enough, but its not like the sewer rats in queens have done anything spectacular to improve that team.
I just noticed that Iguchi's BA, OBP, RBI and HR numbers are remarkably similar to Jimmy Rollins' on an average year. (Clearly not this past year when Rollins lit the world on fire.)
Interesting.
Quote from: ice grillin you on December 20, 2007, 01:21:53 PM
because that shows value
same as the fact
that he couldnt get anything more
than a one year ghetto contract
he got traded for a pitching coaches son
whos only in baseball cause of his father
he did a nice job for the phils this year but lets not start sucking his dick
hes a borderline mlb starter
I do not like green eggs and ham
I do not like them in a box.
I do not like them with a fox.
I do not like them in a boat.
I do not like them with a goat
Quote from: rjs246 on December 20, 2007, 01:25:42 PM
I just noticed that Iguchi's BA, OBP, RBI and HR numbers are remarkably similar to Jimmy Rollins' on an average year. (Clearly not this past year when Rollins lit the world on fire.)
Interesting.
actually theres nothing interesting about it...in fact its one of the most inane meaningless comparisons ive ever seen
because Iguchi sucks...we get it...
34 year olds who get traded for michael dubee usually do
he was 32 when he got traded
Rotoworlds take:
Phillies signed outfielder Geoff Jenkins, who had been with the Brewers, to a two-year, $13 million contract with a mutual vesting option for 2010.
We just have to face it that we live in an era in which even 33-year-old platoon corner outfielders coming off back-to-back mediocre seasons get multiyear deals. It only takes one out of 30 GMs to think a player is worth it. Jenkins isn't a terrible signing. He still covers a fair amount of ground in the outfield, and he complements Jayson Werth well in a platoon situation. Plus, with where the Phillies are, the extra win he might provide over Brad Wilkerson could make all of the difference int he NL East. He just would have been a much better gamble for one year. The Phillies figure to hit him sixth, putting him right behind three guys with the potential for .400 OBPs in Chase Utley, Ryan Howard and Pat Burrell. Sure, two of them are extraordinarily slow, but that could still leave him with a mess of RBI opportunities and give him more fantasy value than he's had since 2005. Dec. 20 - 1:43 pm et
Ed still hasn't posted Jenkins' & Durbin's numbers yet so I will.
Jenkins gets #10 while Durbin gets # 37.
Ironically, those numbers correspond to the number of home runs Jenkins will hit as a Phillie and Durbin will surrender at The Bank.
romey makes funny
Carlos Silva's deal ended up being four years and forty eight million farging dollars. That's what a .500 pitcher brings in 2007.
Christ.
What's that mean with J.D. Durbin wearing number 58?
By the way...I just looked this up...J.D. stands for Joseph Adam Durbin :sly
1. Iguchi doesn't suck. In fact, the way he handles situational hitting (something this team SORELY LACKS) was a huge benefit to this club. Who gives two fargs about his age and who he got traded for? The White Sox knew he was rollin' out and they were zesty so they gave him away. Big deal. His age doesn't mean much either because he's still able to swing the bat and he wouldn't have neede much range at 3rd anyways. And let's be honest; any Tom, Dick or Harry would be better than the clown they have penciled in there now. Wes Helms is trash.
2. Geoff Jenkins and Jayson Werth should be an average platoon. I mean, is it much worse than Milt Thompson/Pete Incavilglia and Wes Chamberlain/Jim Eisenreich? I don't think so. I'd say it's a passable situation. The problem that will arise is when/if Victorino gets hurt and/or Pat Burrell sucks again. Werth has a decent arm too. Good enough to play the shallow depths at CBP. He has speed too. The fact that his name is spelled Geoff angers me for some reason though.
3. Chad Durbin is better than farging Roberto Hernandez whom they reportedly looked into signing.
Quote from: Wingspan on December 20, 2007, 06:03:18 PM
What's that mean with J.D. Durbin wearing number 58?
By the way...I just looked this up...J.D. stands for Joseph Adam Durbin :sly
Put in D.J. Feeley!
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on December 20, 2007, 07:50:53 PM
3. Chad Durbin is better than farging Roberto Hernandez whom they reportedly looked into signing.
huh? The same piece of shtein that was here blowing games day after day a few seasons ago? Why the farg would they even CONSIDER That?
Because they're stupid and it's obvious they don't learn from past mistakes.
Hell, why not trade for Turk Wendell an Dennis Cook again.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on December 20, 2007, 11:56:48 PM
Because they're stupid and it's obvious they don't learn from past mistakes.
Hell, why not trade for Turk Wendell an Dennis Cook again.
throw in the big Turk necklace and now we're talkin!
I think they should sign Mike Williams again too. And Corey Lidle.
Sean Taylor has a killer breaking ball.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on December 21, 2007, 12:08:44 PM
Sean Taylor has a killer breaking ball.
I'd like to think Sean is riding shotgun in Cory's plane... in hell.
Phils signed So Taguchi...1 yr deal w/ option for 2009
Quote from: BigEd76 on December 23, 2007, 03:55:53 PM
Phils signed So Taguchi...1 yr deal w/ option for 2009
Who?
Quote from: FastFreddie on December 23, 2007, 04:09:44 PM
Quote from: BigEd76 on December 23, 2007, 03:55:53 PM
Phils signed So Taguchi...1 yr deal w/ option for 2009
Who?
(http://content.clearchannel.com/Photos/sports_photos/MLB/Cardinals/so_taguchi_GI.jpg) (http://www.baseball-reference.com/t/tagucso01.shtml)
Basically, another 4th outfielder.
QuoteNot just a great utility outfielder...practically a sentence! You are SOOOOO Taguchi!
How do his stats compare to Jimmy Rollins'? Probably not as well as Iguchi's.
Quote from: rjs246 on December 27, 2007, 01:42:57 PM
How do his stats compare to Jimmy Rollins'? Probably not as well as Iguchi's.
He's about one MVP short.
More seriously, Taguchi is a 37-year-old 4th outfielder with little power (.368 SLG last year), decent but not great OBP (.350) who appears to have limited range in the OF and fairly average fielding percentage.
In other words, signing Taguchi bring a "WTF?" from me.
Is Taguchi a former Mariner? Gillick loves him some Azns
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on December 27, 2007, 03:26:51 PM
Is Taguchi a former Mariner? Gillick loves him some Azns
His whole MLB career was with the Cardinals, but he was in the Japanese league for years before that.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on December 27, 2007, 03:11:19 PM
More seriously, Taguchi is a 37-year-old .....
But once you factor in the Jap/US conversion rate, dookie's only like 15.
^^^^^^
:-D :-D :-D
I give this move a :yay
I've liked him as a 4th OF for a couple years now.
He's not flashy, but he's a solid player that can fill in several spots. I didn't realize he was 37.
It's nice to see them signing OFs to more than one year, since Pat is a FA after the season.
Chris Roberson traded to Baltimore :yay :yay :yay
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 02, 2008, 02:49:32 PM
Chris Roberson traded to Baltimore :yay :yay :yay
What did they get for him?
Ca$h considerations?
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7b/United_States_one_dollar_bill,_obverse.jpg/800px-United_States_one_dollar_bill,_obverse.jpg)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7b/United_States_one_dollar_bill,_obverse.jpg/800px-United_States_one_dollar_bill,_obverse.jpg)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7b/United_States_one_dollar_bill,_obverse.jpg/800px-United_States_one_dollar_bill,_obverse.jpg)
(http://www.vikingmagic.com/ama/med/jumbo_coin_quarter.jpg)
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 02, 2008, 02:49:32 PM
Chris Roberson traded to Baltimore :yay :yay :yay
there goes our chance for NL East repeat :P
I guess they'll fill that small void with Golson
I bet my uncle on christmas that the Phillies wouldnt make the World Series. He really thinks they are going to go and win it. Easiest $100 bucks i've ever made, plus if they do go, i'd be more than happy to lose the cash
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on January 02, 2008, 04:15:09 PM
Easiest $100 bucks i've ever made
Easy money, indeed. Unless you take into consideration that the WS is approx 280 days away. That means you're only making about $0.28/day between now and then.....which is even less than it costs to sponsor a starving kid in Africa.
Right but between the money he's saving by letting that kid starve and the money he's earning by betting against the Phillies, I'd say he's doing alright.
Making the World Series isn't that much of a stretch for this team. The National League is so horrendous that even the Phillies could win the NLCS and it wouldn't be that much of a surprise.
Winning the World Series, on the other hand... hahaha. Talk about easy money.
Quote from: rjs246 on January 02, 2008, 06:34:37 PM
Right but between the money he's saving by letting that kid starve and the money he's earning by betting against the Phillies, I'd say he's doing alright.
Starving african children is something i take pride in, along with Monkey Torture (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A_EgpUwMpo)
You and karma are good friends.
That stillupfront's mom Karma owes me 20 bucks
Matt Smith was DFA'ed, so the trade now boils down to Bobby Abreu and Cory Lidle for Jesus Sanchez and Carlos Monasterios.
Go team.
Don't forget: :deion :deion :deion
That trade is a wash. Abreu hasn't made the Yankees any better or worse and his absence certainly had no effect on the Phillies up or down.
i would say his absence had a tremendous positive effect on the team, they played much better after he got traded and won the division the next year
I would say that it's January and there's no baseball in sight.
I would say the Phillies should have gotten a lot more for a player as good as Abreu.
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 09:46:28 PM
I would say that it's January and there's no baseball in sight.
About 6 weeks to spring training.
What the hell is wrong with you people?
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 09:53:10 PM
What the hell is wrong with you people?
Tell me that when we're talking about football in May.
BTW, just looked it up. 37 days until pitchers and catchers report for the Phils. My favorite time of year to live in Florida.
Football is a contact sport that involves actual physical prowess to play. Baseball, in its current incarnation, is dominated by fatasses pumped full of 'lidocaine and B-12' with unusual hand-eye coordination. It doesn't even require athletic ability, just bulk and quick wrists. Sounds like bowling. Or masturbation.
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 09:59:25 PM
Football is a contact sport that involves actual physical prowess to play. Baseball, in its current incarnation, is dominated by fatasses pumped full of 'lidocaine and B-12' with unusual hand-eye coordination. It doesn't even require athletic ability, just bulk and quick wrists. Sounds like bowling. Or masturbation.
I take it you've never been involved in a home-plate collision.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on January 04, 2008, 09:54:04 PM
BTW, just looked it up. 37 days until pitchers and catchers report for the Phils. My favorite time of year to live in Florida.
That is farging great news and just what I wanted to hear after seeing the Flyers get shut out by the Devils.
I can't wait for baseball.
Yeah, they're not much improved, but they made the playoffs last year and no one even thought they'd come close.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on January 04, 2008, 10:00:55 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 09:59:25 PM
Football is a contact sport that involves actual physical prowess to play. Baseball, in its current incarnation, is dominated by fatasses pumped full of 'lidocaine and B-12' with unusual hand-eye coordination. It doesn't even require athletic ability, just bulk and quick wrists. Sounds like bowling. Or masturbation.
I take it you've never been involved in a home-plate collision.
I have. I played baseball for several years. Played on several traveling teams and enjoyed the hell out of it. The very first day I played a contact sport I quit playing baseball and haven't played since. Unless you count beer-soaked softball games. Which was the way god intended baseball-ish games to be played. Since he clearly never intended its players to break a sweat.
(Please note how I didn't even respond to the fact that you used a home plate collision, which happens once every four or five games, to argue that baseball is somehow a contact sport. Didn't even mention a word about it. Not a word.)
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 10:04:14 PM
Quote from: Geowhizzer on January 04, 2008, 10:00:55 PM
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 09:59:25 PM
Football is a contact sport that involves actual physical prowess to play. Baseball, in its current incarnation, is dominated by fatasses pumped full of 'lidocaine and B-12' with unusual hand-eye coordination. It doesn't even require athletic ability, just bulk and quick wrists. Sounds like bowling. Or masturbation.
I take it you've never been involved in a home-plate collision.
I have. I played baseball for several years. Played on several traveling teams and enjoyed the hell out of it. The very first day I played a contact sport I quit playing baseball and haven't played since. Unless you count beer-soaked softball games. Which was the way god intended baseball-ish games to be played. Since he clearly never intended its players to break a sweat.
(Please note how I didn't even respond to the fact that you used a home plate collision, which happens once every four or five games, to argue that baseball is somehow a contact sport. Didn't even mention a word about it. Not a word.)
Obviously you weren't a catcher. Full-body contact? Not every day. Legs taken out for me? Damn nearly every day, at least once.
One guy had to get braces because of my hard head. Teach that jerk to try to truck me.
Quote from: MDS on January 04, 2008, 06:51:08 PM
Matt Smith was DFA'ed, so the trade now boils down to Bobby Abreu and Cory Lidle for Jesus Sanchez and Carlos Monasterios.
Go team.
A DFA's Tommy John farger who couldn't throw a strike
A stupid dead farger who flew into some rich iceholes apartament
Who?
A guy whose last name sounds like a disease you get from banging whores in Tijuana.
Win, win.
Quote from: rjs246 on January 04, 2008, 09:46:28 PM
I would say that it's January and there's no baseball in sight.
Pitchers & catchers report in six weeks, home boy. Can we expect you down in Clearwater again in March, same as always?
PS: LOL. Jay was drunk there.
:-D
Buzzin' a little bit yeah
Your unhinged rage at the Phillies ineptitude comes through loud and clear when you're loaded.
:D
I dig it, personally, because I share it.
My buddy went on a cruise last week, and on that cruise was none other than Carlos Delgado. One night he was in the hot tub with another friend and Delgado got in with his kids...no one else around, just them...and he gets convinced its not actually Delgado and says nothing.
If there was ever a time to make fun of him, it was then. Or engage in butt sex.
Fascinating.
I hope you all die. Terminal illnesses.
if it makes you feel better due to the racists loss today i will be dying of happiness tonight
Would you like me to then tell you what happened on episode 2 of the wire?
i already heard that you saw ep 2...no need to continue on
then applaud my stupid stories or i will reveal info
i will never read this thread again
oh it wont be here, it will be everywhere. pms, texts, love letters. of course, in 2 weeks, its over.
please dont ruin the love letters
Werth avoided arbitration. $1.7M :-\
What? You don't think he's Werth it?
1 Eagle head.....maybe a half
You must be grading on a curve.
Who cares. It's not your money.
it's farging 1.7 for a guy who's going to play half the season...why would you be upset at that? the guy proved he can contribute...
1.7M to a baseball player is like $20 to us.
The Phillies are paying their platoon right fielders a grand total of $8.2M this season.
World Series, baby.
Who's the other one again?
Jeff Geonkins
I hear Samuel Dalembert will be awesome in center.
More new lows for this thread. Nice.
http://www.phillymag.com/philly/portraits
Chase's wife is farging hot.
Skinny. White. Bitch.
Howard gets the cover of MLB 08 The Show (http://www.philly.com/dailynews/sports/20080109_Phillies_-_Sony_picks_Howard_as_its_08_game_face.html)
Phils are reportedly interested in Pedro Feliz.
Anyone but Helms.
Pass on Feliz. No need to dish out more $$ for a mediocre third baseman.
Signing Feliz would mean Helms is gone. Feliz has more pop in his bat and is better defensively. I guess.
Quote from: MDS on January 13, 2008, 06:28:10 PM
Signing Feliz would mean Helms is gone. Feliz has more pop in his bat and is better defensively. I guess.
Bad OPS. There has to be someone else.
Pedro Feliz? Gimme a break. Just like the Phillies, though. They go after the World Series MVP, get turned down, so they go after a piece of garbage like Feliz instead.
Just disgusting.
who cares about OPS for a 7th hitter, he can play defense and will hit 20 home runs...he's not that bad
So can Helms.
ummmm, since when can Helms play defense?
Helms - 53 games started (68 total) 9 errors
Feliz - 137 games started (142 total) 11 errors
im a better fielder than helms
also and i dont know where it got started but the notion that helms is some sort of power hitter is greatly exaggerated as well
basically he sucks
errors are a fairly misleading stat. helms pretty much sucks at everything, feliz is a halfway decent defensive player and hit 20 homers in a giant ballpark. he should have no problem at the little league park.
Lieber signed with the Cubs (1/$3.5M). Bye.
I wish him nothing but the best, like Darryl Kile and Cory Lidle best.
Uncle Cholly was supposed to be on Baseball This Morning on XM175 this morning. They've been promoting it all week and were talking about it until about 10 minutes before he was scheduled to go on. I even made a point of scheduling my morning around it because I was interested in hearing how he thought the off-season was progressing.
Anyway, they came back from break and Buck Martinez announced that evidently someone at the Phillies neglected to tell Cholly that he was supposed to be near a phone this morning so the guys at the show could talk to him, so he never appeared.
Hilarious. :-D
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 18, 2008, 11:17:22 AM
Uncle Cholly was supposed to be on Baseball This Morning on XM175 this morning. They've been promoting it all week and were talking about it until about 10 minutes before he was scheduled to go on. I even made a point of scheduling my morning around it because I was interested in hearing how he thought the off-season was progressing.
Anyway, they came back from break and Buck Martinez announced that evidently someone at the Phillies neglected to tell Cholly that he was supposed to be near a phone this morning so the guys at the show could talk to him, so he never appeared.
Hilarious. :-D
Pathetic.
well, um, like...we gon hit
Quote from: FastFreddie on January 18, 2008, 11:23:20 AM
Pathetic.
I actually had my phone out and was going to text you about his appearance when Martinez made his announcement.
I had everyone else's number punched in too, but still, you were on the list...
That's a dangerous precedent to set.
http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/sports/20080118_ap_penaraysagreeto241m3yrdeal.html (http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/sports/20080118_ap_penaraysagreeto241m3yrdeal.html)
Carlos Pena just struck a deal with Tampa for three years & 24 million.
Ryan Howard just shat himself with glee.
And Holliday just signed for 2 years/$23M.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-rockies-holliday&prov=ap&type=lgns
Shats galore! :-D
Nunez signed a minor-league deal with the Brewers with an invite to spring training.
Interesting stats on Howard:
QuoteThe case for Howard
Go ahead. Try to find anybody who has kicked off a career with a home-run output anywhere near Ryan Howard?s. Good luck. Can't be done.
Nobody in history has hit 47 homers or more in each of his first two full seasons. Nobody. Or here's another way to look at it: After 410 games in the big leagues, Howard is already up to 129 homers. Want to know how insane that is? Here's how insane:
That's 72 more than Junior Griffey, 62 more than Barry Bonds, 54 more than Mike Schmidt, 44 more than A-Rod and 31 more than Albert Pujols at the same stage. The only player in the last half-century who was even within 25 homers of Howard, after this many games, is Bob Horner (who was exactly 25 back, at 104).
In fact, you want to know the player in history who is most comparable? It's that George H. Bambino Ruth. He dabbled in the pitching profession for a few years before finally getting his shot as a full-time hitter at age 25. Whereupon he mashed 54 and 59 homers respectively in 1920-21. Ruth, too, got kind of a late start in his career. But building around him worked out OK for the Yankees, wouldn't you say?
How much older as well as physically and emotionally mature was Howard than the rest of those guys when he became a starter in the Majors?
He's a four year college player who also spent three years in the Minors. Griffey was what, 19 when he broke in at Seattle? How about Bonds? I know he was a college player, but still, he hit the Majors at a young age too (21, I believe).
You can twist the numbers any way you want in favor of Howard, but the bottom line for him is, he's still only entitled to whatever the Phillies are willing to give him or what the arbitrator is willing to award him. That's the way the system is set up, and occasionally players of rare ability get screwed by it. Well, boo hoo. He'll still get his dough so all this nonsense being written about by the hacks in Philly is nothing more than noise.
He can either agree to an incredibly lucrative extension (and let's not kid ourselves - it will be lucrative, maybe not as lucrative as he'd like but it would still be more money than he could ever spend in his life) or he can spend the next four years fighting it out with the Phillies at the arbitration table. Either way, he's a Phillie and for a good long time too.
Imagine if he didnt come to spring training a complete fatass?
His uniform would be huge.
Imagine if he didn't play his home games in a little league park.
Only the iceholes in this town would talk such crap about a player like Howard.
Pathetic.
What the hell?
:-D
It's not crap. He was at least 20 pounds overweight last spring. It cost him the first month of the season, as well as a stint on the DL.
Is it that much to ask a guy who wants 15M+ a year to stay in shape? Not that he doesn't deserve the money, he does, and he'll get it....from the Red Sox in 3 years.
Quote from: Wingspan on January 23, 2008, 04:11:08 PM
he'll get it....from the Red Sox in 3 years.
Probably.
you ingrates should be kissing ryan howard's feet for all that he has done for you.
I personally put money in his pocket when I bought his authentic jersey so I'm good.
i once was going to get mugged and Ryan Howard snorted the mugger up his ginormous nostril and saved my life
sometimes ryan howard burps me when i have heartburn.
Ryan Howard hit Sean Taylor in the dick.
He was swinging for his balls but missed.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on January 23, 2008, 04:33:07 PM
Ryan Howard hit Sean Taylor in the dick.
He was swinging for his balls but missed.
just like you swung and missed with that joke
Quote from: SunMo on January 23, 2008, 04:18:59 PM
i once was going to get mugged and Ryan Howard snorted the mugger up his ginormous nostril and saved my life
Bigger nose, Ryan Howard or Quentin Jammer?
Quote from: SunMo on January 23, 2008, 05:00:00 PM
Quote from: Sgt PSN on January 23, 2008, 04:33:07 PM
Ryan Howard hit Sean Taylor in the dick.
He was swinging for his balls but missed.
just like you swung and missed with that joke
The misses make us appreciate the hits that much more.
Quote from: Seabiscuit36 on January 23, 2008, 05:05:56 PM
Quote from: SunMo on January 23, 2008, 04:18:59 PM
i once was going to get mugged and Ryan Howard snorted the mugger up his ginormous nostril and saved my life
Bigger nose, Ryan Howard or Quentin Jammer?
Greg Oden
It's times like this I miss NoneBetta the most.
Yeah, he had some pretty big nostrils, too.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 23, 2008, 01:40:16 PM
How much older as well as physically and emotionally mature was Howard than the rest of those guys when he became a starter in the Majors?
He's a four year college player who also spent three years in the Minors. Griffey was what, 19 when he broke in at Seattle? How about Bonds? I know he was a college player, but still, he hit the Majors at a young age too (21, I believe).
You can twist the numbers any way you want in favor of Howard, but the bottom line for him is, he's still only entitled to whatever the Phillies are willing to give him or what the arbitrator is willing to award him. That's the way the system is set up, and occasionally players of rare ability get screwed by it. Well, boo hoo. He'll still get his dough so all this nonsense being written about by the hacks in Philly is nothing more than noise.
He can either agree to an incredibly lucrative extension (and let's not kid ourselves - it will be lucrative, maybe not as lucrative as he'd like but it would still be more money than he could ever spend in his life) or he can spend the next four years fighting it out with the Phillies at the arbitration table. Either way, he's a Phillie and for a good long time too.
Rome, what makes you think he will be a Phillie for a long time regardless? If he gets in the arbitration room battling it out with the Phillies of what he's owed, its going to get ugly. They come back at him with all the strikeouts he's had..blah blah blah....he gets salty....and history repeats itself
He owes the Phillies nothing and his parents are the ones pushing this hard. Regardless of the strikeouts, Howard is a star that rarely (like stated in the article) comes around. The Phillies have him and should show their appreciation regardless of the system. They could very well farg this franchise up for years.
The Phillies own Howard's rights for the next four years. Period.
He can either go to arbitration for the next four years or he can sign a longterm deal. Either way he's a Phillie through 2011. If he pisses and moans his way out of town, then so be it. He wouldn't be the first athlete to cry poverty while making millions.
I doubt that happens because he's a big piece of the puzzle and I think the Phillies will come to terms with him. It takes two parties to make a contract, though, and if he's insistent on breaking the bank, then maybe he will leave. The reality is the Phillies aren't the Yankees, Mets or Red Sox in terms of payroll and if they can't budget him in then he'll be gone.
the phillies dont deserve ryan howard
According to Stark, Howard wants A-Rod money :-D
Sayonara.
stark didnt say he wants a-rod money he said his camp wants money closer to that of a-rods new deal than puljos' deal from three years ago...more along the lines of 20+ million a year instead of 14
a 3-yr player won't get $20M/yr. Not from the Phillies, not from the Yankees.
20+ million dollars for a guy with only two-plus years major league service time?
Ridiculous.
I love Howard and all but $20 million a year is too much for a guy who strikes out as much as he does. Considering the Phils don't have to pay him shtein for 4 years they should be creative and front load a deal so his later years aren't too much. Basically find a happy medium for both parties.
im not saying it will happen im just saying its untrue that hes looking for a-rod money
he wont make 20 million this year or next romey...they will buy out his arbitration years for an amount far below that then work up to 20+ million by the end of the deal
We really don't know what he's looking for but I can't believe the Phillies wouldn't offer far and above what any reasonable player in his position would ask for.
They already paid him that way last season, right?
Stark says 7/$150M to start, which is over $21M/yr. A-Rod is the only player making over $20M/yr (unless Manny Ramirez is in that same area). A-Rod money.
Ship him to the Twins for Santana
the avg per year is irrelevant
its how it works it way up...hes not going to be making close to 20 mil until his arbitration years are over and i doubt any year would have him at a-rod money...for most of that deal he will be making closer to puljos (and lots of other players along the way) than to a-rod
in other words in five years lots of guys will be making "a-rod money"
Here's Stark's blog entry in its entirety:
QuotePhils, Howard don't see eye-to-eye
posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2008
Ryan Howard is used to being a veritable history-making machine. But this winter, he's trying to make a whole different kind of history.
Salary-arbitration history.
Unless somebody backpedals in the next couple of weeks, Howard will wind up in a hearing room, for a potentially messy paycheck battle with the Phillies. Here's why we should care:
• Because the Phillies are the only franchise in history that has never lost an arbitration hearing, for one thing. They're 7-0 lifetime, buzzing through an eclectic crew consisting of Jerry Koosman, Alan Knicely, Kevin Gross, Dickie Thon, Dale Sveum, Willie Banks and Travis Lee.
• Because, for another thing, Howard is asking for $10 million. And the record for most dollars awarded to a player who won an arbitration hearing is $8.2 million, by Andruw Jones in 2001. (Alfonso Soriano got $10 million two years ago, but he actually lost -- in a bid for $12 million.)
• And because that $10 million is a figure 43 percent higher than the $7 million the Phillies filed at -- a figure that matches the $7 million the Cardinals gave Albert Pujols the first year he was eligible for arbitration. Which tells us the Howard camp views its esteemed client as the ultimate push-the-arbitration-envelope player.
You'll be hearing Pujols' name a lot over the next few weeks, or possibly the next four years, any time Howard's contract becomes a topic. You'll be hearing it because the Phillies aren't exactly known for being financial trail-blazers, so they're using Pujols' contract history as their blueprint for how to handle -- or is that mishandle -- Howard.
The Phillies renewed Howard at $900,000 last year -- precisely the same amount Pujols got from the Cardinals the year before he was eligible for arbitration. Next up, the Phillies will no doubt offer Howard a long-term deal that mirrors the seven-year, $100-million contract Pujols signed with the Cardinals in his first year of arbitration eligibility.
That might sound reasonable from afar. But there is no chance -- zero -- that the reaction to that offer from Howard, his family and his agent, Casey Close, is going to sound anything like: Where do we sign?
Howard views Pujols as a great name to be compared to -- on the baseball field. But not between the contract lines. It's four years later now, so Howard's reps will argue that his deal should reflect the explosion in revenue in the sport.
They'll also mention that Howard is off to a historic start to his career. So why wouldn't he be looking for a historic contract? The rumblings are that his family, which has already pushed him to change agents twice in his young career, isn't content to compare him to Pujols.
A-Rod is more what this particular family has in mind.
Well, A-Rod -- as you might have noticed -- makes 27 million bucks a year. So even if we assume that the Phillies could buy off some arbitration years at figures below that, it's a good bet that the lowest figure the Howard camp is likely to ask for long-term is $150 million, for seven years -- and very possibly higher.
For a player who has about 2½ years of service time.
There's a better chance the Phillies will start Robin Roberts on Opening Day than there is of them giving Howard 150 million negotiable American dollars -- if not more.
So forget all that happy talk the Phillies are tossing out there about their willingness to talk and negotiate and shower their first baseman with affection. This is one of the most conservative ownership groups in sports. So while talk isn't always cheap, it's cheaper than handing out the richest contract in history for a guy with two-plus years' service time.
Howard's teammates theorized openly last year that Howard's anxiety over his contract had a lot to do with his slow start. Well, he'd better get used to that anxiety, because we'd bet these Ryan Howard contract donnybrooks are about to become as regular a part of our winters as, say, Ground Hog's Day.
Through 2011, anyway. After which we'll see if the prospect of Howard's imminent free agency finally terrifies the Phillies into getting something done.
"it's a good bet that the lowest figure the Howard camp is likely to ask for ..."
sounds solid
I don't understand his rationale. If making the most money you can possibly squeeze out of a franchise that can't compete with the likes of the Yankees is your aim, then by all means he should hold out for that sort of money. If your aim is to make a king's ransom yet still allow the team some flexibility to get better, then he should take a lower amount.
Like I said earlier, I think the Phillies are willing to go huge with Howard in terms of money. But again, how many tens of millions of dollars is enough for these guys? And what happens if Howard gets that sort of dough? How are Utley & Rollins going to react? Are they going to want to tear their contracts up?
And then there's the Cole Hamels factor. If he's going to be an undisputed #1 ace for the next ten years like we all think he is, isn't he going to want to break the bank too?
The Phillies simply can't go nuts with Howard and pay him whatever he's looking for. They just can't.
forget the ridiculous numbers he puts up
and the incredible amounts of fans he puts in the seats
the spotlight he gets shined on the franchise
merchandise he sells
ect ect ect......
the phillies owe howard big time for keeping him in the minors for so long...he lost years of service with that crap...he shouldnt take a "lower amount" from them...they owe him not the other way around
Also, he deserves reparations for slavery.
Wrong.
Howard deserves his own slaves. White womenses!
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 24, 2008, 11:35:31 AM
the phillies owe howard big time for keeping him in the minors for so long...he lost years of service with that crap...he shouldnt take a "lower amount" from them...they owe him not the other way around
That's retarded.
Howard spent less than 3 full seasons in the minors before being called up. Which is actually quite fast for the phils. He went to college late, and wasnt drafted until he was 22.
He didn't really explode in the minors until 2003 (first year in Clearwater). And he was rushed though AA and AAA and full time in 04. The only mistep the phils took was sending him back in beginning 2005, but they had Thome playing and they had him playing every day in AAA rather than sitting on the bench.
I'm going to Phillies College Media Day. I don't know what it is but it sounds fun. I think I get to ask questions to Ruben Amaro. I really should start out with "why are you such a fleshpop?"
call him a beaner
Quote from: Wingspan on January 24, 2008, 01:59:21 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 24, 2008, 11:35:31 AM
the phillies owe howard big time for keeping him in the minors for so long...he lost years of service with that crap...he shouldnt take a "lower amount" from them...they owe him not the other way around
That's retarded.
Howard spent less than 3 full seasons in the minors before being called up. Which is actually quite fast for the phils. He went to college late, and wasnt drafted until he was 22.
He didn't really explode in the minors until 2003 (first year in Clearwater). And he was rushed though AA and AAA and full time in 04. The only mistep the phils took was sending him back in beginning 2005, but they had Thome playing and they had him playing every day in AAA rather than sitting on the bench.
he should have been a full time player from the start of the 2004 season and maybe even 2003...i dont care of it was one day or six months bottom line is they kept him down longer than they should have so that they could hold back his service years for as long as humanly possible...the phillies front office is pathetic and ryan howard should milk them for all they are worth...under no circumstances should he take less than he can get as romey suggested
Barajas heads back to Toronto....1 year + option for 2009
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 24, 2008, 08:27:26 PM
Quote from: Wingspan on January 24, 2008, 01:59:21 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 24, 2008, 11:35:31 AM
the phillies owe howard big time for keeping him in the minors for so long...he lost years of service with that crap...he shouldnt take a "lower amount" from them...they owe him not the other way around
That's retarded.
Howard spent less than 3 full seasons in the minors before being called up. Which is actually quite fast for the phils. He went to college late, and wasnt drafted until he was 22.
He didn't really explode in the minors until 2003 (first year in Clearwater). And he was rushed though AA and AAA and full time in 04. The only mistep the phils took was sending him back in beginning 2005, but they had Thome playing and they had him playing every day in AAA rather than sitting on the bench.
he should have been a full time player from the start of the 2004 season and maybe even 2003...i dont care of it was one day or six months bottom line is they kept him down longer than they should have so that they could hold back his service years for as long as humanly possible...the phillies front office is pathetic and ryan howard should milk them for all they are worth...under no circumstances should he take less than he can get as romey suggested
You didn't even know who he was in 2003...and neither did the phils. They signed Thome that offseason.
You want him called up from single A?
They held back utley (and hamels) to keep the service years delayed. But not howard. Howard was rushed once he had that monster season in clearwater in 2003.
it doesnt matter what i knew...it matters what howard knew and thought...im not talking from my point of view im talking from a negotiating persepctive bwtn howard and the club..and the fact is howard was kept down longer than he should have been and he wants his for that happening of course thats in addition to his major league numbers so far on and off he field
Howard had no control of being sent up from the minors...that argument to getting paid more is null and void
You can bet the major argument and or negotiating factor is that he's a star amongst stars and he wants to be paid like one. If everyone else can break contracts and get more $ because of their status...so can I.
I dont blame him one bit. Pay up bitches
shockingly youre wrong again...howard being kept down longer than he wanted is a factor in him reaching free agency later in his career...hes gonna want to be paid for that...is it the primary factory in the negotiations of course not...is it A factor in them trying to break the bank...you bet your life
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 24, 2008, 10:24:08 PM
Barajas heads back to Toronto....1 year + option for 2009
$1.2M for Rod Barajas = laugh out loud hysterical.
I wish someone would "insult" me by offering me $100M to play a kid's game.
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 25, 2008, 09:40:54 AM
shockingly youre wrong again...howard being kept down longer than he wanted is a factor in him reaching free agency later in his career...hes gonna want to be paid for that...is it the primary factory in the negotiations of course not...is it A factor in them trying to break the bank...you bet your life
Find me one major league player that has entered into arbitration admitting he should have stayed in the minors a little longer...then, and only then will your argument hold any credibility.
im not arguing im giving you fact
edit - also comparing ryan howards minor league career numbers and the way he was kept down combined with his advanced age compares to very few others guys
howard deserves to be paid. for once show the fanbase that as an organization you are actually trying to be first rate instead of the crap we have come to expect from this front office/ownership.
the farging kid won rookie of the year, follwed it up with an mvp season and then in an "off" year still put up bigtime slugger numbers.
Correction: It's an irrelevant "opinion" there is nothing factual about your statement.
the fact remains that howard should be paid.
Quote from: sean_sec227 on January 25, 2008, 10:07:49 AM
the fact remains that howard should be paid.
What exactly should he be paid? This isn't a typical situation, sean. If the Phillies are offering him Pujols money plus a kicker and he doesn't accept it, is that the Phillies' fault?
If he's looking for "historic" money then he's barking up the wrong tree with this team.
Well, maybe that's his point. While the ballpark is friendly for hitters, he probably would rather play in his hometown of St. Louis or in a big money city like New York or Boston.
its hard to argue this without knowing exactly what each side is offering but if hes offered puljos money and wants 20 million more than that pay his ass...remember to that puljos signed three years ago...the price tag has gone up since then
the way i look at any phillie negotiation is that until i hear that the player is asking for something unreasonable ill always side against the team as i dont trust their ownership on anything
and im not the biggest ryan howard fan...i still believe hes a guy that could drop off at anytime...but jesus how do you deny what hes done for this franchise both on and off the field
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 25, 2008, 10:10:29 AM
Quote from: sean_sec227 on January 25, 2008, 10:07:49 AM
the fact remains that howard should be paid.
What exactly should he be paid? This isn't a typical situation, sean. If the Phillies are offering him Pujols money plus a kicker and he doesn't accept it, is that the Phillies' fault?
If he's looking for "historic" money then he's barking up the wrong tree with this team.
the phils could've upped their offer and tried to avoid arbitration. sure they offered pujols money but albert's offer was how long ago ? once again the phils are behind the times.
my point is this team has a bad rep when it comes to paying players. help yourself pr wise with the fans. another million or so would've went a long way.
btw - i am not saying howard deserves the world, just the phils need to learn how to deal with these situations better.
Quote from: sean_sec227 on January 25, 2008, 10:17:35 AM
the phils every team in Philly needs to learn how to deal with these situations better.
It's fair to assume that the Phillies are being cheap and hard-headed with Howard because they've been cheap and hard-headed with players in the past.
However - they did offer Rolen a ridiculous deal. They paid (and continue to pay) Jim Thome an insane contract. They paid Burrell crazy money. They paid Rollins and Utley market value deals (and maybe a little higher in Utley's case) at the time.
Their payroll has been in the 90-100 million dollar range since they moved into the new stadium so it's not like they've been the Tampa Bay Devil Rays.
All I'm saying is there's a chance the Phillies' longterm offer could be very generous. It could be that Howard and his "camp" are the ones being greedy and selfish. I know it's hard to believe considering the history of this club but there's enough recent evidence to suggest that both sides are being unreasonable, not just the Phillies this time.
they offered rolen that deal when they already knew there was zero (0) chance of him accepting. the thome deal was mostly to help put people in the seats but i will give them some credit there. paying burrell crazy money with a no trade clause shows like it did with abreu and lieby that the few times they did spend they spent stupidly.
sure they have spent 90-100mil lately but the issue is that if they spent that money a bit more wisely (eaton for example) and added just a little bit more to that 90-100mil we could've done a lot better as a team.
the word out there is the phillies were willing to pay rowand $10mil a year along with going after derek lowe and paying him big bucks. well, where's that money going now ? why not toss some of it to howard, who is looking more & more like a crybaby to save yourself the situation you have.
its also possible both sides are being reasonable and the phillies wont go that extra step to get the deal done and up there payroll from 90-100 to 100-110
Keep in mind that whether you like it or not...the phils work within a budget. Howard is eligible for free agency in 2011...where he is going to make a ton of money.
YOu want to give him $25M/yr? Fine...but then what do you give Jimmy Rollins? Who's contract also expires in 2011? Utley's after 2012? And Hamel's the same year?
I am not saying howard does or doesn't deserve the money. But if you look what A-Rod's contract did to Texas, that will happen here. They can not pay them all what the market may bear.
Unless you're ok with ticket prices rivaling NFL prices.
IGY would pay higher ticket prices if they'd increase their payroll. He's the wrong person to make that argument to.
i'm not talking about 2011, i'm talking about what the phils could've done "this" year to avoid arbitration with howard. it's not like he can hold out, the arbitrator will make his/her decision and that's it. the point is they could've avoided it. they offered $7mil, he wants $10mil - up the offer to $8.5mil - more than puljos got. the organization looks good and if howard rejects it in favor of going to arbitration he's the one that looks greedy.
Quote from: FastFreddie on January 25, 2008, 10:57:03 AM
IGY would pay higher ticket prices if they'd increase their payroll. He's the wrong person to make that argument to.
of course i would...wouldnt any fan that can afford it?
everyone should want their team to do all that is possible to win a title...and if that includes spending money and subsequently raising ticket prices to pay for it then so be it
and wing stop throwing out the red herring by dropping a-rods name...howard is not asking for nor is he getting anything close to a-rods deal...thats something im sure someone within the phils organization put out there and then people like stark print it
How about addressing the issue of what do you do in 2011 and 2012, when the entire core of your team is set to hit the $20-25M/yr mark? They are not going to give that to all four of them.
Of the four...Rollins, Utley, Howard, Hamels
Which would you chose if you could only keep 1?
....if you could only keep 2?
....if you could only keep 3?
That's what it is going to come down to.
Quote from: Wingspan on January 25, 2008, 11:28:28 AM
How about addressing the issue of what do you do in 2011 and 2012, when the entire core of your team is set to hit the $20-25M/yr mark? They are not going to give that to all four of them.
Of the four...Rollins, Utley, Howard, Hamels
Which would you chose if you could only keep 1?
....if you could only keep 2?
....if you could only keep 3?
That's what it is going to come down to.
why ? it's 2008 and the subject at hand is howard going to arbitration. this subject has absolutely no baring on this team at this point.
i dont give a shtein about 2012...any or all of those guys could be traded by then have blown out an elbow or knee...or just plain suck...hell the team could be sold by then...a lot can happen in four years...what might happen four years from now should be of no concern to the phillies and if it is they are worse humans than i originally thought
Well by that logic of not caring about what happens in 2001/2012...there's no reason to pay $1 more than they have to keep Howard. He's a phillie regardless.
perhaps...and thats their perogative...just as its howards to ask for a 120 million dollar contract
however the phillies have other things to worry about...a disgruntled star player...a disgruntled locker room in whole...a pissed off fan base...a bad reputation with players around the league...but absolutely the phillies can play hardball for the next four years if they choose
They're the only team in Philly that made the playoffs in their most recent season. GO PHILLIES!
'Athletes' deserve more money. Deserve.
Quote from: sean_sec227 on January 25, 2008, 11:00:30 AM
i'm not talking about 2011, i'm talking about what the phils could've done "this" year to avoid arbitration with howard. it's not like he can hold out, the arbitrator will make his/her decision and that's it. the point is they could've avoided it. they offered $7mil, he wants $10mil - up the offer to $8.5mil - more than puljos got. the organization looks good and if howard rejects it in favor of going to arbitration he's the one that looks greedy.
They can still avoid arbitration. All they need to do is arrive at a mutually agreeable deal, sean, but it takes two to tango.
The Phillies are the ones seeming reasonable here, not Howard. In fact, he's sounding more and more like a greedy douchebag, especially when you start hearing words like "A-Rod Money" evidently coming from their side.
Quote from: rjs246 on January 25, 2008, 12:40:31 PM
'Athletes' deserve more money. Deserve.
Your mom deserves more money.
Quote from: Wingspan on January 25, 2008, 11:49:29 AM
Well by that logic of not caring about what happens in 2001/2012...there's no reason to pay $1 more than they have to keep Howard. He's a phillie regardless.
ICY pretty much posted my response word for word. 8)
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 25, 2008, 12:43:03 PM
Quote from: sean_sec227 on January 25, 2008, 11:00:30 AM
i'm not talking about 2011, i'm talking about what the phils could've done "this" year to avoid arbitration with howard. it's not like he can hold out, the arbitrator will make his/her decision and that's it. the point is they could've avoided it. they offered $7mil, he wants $10mil - up the offer to $8.5mil - more than puljos got. the organization looks good and if howard rejects it in favor of going to arbitration he's the one that looks greedy.
They can still avoid arbitration. All they need to do is arrive at a mutually agreeable deal, sean, but it takes two to tango.
The Phillies are the ones seeming reasonable here, not Howard. In fact, he's sounding more and more like a greedy douchebag, especially when you start hearing words like "A-Rod Money" evidently coming from their side.
i know they can rome and my point is the gap is $3mil, well meet it half way and as a team up your offer by $1.5mil. again as i said, if howard still rejects it and starts tossing these ideas that he should crazy money then it's him that looks greedy. again, he's already shown that he's a bit of a crybaby. knowing that you better your offer and avoid bigger problems and at the same time look better to your fanbase.
right now it's the phillies that have the bad rep in this town, not the players. they have to put out the extra effort.
Quote from: FastFreddie on January 25, 2008, 12:37:32 PM
They're the only team in Philly that made the playoffs in their most recent season. GO PHILLIES!
true, too bad the cowboys didnt have a monumental collapse like the mets did. 8)
Similarly to the Phillies, the Cowboys waiting until the postseason to collapse in ugly fashion.
Quote from: FastFreddie on January 25, 2008, 02:08:39 PM
Similarly to the Phillies, the Cowboys waiting until the postseason to collapse in ugly fashion.
a harsh reality sir.
Well, it wasn't harsh that the Cowboys collapsed. I rather enjoyed that.
of course.
Some of Howard's bargaining power just went down the shteinter with Morneau accepting 6/80 from Minny. Howard's better, but now that gives the Phils some ground to hold onto while Pat Gillick's got his fingers in his ears and his tongue sticking out and while Ruben Amaro threatens to kill people.
Either way, and arguing about it is stupid, Howard needs to get paid. It is the Phillies job to get a deal done not only to satisfy him but to hold down the fan base too. If they let him leave or allow him to become too disgruntled then its a major disservice to the team, who is ready to win, and the fans.
The Phillies didn't leave Howard in the minors. Ed Wade left him there. Until he had no choice but to call him up. Remember the west coast trip when they had to play the AL and needed a DH and fargbag Eddie left Howard down on the farm.
Ed Wade tried everything imaginable to farg him up. To include trying to trade him for Ted farging Lilly and Kip goddamn Wells.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on January 26, 2008, 12:19:52 AM
The Phillies didn't leave Howard in the minors. Ed Wade left him there.
say wha?
ed wade was the phillies...you think howard or anyone else for that matter differentiates the two and gives the franchise a pass because they employed a terrible gm?
I think he meant the current regime, IGY. Wade did a lot of stupid shtein in his day and although technically the franchise has to be held accountable for what he did, it's really not Gillick's or Amaro' Jr.'s fault.
In other words if he's holding a grudge for being held up in the minor's his beef isn't with the current guys.
I don't necessarily agree with that, though. Just saying that's what Jay meant.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on January 26, 2008, 12:19:52 AM
Some of Howard's bargaining power just went down the shteinter with Morneau accepting 6/80 from Minny. Howard's better, but now that gives the Phils some ground to hold onto while Pat Gillick's got his fingers in his ears and his tongue sticking out and while Ruben Amaro threatens to kill people.
You could also argue though that the contract the Rockies just gave to Tulowiski (sp?) would give Howard plenty of bargaining power too though.
Tulowitzsky's deal wouldn't influence Howard's situation at all.
Apples/oranges.
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 26, 2008, 09:20:32 AM
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on January 26, 2008, 12:19:52 AM
The Phillies didn't leave Howard in the minors. Ed Wade left him there.
say wha?
ed wade was the phillies...you think howard or anyone else for that matter differentiates the two and gives the franchise a pass because they employed a terrible gm?
Romey's right in knowing what I was saying. I hold Wade responsible for holding him down in the minors so long. It was solely his decision to do that.
Now if Monty and Co. use Wade's terrible decision making to hold that against Howard and not pay him, thats on them totally. He's worth the money and he should be given the extension.
But Howard has to give a little too. But its up to the Phillies to handle this the right way and just farging get something done. But like always, they will farg it up.
oh my bad...i see what youre saying but i also think that howard doesnt care who or why he was held back...just that the team hes trying to get paid from did it and he wants to make up for it...
And you consider that "reasonable" thinking at the bargaining table?
Cause were I come from I call that being a vengeful whiny icehole.
Lets just clear this up now.
Howard deserves to get paid big time, and deserves a long term deal.
The Phillies to need to pay him big money and keep him here for life
Howard probably does not deserve the amount of money he's supposedly asking for in the long term, and this whole "7 million, no I want 10 million" crap is disgusting. 7 Million is 7 million, take the farging money.
And Phillies, be willing to compromise, thrown 8 or 8.5 at him if you need to. Stop being little tight wads.
There. Howard's a bitch. The Phillies are iceholes. The sports world is as it always is. Whiny players and icehole owners.
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 26, 2008, 05:57:40 PM
oh my bad...i see what youre saying but i also think that howard doesnt care who or why he was held back...just that the team hes trying to get paid from did it and he wants to make up for it...
I agree with that. He just wants to get paid. And he deserves it.
This braindead FO is too busy trying to match exactly what the Cards did for Pujols. farg that. Recognize that you have one of the best players in the game and get a deal done.
David Montgomery and the rest of those bitchass people need to be shoved off the Whitman
not quite Phillies but, Leiberthal retires:
QuoteJust before playing soccer for the first time in his life earlier today in a charity celebrity game hosted by Nomar Garciaparra and Mia Hamm, former Dodgers backup catcher Mike Lieberthal, a two-time All-Star while with Philadephia and a graduate of Westlake High School, said he has decided to retire. Lieberthal made the decision in October, when it became clear the Dodgers wouldn't pick up his $1.5 million contract option for this season.
``If they would have picked up my option, I probably would have played one more year,'' Lieberthal said. ``But I didn't want to go anywhere else. ... I'm totally in a very happy place now.''
Lieberthal said he would like to stay in the game in some capacity, possibly in broadcasting, but that he has no desire to coach because it would require him to start again in the low minors and work his way up.
Lieberthal, who turned 36 last week, spent 14 seasons in the majors, mostly as the starting catcher for the Phillies. He spent just one season with the Dodgers, signing last winter to be Russell Martin's backup, and wound up playing in just 38 games while hitting .234 with one RBI. This was one of the truly good guys in the game, and he'll be missed -- although he did say he plans to attend a handful of Dodgers games this season.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on January 26, 2008, 03:25:39 PM
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 26, 2008, 09:20:32 AM
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on January 26, 2008, 12:19:52 AM
The Phillies didn't leave Howard in the minors. Ed Wade left him there.
say wha?
ed wade was the phillies...you think howard or anyone else for that matter differentiates the two and gives the franchise a pass because they employed a terrible gm?
Romey's right in knowing what I was saying. I hold Wade responsible for holding him down in the minors so long. It was solely his decision to do that.
Now if Monty and Co. use Wade's terrible decision making to hold that against Howard and not pay him, thats on them totally. He's worth the money and he should be given the extension.
But Howard has to give a little too. But its up to the Phillies to handle this the right way and just farging get something done. But like always, they will farg it up.
100% agreement wood.
Is there a link to a story that says Howard is looking for A-Rod type money? The only place I've seen this is IGY.
If so, that is absurd. Howard's been great, but not at an A-Rod level.
If they can't make a multi-year agreement this year, hopefully they can at least split the difference (8-9 mil) and avoid arbitration. Otherwise the situation could get ugly fast. I would agree that a deal should be beyond Pujols.
Of course, this is the Phillies...
it was from Stark's blog...it's not as concrete as "he's demanding XX dollars"
here was Romey's post in this thread with the blog post
http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?topic=19884.msg575642#msg575642
Hmmm... somehow I missed that earlier. Thanks.
I guess we'll just have to see how it shakes out.
Deal with it next year when the long-term picture is clearer. He'll get a respectable chunk of change from arbitration this season, and both sides will better see his long-term value to the team versus some of the other guys.
Plus, this might be the season they finally dump Pat "VORP" Burrell's contract.
Quote from: Geowhizzer on January 27, 2008, 12:03:56 PM
Is there a link to a story that says Howard is looking for A-Rod type money? The only place I've seen this is IGY.
wtf?
ive continously said hes NOT asking for a-rod money
Per ESPN:
QuoteThe Philadelphia Phillies have agreed to a two-year deal with free agent third baseman Pedro Feliz, pending a physical.
Feliz batted .253 with 20 home runs and 72 RBIs last season with the San Francisco Giants.
Phils sign Pedro Feliz to a 2-yr deal (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3219098)
yay another mediocre third baseman!
i'm on record right now...i like it
The last 3rd basemen they got from the Giants worked out so well they just had to go back for seconds.
.280 on base %? holy shtein.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on January 28, 2008, 04:28:52 PM
The last 3rd basemen they got from the Giants worked out so well they just had to go back for seconds.
or thirds. Remember Charlie Hayes? ha
I'm OK with it. It means less Wes Helms, more power from the right side and better defense than Dobbs...
Bench:
Coste
Taguchi
Werth/Jenkins
Bruntlett
Feliz/Dobbs
Helms is gone I would assume. Either that or they keep one less pitcher, which is retarded considering the staff isn't all that good to begin with.
Racist.
he caught the final out of Terry Mulholland's no-hitter
You remember Terry Mulholland, right? :-\
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 28, 2008, 05:24:43 PM
You remember Terry Mulholland, right? :-\
Yep. But no idea who the hell Charlie Hayes was.
Any relation to Von? ;)
ha
well, they were both born in the U.S.
Nevermind, I googled him and found a pic. I vaguely remember him but he played for the Phils from 89-91 and again in 95.
89-91 I wasn't really watching baseball (I stopped following baseball shortly after Schmidt retired and didn't really get back into it until the mid/late 90's) and in 95 I was living in Seattle so I wasn't watching them on tv either.
Did Charlie Hayes eat a bunch of steroids and have one massive season before fading into oblivion?
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 28, 2008, 05:24:43 PM
he caught the final out of Terry Mulholland's no-hitter
You remember Terry Mulholland, right? :-\
According to Wiki, he caught the final out of the 1996 World Series and dorked up Mulholland's perfect game with a throwing error.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Hayes
QuoteHe caught the final out of the New York Yankees' 1996 World Series victory. On August 15, 1990, he was a decisive part of a unique baseball game. While Terry Mulholland pitched a complete game shutout victory, not giving up a single hit, walking, or hitting a batsman, and retired every opposing player he faced, the Giants' Rick Parker reached base on a throwing error by Hayes, spoiling an otherwise perfect game.
Two years for that stiff is ridiculous.
This is exactly the type of move that always blows up in their faces. I would rather them have gone with Dobbs/Helms this year and then signed a real third baseman next year.
farging idiots.
Quote from: SunMo on January 28, 2008, 04:16:38 PM
i'm on record right now...i like it
can i be your vp cause im on board
what "real" 3b would you like romey?
remember that lidge is a pending FA and may not be here next year...this is the year to go for broke.
Feliz is a better fielding Nunez, with power, and yes a pathetic OBP, get over it...he's a 7 hitter
Quote from: ice grillin you on January 28, 2008, 06:46:58 PM
Quote from: SunMo on January 28, 2008, 04:16:38 PM
i'm on record right now...i like it
can i be your vp cause im on board
you didn't even have to ask
Quote from: SunMo on January 28, 2008, 04:16:38 PM
i'm on record right now...i like it
Me too.
No more Wes Helms.
More versatility with Dobbs (some RF and LF time or PH) too.
His OBP in the 7 hole means shtein because its not like they have an RBI machine hitting behind him anyways. And really, can he be any worse than that farging automatic out David Bell and the shteinbag Wes Helms?
No.
People wonder why the Phillies are always coming up short. Signing stiffs like Pedro Feliz is reason #1.
But sure, let's all be happy that they did "something." Just like they did last year with Helms.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 28, 2008, 07:47:10 PM
People wonder why the Phillies are always coming up short. Signing stiffs like Pedro Feliz is reason #1.
But sure, let's all be happy that they did "something." Just like they did last year with Helms.
They did make a good effort to sign Lowell who aside from A-Rod was the top F/A on the market. They don't have any trade bait so I'm not really sure what more they could have done.
They could blow it all up and learn a real sport.
(http://www.awa.dk/whisky/jameson/jamesonl.jpg) ? ? ?
Or, as Rome is suggesting, they could blow it all up and get drunk. Either way, everyone wins.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 28, 2008, 06:25:06 PMthen signed a real third baseman next year.
Chipper Jones
Troy Glaus
Hank Blalock
that's next year's FA 3B. Not much to choose from....
There would have been a time I'd kill for Blalock. But he's fallen to injury and mediocrity too much the past couple of seasons.
Troy Glaus is equal in value to Scott Rolen, right?
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 28, 2008, 10:00:34 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 28, 2008, 06:25:06 PMthen signed a real third baseman next year.
Chipper Jones
Troy Glaus
Hank Blalock
that's next year's FA 3B. Not much to choose from....
They have these thingies called trades now too.
Either way my point stands. The Phillies didn't get it done in terms of landing Lowell, so they had to settle for Feliz.
Welcome to mediocrity. Again.
100 wins
My biggest disappointment this offseason was not adding another quality starter. Gillick is big on starting pitching and has been around a while so I figured he'd get creative and be able to do something.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 08:23:05 AM
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 28, 2008, 10:00:34 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 28, 2008, 06:25:06 PMthen signed a real third baseman next year.
Chipper Jones
Troy Glaus
Hank Blalock
that's next year's FA 3B. Not much to choose from....
They have these thingies called trades now too.
Either way my point stands. The Phillies didn't get it done in terms of landing Lowell, so they had to settle for Feliz.
Welcome to mediocrity. Again.
Cmon Rome, even if they got Lowell you would be saying how they didn't squat for a pitcher and welcome to mediocrity again. So either way, they are mediocre with a well-named 3rd baseman or not
Quote from: FastFreddie on January 29, 2008, 08:36:01 AM
Quote from: SD_Eagle on January 29, 2008, 08:31:32 AM
100 wins
No. I'll set the O/U at 88.
Rollins said 100 wins, and I just point that out cause I didn't see a big deal made out of it like when he said they were the team to beat last season.
Right now I'd say over, maybe 90 wins cause of 3 reasons:
1. The NL East got worse
2. No way the bums can suffer more injuries than they did as last season
3. Starting pitching should be better with Myers in the rotation
You are better on a lot of losers to deliver.
Quote from: reese125 on January 29, 2008, 08:37:55 AM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 08:23:05 AM
Quote from: BigEd76 on January 28, 2008, 10:00:34 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 28, 2008, 06:25:06 PMthen signed a real third baseman next year.
Chipper Jones
Troy Glaus
Hank Blalock
that's next year's FA 3B. Not much to choose from....
They have these thingies called trades now too.
Either way my point stands. The Phillies didn't get it done in terms of landing Lowell, so they had to settle for Feliz.
Welcome to mediocrity. Again.
Cmon Rome, even if they got Lowell you would be saying how they didn't squat for a pitcher and welcome to mediocrity again. So either way, they are mediocre with a well-named 3rd baseman or not
First of all you don't know what I would post. Second, the Phillies did improve their pitching in the offseason. They got Lidge and that moved Myers back to the rotation where he belongs. So you're wrong about my reaction either way.
And what exactly is so great about winning 88-90 games every year? You're mediocre when you get to the postseason once in 15 years, reese. That's the definition of mediocrity.
Pedro Feliz > Wes Helms/David Bell
When they have Utley, Howard & Rollins in that INF the need for a stud 3B isn't there. All they need is a good defensive guy (Feliz is) who can be decent with the bat.
Settling on Feliz is cool with me.
they should sign superstars at every position, that is the only solution
Quote from: SunMo on January 29, 2008, 09:00:38 AM
they should sign superstars at every position, that is the only solution
The only solution for you is Zyklon-B.
feliz gets rid of helms and that is a good thing no matter what he does this year...helms is unwatchable
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 09:02:23 AM
Quote from: SunMo on January 29, 2008, 09:00:38 AM
they should sign superstars at every position, that is the only solution
The only solution for you is Zyklon-B.
play by play of the last 30 seconds...
1. google search "zyklon-b"
2. loling my lil head off
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 28, 2008, 06:25:06 PM
Two years for that stiff is ridiculous.
This is exactly the type of move that always blows up in their faces. I would rather them have gone with Dobbs/Helms this year and then signed a real third baseman next year.
farging idiots.
That's idiotic.
Any move that keeps Helms off the field is a good one. Feliz's deal doesn't handcuff anyone, and makes him easily tradable if they find a "real" 3B next offseason. This move is basically replacing Nunez, with a slightly better bat than nunez had.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 08:51:00 AM
And what exactly is so great about winning 88-90 games every year? You're mediocre when you get to the postseason once in 15 years, reese. That's the definition of mediocrity.
Wrong. Making the playoffs once in 15 years isn't mediocre. Are the Detroit Lions mediocre? Are the Arizona Cardinals mediocre? No. Once in 15 years is the definition of atrocious. Abominable even.
I was referring more to what they've done the last five or six years in terms of mediocre.
before last season these are the teams that existed in 1993 and hadnt made the mlb playoffs since
toronto
kansas city
milwaukee
pittsburgh
philadelphia
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 08:23:05 AMThey have these thingies called trades now too.
OK, so that adds who? Adrian Beltre? They don't have anything to trade anyway. They tried to get Lowell but he went back to Boston.
The 25-man roster is pretty much set except for two bullpen spots and the 5th OF. Looking back on all the junk the 07 Phillies threw out there, it's amazing they were within 10 games of the Mets. Hopefully the roster is more consistent this year in terms of health...
easy is all phillied up
hell yeah....2 weeks until spring training
Next Friday is that Meet the Phillies show on CSN
I'd be more excited if what they did in the offseason made them actual contenders.
They treaded water. Barely.
And now the Mets are gonna get Santana and leave the Phillies in their dust.
Yay team!
hater
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 03:27:19 PM
I'd be more excited if what they did in the offseason made them actual contenders.
They treaded water. Barely.
And now the Mets are gonna get Santana and leave the Phillies in their dust.
Yay team!
Like last year?
The Mets paid a high price in prospects to land Santana, agreeing to send the Twins outfielder Carlos Gomez and pitchers Phil Humber, Deolis Guerra and Kevin Mulvey.
They also just made themselves head and shoulders better than every other team in the division... (assuming the trade happens).
Quote from: rjs246 on January 29, 2008, 04:28:51 PM
They also just made themselves head and shoulders better than every other team in the division... (assuming the trade happens).
Meh
All they do with bringing in Santana was assure they will remain competitive. The rest of their staff is actually worse than the phils.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2008-01-29-twins-mets-santana_N.htm
let me know when he can play 2nd base and right field too
Quote from: SunMo on January 29, 2008, 04:40:21 PM
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2008-01-29-twins-mets-santana_N.htm
let me know when he can play 2nd base and right field too
I couldn't help but laugh at this:
QuoteThe Twins, meanwhile, would see yet another young star they produced leave the organization. Their Gold Glove outfielder, Torii Hunter, left for the Los Angeles Angels this offseason.
Who are these young stars? Hunter will be 33 this year and Santana is like 28 or 29. Both obviously have plenty of good years left but to call either of them "young" is funny to me. Especially Hunter.
Quote from: SunMo on January 29, 2008, 04:40:21 PM
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2008-01-29-twins-mets-santana_N.htm
let me know when he can play 2nd base and right field too
castillo is a good second basemen...and church isnt to bad in rf...they certainly arent hurting at those positions
castillo is done...he'll miss at least 50 games this year
oh i didnt see that
he looks like Barbaro when he runs
king and santana are going to have some epic battles over the next five years....change up mania...
i just did the math too...they should face off for our mvp six pack april 20th mets game
not really....but i hope
Hamels, Myers, Kendrick, Moyer, Eaton
vs.
Santana, Martinez, Maine, Perez, Hernandez
clearly the mets rotation is better when healthy, but pedro and el duque can blow up with injuries anytime, and i think oliver perez was a fluke last year. and they still have Billy the gagger as their closer.
It will be funny to watch Burrell have career days against Santana and then go 0-for against the Eric Milton's of the NL.
Today in Phillies history:
1948: Commissioner Happy Chandler fines the Phillies and two other clubs $500 for signing high school players
1961: Billy Hamilton is selected for baseball's Hall of Fame by a vote of the special veterans' committee
2005: Three Phillies minor-leaguers, and two from the Toronto Blue Jays, were involved in a fistfight with some locals in the parking lot outside a Clearwater bar. First-round draft pick Cole Hamels suffers a broken hand.
We have Pedro Feliz. Titletown, baby.
Quote from: PhillyGirl on January 29, 2008, 04:17:19 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 03:27:19 PM
I'd be more excited if what they did in the offseason made them actual contenders.
They treaded water. Barely.
And now the Mets are gonna get Santana and leave the Phillies in their dust.
Yay team!
Like last year?
Santana made all the difference last year, yes.
i can see hamels slapping someone, but not punching.
Myers is mentoring him with a "crawl before you walk" mentallity.
^ I chuckled. ^
Odalis Perez worked out for the Phils in the Dominican Republic
There he is, that's my boy. Good to see you back in form, Easy. Keep it up.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 06:12:29 PM
Quote from: PhillyGirl on January 29, 2008, 04:17:19 PM
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on January 29, 2008, 03:27:19 PM
I'd be more excited if what they did in the offseason made them actual contenders.
They treaded water. Barely.
And now the Mets are gonna get Santana and leave the Phillies in their dust.
Yay team!
Like last year?
Santana made all the difference last year, yes.
*sigh*
Rome...if you couldn't tell what I was getting at, there's less hope for you than I thought.
Got my Phillies spring training tickets in the mail yesterday. Four tickets for the Yankees & four for the Tigers directly behind home plate.
Nine days till pitchers & catchers report... :drool
Anyone know who the 1st batter at the plate was in Harry Kalas' first ever play-by-play game?
i know he opened the Vet...and that Boots Day was the first batter...i don't know if they played a series on the road before that
i'll go with Boots Day
Tony Taylor? (http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/HOU/HOU196504120.shtml)
Mickey Mantle fellas
Angelo Cataldi had Kalas in this morning and he played the tape. farging awesome
oh, he said first ever game...not first Phillies game.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on February 05, 2008, 11:41:32 AM
Got my Phillies spring training tickets in the mail yesterday. Four tickets for the Yankees & four for the Tigers directly behind home plate.
Nine days till pitchers & catchers report... :drool
You have your Eaton jersey ironed and ready to go?
Quote from: reese125 on February 05, 2008, 01:40:19 PM
Mickey Mantle fellas
Angelo Cataldi had Kalas in this morning and he played the tape. farging awesome
his major league debut was with houston in 1965...and that game Ed linked was the first they played that year...so i don't know how Mantle could've been his first ever PBP call
take it up with your boy Ang, or look up this mornings show. The shtein was cool as hell to hear Mantle's name by Harry
he's not my boy...i haven't listened to that show in probably 7 years
It was way better when Kalas said "Mickey Morandini". Mantle is boring by comparison.
edit: Hughes works with several collectors to find rare pieces. He found a clip from Kalas' first broadcast with the Houston Astros, on April 9, 1965, in an exhibition game against the New York Yankees that officially opened the Astrodome.
Kalas' first words?
"Mickey Mantle will lead off for the New York Yankees."
Since when was Mantle a leadoff hitter?
Quote from: BigEd76 on February 05, 2008, 01:54:03 PM
Since when was Mantle a leadoff hitter?
in his first two seasons before he had his leg injuries he used to lead off...tho that was way before 1965
before Joe D made him run into the drainage in right field
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 05, 2008, 01:51:03 PM
edit: Hughes works with several collectors to find rare pieces. He found a clip from Kalas' first broadcast with the Houston Astros, on April 9, 1965, in an exhibition game against the New York Yankees that officially opened the Astrodome.
Kalas' first words?
"Mickey Mantle will lead off for the New York Yankees."
you want to blow me now or later Mary
ewww, you want a dude to blow you?
I guess when you get so used to something, it almost becomes 2nd nature. IGY will tell ya
you still were mad vague and came with incomplete information that i had to use valuable work time to verify and better explain
plus why would i blow you...even if you got it right you were merely repeating information you got somewhere else and yet you still couldnt come fully correct....i suppose being half assed this time is better than being your normal completely useless
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 05, 2008, 02:01:22 PM
you still were mad vague and came with incomplete information that i had to use valuable work time to verify and better explain
plus why would i blow you...even if you got it right you were merely repeating information you got somewhere else and yet you still couldnt come fully correct....i suppose being half assed this time is better than being your normal completely useless
Yeah I know...whatever makes you sleep better under your Punkie Brewster down comforter bud
Tomorrow i can purchase opening day tickets...sweetness.
By Saam was the primary play-by-play announcer when the Vet opened. Kalas was in the Wheels role back then and Whitey was the color guy.
Quote from: SunMo on February 05, 2008, 01:46:21 PM
he's not my boy...i haven't listened to that show in probably 7 years
Translated:
Quote from: SunMo on February 05, 2008, 01:46:21 PM
I missed his show today for the first time in 7 years.
Adam Eaton still being on the Phillies is really just a sickening thought.
Yep.
My ass is still frozen from going to an April game when that abortion pitched against the Braves.
But hey, at least he's injury prone.
Let's root for a blown out shoulder, another torn ligament in his thumb or that he has to have a hysterectomy.
Have no fears about the starting rotation. After all, the Phillies are going to be taking another look at Mr. Anna Benson this week.
I'll take him over Beaton. Hell, I'd take Anna over him.
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20080206_Benson_spurs_Phillies_interest.html
Looks like Benson might be on his way here after all.
As long as Anna comes with him.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on February 06, 2008, 04:39:04 PM
http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/20080206_Benson_spurs_Phillies_interest.html
Looks like Benson might be on his way here after all.
The best part of that article:
QuotePitchers and catchers open spring training a week from tomorrow in Clearwater, Fla.
I will be a LOT more excited about this season if they bring in Benson to replace Eaton. I can't stomach that fargface once every 5 days.
So does Utley win the MVP this year?
Because he was on pace to do it last year before that corksucker from the Nats broke his wrist.
How cool would that be to have back to back to back MVPs?
Very cool, and yet on the other hand very sad to not even have 1 WS showing to show for it.
Until they win this year! Go team!
Quote from: Munson on February 06, 2008, 11:18:13 PM
Very cool, and yet on the other hand very sad to not even have 1 playoff GAME win to show for it.
So last night I when I bought my opening day seats...selecting best available got me 300 level seats, i was hoping for 200 behind the plate. I am pretty sure the game is close as can be to being sold out.
Not sure how true it is but I heard the lower level is sold out for the year?
Quote from: Wingspan on February 07, 2008, 09:42:31 AM
So last night I when I bought my opening day seats...selecting best available got me 300 level seats, i was hoping for 200 behind the plate. I am pretty sure the game is close as can be to being sold out.
we got ours a while back thru the six pack plan so i havent been following the opening day sales too closely but i thought there was gonna be a lottery for the remaining seats and that the lottery was being held at the end of the month
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 07, 2008, 11:32:39 AM
Quote from: Wingspan on February 07, 2008, 09:42:31 AM
So last night I when I bought my opening day seats...selecting best available got me 300 level seats, i was hoping for 200 behind the plate. I am pretty sure the game is close as can be to being sold out.
we got ours a while back thru the six pack plan so i havent been following the opening day sales too closely but i thought there was gonna be a lottery for the remaining seats and that the lottery was being held at the end of the month
I can't imagine that there are that many left then. I have a partial season plan. Which I had the option to add on opening day and some red sox games.
oh right....same with our partial plan sox or opener...id rather get an anal wart then have to go to a red sox game in philly...
whatever opener tix arent being given out thru plans are going into a lottery to be held at the end of the month...thats what it is
I just pulled 2 in Section 330 Row 7 Seats 13-14 on the Six-Pack plan.
sun where are our opening day johnsons?
i said openeing day not every day
For the hell of it I just checked a Sunday 14 Game plan out and found three seats directly behind home plate in section 316 row 3 available.
I really need to move back home.
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 07, 2008, 11:47:29 AM
i said openeing day not every day
Doesn't opening day fall under the everyday umbrella?
yes but it was clear that by me specifying opening day that i didnt mean what sb thought i meant
on another ticket note i went to the yankees website the other day to try and get tickets to a game since this is the last season of the stadium and the entire season is sold out
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 07, 2008, 12:01:56 PM
on another ticket note i went to the yankees website the other day to try and get tickets to a game since this is the last season of the stadium and the entire season is sold out
Not surprised at all. Nose bleed seats vs the ***** Rays will probably run a C note a piece on ebay and the like. I really wish I would have had an opportunity to take in a game up there. Would have especially loved to have seen a Sox/Yanks game in NY and then in Boston.
yeah im definitely going since ive never been but now im gonna have to stubhub it and pay more
been to fenway tho....that place is so farging cool...minus the intolerable bostonites
I'll be in Philly sometime during the summer. I may have to bite the bullet and pay the big bucks for a ticket. It's one of the few remaining stadiums from when I was a kid so I'd really love to catch a game there.
Yankee Stadium
Fenway
Dodger Stadium
Wrigley
I think those are the only ones left. Was Comiskey blown up or just renamed?
may 31 - nationals - sec 418 row 11-12
wow we suck
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 07, 2008, 11:43:13 AM
oh right....same with our partial plan sox or opener...id rather get an anal wart then have to go to a red sox game in philly...
whatever opener tix arent being given out thru plans are going into a lottery to be held at the end of the month...thats what it is
I got 2 sets to r sox game, my intention is to have them pay for about 1/3 of my entire 17 game package.
Quote from: SunMo on February 07, 2008, 12:52:24 PM
may 31 - nationals - sec 418 row 11-12
Row 11 and 12?
You guys are bigger than I thought
Spring Training opens one week from today kiddies.
Also, Howard got his arbitration date.....either the 20th or 22nd....I forget which one. He wants $10 mil, the Phils have offered $7.
Quote from: Sgt PSN on February 07, 2008, 03:13:01 PM
Also, Howard got his arbitration date.....either the 20th or 22nd....I forget which one. He wants $10 mil, the Phils have offered $7.
(http://skinnymoose.com/network/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/back_to_the_future.jpg)
i didnt have the heart
mine was black as night...that's why i could do it
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 07, 2008, 12:01:56 PM
yes but it was clear that by me specifying opening day that i didnt mean what sb thought i meant
on another ticket note i went to the yankees website the other day to try and get tickets to a game since this is the last season of the stadium and the entire season is sold out
yea i saw the same thing. never been there, want to go to a game. i figure that not everything is sold out, rather they will release single game tix day of game or a little before. but i could be wrong.
Quote from: ice grillin you on February 07, 2008, 04:20:09 PM
i didnt have the heart
Quote from: SunMo on February 07, 2008, 04:24:24 PM
mine was black as night...that's why i could do it
Sorry. Not tuned into wip all day like yous guys.
haha, i don't listen to WIP...but the arbitration figures and date have been known for about 3 weeks.
I had heard the figures before, but not the date. Heard that for the first time on the radio today......while driving my Delorean.
that's the spirit
I've got spirit, yes I do! I've got spirit, how 'bout YOU!?!?
just die already
Ok. But then I'll always be with you.
no you won't, you'll be dead, it's the best part
I'll be with you in spirit, haunting your dreams and randomly showing up in the reflection in your mirror.
ESPN's Buster Olney reports that the Mets will only sign Kyle Lohse if he agrees to play for New York at a very discounted rate.
Lohse wouldn't be much of an upgrade for the Mets in terms of talent, but he would provide valuable depth for an injury-prone rotation that includes Orlando Hernandez and Pedro Martinez.
Source: espn.com
http://www.concretefield.com/forum/index.php?topic=20018.0
Read on the Phils MB that Benson will be in Philly tomorrow presumably to work out a contract.
Quote from: PhillyPhreak54 on February 10, 2008, 09:47:49 PM
Read on the Phils MB that Benson will be in Philly tomorrow presumably to work out a contract.
Why would he be in Philly when everyone and their brother is on their way to Clearwater? Pitchers & catchers report in four days, after all. You don't think the brass is there already? Just asking.
Is it such a stretch to think that the upper management stays in Philly?
Isn't arbitration coming up for Howard? They've got a lot of business to attend to.
Arbitration is next Wednesday in Clearwater
A season of Benson means a season of the nutjob wifey:
(http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/Sidebox-Anna-Benson.article.jpg)
Yay for fun off field trainwrecks.
The Philly media needs someone new now that Alycia Lane is gone LOL
Quote from: PhillyGirl on February 10, 2008, 09:56:44 PM
Is it such a stretch to think that the upper management stays in Philly?
Isn't arbitration coming up for Howard? They've got a lot of business to attend to.
The entire operation moves to Clearwater this week. I suppose it's not a stretch to think a few executives (namely Amaro or Gillick) would stay behind especially to deal with Howard.
Like I said... just asking.
PS: Thanks Ed. :)
didnt benson and his wife get divorced a couple years ago
I think they filed but decided to stay together
Quote from: SD_Eagle on February 11, 2008, 07:39:22 AM
I think they filed but decided to stay together
That's what I remember.
She'll help boost ticket sales every 5th day so I guess the Phils got that going for them.
why isn't corey patterson getting any interest from anyone? i remember him two or three years ago, before he got injured, he was playing like one of the best CFs in the game. he couldn't have gone that far downhill that fast.
Benson is a done deal....1 yr, minor league + spring training invite
Hello Anna >:D
He probably won't make the team.
New Alycia Lane = Jen Utley
Good. Low risk signing and hopefully they catch lightning in a bottle with him.
Now, just get rid of Eaton.
he wont make the team...if he had shown anything to the rest of the league....and he tried out for a ton of teams...someone would have easily outbid the phils
plus isnt he hurt to the point where he wouldnt even pitch until may or june?
wifey
(http://internetservices.readingeagle.com/blog/paws/archives/JenChaseUtleyPuppies.gif)
Low risk signing for possible depth. He should be ok for a spot start or mop up duty right as Lidge goes on the DL though, so that's a bonus.
With the money pitchers get...even a bad pitcher gets $5M to go 7-10 4.50 era. He must not even be close.
QuoteChuck LaMar, the Phillies' director of pro scouting, watched Benson throw twice in the past 10 days and said his velocity is "60 to 70 percent" of his pre-surgery form. LaMar said it's doubtful that Benson will make the team out of spring training, but he could be ready later in the season.
"He's coming into camp thinking he'd be ready opening day," LaMar said. "That's awfully aggressive for us being only 10-1/2 months post-op. I think Kris still has a ways to go. The command of his pitches are in place. Really, we're just waiting on the velocity.
"If he continues to make the progress that he's made, he'll pitch in the major leagues again. I was very encouraged by the workouts. He wanted to be a Philadelphia Phillie and wanted to get this done."
The sad thing is they could have signed Livan Hernandez and gotten a guaranteed 200-220 innings out of him this season.
But sure, a gimp with half an arm is much better, especially considering how deep and strong the Phillies rotation is right now.
corksucking losers.
Quote from: Jerome99RIP on February 13, 2008, 04:03:28 PM
The sad thing is they could have signed Livan Hernandez and gotten a guaranteed 200-220 innings out of him this season.
But sure, a gimp with half an arm is much better, especially considering how deep and strong the Phillies rotation is right now.
corksucking losers.
thats why i say hes done...any pitcher such as a hernandez that could contribute and would garner interest thruout the rest of the league would have been signed by another team
What interest did Livan have? He was rumored to the Mets and maybe the Nationals, but that was it. The Twins needed someone to replace Santana and overpaid for him....
Five million dollars for a pitcher who is going to start 32-35 games and pitch 200-230 innings guaranteed is not overpaying, Ed.
Quote from: BigEd76 on February 13, 2008, 04:09:08 PM
What interest did Livan have? He was rumored to the Mets and maybe the Nationals, but that was it. The Twins needed someone to replace Santana and overpaid for him....
so someone overpaid for him but no one was interested?
Plus dook can hit! He'd be better right away as a hitter than Barajas was last year.
Ed obviously doesn't know baseball.
i guess baseball isnt stuff then
Ed knows snuff.
They could get 200 innings from Eaton anyway.
in allentown